Despite strong objections from conservative Christian apologists, the prevailing rabbinic interpretation of Isaiah 53 ascribes the “servant” to the nation of Israel who silently endured unimaginable suffering at the hands of its gentile oppressors. The speakers, in this most-debated chapter, are the stunned kings of nations who will bear witness to the messianic age and the final vindication of the Jewish people following their long and bitter exile. “Who would have believed our report?,” the astonished and contrite world leaders wonder aloud in dazed bewilderment (53:1).1
The stimulus for the world’s baffled response contained in this famed cluster of chapters at the end of the Book of Isaiah is the unexpected salvation of Israel. The redemption of God’s people is the central theme in the preceding verse (52:12) where the “you” signifies the Jewish people who are sheltered and delivered by God. Moreover, the “afflicted barren woman” in the following chapter is protected and saved by God, and is also universally recognized as the nation of Israel2 (54:1).
The well-worn claim frequently advanced by Christian apologists who argue that the noted Jewish commentator, Rashi (1040 CE – 1105 CE), was the first to identify the suffering servant of Isaiah 53 with the nation of Israel is inaccurate and misleading. In fact, Origen, a prominent and influential church father, conceded in the year 248 CE – eight centuries before Rashi was born – that the consensus among the Jews in his time was that Isaiah 53 “bore reference to the whole [Jewish] people, regarded as one individual, and as being in a state of dispersion and suffering, in order that many proselytes might be gained, on account of the dispersion of the Jews among numerous heathen nations.”3
The broad consensus among Jewish, and even some Christian commentators, that the “servant” in Isaiah 52-53 refers to the nation of Israel is understandable. Isaiah 53, which is the fourth of four renowned Servant Songs, is umbilically connected to its preceding chapters. The “servant” in each of the three previous Servant Songs is plainly and repeatedly identified as the nation of Israel.
Isaiah 41:8-9
But you, Israel, my servant, Jacob, whom I have chosen, the offspring of Abraham, my friend; you whom I took from the ends of the earth, and called from its farthest corners, saying to you, “You are my servant, I have chosen you and not cast you off.”
Isaiah 44:1
But now hear, O Jacob my servant, Israel whom I have chosen!
Isaiah 44:21
Remember these things, O Jacob, and Israel, for you are my servant; I formed you; you are my servant; O Israel, you will not be forgotten by me.
Isaiah 45:4
For the sake of my servant Jacob, and Israel my chosen, I called you by your name, I name you, though you do not know me.
Isaiah 48:20
Go out from Babylon, flee from Chaldea, declare this with a shout of joy, proclaim it, send it out to the end of the earth; say, “The Lord has redeemed his servant Jacob!”
Isaiah 49:3
And he said to me, “You are my servant, Israel, in whom I will be glorified.”
According to this widespread rabbinic opinion, Isaiah 53 contains a deeply moving narrative which world leaders will cry aloud in the messianic age. The humbled kings of nations (52: 15) will confess that Jewish suffering occurred as a direct result of “our own iniquity,” (53:5) e.g., depraved Jew-hatred, rather than, as they previously thought, the stubborn blindness of the Jews.
The stunned reaction of the world’s nations to the unexpected vindication and redemption of the Jewish nation in the messianic age is a recurring theme throughout the Hebrew Scriptures.4 Israel’s neighbors will be amazed when their age-old assessment of the Jew is finally proven wrong. Throughout Israel’s long and bitter exile, the nations mistakenly attributed the miserable predicament of the Jew to his stubborn rejection of the world’s religions. In the End of Days, however, the gentiles will discover what was until then unimaginable – the unwavering Jew was, in fact, all this time faithful to the one true God. On the other hand, “We despised and held him of no account” (53:3).
In essence, the final and complete redemption of the Jews, to which the stunned nations will bear witness, contradicts everything Israel’s gentile neighbors had ever previously anticipated, heard, or considered (52:15). “Who would have believed our report?” the kings will ask with their mouths wide open in amazement (53:1). The curtain of blindness is finally lifted when the “holy Arm of the Lord before the eyes of all the nations, all the ends of the earth will witness the salvation of His people” (52:10).
The unanticipated vindication of the Jews in the End of Days, however, will raise nagging, introspective questions for Israel’s neighbors: How then can we explain the Jews’ long-enduring suffering at our own hands? After all, the age-old reasons we contrived to explain away Israel’s agony are clearly no longer valid. Who is to blame for Israel’s miserable existence in exile? In short, why did the servant of God seem to suffer without measure or cause?
Therefore, Isaiah 53:8 concludes with their stunning confession, “for the transgressions of my people [the gentile nations] they [the Jews]were stricken.” The fact that the servant is spoken of in the third person, plural לָמוֹ (lamo)illustrates beyond doubt that the servant is a nation rather than a single individual.
The rabbinic interpretation of Isaiah 53 fits in seamlessly with its surrounding chapters which all clearly depict the nation of Israel as “despised, afflicted” (54:6-11), and oppressed “without cause” (52:4) at the hands of the gentile nations.
According to the most ancient rabbinic commentaries, the identification of Israel as God’s servant is evident throughout the four Servant Songs.5 As such, rabbinic sources from the Talmudic period identify the servant of Isaiah 53 in the plain sense as the Jewish people, consistent with the previous three Servant Songs.
For example, commenting on Isaiah 53 the Talmud states:
Rava said in the name of Rav Sachorah who said it in the name of Rav Huna: Whomever the Holy One, blessed is He, desires, He crushes with afflictions as it is stated “And the one whom Hashem desires He crushed with sickness (Isaiah 53:10). Now, one might have thought that this applies even if he does not accept [the afflictions] with love. Scripture therefore states in the continuation of the verse “if his soul acknowledges his guilt” (ibid.)… And if he accepts [the afflictions with love] what is his reward? He will see offspring and live long days. Moreover, he will retain his studies, as it is stated “and the desire of Hashem will succeed in his hand” (ibid.).
(Talmud Berachos 5a)
The ancient Midrash Rabba on Numbers 23 likewise attests that Isaiah 53 refers to the nation of Israel:
“I have eaten my honeycomb with my honey” (Song of Songs 5:1): because the Israelites poured out their soul to die in captivity, as it is said, “Because he poured out his soul to die.”
(Midrash Rabba Isaiah 53:12)
Interestingly, the traditional Church did not completely satisfy the Christian mind with their stock interpretation of Isaiah 53. There is, therefore, a consensus among many modern, liberal Christian commentators which is in accord with this prevailing rabbinic exegesis on this most debated chapter. For example, the commentary of the 11th century Rashi and the 20th century Christian Oxford New English Bible6 are strikingly similar. Both clearly identify the “suffering servant” in Isaiah 53 as the nation of Israel, who suffered as a humiliated individual at the hands of the gentile nations.
Conservative Christians, on the other hand, strongly argue against the Jewish interpretation of Isaiah 53 for a number of expected reasons. Historically, the Church has relentlessly used Isaiah 53 as its most important proof-text in order to demonstrate the veracity of the Gospels. They argue that this chapter proves that Jesus’ death was explicitly prophesied in the Hebrew Scriptures. In fact, the author of the Book of Acts claims that Philip converted an Ethiopian eunuch using Isaiah 53,7 and the author of Luke,8 John9 and I Peter10 associate Isaiah 53 with Jesus as well. While evangelicals routinely claim that Jesus is alluded to in several hundred verses throughout the Hebrew Bible, there is only a handful of passages in Tanach that the Church insists irrefutably identify Jesus alone as the messiah; Isaiah 53 is chief among these polemical texts.
Consequently, since time immemorial, missionaries fervently used Isaiah 53 to proclaim that the Hebrew prophet Isaiah predicted the advent of Christianity centuries before the birth of Jesus. Accordingly, the traditional Church recoils at the rabbinic interpretation of the fourth Servant Song. Such a monumental concession would require Christendom to abandon one of its most cherished polemical chapters used to defend its own teachings, and a vital part of its textual arsenal used
against its elder rival, Judaism.
Besides, the systemic suffering of the Jews plays no essential role in Christian theology. The suffering of Jesus, on the other hand, is the cornerstone of Church doctrine. In fact, widespread Christian teachings throughout history concluded that the suffering of the Jews illustrates the wrongness of their beliefs, while the suffering of Jesus and his followers illustrates the truth and veracity of the Cross. As a result, conservative Christians are unyielding in their rejection of the Jewish interpretation of Isaiah 53.
Liberal Christian scholars, on the other hand, are frequently in accord with the classic rabbinic commentaries on Isaiah 53. Unlike their conservative coreligionists, liberal Christians do not use or depend on Church dogma or creedal statements to interpret the Bible. In other words, liberal Christian Bible commentators tend to interpret scripture without any preconceived notion of the correctness of Church teaching. Instead, they apply the same modern hermeneutics used to understand any ancient writings to their interpretation of the Bible. Given that Isaiah’s first three Servant Songs clearly identify Israel as God’s servant, and the surrounding chapters of Isaiah 53 clearly speak of Israel as a suffering and humiliated individual, liberal Christian scholarship frequently ascribes the servant in Isaiah’s fourth Servant Song to the nation of Israel.11
Rabbinic commentaries that state Isaiah 53 refers to the messiah
According to rabbinic thought when Isaiah speaks of the “servant,” the prophet is not speaking of all the Jewish people. Rather, the “servant” in these uplifting prophetic hymns refers to the righteous remnant of Israel – the most pious of the nation. The faithful members of Israel who willingly suffer for Heaven’s sake are identified in Tanach as God’s servant. These are the devout that call upon the name of the Lord (43:7), who bear witness to His unity (43:11), and are therefore charged to restore the rest of Jacob (49:5).
“You are my witnesses declares the Lord, and My servant whom I have chosen.”
(Isaiah 43:10)
In essence, God’s “servant” are the cherished few – the faithful who walk in the footsteps of Abraham, whom the Almighty called “My friend.”
“But you, O Israel, My servant, Jacob, whom I have chosen, you, descendants of Abraham My friend”
(Isaiah 41:8)
Simply put, the Servant Songs address only the believers of Israel who emulate the first patriarch of the Jewish people. As Abraham endured trials and adversity in his walk with God, so too would His servant, the righteous remnant of Israel, endure ordeals and affliction in its sacred path (Isaiah 49:3; 51:21; 54:11; Psalm 44:11-15).
The Hebrew prophet Zephaniah vividly describes in two seminal verses the cherished remnant of Israel in the following manner:
“And I will leave in the midst of thee an afflicted and poor people, and they shall take refuge in the name of the Lord. The remnant of Israel shall not do iniquity, nor speak lies, neither shall a deceitful tongue be found in their mouth; for they shall feed and lie down, and none shall make them afraid.”
(Zephaniah 3:12-13)
In rabbinic thought, all of God’s faithful, gentiles included (Zechariah 13:8-9), endure suffering on behalf of God (Isaiah 40:2; Zechariah 1:15). Thus, Jewish leaders of the past, such as Moses12 and Jeremiah,13) Rabbi Akiva,14 as well as future eschatological figures, such as the messiah ben Joseph and the messiah ben David, are held up in rabbinic literature as individuals who exemplify the “servant” who willingly suffers on behalf of Heaven.
Therefore, when the Talmud (Sanhedrin 98a) describes the predicament of the messiah as he is waiting to be summoned by God, the rabbis cast him as:
“sitting among other paupers, all of them afflicted with disease. Yet, while all the rest of them tie and untie their bandages all at once, the messiah changes his bandages one at a time, lest he is summoned for the redemption at a moment’s notice.”
While this story may be understood allegorically, its jarring message is clear: The messiah, like other afflicted members of Israel, endures the agony and trials assigned to the faithful. However, unlike the other suffering saints who completely remove all their bandages before patiently replacing them with a fresh dressing, the messiah must methodically replace each bandage, one at a time. In other words, the messiah does not suffer more or less than other servants of God. Rather, according to the Talmud, the messiah is different from other men of God because he must be ready at a moment’s notice to usher in the deliverance of his beleaguered people. Because he is prepared to be summoned for the redemption at all times, he is never in a predicament where his bandages are fully removed.
When Isaiah speaks of the suffering remnant of Israel, the messianic king is, therefore, included. The final heir of David’s throne is an integral member of the pious of Israel. This is, according to rabbinic interpretation, the pshat, or the plain meaning of the text in Isaiah 52:13 – 53:12. Therefore, when both ancient and modern rabbinic commentators expound on the clear meaning of the text, they ascribe the suffering servant in Isaiah 53 to the nation of Israel. Moreover, while Ezekiel warned that the righteous can never suffer or die as a sacrificial atonement for the wicked,15 the Talmud teaches:
“Whosoever weeps over the [suffering] of the righteous man, all his sins are forgiven.”
(Talmud, Shabbat 105b)
In order to shed much needed light on the famed Servant Songs, numerous rabbinic commentators hold up Jewish heroes as a paradigm of Isaiah 53’s “servant.” Accordingly, while on one hand the Talmud, Zohar, and other ancient rabbinic texts state explicitly that the “servant” of Isaiah 53 refers to the faithful of corporate Jewry,16 the same sources frequently point to renowned saints of Israel as an archetype of the Suffering Servant. These virtuous individuals include saints such as Moses, Elijah, Jeremiah, the messiah the son of Joseph and David – each of them embodies perfect examples of God’s servant, the righteous remnant of Israel.
Bear in mind that the rabbinic commentary on Isaiah 53 is not dualistic or multilateral. Meaning, the sages of old did not suggest that Isaiah 53 refers to either the righteous remnant of Israel, Moses, Jeremiah, or an anointed leader. Rather, the servant in all four Servant Songs are the faithful descendants of Abraham. Isaiah 53 attests to an unprecedented worldwide repentance of all of mankind – a redemptive achievement accomplished by no other saint in history. Therefore, rabbinic commentators tend to lift up the messiah’s name more frequently than the names of other faithful servants of God.
While the bulk of rabbinic commentary seeks to provide the pshat – the principal analysis which illuminates the plain meaning of sacred literature – there is, broadly speaking, a second, and distinct stream of rabbinic commentary which explores the drash. In general terms, the drash delves into the deeply profound, yet often less precise homiletic method of exegesis used to interpret the Hebrew Scriptures. This sacred material is often referred to as midrashic, literally “derived from a drash.”
In Jewish thought, the pshat conveys the foundational understanding of any text in Tanach; this is the commentary which elucidates the clear and basic meaning of a verse. As the sages declare in the Talmud, “A verse cannot depart from its plain meaning.” (Shabbat 63a; Yev. 11b, 24a). Accordingly, the midrashic interpretation of a biblical verse is never intended to nullify, contradict, or injure the natural sense of a text. On the contrary, thepshat always supplies the primary meaning of a passage. Moreover, it is impossible to fully grasp the inspirationalmidrashic commentary without first comprehending the simple meaning of a text.
On the other hand, without the sublime illumination of the Midrash, seminal, seemingly-disconnected principles throughout various regions of Tanach can be challenging to harmonize and fully comprehend. In other words, with only the pshat commentary, Biblical principles when studied independently, can only be understood on a fundamental level.Yet the separate, straightforward commentaries of the pshat may appear incompatible and disjointed from other regions of scripture without the midrashic commentary. Midrashic literature, generally speaking, weaves together and painstakingly merges Judaism’s Written and Oral tradition into a transcendent revelation. Because the Midrash illuminates rabbinic thought to its fullest, holistic expression, it stands out as a vital tool for the student of sacred literature.
Few chapters in Tanach better illustrate the vital role the Midrash plays in expounding Biblical texts than Isaiah 53. The straightforward rabbinic approach to elucidate Isaiah 53 begins by identifying the astonished speakers in Isaiah 53:1-9 and the “Servant” in Isaiah 52:13 and 53:11. The rabbinic annotations, i.e. the pshat, convey the clear and essential commentary. They describe how these passages record the reaction of the astonished and contrite kings of nations when they discover that the faithful members of Israel were always God’s true servant. As mentioned, the identities of the speakers and the servant are evident from the surrounding chapters of Isaiah 53.
The Midrash, however, illuminates a most profound, yet often overlooked central theme of Isaiah 53; never before in history has any servant of God brought about the mass repentance of the gentiles. Whereas the patriarch Abraham redeemed only 70 souls in Haran, the future scion of the House of David will usher in an unprecedented epoch, where gentile kings of nations will repent, as vividly described in the fourth Servant Song. In other words, the messiah will bring about an age when the most important feature of Isaiah 53 will materialize – the worldwide repentance of the gentiles. Whereas Moses drew only a single nation from Egypt into the service of God, the messianic king will redeem the other nations as well. At this epic, redemptive moment in the future all the nations will perceive that Judaism is the only true faith, as it is written:
“For then I will make the peoples pure of speech, so that they all invoke the name of the Lord and serve Him with one accord.”
(Zephaniah 3:9)
Thus, in the messianic age, the gentiles will confess aloud the remorseful and repentant words sketched in Isaiah 53. In essence, the sequence of events outlined in the fourth Servant Song will be an unparalleled occasion in history. Never before throughout the annals of time have “the gentiles come to your light, and kings to the brightness of your rising” (Isaiah 60:3).
Consequently, although various rabbinic literature highlights numerous Biblical saints whose lives exemplify the Suffering Servant of Israel in Isaiah 53, the future messiah is held up more frequently and prominently than any other pious Jew in this startling context; for the future anointed Davidic king will usher in this dramatic epoch in which the gentiles will repent, as outlined in Isaiah 53. In other words, the stunning narrative of the fourth Servant Song will be made possible by the reign of the messiah, the foremost member of God’s Suffering Servant, Israel. Only the messiah will accomplish this global achievement in the final redemption, which neither Abraham, Moses, or Jeremiah were able to accomplish. Only the messianic age will spawn worldwide repentance of the nations. Therefore, the rabbis teach,
“My servant shall be high, and lifted up, and lofty exceedingly – he will be higher than Abraham, more exalted than Moses, loftier than the angels.”17
(Midrash Tanchuma)
In short, the messiah will ignite the contrition of Israel’s neighbors as outlined in Isaiah’s fourth Servant Song.
Because of the deeply esoteric and widely elastic nature of midrashic writings, these millennia-old texts are vulnerable to misuse by opponents of the Jewish faith. Isaiah 53 – the chapter in the Bible which has for ages formed one of the principal battlefields between Jews and their Christian opponents – is no exception to this rule.
Under ordinary circumstances, traditional Church apologists regard rabbinic commentaries with sneering derision, casting them at best as damaging to spiritual enlightenment. However, ancient midrashic annotations on Isaiah 53 which can be ripped out of context and portrayed as supportive of Christian teachings are wildly quoted and cheerfully paraded by missionaries with the hope of winning more unclaimed souls to the Cross. The fact that the Christian interpretation of Isaiah 53 is not supported by the chapters that surround it, only adds to the Church’s desperate feeding frenzy on these ancient rabbinic texts. It is astonishing that missionaries would use rabbinic texts to support Christian doctrines given that each and every one of the rabbis that they zealously quote utterly rejected the teachings of Christianity.
The most frequently quoted rabbinic text in Christian literature is, without doubt, the second-century Targum Yonatan ben Uziel on Isaiah 53. Although the word “Targum” literally means a “Translation,” the Targum Yonatan ben Uziel is not at all a word-for-word translation of Tanach. Rather, this unique, highly-regarded Aramaic annotation on the Hebrew Scriptures fuses together
both drash and pshat – the homiletic and plain meaning of a text – in its running, dynamic commentary on the Prophets. Accordingly, it is the messiah who is raised up as God’s ideal servant in the Targum Yonatan ben Uziel on Isaiah 52:13, yet on the following verse, the Targum identifies the faithful of Israel who suffer vicariously (Isaiah 52:14).
As expected, missionaries selectively quote the Targum Yonatan ben Uziel on Isaiah 52:13, which identifies God’s servant as the messiah.
The Targum’s rendering of Isaiah 52:13 is as follows:
“Behold my servant Messiah shall prosper; he shall be high, and increase, and be exceedingly strong.”
Yet the Targum’s commentary on the following verse, Isaiah 52:14, identifies Israel as the long-suffering and humiliated servant:
“As the house of Israel looked to him during many days, because their countenance was darkened among the peoples, and their complexion (darkened) beyond the sons of men.”
As expected, the commentary of Targum Yonatan ben Uziel on Isaiah 52:14 is nowhere to be found in Christian missionary material. There is not a single Church apologist who quotes the Targum’s elucidation on Isaiah 53:10. For it is upon these words of Isaiah, “He is crushed and made ill,” where the Targum identifies the suffering servant as the nation of Israel who suffers unbearable chastisement in the following commentary:
“But it is the Lord’s good pleasure to refine and cleanse the remnant of His people in order to purify their souls from sin; they shall see the kingdom of the messiah, they shall increase their sons and daughters, they shall prolong their days; and those who perform the Law of the Lord shall prosper in good pleasure.”
Although the above quotation from Targum Yonatan ben Uziel on Isaiah 53:10 is deliberately ignored by Christendom’s missionaries, this two-millennia-old message remains immortal. The nation of Israel, God’s servant, suffered unimaginable torment at the hands of her gentile neighbors so that her sins would be washed away.
“Speak tenderly to Jerusalem, and declare to her: Her term of service is over, her iniquity is expiated; for she has received at the hand of the Lord double for all her sins.”
(Isaiah 40:2)
Simply put, there are 15 verses in the Targum’s annotation on Isaiah 53 (52:13-15 and 53:1-12), yet with surgical precision, missionary conversionist tracts selectively and deliberately ignore almost all of them with the exception of the first verse on Isaiah 52:13. This is a well-worn technique of wielding rabbinic literature as an evangelical sledgehammer, in order to drive home the well-crafted message to unlettered Jews that ancient rabbis concealed the truth that Isaiah 53 is speaking of Jesus, and not the nation of Israel. Nothing, of course, could be further from the truth.
- Midrash Rabbah (Numbers XXIII.2), Zohar (Genesis & Leviticus), Talmud (Brochos 5a), Rashi, Joseph Kara, Ibn Ezra, Joseph Kimchi, David Kimchi, Nachmanadies, Abarbinbanel, et all
- Ibn Ezra on Isaiah 53
- Origen, Contra Celsum, Chadwick, Henry; Cambridge Press, book 1, chapter 55, page 50
- Isaiah 41:11; Micah 7:15-16; Jeremiah 16:19-20;
- Isaiah 41:8-9; 43:10; 44:1; 44:21; 45;4; 48:20; 49:3
- The New English Bible, Oxford Study Edition, page 788-789. See also the Revised Standard Bible, Oxford Study Edition, page 889.
- Acts 8:28-34
- Luke 22:37
- John 12:38
- I Peter 2:22
- The Christian New English Bible, Oxford Study Edition, annotation on Isaiah 52:13-53:12 explains:
The “fourth Servant Song, the Suffering Servant, Israel, the servant of God, has suffered as a humiliated individual. However, the servant endured without complain because it was vicarious suffering (suffering for others). 52:13-15: Nations and kings will be surprised to see the servant exalted. 53:1: The crowds, pagan nations, among whom the servant (Israel) lived, speak here (through verse 9), saying that the significance of Israel’s humiliation and exaltation is hard to believe (page 788-789). See also the Revised Standard Bible, Oxford Study Edition, page 889.
Walter Brueggemann Ph.D., Isaiah 40 – 66 (Louisville: Kentucky, 1998), p. 143, states:
“There is no doubt that Isaiah 53 is to be understood in the context of the Isaiah tradition. Insofar as the servant is Israel – a common assumption of Jewish interpretation – we see that the theme of humiliation and exaltation serves the Isaiah rendering of Israel, for Israel in this literature is exactly the humiliated (exiled) people who by the powerful intervention of Yahweh is about to become the exalted (restored) people of Zion. Thus the drama is the drama of Israel and more specifically of Jerusalem, the characteristic subject of this poetry. Second, although it is clear that this poetry does not have Jesus in any first instance on its horizon, it is equally clear that the church, from the outset, has found the poetry a poignant and generative way to consider Jesus, wherein humiliation equals crucifixion and exaltation equals resurrection and ascension.”
- Talmud, Sotah 14a and the Sifri on Deuteronomy 355 applies Isaiah 53:12 to Moses
13. Rabbi Sadyah Gaon (tenth century), Oxford Ms. (Poc 32
14. Jerusalem Talmud, Shkalim V.I.
15. Ezekiel 18:20-23
16. Midrash Rabbah (Numbers XXIII.2), Zohar (Genesis & Leviticus), Talmud (Brochos 5a),
17. Yalkut, ii, 571 on Zachariah 4:7
Categories: Bible, Biblical scholarship, Christianity, God, Judaism
Blogging Theology 
“though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.”
Yup sounds like Israel to me.
Paul when did you become a Zionist Muslim
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Haha best comment I’ve seen in a while. Don’t worry, Paul won’t address any inconsistencies.
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” would have made his grave with them, e.g. the bodies of both he and they would have been tossed into a common grave….sammy you wish your presumption was true lol….but unfortunately your assumption is not supported in the gospels shishkabab
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hahah and sammy jesus died with the poor wicked men not with the rich mate 😉
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gagaghahah how about the rest of verse 9 you shifty two lol…
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lol example “his grave was set with the wicked.”…. jesus was buried in a new empty tomb alone and there is nothing in the gospels that stipulate Jesus was buried with the wicked !? lol…and “with the rich in his deaths”? did Jesus die with the Rich!? lol…i must of missed it somewhere in the Gospels!?..
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Let’s expose this liar again:
“And they made his grave with the wicked (plural) and with a rich man (singular) in his death, although he had done no violence, and there was no deceit in his mouth.” Isaiah 53:9
This perfectly describes what happened to Jesus since, being crucified with two criminals (i.e., the wicked), he would have made his grave with them, e.g. the bodies of both he and they would have been tossed into a common grave, but a rich man named Joseph stepped in and buried Jesus in his own tomb!
“Then two robbers were crucified with him, one on the right and one on the left… When it was evening, there came a rich man from Arimathe′a, named Joseph, who also was a disciple of Jesus. He went to Pilate and asked for the body of Jesus. Then Pilate ordered it to be given to him. And Joseph took the body, and wrapped it in a clean linen shroud, and laid it in his own new tomb, which he had hewn in the rock; and he rolled a great stone to the door of the tomb, and departed. Mary Mag′dalene and the other Mary were there, sitting opposite the sepulchre.” Matthew 27:38, 57-61
So what Omar thought was an objection in his favor turns back to expose him and prove that Muhammad was a false prophet!
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” would have made his grave with them, e.g. the bodies of both he and they would have been tossed into a common grave….sammy you wish your presumption was true lol….but unfortunately your assumption is not supported in the gospels shishkabab and furthermore sammy jesus died with the poor wicked men not with the rich mate.. sorry verse 9 not referring to Jesus according to the gospel narrative 😉
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Williams’ let’s see how Singer ends up refuting you and your deen, and actually confirming the Christian interpretation. All capital emphasis shall be mine, so here goes:
BEGIN
RABBINIC COMMENTARIES THAT STATE ISAIAH 53 REFERS TO THE MESSIAH
In rabbinic thought, all of God’s faithful, gentiles included (Zechariah 13:8-9), endure suffering on behalf of God (Isaiah 40:2; Zechariah 1:15). Thus, Jewish leaders of the past, such as Moses12 and Jeremiah,13) Rabbi Akiva,14 as well as future eschatological figures, SUCH AS THE MESSIAH BEN JOSEPH AND THE MESSIAH BEN DAVID, are held up in rabbinic literature as individuals who exemplify the “servant” who willingly suffers on behalf of Heaven.
Therefore, when the Talmud (Sanhedrin 98a) describes the predicament of the messiah as he is waiting to be summoned by God, the rabbis cast him as:
“sitting among other paupers, all of them afflicted with disease. Yet, while all the rest of them tie and untie their bandages all at once, the messiah changes his bandages one at a time, lest he is summoned for the redemption at a moment’s notice.”
While this story may be understood allegorically, its jarring message is clear: THE MESSIAH, like other afflicted members of Israel, ENDURES THE AGONY AND TRIALS ASSIGNED TO THE FAITHFUL. However, unlike the other suffering saints who completely remove all their bandages before patiently replacing them with a fresh dressing, the messiah must methodically replace each bandage, one at a time. In other words, the messiah does not suffer more or less than other servants of God. Rather, according to the Talmud, the messiah is different from other men of God because he must be ready at a moment’s notice to usher in the deliverance of his beleaguered people. Because he is prepared to be summoned for the redemption at all times, he is never in a predicament where his bandages are fully removed.
When Isaiah speaks of the suffering remnant of Israel, THE MESSIANIC KING IS, THEREFORE, INCLUDED. THE FINAL HEIR OF DAVID’S THRONE IS AN INTEGRAL MEMBER OF THE PIOUS OF ISRAEL. This is, according to rabbinic interpretation, the pshat, or the plain meaning of the text in Isaiah 52:13 – 53:12. Therefore, when both ancient and modern rabbinic commentators expound on the clear meaning of the text, they ascribe the suffering servant in Isaiah 53 to the nation of Israel.
In order to shed much needed light on the famed Servant Songs, numerous rabbinic commentators hold up Jewish heroes as a paradigm of Isaiah 53’s “servant.” Accordingly, while on one hand the Talmud, Zohar, and other ancient rabbinic texts state explicitly that the “servant” of Isaiah 53 refers to the faithful of corporate Jewry,16 the same sources frequently point to renowned saints of Israel as an archetype of the Suffering Servant. These virtuous individuals include saints such as Moses, Elijah, Jeremiah, THE MESSIAH SON OF JOSEPH AND DAVID – each of them embodies perfect examples of God’s servant, the righteous remnant of Israel.
Bear in mind that the rabbinic commentary on Isaiah 53 is not dualistic or multilateral. Meaning, the sages of old did not suggest that Isaiah 53 refers to either the righteous remnant of Israel, Moses, Jeremiah, or an anointed leader. Rather, the servant in all four Servant Songs are the faithful descendants of Abraham. Isaiah 53 attests to an unprecedented worldwide repentance of all of mankind – a redemptive achievement accomplished by no other saint in history. THEREFORE, RABBINIC COMMENTATORS TEND TO LIFT UP THE MESSIAH’S NAME MORE FREQUENTLY THAN THE NAMES OF OTHER FAITHFUL SERVANTS OF GOD …
The Midrash, however, illuminates a most profound, yet often overlooked central theme of Isaiah 53; never before in history has any servant of God brought about the mass repentance of the gentiles. Whereas the patriarch Abraham redeemed only 70 souls in Haran, THE FUTURE SCION OF THE HOUSE OF DAVID WILL USHER IN AN UNPRECEDENTED EPOCH, where gentile kings of nations will repent, as vividly described in the fourth Servant Song. In other words, THE MESSIAH WILL BRING ABOUT AN AGE WHEN THE MOST IMPORTANT FEATURE OF ISAIAH 53 WILL MATERIALIZE – the worldwide repentance of the gentiles. Whereas Moses drew only a single nation from Egypt into the service of God, the messianic king will redeem the other nations as well…
Consequently, although various rabbinic literature highlights numerous Biblical saints whose lives exemplify the Suffering Servant of Israel in Isaiah 53, THE FUTURE MESSIAH IS HELP UP MORE FREQUENTLY AND PROMINENTLY THAN ANY OTHER PIOUS JEW IN THIS STARTLING CONTEXT; for the future anointed Davidic king will usher in this dramatic epoch in which the gentiles will repent, as outlined in Isaiah 53. In other words, the stunning narrative of the fourth Servant Song WILL BE MADE POSSIBLE BY THE REIGN OF THE MESSIAH, THE FOREMOST MEMBER OF GOD’S SUFFERING SERVANT, israel. ONLY THE MESSIAH WILL ACCOMPLISH THIS GLOBAL ACHIEVEMENT IN THE FINAL REDEMPTION, WHICH NEITHER ABRAHAM, MOSES, OR JEREMIAH WERE ABLE TO ACCOMPLISH. Only the messianic age will spawn worldwide repentance of the nations. Therefore, the rabbis teach,
“My servant shall be high, and lifted up, and lofty exceedingly – he will be higher than Abraham, more exalted than Moses, loftier than the angels.”17
In short, THE MESSIAH WILL IGNITE THE CONTRITION OF ISRAEL’S NEIGHBORS AS OUTLINED IN ISAIAH’S FOURTH SERVANT SONG.
END
In spite of all his hoopla and smoke and mirrors, Singer had no choice but to admit that his own rabbis interpreted Isaiah 53 more frequently of the Messiah than anyone else!
This now places you in the embarrassing situation of having to accept the fact that since your Quran confirms that Jesus is the Messiah, you have no choice but to acknowledge that Jesus is the perfect fulfillment of Isaiah 53, and therefore did indeed suffer for the sins of the world in order to bring about God’s salvation to the ends of the earth!
You must also contend with the fact that Isaiah 53 stands as witness against Muhammad since it exposes and condemns him as a false prophet (which he was). OUCH!
Thanks to you, I am now going to write an article where I take these quotes from Singer and use them to prove Muhammad was a false prophet!
Now what was it about Singer’s eisegesis that you thought was actually supportive of your case and refuted the truth of Christianity? 😉
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what a banana response from sammyshishkabab lpl..
I accept the fact the Quran confirms that Jesus is the Messiah, and choose not acknowledge that Jesus is the fulfillment of Isaiah 53, and therefore did not indeed suffer for the sins of the world in order to bring about God’s salvation to the ends of the earth!
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Now Williams, watch how I take the context of the very verses that Singer cited to prove that the Servan of Isaiah 53 is national Israel and turn i against him:
1. Isaiah 41:8-9.
“Behold, all who are incensed against you shall be put to shame and confounded; those who strive against you shall be as nothing AND SHALL PERISH. You shall seek those who contend with you, but you shall not find them; those who war against you shall be as nothing at all.” Isaiah 41:11-12
Far from being saved by Israel’s afflictions, those nations that wage war against her shall actually perish, shall be destroyed.
2. Isaiah 44:1, 21.
“Remember these things, O Jacob, and Israel, for you are my servant; I formed you, you are my servant; O Israel, you will not be forgotten by me. I have swept away YOUR TRANSGRESSIONS like a cloud, and YOUR SINS like mist; return to me, for I have redeemed you. Sing, O heavens, for the Lord has done it; shout, O depths of the earth; break forth into singing, O mountains, O forest, and every tree in it! For the Lord has redeemed Jacob, and will be glorified in Israel.” Isaiah 44:21-23
Instead of atoning for the sins of the nations, Israel itself needs to be saved for its own transgressions and sins. This in itself proves that the Servant of Isaiah 53 cannot be the nation:
“And they made his grave with the wicked and with a rich man in his death, although he had done NO VIOLENCE, and there was NO DECEIT IN HIS MOUTH.” Isaiah 53:9
Here are other texts which speak of Israel suffering because of its own sins, not because of the sins of other nations:
“And I said: ‘Woe is me! For I am lost; for I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst OF A PEOPLE OF UNCLEAN LIPS; for my eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts!’… And he said, ‘Go, and say to this people: “Hear and hear, but do not understand; see and see, but do not perceive.” Make the heart of this people fat, and their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their hearts, and turn and be healed.’ Then I said, ‘How long, O Lord?’ And he said: ‘Until cities lie waste without inhabitant, and houses without men, and the land is utterly desolate, and the LORD removes men far away, and the forsaken places are many in the midst of the land. And though a tenth remain in it, it will be burned again, like a terebinth or an oak, whose stump remains standing when it is felled.’ The holy seed is its stump.” Isaiah 6:5, 9-13
“Hear, YOU DEAF; and look, YOU BLIND, that you may see! Who is blind but my servant, or deaf as my messenger whom I send? Who is blind as my dedicated one, or blind as the servant of the LORD? He sees many things, BUT DOES NOT OBSERVE THEM; his ears are open, BUT HE DOES NOT HEAR. The LORD was pleased, for his righteousness’ sake, to magnify his law and make it glorious. But this is a people robbed and plundered, they are all of them trapped in holes and hidden in prisons; they have become a prey with none to rescue, a spoil with none to say, ‘Restore!’ Who among you will give ear to this, will attend and listen for the time to come? Who gave up Jacob to the spoiler, and Israel to the robbers? Was it not the LORD, AGAINST WHOM WE HAVE SINNED, IN WHOSE WAYS THEY WOULD NOT WALK, AND WHOSE LAW THEY WOULD NOT OBEY? So he poured upon him the heat of his anger and the might of battle; it set him on fire round about, BUT HE DID NOT UNDERSTAND; it burned him, BUT HE DID NOT TAKE IT TO HEART.” Isaiah 42:18-25
“Rouse yourself, rouse yourself, stand up, O Jerusalem, YOU HAVE DRUNK AT THE HAND OF THE LORD THE CUP OF HIS WRATH, who have drunk to the dregs the bowl of staggering. There is none to guide her among all the sons she has borne; there is none to take her by the hand among all the sons she has brought up. These two things have befallen you—who will condole with you?— devastation and destruction, famine and sword; who will comfort you? Your sons have fainted, they lie at the head of every street like an antelope in a net; THEY ARE FULL OF THE WRATH OF THE LORD, THE REBUKE OF YOUR GOD. Therefore hear this, you who are afflicted, who are drunk, but not with wine: Thus says your Lord, the LORD, your God who pleads the cause of his people: ‘Behold, I have taken from your hand the cup of staggering; the bowl of my wrath you shall drink no more; and I will put it into the hand of your tormentors, who have said to you, “Bow down, that we may pass over”; and you have made your back like the ground and like the street for them to pass over.'” Isaiah 51:17-23
“Behold, the LORD’s hand is not shortened, that it cannot save, or his ear dull, that it cannot hear; BUT YOUR INIQUITIES HAVE MADE A SEPARATION BETWEEN YOU AND YOUR GOD, AND YOUR SINS HAVE HID HIS FACE FROM YOU so that he does not hear. For your hands are defiled with blood and your fingers with iniquity; your lips have spoken lies, your tongue mutters wickedness. No one enters suit justly, no one goes to law honestly; they rely on empty pleas, they speak lies, they conceive mischief and bring forth iniquity. They hatch adders’ eggs, they weave the spider’s web; he who eats their eggs dies, and from one which is crushed a viper is hatched. Their webs will not serve as clothing; men will not cover themselves with what they make. Their works are works of iniquity, and deeds of violence are in their hands. Their feet run to evil, and they make haste to shed innocent blood; their thoughts are thoughts of iniquity, desolation and destruction are in their highways. The way of peace they know not, and there is no justice in their paths; they have made their roads crooked, no one who goes in them knows peace. Therefore justice is far from us, and righteousness does not overtake us; we look for light, and behold, darkness, and for brightness, but we walk in gloom. We grope for the wall like the blind, we grope like those who have no eyes; we stumble at noon as in the twilight, among those in full vigor we are like dead men. We all growl like bears, we moan and moan like doves; we look for justice, but there is none; for salvation, but it is far from us. For our transgressions are multiplied before thee, and our sins testify against us; for our transgressions are with us, and we know our iniquities: transgressing, and denying the LORD, and turning away from following our God, speaking oppression and revolt, conceiving and uttering from the heart lying words. Justice is turned back, and righteousness stands afar off; for truth has fallen in the public squares, and uprightness cannot enter. Truth is lacking, and he who departs from evil makes himself a prey.” Isaiah 59:1-15
See also Isaiah 1.
Ironically, Singer references Isaiah 54:6-11 but fails to see how this backfires against him since it proves that Israel is anything but righteous or sinless!
“For the LORD has called you like a wife forsaken and grieved in spirit, like a wife of youth when she is cast off, says your God. For a brief moment I FORSOOK YOU, but with great compassion I will gather you. IN OVERFLOWING WRATH FOR A MOMENT I HID MY FACE FROM YOU, but with everlasting love I will have compassion on you, says the LORD, your Redeemer. For this is like the days of Noah to me: as I swore that the waters of Noah should no more go over the earth, so I have sworn that I will not be angry with you and will not rebuke you. For the mountains may depart and the hills be removed, but my steadfast love shall not depart from you, and my covenant of peace shall not be removed, says the LORD, who has compassion on you. O afflicted one, storm-tossed, and not comforted, behold, I will set your stones in antimony, and lay your foundations with sapphires.”
3. Isaiah 45:4.
“But Israel is saved by the LORD with everlasting salvation; you shall not be put to shame or confounded to all eternity… Declare and present your case; let them take counsel together! Who told this long ago? Who declared it of old? Was it not I, the LORD? And there is no other god besides me, a righteous God and a Savior; there is none besides me. Turn to me and be saved, all the ends of the earth! For I am God, and there is no other.” Isaiah 45:17, 21-22
Israel is no different and no better than the nations since it also is need of being saved by God.
4. Isaiah 48:20.
“Hear this, O house of Jacob, who are called by the name of Israel, and who came forth from the loins[a] of Judah; who swear by the name of the Lord, and confess the God of Israel, BUT NOT IN TRUTH OR RIGHT… Because I know that you are OBSTINATE, and your neck is an iron sinew and your forehead brass… You have never heard, you have never known, from of old your ear HAS NOT BEEN OPENED. For I knew that you would deal VERY TREACHEROUSLY, AND THAT FROM BIRTH YOU WERE CALLED A REBEL. For my name’s sake I DEFER MY ANGER, for the sake of my praise I RESTRAIN IT FOR YOU, THAT I MAY NOT CUTT YOU OFF.” Isaiah 48:1, 4, 8-9
5. Isaiah 49:3.
“Listen to me, O coastlands, and hearken, you peoples from afar. The LORD called me from the womb, from the body of my mother he named my name. He made my mouth like a sharp sword, in the shadow of his hand he hid me; he made me a polished arrow, in his quiver he hid me away. And he said to me, ‘You are MY SERVANT, ISRAEL, in whom I will be glorified. But I said, ‘I have labored in vain, I have spent my strength for nothing and vanity; yet surely my right is with the LORD, and my recompense with my God.’ And now the LORD says, who formed me from the womb to be HIS SERVANT, TO BRING JACOB BACK TO HIM, AND THAT ISRAEL MIGHT BE GATHERED TO HIM, for I am honored in the eyes of the LORD, and my God has become my strength—he says: ‘It is too light a thing that you should be MY SERVANT to raise up THE TRIBES OF JACOB AND TO RESTORE THE PRESERVED OF ISRAEL; I will give you as a light to the nations, that my salvation may reach to the end of the earth.” Isaiah 49:1-6
As the context clearly shows there are actually two Israels, not one! You have an individual who is called Israel, and the nation of Israel whom the individual saves.
And here is the final point which I will refute:
Therefore, Isaiah 53:8 concludes with their stunning confession, “for the transgressions of my people [the gentile nations] they [the Jews]were stricken.” The fact that the servant is spoken of in the third person, plural לָמוֹ (lamo)illustrates beyond doubt that the servant is a nation rather than a single individual.
This again illustrates how deceptive and dishonest Singer is since he knows that the word lamo is used elsewhere in contexts where it clearly refers to a single individual:
“Then it becomes fuel for A MAN; HE takes a part of it and warms HIMSELF, HE kindles a fire and bakes bread; also HE makes a god and worships it, HE makes it a graven image and falls down before (lamo) it.” Isaiah 44:15
“Blessed by the Lord my God be Shem; and let Canaan be his (lamo) slave. God enlarge Japheth, and let him dwell in the tents of Shem; and let Canaan be his (lamo) slave.” Genesis 9:26-27
Therefore, the use of the plural Isaiah 53:8 does not prove that the Servant is the nation.
So much for Singer’s arguments.
For a more thorough refutation of Singer’s claim please read the following rebuttal: http://www.answering-islam.org/authors/nakdimon/rebuttals/ibnanwar/isaiah53.html
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oh shammy you rehash the same refuted arguments over and over that you have derived from Dr. Michael Brown’s thesis
http://judaismsanswer.com/targum.htm
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“he was wounded for our transgressions” (53:5).
According to Christian theology, Jesus was not so much bruised or wounded for man’s transgressions as he was killed.
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Paul’s Paul
What always cracks me up is how Muslim run to Lying Zionist Jews who not just Reject Christ but hate him with a passion. Most of these lying Zionist Jews wont even say his name. Instead they will mis pronounce his name to mean “May his name be blotted out” the polite ones will say “that J person”
It just demonstrates that Death Loving Muslims hate Jesus more than they hate lying Zionist Jews.
I guess there is hope for peace in the middle east. As long as these two groups can get together and hate Jesus.
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“because he had done no violence” (53:9).
John 2:15 (“And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables”) and Mark 11:15 clearly prove the inapplicability of this verse to Jesus.
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oh nonsense!
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Burhanuddin1 yah the violence in Isa refers to killing not over turning tables lol
Omar I agree what Burhanuddin1 said is nonsense
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“for the transgressions of my people was he stricken” (53:8).
Yet, Jesus was supposedly stricken for all people, not just “my people”.
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my comment was in reference to you thats right😉
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Burh wrote…
“Yet, Jesus was supposedly stricken for all people, not just “my people”.”
Wrong again, he was stricken for HIS PEOPLE, You are not his Peeps, nor are the Zionist Jews you appeal to, nor are atheists or hindu’s or whatever.
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Omar what did I say that was nonsense?
Rabbi Singer is a Rabid Lying ZIONIST JEW full stop.
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“nor are the Zionist Jews you appeal to, nor are atheists or hindu’s or whatever.”
I’m appealing to sola scriptura, that’s right!
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“he shall see his seed” (53:10).
Throughout the OT “seed” always meant children or physical descendants. Yet, Jesus had no children.
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Burhanuddin1
“Throughout the OT “seed” always meant children or physical descendants. Yet, Jesus had no children.”
Just keep playing that game of a thousand cuts. LOL
Sorry we’re not Salafi’s
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That’s Right
“Wrong again, he was stricken for HIS PEOPLE, …”
vs
“and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.” (1 Jn. 2:2)
LOL
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“Just keep playing that game of a thousand cuts. LOL”
No stupid denials left? Lame.
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Burhan no whats lame is that you can not deal with the refutations I’m giving you so you just move on to another lame point.
Typical Muslim, can deal with the truth so he just ignore the truth.
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No refutation from you. You just deny facts.
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BTW BUrhun
Isaiah 1:4, 14:20 and 57:4 all use seed/zera metaphorically and not in a biological sense
So just ignore that refutation and move on to your next lame bullet point
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At least you try.
If “seed” refers to Jesus’ disciples then the prophet should have written “sons” because “seed” refers to those produced by carnal acts.
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…he shall prolong his days” (53:10).
Means he shall live long; whereas, Jesus did not live to an old age.
He died according to you when he was approximately 30 years old.
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Burhun
And just as predicted you ignore the refutation and more on to your next cut…
…he shall prolong his days” (53:10).
Means he shall live long; whereas, Jesus did not live to an old age.
He died according to you when he was approximately 30 years old.
Wrong it means he will live eternally forever and ever amen.
Ok ingore that and move on to your next one lol
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I did not ignore your denial.
“Wrong it means he will live eternally forever and ever amen.”
It gets even worse. Now you even deny he died? Absolutely great.
Jesus did not live “eternally forever and ever”.
He died according to you when he was approximately 30 years old.
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LOL yah thats Right Burhan thats exactly right lol
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That’s Right: Yo there Robert Wells, aka Radical Moderate.
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BTW here is what the Rabbi’s teach on Isa 53
“Midrash on Isaiah 52:13
Who art thou, O great mountain? (Zech. 4:7.) This refers to the King Messiah. And why does he call him “the great mountain?” because he is greater than the patriarchs, as it is said, “My servant shall be high, and lifted up, and lofty exceedingly”—he will be higher than Abraham, who says, “I raise high my hands unto the Lord” (Gen. 14:22); lifted up above Moses, to whom it is said, “Lift it up into thy bosom” (Num. 11:12); loftier than the ministering angels, of whom it is written, “Their wheels were lofty and terrible” (Ez. 1:18). And out of whom does he come forth? Out of David
“Commenting On This Midrash
Rabbi Don Yitshaq Abravanel, the illustrious Spanish Bible commentator and philosopher commentating on the Midrash.
It is extremely difficult to understand how any child of man can be exalted above Moses, of whom the Law bears witness, saying, “No prophet ever arose in Israel like him” (Deut. 34:10); still more so, then, how any one “born of woman” can assume a position higher than the angels, whose substance admits of nothing above it except the substance of the First Cause: from the latter expression, in fact, Christian teachers have attempted to establish their doctrine of the Divinity of the Messiah.”
“Rabbi Moshe Ibn Crispin (fourteenth century)
Exceedingly above the ministering angels, because that same comprehensive intelligence will approach [God] more nearly than theirs. For it is an exceedingly high privilege, that one whose nature is compound and material should attain to a grade of intelligence more nearly Divine than that which belongs to the incorporeal; and so it is said of him that “his strength is greater than that of the ministering angels,” because these have no impediment in the exercise of their intellect, whereas that which is compound is continually impeded in consequence of material element in its nature. Accordingly the grade of his intelligence being such as this, he is said to be “lofty exceedingly,” and his strength to be “greater than the angels.”
… And when this “servant of the Lord” is born, from the day when he comes to years of discretion, he will continue to be marked by the possession of intelligence enabling him to acquire from God what it is impossible for any to acquire until he reaches that height whither none of the sons of men, except him, have ever ascended.
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BTW here is some more what the Rabbi’s say on Isa 53
Thalmud of Babylon.
Sanhedrin Fol 98b
The Messiah " what is his name? . . .The Rabbis say,The leprous one [;those] of the house of
Rabbi [say,The sick one], as it is said; Surely he hath borne our sicknesses, etc.
Brakhot Fol 5
2. Rabbae states on the authority of R. S'horah that R. Huna 1.5". . …" said, The Holy One
bruises with chastisement every cue in whom he has pleasure, as it is written, 'And the Lord
was pleased to bruise him,he made him to be sick.' It might however be thought, that this was
the case even with those who do not accept the chastisement willingly; tlie words are therefore
added, his soul makes a trespass offering,' for as the ' trespass-offering ' implies a knowledge of
the sin,so the chastisement to come by the pleasure of God ought to be known by the person
who has to receive it. When, then,he had received them so, what is his reward? 'He shall see
seed,and lengthen days;' and moreover that the study of the law shall be established by his
hands, as it is written,' And the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.’
Sotah Fol 14
3. R. Shimlai established the following Midrash: Why did Moses our Teacher desire to enter
into the land of Israel was it that he wanted to eat of its fruit, or to take his fill of its good things1
No: Moses said, Many are the commandments enjoined upon Israel, and only in the land of
Canaan can they be performed: let me, then, enter the land, in order that they may all be
performed through my aid. So the Holy One said to him, Dost thou seek anything except to
receive a reward? I will regard thee as though thou hadst performed them: for thus it is written,'
Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great,'etc.; 'I will divide him a portion among the
great,' might bear the meaning like those who come last, not like those who come first; it is
therefore added, 'With the mighty he will divide spoil, 'like Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, who were
[the first and] mighty in the law and the commandments : 'because he poured out his soul to die,
'he was ready to die, as it is said, 'But if not, blot me I pray thee,' etc. (Ex.xxxii. 32): 'he was
numbered with the transgressors,' for he was numbered with
those who died in the wilderness : 'he bore the sin of many,' because he atoned for the making
of the golden calf : 'he intercede for transgressors,' because he sought for mercy towards those
that had transgressed in Israel that they might turn to repentance" for yj3 means merely to pray
or intercede as Jer. vii. 16.
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If Isa. 53 is the strongest reference to a suffering Jesus in the OT, then the case for prophetic proof-texts in order to demonstrate the veracity of the Gospels is weak indeed.
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Time to school another apologist wannabe. Burhan writes:
BEGIN
“for the transgressions of my people was he stricken” (53:8).
Yet, Jesus was supposedly stricken for all people, not just “my people”.
END
He then writes:
That’s Right
“Wrong again, he was stricken for HIS PEOPLE, …”
vs
“and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.” (1 Jn. 2:2)
LOL
END
Let’s see what he conveniently left out:
“so he shall SPRINKLE (yazzeh) MANY NATIONS. Kings shall shut their mouths at him; for that which had not been told them they shall see, and that which they had not heard they shall consider.” Isaiah 52:15
“He shall see of the anguish of his soul and be satisfied. By his knowledge My righteous servant SHALL JUSTIFY THE MANY, FOR HE SHALL BEAR THEIR INIQUITIES. Therefore, I will divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong, because he poured out his soul to death, and he was numbered with the transgressors, THUS HE BORE THE SIN OF MANY and made intercession for the transgressors.” Isaiah 53:11-12
Now let us see how the same Hebrew root for sprinkle is used elsewhere:
“Aaron shall bring the bull of the sin offering, which is for himself, and shall make atonement for himself, and for his house, and shall kill the bull of the sin offering for himself. And he shall take a censer full of burning coals of fire from the altar before the Lord, and two handfuls of sweet incense beaten small, and bring it within the veil. And he shall put the incense on the fire before the Lord, that the cloud of the incense may cover the mercy seat that is over the testimony, so that he does not die. And he shall take of the blood of the bull, AND SPRINKLE (wahizzah) it with his finger on the mercy seat on the eastern side, and before the mercy seat he shall sprinkle from the blood with his finger seven times. Then he shall kill the goat of the sin offering, which is for the people, and bring its blood within the veil, and do with that blood as he did with the blood of the bull, AND SPRINKLE (wahizzah) it over and in front of the mercy seat. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Place, because of the uncleanness of the children of Israel and because of their transgressions in all their sins, and so he shall do for the tent of meeting that remains among them in the midst of their uncleanness. There shall be no man in the tent of meeting when he goes in to make atonement in the Holy Place, until he comes out and has made atonement for himself, and for his household, and for all the congregation of Israel.” Leviticus 16:11-17
We therefore see that nowhere does Isaiah claim that the Messiah would be stricken ONLY for Isaiah’s people, i.e. Israel, since he clearly affirms that he would also sprinkle and justify many nations by bearing their sins. Now let’s see if the NT agrees with Isaiah’s prophecy:
“She will bear a Son, and you shall call His name JESUS, for He will save HIS PEOPLE from their sins.” Matthew 1:21
“even as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve and to give His life as a ransom FOR MANY.” Matthew 20:28
“Then He took the cup, and after He gave thanks, He gave it to them, saying, ‘Drink of it, all of you. For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed FOR MANY for the remission of sins.'” Matthew 26:27-28
“so Christ was offered once to bear the sins OF MANY, and He will appear a second time, not to bear sin but to save those who eagerly wait for Him.” Hebrews 9:27
“And they sang a new song, saying: ‘You are worthy to take the scroll, and to open its seals; for You were slain, and have redeemed us to God by Your blood out of EVERY TRIBE AND TONGUE AND PEOPLE AND NATION, and have made us kings and priests unto our God; and we shall reign on the earth.'” Revelation 5:9-10
Irony of ironies! The NT perfectly agrees with Isaiah that Jesus the Messiah came to die for sins of his people as well as for the transgressions of many nations!
LOL right back at ya!
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oh nonsense shammy lo.. NT does not perfectly agrees with the totality of Isaiah and the Jesus narrative in the unreliable Gospels..The Jewish Rabbis have continously refuted and counter argued the false Christian polemics regarding Isaiah and Jesus and also your christological polytheism over and over lol…Ill deal with your false presumptions after Ramadan mate!😉
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Time to school Paul’s Pal, let’s see what I “conveniently left out” backfires at him.
“… Kings shall shut their mouths at him.(52:15)” What king ceased to speak because of Jesus?
“Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great” (53:12).
If Jesus is not great, then who are the great?
When did Jesus ever divide a portion with the great?
Who could divide him his portion, since he is God?
…and he shall divide the spoil with the strong” (53:12)
Jesus divides spoils? Would a perfectly good being be dividing spoils? Nowhere do we read that he plundered or divided spoils with the strong.
This verse implies Jesus was not one of the strong which would contradict John 17:2 (“As thou hast given him power over all flesh”).
…he poured out his soul to death” (53:12).
I thought only the flesh of Jesus underwent death.
Jesus did not die willingly for his creatures. He feared and prayed as is shown by Matt. 26:37-39 (“And he took with him Peter and the two sons of Zebedee, and began to be sorrowful and very heavy. Then saith he unto them, My soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death:…and he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me…” and Matt. 27:46 (“My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?”
THUS HE BORE THE SIN OF MANY
Yet, Jesus was supposedly bear the sins all people, not just “many”.
LOL right back at ya!
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Since I have already obliterated the desperate and pathetic attempt of butchering the meaning of zera in Isaiah 53:10 in the following rebuttal: http://answeringislam.net/authors/shamoun/messiahs_seed.html
There will be no need for me to refute Burhan’s nonsense again.
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ok Sam leave Burhan alone mate lol… go play with some Rabbis. . 😉
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And now to address a final point made by this apologist wannabe, note what Burhan wrote:
BEGIN
“because he had done no violence” (53:9).
John 2:15 (“And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables”) and Mark 11:15 clearly prove the inapplicability of this verse to Jesus.
END
Let’s see what the Hebrew word “violence” means:
NAS Exhaustive Concordance
Word Origin
from chamas
Definition
violence, wrong
NASB Translation
malicious (3), violence (48), violent (6), wrong (3).
Brown-Driver-Briggs
חָמָס noun masculinePsalm 7:17 violence, WRONG — absolute ׳ח Genesis 6:11+ 44 t.; construct חֲמַס Judges 9:24 7t.; suffix חֲמָסִי Genesis 16:5; Jeremiah 51:35 (in both = wrong done to me); חֲמָסוֺ Psalm 7:17; plural חֲמָסִים 2 Samuel 22:49 3t.; — violence, specifically of physical violence Judges 9:24; 2 Samuel 22:3 (not “” Psalm 18:3), Obadiah 10; Habakkuk 1:9; Jeremiah 51:35 (of Chaldeans), Habakkuk 2:8,17 (twice in verse); Joel 4:19; Psalm 72:14; BUT ALSO WRONG, INCLUDING INJURIOUS LANGUAGE, harsh treatment, etc. Genesis 16:5 (J, of wrong done to Sarah by, Hagar), Job 19:7; Malachi 2:16; IN GENERAL OF RUDE WICKEDNESS OF MEN, their noisy, wild, ruthlessness Micah 6:12; Habakkuk 1:2; Zephaniah 1:9; Proverbs 10:6,11; Proverbs 13:2; Proverbs 26:6 + Ezekiel 7:11 (si vera lectio, see Co), “” שֹׁד Amos 3:10; Habakkuk 1:3; Jeremiah 6:7; Jeremiah 20:8; Ezekiel 45:9; Isaiah 60:18, “” רִיב Psalm 55:10, “” עָמָל Psalm 7:17, “” גַּאֲוָה Psalm 73:6, ׳אֹהֵב ח Psalm 11:5 (“” רָשָׁע), denied, of servant of ׳י Isaiah 53:9, בארץ ׳ח Jeremiah 51:46, compare Genesis 6:11,13 (P), Ezekiel 8:17; Ezekiel 12:19; מָֽלְאוּ ׳מַחֲשַׁכֵּיאֶֿרֶץ נְאוֺת ח Psalm 74:20, ׳הָעִיר מָֽלְאָה ח Ezekiel 7:23; Ezekiel 28:16, ׳שֶׁבֶת ח Amos 6:3 is (probably) enthronement of violence; ׳כְּלֵי ח Genesis 49:5 (poem) instrument, weapons, of violence; — other phrases are: בְּיָדַיִם ׳ח Jonah 3:8; 1 Chronicles 12:17, compare Job 16:17, יְדֵיכֶם ׳ח Psalm 58:3 and בְּכַמֵּיהֶם ׳מֹּעַל ח Isaiah 59:6; ׳עֵד ח i.e. a witness that promotes violence AND WRONG Exodus 23:1 (JE), Deuteronomy 19:16, ׳עֵדֵי ח Psalm 35:11; עֵדֵי שֶׁקֶר וִיפֵהַ חָמָס Psalm 27:12; ׳שׂנאת ח Psalm 25:19 #NAME? violence; אִישׁ חָמָס = violent man Psalm 18:49 (2 Samuel 22:49 has the later חמסים ׳א, compare below) Psalm 140:12; Proverbs 3:31; Proverbs 16:29; אישׁ חמסים (later) Psalm 140:2; Psalm 140:5; 2 Samuel 22:49; יֵין חֲמָסִים Proverbs 4:17 i.e. wine gained by violence (“” לֶחֶם רֶשַׁע).
Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance
cruelty, damage, FALSE, INJUSTICE, oppressor, UNRIGHTEOUS, violence against, done,
From chamac; violence; BY IMPLICATION, WRONG; by meton. UNJUST GAIN — cruel(-ty), damage, FALSE, INJUSTICE, X oppressor, UNRIGHTEOUS, violence (against, done), violent (dealing), WRONG.
see HEBREW chamac
SOURCE: http://biblehub.com/hebrew/2555.htm
As the above lexical source confirms, the kind of violence which Isaiah had in mind is that which is unjust, unrighteous and wicked in nature. What Jesus did was far from being unjust, unrighteous or wicked since he was justly punishing those who had turned God’s house into a den of robbers dishonoring the honor and glory of God.
It is time for Burhan, Omar, Eric and Intellect to find another line of work since defending the lies of Islam and attacking the truth of the Lord Jesus isn’t working for them.
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No sam It is time for you to find another job since defending the lies of christological polytheism and attacking the truth of Islam isn’t working for you mate….im sure some Rabbi’s can find you a job to work at a florist…😉
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I almost forgot to decimate this other one of Burhan’s nonsense. Here goes:
BEGIN
“he was wounded for our transgressions” (53:5).
According to Christian theology, Jesus was not so much bruised or wounded for man’s transgressions as he was killed.
END
Once again, let’s see what this gentleman omitted:
“See, my servant will act wisely; he will be raised and lifted up and highly exalted. Just as there were many who were appalled at him—his appearance was SO DISFIGURED BEYOND THAT OF ANY HUMAN BEING and his form MARRED BEYOND HUMAN LIKENESS—” Isaiah 52:13-14
“By oppression and judgment he was taken away. Yet who of his generation protested? FOR HE WAS CUT OFF FROM THE LAND OF THE LIVING; for the transgression of my people he was punished. He was assigned A GRAVE with the wicked, and with the rich IN HIS DEATH, though he had done no violence, nor was any deceit in his mouth. Yet it was the LORD’s will TO CRUSH HIM and cause him to suffer, and though the LORD makes his life an offering for sin, he will see his offspring and prolong his days, and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand. After he has suffered, he will see the light of life and be satisfied;” Isaiah 53:8-11a
The context makes it abundantly clear that the servant dies as a result of his “wounds.” After all, ever heard of a mortal wound?
Now let’s see what the NT teaches:
“Thomas, the one called Didymus, one of the Twelve, wasn’t with the disciples when Jesus came. The other disciples told him, ‘We’ve seen the Lord!’ But he replied, ‘Unless I see the nail marks in his hands, put my finger in THE WOUNDS left by the nails, and put my hand into his side, I won’t believe.’After eight days his disciples were again in a house and Thomas was with them. Even though the doors were locked, Jesus entered and stood among them. He said, “Peace be with you.’ Then he said to Thomas, ‘Put your finger here. Look at my hands. Put your hand into my side. No more disbelief. Believe!’ Thomas responded to Jesus, ‘My Lord and my God!’ Jesus replied, ‘Do you believe because you see me? Happy are those who don’t see and yet believe.'” John 20:24-29
Finally, the Hebrew word translated “wounded” is macholal, and comes from chalal. Let’s see how the lexicons define this term:
Brown-Driver-Briggs
I. חָלַל verb bore, PIERCE (Arabic perforate, PIERCE THROUGH, transfix, Ethiopic (hollow) read; Aramaic חֲלַל hollow out, חֲלִילָא pipe; adjective hollow, cave, sheath, etc.; Late Hebrew in derivatives חָלָל noun hollow, adjective slain, חָלִיל pipe); —
Qal Perfect לִבִּי חָלַל בְּקִרְבִּי my heart is PIERCED (wounded) within me Psalm 109:22 (? literally one has PIERCED my heart; or read
Pu`al חֻלַּל ?); Infinitive construct חַלּוֺתִי הִיא Psalm 77:11 it is my PIERCING, my wound (my woe, my cross; so Ew Hi De Bae MV SS Köi. 341, but Hup Pe Bi Che read חֲלוֺתִי my sickness).
Pi`el Participle plural (Baer) בְּיַד מְחַללֶי֑ךָ Ezekiel 28:9 in the hand of the ones wounding thee (Sm Co read מְחוֺלְלֶ֑ךָ).
Pu`al Participle מְחֻלֲלֵי חֶרֶב PIERCED by the sword Ezekiel 32:26.
Po`el Perfect3feminine singular חֹלֲלָה יָדוֺ נָחָשׁ בָּרִחַ Job 26:13 his hand PIERCED the fleeing serpent; Participle feminine מְחוֺלֶלֶת תַּנִּין Isaiah 51:9 who PIERCED the dragon.
Po`al Participle מֲחֹלָל מִמְּשָׁעֵינוּ Isaiah 53:5 PIERCED, wounded because of our transgressions (of the servant of ׳י, “” מְדֻכָּא מֵעֲוֺנֹתֵינוּ)…
Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance
begin men began, defile, break, defile, eat as common things
A primitive root (compare chalah); properly, to bore, i.e. (by implication) to wound, to dissolve; figuratively, to profane (a person, place or thing), to break (one’s word), to begin (as if by an “opening wedge”); denom. (from chaliyl) to play (the flute) — begin (X men began), defile, X break, defile, X eat (as common things), X first, X gather the grape thereof, X take inheritance, pipe, player on instruments, pollute, (cast as) profane (self), prostitute, SLAY (SLAIN), sorrow, stain, wound.
SOURCE: http://biblehub.com/hebrew/2490.htm
Talk about further humiliation! The word for wounded can and often does refer to being pierced through. This explains other versions render macholal as pierced:
“He was PIERCED because of our rebellions and CRUSHED because of our crimes. He bore the punishment that made us whole; by his wounds we are healed.” Common English Bible
“But He was PIERCED THROUGH for our transgressions, He was CRUSHED for our iniquities; The chastening for our ]well-being fell upon Him, And by His scourging we are healed.” New American Standard Version
“But he was PIERCED for our transgressions, he was CRUSHED for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was on him, and by his wounds we are healed.” New International Version
Like I said, time for Burhan to find something else to do. Maybe he and Omar can start working at MeccaDonalds in Saudi Arabia! 🙂
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…his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men” (52:14)
when was his visage marred more than that of all others? This verse also contradicts the alleged description of Jesus given in Psalm 45:2 (“Thou are fairer than the children of men”)
And he made his grave with the wicked and with the rich in his death” (53:9).
When was Jesus buried with anyone?
When was Jesus with the rich in his death or buried with the rich?
This description contradicts the glorious burial predicted in Isaiah 11:10 (“And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse,…and his rest shall be glorious”).
Actually, in so far as Jesus is concerned, the prophecy was reversed. Jesus made his grave with the rich by being buried in the sepulchre of the rich Joseph of Arimathoea (Matt. 27:57), and was with the wicked, crucified thieves (not rich people) in his death.
Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him” (53:10).
Would God be pleased to bruise Christ, his only begotten son and equal or to put him to grief?
Applying this verse to Jesus would seem to prove that he did not come of his own accord to meet death.
And this verse is clearly in opposition to the description of God given in Lam. 3:33
(“For he doth not afflict willingly nor grieve the children of men”).
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“Maybe he and Omar can start working at MeccaDonalds in Saudi Arabia!”… oh that would be awesome right now!…yumm😲
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“his visage was so marred” (52:14) and “we hid,” “he was despised,” “we esteemed” (53:3) and “he hath borne,” “smitten of God and afflicted” (53:4) and “he was wounded,” “he was bruised” (53:5) and “He was oppressed, and he was afflicted” (53:6) and “He was taken and cut off” (53:8) and “he made his grave” and “he had done no violence” (53:9). All these past tense verbs show that Isaiah is referring to an earlier individual, not someone living 700 years in the future.
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Man, you really are a joke:
Hebrew Tenses
Sometimes it is claimed that the messianic prophecies cited by Christians are in the past tense. Therefore, it is said, they cannot refer to a future, coming Messiah.
This is an invalid argument. There is no such thing as tense” in biblical Hebrew. (Modern Hebrew, on the other hand, does have tenses.) Biblical Hebrew is not a “tense” language. Modern grammarians recognize that it is an “aspectual” language. This means that the same form of a verb can be translated as either past, present, or future depending on the context and various grammatical cues. The most well known grammatical cue is the “vav-consecutive” that makes an imperfective verb to refer to the past.
Therefore it is wrong to say that Isaiah 53 or other prophecies are in the “past tense.” Biblical Hebrew has no tenses. There are many examples of what is wrongly called the “past tense” form (properly called “the perfective” or “perfect”) being used for future time.
This fact was recognized by the medieval commentators as well as by modern grammarians, as shown by the following citations.
Medieval Jewish grammarian and commentator David Kimchi on the prophets’ use of the perfect for future events:
“The matter is as clear as though it had already passed.”
David Kimchi, Sefer Mikhlol. Cited in Waltke, Bruce K. and O’Connor, Michael Patrick. An Introduction to Biblical Hebrew Syntax (Winona Lake, IN: Eisenbrauns, 1990), p. 464 n. 45. They reference Leslie McCall, The Enigma of the Hebrew Verbal System: Solutions From Ewald to the Present (Sheffield: Almond, 1982), p. 8.
Rabbi Isaac ben Yedaiah (13th c.)
[The rabbis] of blessed memory followed, in these words of theirs, in the paths of the prophets who speak of something which will happen in the future in the language of the past. Since they saw in prophetic vision that which was to occur in the future, they spoke about it in the past tense and testified firmly that it had happened, to teach the certainty of his [God’s] words — may he be blessed — and his positive promise that can never change and his beneficent message that will not be altered.
Saperstein, Marc. “The Works of R. Isaac b. Yedaiah.” Ph.D. dissertation, Harvard University, 1977, pp. 481-82. Cited in Daggers of Faith by Robert Chazan, Berkeley: UC Press, 1989, p. 87.
From the standard grammar of Biblical Hebrew, Gesenius’ Hebrew Grammar (section 106n, pp. 312-313):
More particularly the uses of the perfect may be distinguished as follows: — …To express facts which are undoubtedly imminent, and, therefore in the imagination of the speaker, already accomplished (perfectum confidentiae), e.g., Nu. 17:27, behold, we perish ,we are undone, we are all undone. Gn. 30:13, Is. 6:5 (I am undone), Pr. 4:2….This use of the perfect occurs most frequently in prophetic language (perfectum propheticum). The prophet so transports himself in imagination into the future that he describes the future event as if it had been already seen or heard by him, e.g. Is. 5:13 therefore my people are gone into captivity; 9:1ff.,10:28,11:9…; 19:7, Jb. 5:20, 2 Ch. 20:37. Not infrequently the imperfect interchanges with such perfects either in the parallel member or further on in the narrative.
David (“Fortress of David,” 18th c. commentary by David Altschuler) on Jeremiah 31:32:
“I will place — lit. I placed. This is the prophetic past. I will incline their hearts to keep the Torah.”
Cited in Rosenberg, A. J. Jeremiah: A New English Translation. New York: The Judaica Press, 1985, vol. 2, p. 255.
Contemporary Jewish commentator Nahum Sarna on Exodus 12:17, “for on this very day I brought your ranks out of the land of Egypt”:
This is an example of the “prophetic perfect.” The future is described as having already occurred because God’s will inherently and ineluctably possesses the power of realization so that the time factor is inconsequential.
Exodus: The Traditional Hebrew Text with the New JPS Translation (Philadelphia: Jewish Publication Society, 1991), p. 59.
From the recent textbook of Biblical Hebrew, An Introduction to Biblical Hebrew Syntax (Sec. 30.5.1.e, pp. 489-490):
Referring to absolute future time, a perfective form may be persistent or accidental. A persistent (future) perfective represents a single situation extending from the present into the future.
Until when will you refuse to humble yourself before me? Exod 10:3
With an accidental perfective a speaker vividly and dramatically represents a future situation both as complete and as independent.
And concerning Ishmael . . . I will bless him. Gen.17:20
Women will call me happy. Gen. 30:13
We will die. We are lost, we are all lost. Num. 17:27
This use is especially frequent in prophetic address (hence it is also called the “prophetic perfect” or “perfective of confidence”).
I see him, but not now; I behold him, but not near. A star will come out of Jacob. Num. 24:17.
In the past he humbled . . . in the future he will honor . . . The people walking in darkness will see a great light. Isa. 8:23-9:1
Waltke and O’Connor [full reference given above], pp. 489-490.
SOURCE: http://jewsforjesus.org/answers/prophecy/hebrew-tenses
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sam you really are a joke!.. your armature bogus articles that reflect your false presumptions on Isaiah 53 including the misleadindlg use of tense are all collectively dismantled in the following devastating refutation of your myths!.. as i said go play with some rabbis who will cure your of your false notions about Isaiah 53..
http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=41&ved=0ahUKEwi_3KObv8LNAhWDVZQKHYV3Ahw4KBAWCBkwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fthejewishhome.org%2Fcounter%2FIsa53JP.pdf&usg=AFQjCNHyOngKElqOAl_IelAi6Y3EUWo2Nw
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Here you go Williams! Enjoy!
http://www.reformedapologeticsministries.com/2016/07/an-anti-christian-rabbi-proves-muhammad.html
http://www.reformedapologeticsministries.com/2016/07/an-anti-christian-rabbi-proves-muhammad_26.html
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Thanks
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And you are really going to love this one since I prove from the Arabic lexicons that the Quran teaches that the earth is flat, refuting the lies of many an apologist that claims that it teaches it is a sphere. Enjoy my friend! http://www.reformedapologeticsministries.com/2016/07/the-flat-earth-quran-revisited.html
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