I’m not convinced Aisha (ra) was 9 when she married the Prophet (saw). Ages of people seem to be exaggerated in the early Islamic sources. For instance, Abu Afak was 120 years old which seems highly implausible given the mortality rate in 7th century Arabia; similarly, Khadija (ra) was 40 when she married the Prophet which seems implausible due to the low likelihood of being able to concieve past 50, and she bore him many daughters!
The young age of Aisha could very well be Sunni propaganda. Casting her as the Prophet’s youngest and favorite wife served as a counter narrative to Shiite polemics.
There goes KMAK destroying the very foundation of the Quran since by throwing your earliest and supposedly mist reliable traditions under the bus, you have no basis to answer questions concerning the what, why, who, where, when and how of your scripture.
Moreover, care to debate me in my Paltalk room to see if whether Aisha was 9 according to your supposedly best and most reliable sources?
KMAK again exposes his illiteracy and that receiving a formal educated was a total waste in your case. Note what he says:
“Doubting Aisha’s age = throwing your earliest and supposedly mist reliable traditions under the bus? You really are an uneducated buffoon.”
Now let me expose who the real uneducated buffoon is.
Since Aisha’s age is found in all your major sources, including your earliest ones, and since all the information you know about your false profit and his “revelations” come from these very same sources, this means that by calling into question the reliability of these authors and compilers concerning Aisha’s age,information which is found in every one of these sources, and deemed to be absolutely reliable by the authors/compilers, then you pretty much destroyed the very foundation of your deen since you have now called into question the ability of these authors/compilers pass on reliable historical information concerning the life and mission of your profit.
1. Why did God (Jesus) allow Jacob to give his 7-year-old daughter away in marriage to Shechem?
2. Why didn’t Jesus (God) stop child marriages in Jacob’s time, if it was something he was against, as YOU claim shamoun??
Here in the following article, there is a number of proofs from GENESIS where Jacob gave away her daughter in marriage when she was 7 (SEVEN) YEARS OLD, yes you heard it right.
Williams, I am actually writing a rebuttal to Brown exposing the gross lie that Aisha wasn’t a child or that she was mature enough to have sex with a 54 year old man.
Do you really want to justify a 54 year old man having sex with a 9 tear old minor still playing with her dolls and on swings?
Narrated Aisha:
The Prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six (years). We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Bani-al-Harith bin Khazraj. Then I got ill and my hair fell down. Later on my hair grew (again) and my mother, Um Ruman, came to me WHILE I WAS PLAYING IN A SWING WITH SOME OF MY GIRL FRIENDS. She called me, and I went to her, not knowing what she wanted to do to me. She caught me by the hand and made me stand at the door of the house. I was breathless then, and when my breathing became all right, she took some water and rubbed my face and head with it. Then she took me into the house. There in the house I saw some Ansari women who said, “Best wishes and Allah’s Blessing and a good luck.” Then she entrusted me to them and they prepared me (for the marriage). Unexpectedly Allah’s Apostle came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 58, Number 234)
‘A’isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported that Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) married her when she was seven years old, and he was taken to his house as a bride when she was nine, AND HER DOLLS WERE WITH HER; and when he (the Holy Prophet) died she was eighteen years old. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3311)
Really? Come on Williams, you are much better and more moral than this.
To what extent does playing with dolls preclude one from being physically mature, taking into account the context of 7th century Arabia? Also, to what extent was Muhammad’s relationship with Ayesha wrong?
Williams, you often really end up disappointing me because you can’t see how stupid some of the questions and arguments offered by Muslims truly are. Take for instance KMAK’s question which you like, which only exposes that he is “an uneducated buffoon” who has no business discussing his religion. Now let help educate this illiterate Muslim wannabe by letting his own scholars explain to him why Aisha playing with dolls PROVES she was a minor, and not a mature girl:
Narrated ‘Aisha:
I used to play with the dolls in the presence of the Prophet, and my girl friends also used to play with me. When Allah’s Apostle used to enter (my dwelling place) they used to hide themselves, but the Prophet would call them to join and play with me. (The playing with the dolls and similar images IS FORBIDDEN, but it was allowed for ‘Aisha at that time, as she was a little girl, NOT YET REACHED THE AGE OF PUBERTY.) (Fateh-al-Bari page 143, Vol.13) (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 73, Number 151)
Here you have the commentary of Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani explaining why Aisha was permitted to play with dolls when Islam prohibits such things. The reason? BECAUSE SHE HADN’T REACHED PUBERTY YET!
Here is another narration showing Aisha wasn’t pubescent yet when Muhammad slept with her:
Narrated ‘Aisha:
The Prophet was screening me with his Rida’ (garment covering the upper part of the body) while I was looking at the Ethiopians who were playing in the courtyard of the mosque. (I continued watching) till I was satisfied. So you may deduce from this event how a little girl (WHO HAS NOT REACHED THE AGE OF PUBERTY) who is eager to enjoy amusement should be treated in this respect. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 163)
So here again we see that Muhammad allowed Aisha to observe things that would be normally forbidden for women BECAUSE SHE WAS A LITTLE GIRL WHO HADN’T REACHED PUBERTY!
I can understand why you wouldn’t know this Williams, but I can’t understand how this “uneducated buffoon” and world class ignoramus wouldn’t know what his own false, wicked religion teaches concerning these things.
Now just to show both of you how repulsive your defense of Muhammad’s marriage to a minor truly is, please let me know if you would be ok with a 54 year old Muslim marrying and having sex with your 9 year old sister or daughter. And I hope you bring up the cultural argument since I will bury that pathetic and stupid defense for your reading pleasure.
Sam I have no problem with the marriage. If you were consistent with your beliefs you would have no problem either.
How old do historians think Mary was when she married Joseph? TWELVE. And if Joseph was considerably older than Mary as Christian tradition says he was, then you MUST condemn St Joseph for being a child abuser.
“ow just to show both of you how repulsive your defense of Muhammad’s marriage to a minor truly is, please let me know if you would be ok with a 54 year old Muslim marrying and having sex with your 9 year old sister or daughter”
That has been happening with jews and christians for 1900 years!
Williams, your arguments go from bad to outright pathetic. Note what you wrote:
BEGIN
i have no problem with the marriage. If you werw consistent with yor beliefs you would nbot either.
How old do historians think Mary was when she married Joseph? TWELVE. And if Joseph was considerably older than Mary as Christian tradition says he was, then you MUST condemn St Joseph for being a child abuser.
END
First, quote a reliable historical source that places Mary’s age at 12.
Second, quote a reliable historical source that says that Joseph was nearly 6 times here age, like we find in the case of your profit. Muhammad was old enough to be Aisha’s great grandfather.
This brings me to my fourth point. Comparing the marriage of a 12 year old girl with someone around her age, and not much older than her, is not the same as a prepubescent 9 year old girl who is still found playing with dolls and swings with other minors marrying a 54 year old man.
Fourth, you claim your profit is a role model for all peoples, in all places, for all times. Therefore, we would expect such a man to abolish cultural practices that are bad and harmful, especially for the psychological, physiological, and emotional well being of young girls. We wouldn’t expect him to enshrine a practice which allows grown men till this very day to marry and have sex with young minors as we find in Quran 65:4 and all the classical commentaries and hadiths that explain this verse:
And if you are in doubt as to the prescribed period for such of your women as have despaired of monthly courses, then know that the prescribed period for them is three months, and also for such AS DO NOT HAVE not have their monthly courses YET.. And as for those who are with child, their period shall be until they are delivered of their burden. And whoso fears ALLAH, HE will provide facilities for him in his affair. S. 65:4 Sher Ali
The surrounding context deals with the issue of the waiting period for divorce, and remarriage. The Quran is telling Muslims to wait for a certain period of time before making the divorce final or deciding to forego it. The Quran exhorts men to wait a period of three months in the case of women who either are no longer menstruating or haven’t even started their menstrual cycles! Thus, Islam permits men to marry prepubescent girls and even divorce them if they so choose!
We find the following narration in Sahih Al-Bukhari:
Narrated Sahl bin Sad:
While we were sitting in the company of the Prophet a woman came to him and presented herself (for marriage) to him. The Prophet looked at her, lowering his eyes and raising them, but did not give a reply. One of his companions said, “Marry her to me O Allah’s Apostle!” The Prophet asked (him), “Have you got anything?” He said, “I have got nothing.” The Prophet said, “Not even an iron ring?” He said, “Not even an iron ring, but I will tear my garment into two halves and give her one half and keep the other half.” The Prophet; said, “No. Do you know some of the Quran (by heart)?” He said, “Yes.” The Prophet said, “Go, I have agreed to marry her to you with what you know of the Qur’an (as her Mahr).” ‘And for those who have no courses (i.e. they are still immature). (65.4) And the ‘Iddat for the girl BEFORE PUBERTY is three months (in the above Verse). (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 63; emphasis ours)
Ibn Kathir writes regarding this verse:
, “The `Iddah is made up of cleanliness and the menstrual period.” So he divorces her while it is clear that she is pregnant, or he does not due to having sex, or since he does not know if she is pregnant or not. This is why the scholars said that there are two types of divorce, one that conforms to the Sunnah and another innovated. The divorce that conforms to the Sunnah is one where the husband pronounces one divorce to his wife when she is not having her menses and without having had sexual intercourse with her after the menses ended. One could divorce his wife when it is clear that she is pregnant. As for the innovated divorce, it occurs when one divorces his wife when she is having her menses, or after the menses ends, has sexual intercourse with her and then divorces her, even though he does not know if she became pregnant or not. There is a third type of divorce, which is neither a Sunnah nor an innovation where one divorces A YOUNG WIFE WHO HAS NOT BEGUN TO HAVE MENSES, the wife who is beyond the age of having menses, and divorcing one’s wife before the marriage was consummated. (Capital emphasis ours)
And:
The `Iddah of Those in Menopause and Those Who do not have Menses
Allah the Exalted clarifies the waiting period of the woman in menopause. And that is the one whose menstruation has stopped due to her older age. Her `Iddah is three months instead of the three monthly cycles for those who menstruate, which is based upon the Ayah in (Surat) Al-Baqarah. [see 2:228] The same for THE YOUNG, WHO HAVE NOT REACHED THE YEARS OF MENSTRUATION…
Ibn Abi Hatim recorded a simpler narration than this one from Ubay bin Ka`b who said, “O Allah’s Messenger! When the Ayah in Surat Al-Baqarah was revealed prescribing the `Iddah of divorce, some people in Al-Madinah said, `There are still some women whose `Iddah has not been mentioned in the Qur’an. There are THE YOUNG, the old whose menstruation is discontinued, and the pregnant.’ Later on, this Ayah was revealed… (Capital emphasis ours)
In fact, didn’t Muhammad abolish the very humane practice of adoption? Therefore, you have no problem with a man who abolishes something so beautiful as a adoption and who then enshrines marriages with young girls!
Finally, you forget the fact that the Quran forbade anyone from marrying any of Muhammad’s widows. This means that Aisha was left husbandless and childless from the age of 18 until her death many years later. And you still have the audacity to believe that your man Muhammad was a mercy for mankind? He was no mercy, but misery since his coming into the world destroyed the lives and mental and spiritual health of countless numbers of human beings, beginning with his own wives.
Shame on you for trying to justify such a filthy, wicked practice.
“Fourth, you claim your profit is a role model for all peoples, in all places, for all times. ”
Of course! He, also, taught us that the custom and tradition for each time and place are considered if they don’t violate Law of God.
That kind of marriage was very popular, and it was not wrong based on that culture.
Moreover, that’s exactly what christians and jews used to do at that region.
The problem with christians today ( The western ones only), that they are so arrogant that they make the scale for what it is wrong & what it is right on base of their culture.
Dude! your bible as whole does not fit this view!
By the way, Jesus was not a white dude nor did he speak English.
Finally, I encourage you to read the biography of Aisha ( peace be upon her) to see how a great woman she was.
Shamoun the uneducated clown, here’s a hadith that indicates Aisha(ra) was past her puberty before she consummated her marriage to the Prophet:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
As for Ibn Hajar’s commentary, it is obvious he is attempting to reconcile the contradiction between Aisha playing with dolls and what he knew about the status of dolls in Islam during his time. ‘Aisha played with dolls. But we have been taught that playing with dolls is Haram. Therefore, Aisha must have been prepubescent’.
It didn’t occur to Ibn Hajar that perhaps the Prophet(saw) made an exception for Aisha. In any case, can you tell me to what extent classical jurists have permitted men to consummate marriages to prepubescent wives based on Ibn Hajar’s reading of the Hadith?
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
Could Shamoun please answer some of my questions if you can:
1. Why did God (Jesus) allow Jacob to give his 7-year-old daughter away in marriage to Shechem?
2. Why didn’t Jesus (God) stop child marriages in Jacob’s time, if it was something he was against, as YOU claim shamoun??
3. Why do you follow Jesus god, who allowed, permitted these things?
Here in the following article, there is a number of proofs from GENESIS where Jacob gave away her daughter in marriage when she was 7 (SEVEN) YEARS OLD, yes you heard it right.
And the elephant in the room is that Sam Shamoun is on record saying the Biblical age of consent is puberty. We have already seen Ezekiel 16 being used as a proof text by a Christian apologist to show the Biblical age of consent is puberty:
…Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, you who were naked and bare. 8 ” ‘Later I passed by, and when I looked at you and saw that you were old enough for love… [taken from Ezekiel 16]
See here for more information on this see:
And in any case, this quote maybe of interest:
“The Bible gives us no information about the age at which girls are married. The practice of marrying the eldest first was not universal (Gn 29:26). On the other hand, it seems certain that girls, and therefore presumably boys too, were married very young; for centuries this has been the custom of the East, and in many places it still obtains to-day.” (De Vaux, R. (1997). Ancient Israel: Its Life and Institutions (John McHugh, trans.). Grand Rapids, Michigan: Wm. B. EerdmansPublishing Co. p. 29)
I would also like to refer the readers to material from the Jesus scholar Geza Vermes, in which he highlights Jewish tradition at the time of Jesus was in fact to use puberty as a biological sign for consummation of marriage.
Ahem is right. Concernign Ezekiel 16:4-14, God mentions that the young babe attained the age for lovemaking after her breasts had formed and her pubic hairs had grown, clear signs of puberty. The reason we believe that the reference is to pubic hair is because a) the hair on the head of a girl grows many years before reaching the time of puberty, and b) the connection to nakedness suggests that the exposure of her body parts needed to be covered since it was shameful for them to be exposed for all to see. In other words, there was no shame for the hair of a girl’s head to be uncovered, but exposing one’s pubic hairs would be.
Here is how the English Standard Version renders the above passage:
“I made you flourish like a plant of the field. And you grew up and became tall and arrived at full adornment. Your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. When I passed by you AGAIN and saw you, behold, you were at the age for love, and I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness; I made my vow to you and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Lord GOD, and you became mine.” Ezekiel 16:7-8 ESV
Pay attention to the fact that it is only after the young girl attained maidenhood, puberty, that God passed by again and then proceeded to marry her. God’s spreading the corner of his garment and making a covenant with the young maiden refers to marriage as the following passages indicate:
“A man shall not take his father’s wife so that he will not uncover his father’s skirt.” Deuteronomy 22:30
“He said, ‘Who are you?’ And she answered, ‘I am Ruth your maid. So spread your covering over your maid, for you are a close relative.’” Ruth 3:9
Ruth is asking Boaz to marry her so as to preserve Naomi’s family’s line. Thus, we have a biblical text establishing puberty as the minimum age for marriage.
Man, can’t wait to get this pagan in my room come August 20th! Now check out my next posts.
Since Yahyaslime likes commentaries here are some for him to chew over as he prepares for his slaughter come August 20th.
16:1ff This message reminded Jerusalem of its former despised status among the Canaanite nations. Using the imagery of a young baby growing TO MATURE WOMANHOOD, God reminded that he raised her from a lowly state to great glory as his bride… (Life Application Study Bible, New American Bible- Updated Edition [Zondervan Grand Rapids, MI, May 2000], p. 1364)
16:6-14 The LORD passes by twice (vv. 6-7, 8-14)… The LORD’s action contrasts with that of the parents. Following ancient Near Eastern custom, the LORD enacts a legal adoption by announcing, literally, “In your blood, live.” The life-giving act, however, is threatened by the nakedness OF POSTPUBESCENT REALITY… The LORD acts to protect the vulnerable young woman WHO IS NOW SEXUALLY MATURE… (The New Interpreter’s Study Bible: New Revised Standard Version With the Apocrypha (Hardcover) [Abingdon Press, May, 2003], p. 1175)
The creative command turned into fact, and the baby grew INTO ADOLESCENCE AND SEXUAL MATURITY, marked by breasts and pubic hair (cf. Isa 7:20)… (Leslie C. Allen, Word Biblical Commentary: Ezekiel 1-19 [Word Book Publishers, Dallas TX 1994], p. 237)
God then cared for the nation and caused it to increase and flourish like sprouts in a field, language reminiscent of the growth of the nation in Egypt as described in Exod 1:7, 12. So she (Israel) prospered until she reached the maturity of womanhood. As a beautiful young woman of marriageable age, she became the wife of Yahweh… (Lamar Eugene Cooper, Sr., New American Commentary: An Exegetical and Theological Exposition of Holy Scripture- NIV Text, Ezekiel [Broadman & Holman Publishers 1994], pp. 169-170)
… The word of the Lord was all it took to turn the field from a place of death (16:5) to a place of life (16:7). Subsequently, she grew up, REACHED SEXUAL MATURITY (16:7), AND ATTAINED AN AGE OF APPROPRIATE FOR MARRIAGE (16:8)…
6. NIV: “You … became the most beautiful of jewels. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew,” should perhaps rather be translated, “You developed the ornament of ornaments [namely] your breasts were formed and your [pubic] hair sprouted.” The point is the physical development THAT ACCOMPANIES THE ONSET OF PUBERTY… (Iain M. Duguid, The NIV Application Commentary: Ezekiel [Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids MI, 1999], p. 210)
… The text chronicles her growth; she flourishes (grows up) “like a sprout (… semah) of the field,” a vegetal simile conventionally an increase in population, but here descriptive of physical maturation. “At full womanhood” (NRSV) is, in Hebrew, “ornament of ornaments” (i.e., the loveliest of ornaments): well-formed and “sprouted” [simmeah] pubic hair. Ezekiel’s double of samah, “to sprout,” v. 7 creates a “a verbal bridge” between the images of vegetal fertility and female puberty… Now Yahweh passes by her again and, seeing THAT SHE HAS REACHED THE AGE FOR SEXUAL LOVEMAKING… spreads the edge (lit., “wing”) of his cloak over her, covering her nakedness… (The New Interpreter’s Bible: A Commentary in Twelve Volumes: Introduction to Prophetic Literature, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Baruch, Letter of Jeremiah, Lamentations, Ezekiel [Abingdon Press, Nashville 2001], Volume VI, pp. 1226-1228)
… It denotes growing to the threshold of maturity and child bearing in a woman… After this there takes place the second occasion of Yahweh’s passing by, introduced verbally exactly like the first. This calls THE MATURE GIRL TO THE FULL HONOR OF WOMANHOOD and to “life” in the full sense… the sovereign freedom of Yahweh, who is wherever he wills to be and who is therefore always present at the right time, is to be seen in this. Yahweh affirms what v. 7 has described, on the basis of what he himself has seen, and does not shrink from the view that he is waiting until the time is ripe. Then he affirms his choice… (Walther Zimmerli, Hermenia, Critical and Historical Commentary on the Bible Series- Ezekiel 1: A Commentary on the Book of the Prophet Ezekiel, Chapters 1-24 [Fortress Press, Philadelphia 1979], pp. 339-340)
A non-Christian Jewish commentary writes regarding 16:6-8:
God wills the abandoned infant to live. She lives ANF GROWS TO PUBERTY… UPON REACHING PUBERTY, SHE IS READY FOR MARRIAGE … (The Jewish Study Bible: Tanakh Translation, Torah, Nevi’im, Kethuvim (Hardcover) [Oxford University Press, October 2003], p. 1069)
Now let’s see how various translations render Ezekiel 16:7-8.
I made you thrive like plants of the field. You grew up AND MATURED and became very beautiful. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, but you were stark naked. Then I passed by you and saw you, AND YOU WERE INDEED AT THE AGE OF LOVE… Holman Christian Standard Bible
and grow up like a plant of the field. And you grew up and became tall AND ARRIVED AT FULL MAIDENHOOD; your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. When I passed by you again and looked upon you, behold, YOU WERE AT THE AGE OF LOVE… RSV
and grow up like a plant of the field. You grew up and became tall AND ARRIVED AT FULL WOMANHOOD; your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. I passed by you again and looked on you; you were at the age for love… NRSV
You grew and developed, YOU CAME TO THE AGE OF PUBERTY; your breasts were formed, your hair had grown, but you were still stark naked. Again I passed by you and saw that you were now old enough for love… NAB
And I made you grow like the gross of the fields. You developed, you, YOU REACHED MARRIAGEABLE AGE. Your breasts became firm and your hair grew richly, but you were stark naked. New Jerusalem Bible
“I will increase your numbers just like plants growing in the field.” And you did increase, you developed, YOU REACHED PUBERTY, your breasts appeared, and your hair grew long; but you were naked and exposed… Again I passed by you, looked at you and saw that your time had come, the time for love… Complete Jewish Bible
I made you grow like a plant in the field. You grew up, matured, and became a young woman. Your breasts developed, and your hair grew. Yet, you were naked and bare. I went by you again and looked at you. YOU WERE OLD ENOUGH TO MAKE LOVE TO… GOD’s WORD Translation
“Grow up like a plant in the field!” And you did. You grew up. You grew tall AND MATURED AS A WOMAN, full-breasted, with flowing hair. But you were naked and vulnerable, fragile and exposed. I came by again and saw you, SO THAT YOU WERE READY FOR LOVE and a lover… The Message
I caused you [Israel] to multiply as the bud which grows in the field, and you increased and became tall AND YOU CAME TO FULL MAIDENHOOD and beauty; your breasts were formed and your hair had grown, yet you were naked and bare. Now I passed by you again and looked upon you; behold, YOU WERE MATURING AND AT THE TIME FOR LOVE… Amplified Bible
I took care of you, like someone caring for a tender, young plant. You grew up TO BE A BEAUTIFUL WOMAN with perfect breasts and long hair, but you were still naked. When I saw you again, YOU WERE OLD ENOUGH TO HAVE SEX… CEV
YahyaSlime could not have picked a worse example from the OT to condone his wicked profit having sex with a 9 year old minor playing with dolls.
In light of the foregoing we conclude that the Bible does set forth the acceptable age of marriage. Yahweh’s parable to his people presupposes their prior knowledge and acceptance of the marriageable age being set sometime after a young maiden has attained puberty. Anything before this would be viewed as abnormal and unusual. Extra-biblical sources provide some support for puberty being the marriageable age, that both Jews and Christians have understood this to be the case. For instance, an early Christian writer and Church Father, Clement of Alexandria, wrote:
It is not only fornication, but also the giving in marriage prematurely, that is called fornication; when, so to speak, one not of ripe age is given to a husband, either of her own accord or by her parents. (Clement of Alexandria, IX.-Fragment of the Treatise on Marriage, Early Church Fathers – Ante-Nicene Fathers, Volume II; online edition; bold and underline emphasis ours)
The Mishnah sets the age of maturity for a female at twelve years and six months:
“she won her case in court before she matured [at the age of twelve years and six months], lo, they belong to the father.” Mishnah Ketubot, 4:1.
The Baker Encyclopedia of the Bible in volume 2, page 1407, under “Marriage”, states this about Jewish marriage customs:
“Subsequently, MINIMUM AGES ages (for marriage) of 13 for boys and 12 for girls were set.”
Jim West, Th.D., writes in an online article titled, “Ancient Israelite Marriage Customs”:
“The wife was to be taken from within the larger family circle (usually at the ‘outset of puberty’ OR AROUND THE AGE OF 13) in order to maintain the purity of the family line.” (Source)
With that said I am going to quote the Islamic sources proving that Aisha was a minor who hadn’t attained puberty, which means that Muhammad stands condemned for fornicating with a child who was so young that she was still playing with dolls. What makes this disgusting is that none of you see anything wrong with a 54 year old man violating a child in the name of his god. Truly reprehensible.
Pathetic attempt by Shamoun as usual. He has no problem with his Jesus (God) allowing and permitting (BIBLE) his soldiers to penetrate (rape) pre-pubescent girls, yet has the cheek to talk about Aisha’s marriage:
TWO accurate translations which clearly show that the passage only speaks about ‘female children’ are as follows:
Jubilee Bible 2000 – “But all the FEMALE CHILDREN children that have not known a man by lying with him keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Webster’s Bible – “Translation But all the FEMALE CHILDREN that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Christian scholars say MARRIAGE with pre-pubescent was allowed:
Whedon’s Commentary on the Bible:
Verse 17-18.
The little ones — The object of the command to kill every male was to exterminate the whole nation, the cup of whose iniquity was full. For the righteousness of the mode see Joshua 6:21, note. Every woman who might possibly have been engaged in the licentious worship of Peor was to share the fate of the male children, to preserve Israel from all taint of that abomination. The pure maidens could be incorporated into Israel without peril to the national religion. Joshua 6:23-25, notes. They could not be treated as concubines, since the law against fornication was in full force, (Deuteronomy 22:25-29,) but THEY COULD BE LAWFULLY MARRIED TO THEIR CAPTORS (DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14).
Peter Pett’s Commentary on the Bible:
Numbers 31:18
‘But all the women-children, who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.’ But the young women children were a different matter. THEY COULD BE TAKEN IN MARRIAGE or as servants and would expect to accept the religion of their new husbands or masters. They would gradually be merged into Israel. Compare DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14. They would not feel the same responsibility for blood vengeance which was mainly incumbent on the males.[2]
Notice both commentaries direct readers to READ deuteronomy 21:14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
There you have it, Jesus, who is God of the Old Testament allowed marriage and the rape of pre-pubescent girls. Deuteronomy is about RAPE, this fact is referenced in the following five articles;
GOD willing there will be more articles published how the filthy, made up god Sham-moon worships allows and permits rape all through out the Bible, from the Old Testament to the Testament.
“The creative command turned into fact, and the baby grew INTO ADOLESCENCE AND SEXUAL MATURITY, marked by breasts and pubic hair”
OK when does that happen for girls scientifically? (10-14)! http://www.medicinenet.com/puberty/article.htm
Williams you really should be ashamed and disgusted with yourself for lying through your teeth again about me and for justifying the actions of your perverted profit. Note what you said:
BEGIN
Oh Sam I am very very disappointed in you. Surely you can do better? I am just asking you to be consistent. Why do you find that so difficult?
“Sam Shamoun is on record saying the Biblical age of consent is puberty.”
So if a Jewish girl is 10 or 12 years old, you are happy to see her married to an older man.
Dude is the Chicago heat affecting your brain?
END
Williams, do I need to repost my response here to show you how shamelessly perverted my words? First, show me where I said anything about a 10 year old. Second, my comment regarding the age of 12 was within the context of what Jewish culture deemed to be an appropriate age. Unlike your profit, the Jews required that a girl had to have attained puberty and mature enough to have sex before being married off to someone. And so they came with a range of 12 and half for girls, NOT 9! Nor would they allow marriages with minors who hadn’t had their periods yet, like your false profit did.
Third, I was responding to your claim about Mary being 12, explaining that even if she were twelve this doesn’t mean she married a man 6 times here age. Nor is 12 the same as a 9 year old minor who hadn’t attained puberty having sex with a man old enough to be her grandfather. So I think kissing the black stone and reading the Quran have made you retarded, which is why could shameless misread my comments.
With that said, be a man and answer my questions which conveniently evaded. UNLIKE THE TALMUD, OR RABBINIC JEWS, you believe Muhammad was a man for all peoples at all times. THEREFORE, why didn’t your profit abolish this “cultural” practice of sexually violating minors to immature to have sex if he is supposedly a role model FOR ALL TIMES? Why enshrine and engage in such a vile practice that leaves girls traumatized sexually, emotionally and physiologically? And do you think that Muhammad was right for abolishing adoption, A HUMANE PRACTICE, while enshrining the sexual violation of minors?
Finally, are you ok with your profit leaving his wives husbandless and childless for all the days of their lives? Are you ok with Muhammad leaving Aisha a widow at 18, and being the reason for her remaining without any children, without any man to love her, for years after your false profit’s death?
Now be a man and answer my questions, and stop your tap dance routine.
Your bible permits to marry a girl who reached her puberty (10-14). That means a pastor in his 60s can marry a girl who is in age of 10.
What’s the result of that permission?
The result that permission has been applied for more than 2000 years by jews and christians.
If you think that you’ve become so ” civilized” to apply that “disgusting teaching” in your bible, it would be your own problem.
I know already that you will be more “civilized” to permit gays’ marriage in the future ,and you will condemn Islam for prohibiting that.
It’s not our problem that you christianized most values of secular products.
Shamoun why you lying for? the Old Testament allowed pre-pubescent marriages. This is why Rebekah was married off at 3, according to Rashi:
1. Rashi’s commentary on Genesis 25:20 says:
forty years old: For when Abraham came from Mount Moriah, he was informed that Rebecca had been born. Isaac was then thirty-seven years old, for at that time Sarah died, and from the time that Isaac was born until the “Binding” [of Isaac], when Sarah died, were thirty-seven years, for she was ninety years old when Isaac was born, and one hundred and twenty-seven when she died, as it is stated (above 23:1): “The life of Sarah was [a hundred and twenty-seven years.”] This makes Isaac thirty-seven years old, and at that time, Rebecca was born. He waited for her until she would be fit for MARITAL RELATIONS-THREE YEARS-AND THEN MARRIED HER.— [From Gen. Rabbah 57:1
Your lie that they got married at 12 when they hit puberty is not histrically true. Israelite girls (those that followed OT LAW) allowed Pre-pubescent marriages to happen:
Professor Geza Vermes who is well-known and a respected scholar comments that Pre-pubescent girls were allowed to be married.
“…the Greek parthenos could also mean that the girl was young and/or unmarried. In fact, in the Septuagint translation of the Old Testament parthenos was used to render three distinct Hebrew words, ‘Virgin’, ‘girl’ and ‘young woman’. Already Rabbis in the Tannaitic era (first to second century ad) subscribed to further nuances, and there is no reason to think that all these were invented by them. Even the word betulah, which normally means virgo intact, when used by them could carry the laternal sense of bodily immaturity with the consequential inability to conceive. In Rabbinic terminology this type of virginity in a woman ceased with the physical onset of puberty. The Mishnah, the oldest of the rabbinic codes, defines a virgin as a female who ‘has never seen blood even though she is married’ (mNiddah 1:4). The Tosefta, another early Jewish code of law, claims in the name of Rabbi Eliezer ben Hyrcanus (late first century ad) that such a woman would continue to count as a virgin even after she had conceived and borne children without prior menstruation (tNiddah 1:6)! To understand these statements, WE MUST REMEMBER THAT IN THE INTERTESTAMENTAL AND EARLY RABBINIC AGE, PRE-PUBERTY MARRIAGE WAS GENERALLY PERMITTED. In fact rabbis seriously debated whether bloodstains found after the wedding night in nuptial bed of a minor, i.e. a ‘virgin in respect of menstruation’, marked her first period or the consummation of the marriage.”
Reverend Kathryn J. Riss also makes mention that in first century parents married off their daughters who were pre-pubescent to much older men. What is interesting is she does not mention once that Rabbis or anyone higher up in authority speaking against such marriages.
“The longest New Testament passage on marriage is found, not in Ephesians, but in 1 Corinthians chapter 7. In stark contrast to the legal positions and social expectations of the first century, here the rights and responsibilities of man and woman are upheld as equal. Although marriages were arranged by parents, who often ESPOUSED THEIR PRE-PUBESCENT DAUGHTERS TO MUCH OLDER MEN…” [11]
Theological Dictionary of the Old Testament, by G. Johannes Botterweck, Helmer Ringgren and Heinz-Josef Fabry it states,
“One might counter that the expression mohar habbetulot (Ex. 22:16[17]) refers rather to the pretium virginitatis. In this case, the mohar would be compensation to the girl for the loss of her virginity. This explanation, however, is unacceptable, since it proceeds on the assumption that the term betula means ‘virgin.’ This may doubtlessly be the case in many passages, but in joel 1:8, betula thus refers to a married woman who had been ‘possessed’ by her husband (ba’al); betula thus refers to a marriageable girl who was physically able to cope with a man, ‘taking her into his possession.’ Here the term betula says nothing about her virginity. Ex.22:16 (17) (kesep yisqol kemohar hab betulot) can thus be translated ‘he shall weigh out as much silver as is required for marriageable girls.’ In this context we should point out that ancient Hebrew custom did not associate marriageability with puberty. In contrast to the marriageable girl (betula), the…. Alma refers to a girl in puberty capable of conception. GIRLS COULD IN FACT ALREADY BE GIVEN MARRIAGE LONG BEFORE ACTUAL PHYSICAL MATURITY, PERHAPS EVEN AS YOUNG AS FIVE YEARS OLD (CF. LEV. 27:5), AND IT DID HAPPEN THAT MARRIAGES WERE ALREADY CONSUMMATED WITH PREPUBESCENT GIRLS. [12] https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/09/14/bible-child-marriage-in-ancient-israelite-times-paedophilia/
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
Folks, have you all never heard something called “pubertas praecox”?
In addition, people in Arabia grew up and still grow up in a society with strict and very harsh conditions, thus getting mentally more mature in a much younger age, unlike todays western “softened” teenies with good and comfort life conditions, even if you still play with dolls, though.
Furthermore, Aisha (ra) was a very intelligent person, even a female scholar; that’s why I’m wondering why there are no other ones anymore, because remeber, there are only male prophets, but why not also female scholars?
Common, that’s not an Ad-Hoc argumentation at all, just sum up all these things and I hope you will get a proper answer to this “problem”.
Williams, thanks for being so cowardly as to block my comments so I can obliterate the lies of KMAK and flyingstonekisser, a.k.a. Discover-The-Paganism-And-Immorality-Of-Muhammad.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
Why is my comment not getting approved br Paul Williams? Here it is again:
Pathetic attempt by Shamoun as usual. He has no problem with his Jesus (God) allowing and permitting (BIBLE) his soldiers to penetrate (rape) pre-pubescent girls, yet has the cheek to talk about Aisha’s marriage:
TWO accurate translations which clearly show that the passage only speaks about ‘female children’ are as follows:
Jubilee Bible 2000 – “But all the FEMALE CHILDREN children that have not known a man by lying with him keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Webster’s Bible – “Translation But all the FEMALE CHILDREN that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Christian scholars say MARRIAGE with pre-pubescent was allowed:
Whedon’s Commentary on the Bible:
Verse 17-18.
The little ones — The object of the command to kill every male was to exterminate the whole nation, the cup of whose iniquity was full. For the righteousness of the mode see Joshua 6:21, note. Every woman who might possibly have been engaged in the licentious worship of Peor was to share the fate of the male children, to preserve Israel from all taint of that abomination. The pure maidens could be incorporated into Israel without peril to the national religion. Joshua 6:23-25, notes. They could not be treated as concubines, since the law against fornication was in full force, (Deuteronomy 22:25-29,) but THEY COULD BE LAWFULLY MARRIED TO THEIR CAPTORS (DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14).
Peter Pett’s Commentary on the Bible:
Numbers 31:18
‘But all the women-children, who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.’ But the young women children were a different matter. THEY COULD BE TAKEN IN MARRIAGE or as servants and would expect to accept the religion of their new husbands or masters. They would gradually be merged into Israel. Compare DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14. They would not feel the same responsibility for blood vengeance which was mainly incumbent on the males.[2]
Notice both commentaries direct readers to READ Deuteronomy 21:14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
Williams, thanks for being so cowardly as to block my comments so I can obliterate the lies of KMAK and flyingstonekisser, a.k.a. Discover-The-Paganism-And-Immorality-Of-Muhammad.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
FLYINGSTONESMOOCHER is back at it I see, again reading the Holy Bible as if it were his filthy Quran and sunna. So here goes!
Let me once again demolish your filthy gross perversion of Deuteronomy 21:10-14, since you have it confused with your wicked profit raping married women:
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For instance, the following verse permits Muslim men (which includes Muhammad himself) to sleep with married women whom they have taken captive:
Also (prohibited are) women already married, except those whom your right hands possess: Thus hath God ordained (Prohibitions) against you: Except for these, all others are lawful, provided ye seek (them in marriage) with gifts from your property, – desiring chastity, not lust, seeing that ye derive benefit from them, give them their dowers (at least) as prescribed; but if, after a dower is prescribed, agree Mutually (to vary it), there is no blame on you, and God is All-knowing, All-wise. S. 4:24 Y. Ali
Tragically, this did not remain a mere abstraction but was readily put into practice by Muhammad’s sexually craved jihadists:
Abu Sirma said to Abu Sa’id al Khadri: O Abu Sa’id, did you hear Allah’s Messenger mentioning al-‘azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah’s Messenger on the expedition to the Bi’l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing ‘azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah’s Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah’s Messenger, and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3371)
And:
Abu Said al-Khudri said: The apostle of Allah sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain. They met their enemy and fought with them. They defeated them and took them captives. Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Quranic verse, ‘And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess’. That is to say, they are lawful for them when they complete their waiting period. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Volume 2, Number 2150)
This same narration is found in all of the major hadith collections:
Chapter 36. What Has Been Related (About A Man) Who Captures A Slave Woman That Has A Husband, Is It Lawful For Him To Have Relations With Her?
1132. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri narrated: We got some captives on the day of Awtas, and they had husbands among their people. They mentioned that to the Messenger of Allah, so the following was revealed: And women who are already married, except those whom your right hands possess. (Hasan) (English Translation of Jami‘ At-Tirmidhi, Compiled by Imam Hafiz Abu ‘Eisa Mohammad Ibn ‘Eisa At-Tirmidhi, From Hadith No. 544 to 1204, translated by Abu Khaliyl (USA), ahadith edited and referenced by Hafiz Tahir Zubair ‘Ali Za’i [Darussalam Publishers & Distributors, First Edition: November 2007], Volume 2, p. 502; underline emphasis ours)
And:
1137. Jabir bin ‘Abdullah narrated: “We practiced ‘Azl while the Qur’an was being revealed.” (Sahih)
(Abu ‘Eisa said:) The Hadith of Jabir is a Hasan Sahih Hadith. It has been reported from him through other routes.
There are those among the people of knowledge, among the Companions of the Prophet and others, who permitted ‘Azl. Malik bin Anas said: “The permission of the free woman is to be requested for ‘Azl, while the slave woman’s permission need not be requested.” (Ibid., Chapter 39. What Has Been related About ‘Azl, p. 507)
Finally:
(3) 3016. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri said: “On the Day of Awtas, we captured some women who had husbands among the idolaters. SO SOME OF THE MEN DISLIKED THAT, so Allah, Most High, revealed: ‘And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess….’” (Sahih)
[Abu ‘Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan.
(4) 3017. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri said: “we captured some women on the Day of Awtas and they had husbands among their people. That was mentioned to the Messenger of Allah so Allah revealed: ‘…And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess….” (Sahih)
[Abu ‘Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan.
This is how it was reported by Ath-Thawri, from ‘Uthman Al-Batti, from Abu Al-Khalil, from Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri from the Prophet and it is similar. “From Abu ‘Alqamah” is not in this Hadith and I do not know of anyone who mentioned Abu ‘Alqamah in this Hadith except in what Hammam mentioned from Qatadah. Abu Al-Khalil’s name is Salih bin Abi Mariam. (Jami‘ At-Tirmidhi, Volume 5, From Hadith No. 2606 to 3290, Chapter 4. Regarding Surat An-Nisa’, pp. 331-332; capital and underline emphasis ours)
Thus, Muhammad and his deity condoned and encouraged men to virtually rape their female captives whether they were married or not.
Now unless this taqiyyist wants us to believe that such women whose families had just been murdered and (in some cases) whose husbands were still alive would actually consent to having sex with their captors, it should be apparent that the Islamic deity is actually permitting, and even encouraging, rape and adultery in his so-called holy book!
How truly sad and tragic for these women that Muhammad and his god did not share the shame and concern of the jihadists regarding the highly unethical nature of raping captives whose husbands were still alive. Instead, Allah and his messenger rushed to justify such a perverted and heinous crime!
Contrast this filth with what Deuteronomy teaches concerning the issue of female captives:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her.” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
Here we see that, instead of permitting men to rape captive women, the Holy Bible forces the Israelites to marry them if they wanted to have sex with them, and then letting them go free in case of a divorce. This means that the Holy Bible is actually dignifying these women by not allowing them to be treated the way Allah and his “messenger” had them treated, namely like animals. Now this is a command which predates the Quran by approximately 2200 years!
To say that such an injunction was truly shocking and revolutionary for that time period would be a wild understatement, just as the following commentaries illustrate:
“The law focuses on the rights of the woman by stating that the man who marries a female prisoner of war and subsequently becomes dissatisfied with her, for whatever reasons, is not permitted to reduce her to slavery. Such a woman had legal rights in ancient Israel, and moral obligations ensue from the fact that the man initiated a sexual relationship with her. Perhaps the most significant conclusion to draw from this text is the respect for the personhood of a captured woman. A primary concern in the laws of Deut 21–25 is for protecting the poor and vulnerable in society from exploitation on the part of the powerful.” (Duane L. Christensen, Word Biblical Commentary: Deuteronomy 21:10–34:12 [Thomas Nelson Publishers, Nashville, TN 2002], Volume 6b, p. 475; bold emphasis ours)
“Throughout the ancient Mediterranean world, captive women of vanquished peoples were assumed to be the due sexual prerogative of the victors. This law exceptionally seeks to provide for the human rights of the woman who falls into this predicament… the verb ‘inah is also sometimes used for rape, and its employment here astringently suggests that the sexual exploitation of a captive woman, even in a legally sanctioned arrangement of concubinage, is equivalent to rape.” (Robert Alter, The Five Books of Moses: A Translation with Commentary [W. W. Norton & Company, 2008], p. 982; bold emphasis ours)
“The instructions given for the treatment of female captives in Deuteronomy 21:10-14 take it for granted that a conquering army have the right to dispose of the conquered population in any way that it wishes. It is hard for those coming from a different cultural context to see this as anything other than appalling, but this approach would have been unquestioned within the ancient Near East, and we have to see these instructions within that setting. What is remarkable is that although the woman may have had no choice in the matter–the soldier who fancied her has every right to make her this wife–nevertheless her identity as a human being is at least to some extent recognized. She is not to be thrown into the new situation but must be allowed time to mourn for her parents and her past life… Within these oppressive situations the laws are geared to provide at least a level of protection for the women involved… Women who were bought as wives or captured in war and taken as wives could not be sold as slaves or even neglected (Ex 21.11; Deut 21.14).” (The IVP Women’s Bible Commentary, eds. Catherine Clark Kroeger & Mary J. Evans [InterVarsity Press, Downers Grove, IL 2002], pp. 100, 102)
“The space given for weeping is not primarily a period of mourning (though it is perhaps to be assumed that the woman’s father has died in the herem; 20:13, 15). Rather, it is given in compassionate consideration of the large adjustment she must make, and the accompanying trauma. It is an acknowledgment, too, that her former life is ended and a new life is to begin (cf. Ps. 45:10). The hints of compassion breaking through the brutality of the age reflect an awareness of divine compassion, however limited by the thought climate of the times.” (Ian Cairns, Word and Presence: A Commentary on the book of Deuteronomy (International Theological Commentary), [William B. Eerdmans Publishing Co., Grand Rapids, MI 1992], p. 189; bold emphasis ours)
For more on the humanitarian nature of this OT passage we recommend the following article: A note on the humanitarian character of Deut 21.10-14.
Unfortunately, there’s more to the story. The so-called sound ahadith report that Muhammad taught that Allah has predestined the amount of adultery a person must necessarily commit:
Narrated Ibn ‘Abbas:
I did not see anything so resembling minor sins as what Abu Huraira said from the Prophet, who said, “Allah has written for the son of Adam his INEVITABLE share of adultery whether he is aware of it or not: The adultery of the eye is the looking (at something which is sinful to look at), and the adultery of the tongue is to utter (what it is unlawful to utter), and the innerself wishes and longs for (adultery) and the private parts turn that into reality or refrain from submitting to the temptation.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 77, Number 609)
Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he OF NECESSITY MUST COMMIT (or there would be no escape from it). (Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421; see also Number 6422)
In other words, these Muslims were only carrying out the very sexual filth which their god had predestined for them!
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And here is my demolition of his butchering of the word ana. This isn’t anything. Watch what I am going to do with your shame piece on Q. 9:29 which I am nearly finished with it. Like I said, everytime you lie through your teeth in the name of the jinn you worship and his profit I will take it out on Muhammad. So enjoy!
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To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
What the readers of our site may not know is that the Holy Bible makes a reference to the general age of a girl considered for marriage. The reference is found in a parable where God likens Israel to a baby girl whom Yahweh took in and then eventually married. The parable proceeds to liken Israel’s dabble with idolatry to a wife who commits adultery and prostitution.
Not only does this specific parable present the marriageable age of a girl, the parable also assumes that this is a fact that was already well known and observed by the peoples, specifically Israel.
“On the day you were born your cord was not cut, nor were you washed with water to make you clean, nor were you rubbed with salt or wrapped in cloths. No one looked on you with pity or had compassion enough to do any of these things for you. Rather, you were thrown out into the open field, for on the day you were born you were despised. Then I passed by and saw you kicking about in your blood, and as you lay there in your blood I said to you, ‘Live!’ I made you grow like a plant of the field. You grew up and developed and became the most beautiful of jewels. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, you who were naked and bare. Later I passed by, and when I looked at you and saw that you were old enough for love, I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness. I gave you my solemn oath and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Sovereign LORD, and you became mine. I bathed you with water and washed the blood from you and put ointments on you. I clothed you with an embroidered dress and put leather sandals on you. I dressed you in fine linen and covered you with costly garments. I adorned you with jewelry: I put bracelets on your arms and a necklace around your neck, and I put a ring on your nose, earrings on your ears and a beautiful crown on your head. So you were adorned with gold and silver; your clothes were of fine linen and costly fabric and embroidered cloth. Your food was fine flour, honey and olive oil. You became very beautiful and rose to be a queen. And your fame spread among the nations on account of your beauty, because the splendor I had given you made your beauty perfect, declares the Sovereign LORD.” Ezekiel 16:4-14
God mentions that the young babe attained the age for lovemaking after her breasts had formed and her pubic hairs had grown, clear signs of puberty. The reason we believe that the reference is to pubic hair is because a) the hair on the head of a girl grows many years before reaching the time of puberty, and b) the connection to nakedness suggests that the exposure of her body parts needed to be covered since it was shameful for them to be exposed for all to see. In other words, there was no shame for the hair of a girl’s head to be uncovered, but exposing one’s pubic hairs would be.
Here is how the English Standard Version renders the above passage:
“I made you flourish like a plant of the field. And you grew up and became tall and arrived at full adornment. Your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. When I passed by you AGAIN and saw you, behold, you were at the age for love, and I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness; I made my vow to you and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Lord GOD, and you became mine.” Ezekiel 16:7-8 ESV
Pay attention to the fact that it is only after the young girl attained maidenhood, puberty, that God passed by again and then proceeded to marry her. God’s spreading the corner of his garment and making a covenant with the young maiden refers to marriage as the following passages indicate:
“A man shall not take his father’s wife so that he will not uncover his father’s skirt.” Deuteronomy 22:30
“He said, ‘Who are you?’ And she answered, ‘I am Ruth your maid. So spread your covering over your maid, for you are a close relative.’” Ruth 3:9
Ruth is asking Boaz to marry her so as to preserve Naomi’s family’s line.
“And this second thing you do. You cover the LORD’s altar with tears, with weeping and groaning because he no longer regards the offering or accepts it with favor from your hand. But you say, ‘Why does he not?’ Because the LORD was witness between you and the wife of your youth, to whom you have been faithless, though she is your companion and your wife by covenant. Did he not make them one, with a portion of the Spirit in their union? And what was the one God seeking? Godly offspring. So guard yourselves in your spirit, and let none of you be faithless to the wife of your youth. ‘For the man who hates and divorces, says the LORD, the God of Israel, covers his garment with violence, says the LORD of hosts. So guard yourselves in your spirit, and do not be faithless.’” Malachi 2:13-16
Thus, we have a biblical text establishing puberty as the minimum age for marriage.
I am continue from where I left off. Pay careful attention flyinghourisnatcher!
At this point I am going to quote various translations and commentaries in order to solidify that the Holy Bible, unlike the trash you call the Quran and sunna, only allows marriages with sexually mature women.
Bible Translations
16:1ff This message reminded Jerusalem of its former despised status among the Canaanite nations. Using the imagery of a young baby growing TO MATURE WOMANHOOD, God reminded that he raised her from a lowly state to great glory as his bride… (Life Application Study Bible, New American Bible- Updated Edition [Zondervan Grand Rapids, MI, May 2000], p. 1364)
16:6-14 The LORD passes by twice (vv. 6-7, 8-14)… The LORD’s action contrasts with that of the parents. Following ancient Near Eastern custom, the LORD enacts a legal adoption by announcing, literally, “In your blood, live.” The life-giving act, however, is threatened by the nakedness OF POSTPUBESCENT REALITY… The LORD acts to protect the vulnerable young woman WHO IS NOW SEXUALLY MATURE… (The New Interpreter’s Study Bible: New Revised Standard Version With the Apocrypha (Hardcover) [Abingdon Press, May, 2003], p. 1175)
The creative command turned into fact, and the baby grew INTO ADOLESCENCE AND SEXUAL MATURITY, marked by breasts and pubic hair (cf. Isa 7:20)… (Leslie C. Allen, Word Biblical Commentary: Ezekiel 1-19 [Word Book Publishers, Dallas TX 1994], p. 237)
God then cared for the nation and caused it to increase and flourish like sprouts in a field, language reminiscent of the growth of the nation in Egypt as described in Exod 1:7, 12. So she (Israel) prospered until she reached the maturity of womanhood. As a beautiful young woman of marriageable age, she became the wife of Yahweh… (Lamar Eugene Cooper, Sr., New American Commentary: An Exegetical and Theological Exposition of Holy Scripture- NIV Text, Ezekiel [Broadman & Holman Publishers 1994], pp. 169-170)
… The word of the Lord was all it took to turn the field from a place of death (16:5) to a place of life (16:7). Subsequently, she grew up, REACHED SEXUAL MATURITY (16:7), AND ATTAINED AN AGE OF APPROPRIATE FOR MARRIAGE (16:8)…
6. NIV: “You … became the most beautiful of jewels. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew,” should perhaps rather be translated, “You developed the ornament of ornaments [namely] your breasts were formed and your [pubic] hair sprouted.” The point is the physical development THAT ACCOMPANIES THE ONSET OF PUBERTY… (Iain M. Duguid, The NIV Application Commentary: Ezekiel [Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids MI, 1999], p. 210)
… The text chronicles her growth; she flourishes (grows up) “like a sprout (… semah) of the field,” a vegetal simile conventionally an increase in population, but here descriptive of physical maturation. “At full womanhood” (NRSV) is, in Hebrew, “ornament of ornaments” (i.e., the loveliest of ornaments): well-formed and “sprouted” [simmeah] pubic hair. Ezekiel’s double of samah, “to sprout,” v. 7 creates a “a verbal bridge” between the images of vegetal fertility and female puberty… Now Yahweh passes by her again and, seeing THAT SHE HAS REACHED THE AGE FOR SEXUAL LOVEMAKING… spreads the edge (lit., “wing”) of his cloak over her, covering her nakedness… (The New Interpreter’s Bible: A Commentary in Twelve Volumes: Introduction to Prophetic Literature, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Baruch, Letter of Jeremiah, Lamentations, Ezekiel [Abingdon Press, Nashville 2001], Volume VI, pp. 1226-1228)
… It denotes growing to the threshold of maturity and child bearing in a woman… After this there takes place the second occasion of Yahweh’s passing by, introduced verbally exactly like the first. This calls THE MATURE GIRL TO THE FULL HONOR OF WOMANHOOD and to “life” in the full sense… the sovereign freedom of Yahweh, who is wherever he wills to be and who is therefore always present at the right time, is to be seen in this. Yahweh affirms what v. 7 has described, on the basis of what he himself has seen, and does not shrink from the view that he is waiting until the time is ripe. Then he affirms his choice… (Walther Zimmerli, Hermenia, Critical and Historical Commentary on the Bible Series- Ezekiel 1: A Commentary on the Book of the Prophet Ezekiel, Chapters 1-24 [Fortress Press, Philadelphia 1979], pp. 339-340)
A non-Christian Jewish commentary writes regarding 16:6-8:
God wills the abandoned infant to live. She lives ANF GROWS TO PUBERTY… UPON REACHING PUBERTY, SHE IS READY FOR MARRIAGE … (The Jewish Study Bible: Tanakh Translation, Torah, Nevi’im, Kethuvim (Hardcover) [Oxford University Press, October 2003], p. 1069)
Now let’s see how various translations render Ezekiel 16:7-8.
I made you thrive like plants of the field. You grew up AND MATURED and became very beautiful. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, but you were stark naked. Then I passed by you and saw you, AND YOU WERE INDEED AT THE AGE OF LOVE… Holman Christian Standard Bible
and grow up like a plant of the field. And you grew up and became tall AND ARRIVED AT FULL MAIDENHOOD; your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. When I passed by you again and looked upon you, behold, YOU WERE AT THE AGE OF LOVE… RSV
and grow up like a plant of the field. You grew up and became tall AND ARRIVED AT FULL WOMANHOOD; your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. I passed by you again and looked on you; you were at the age for love… NRSV
You grew and developed, YOU CAME TO THE AGE OF PUBERTY; your breasts were formed, your hair had grown, but you were still stark naked. Again I passed by you and saw that you were now old enough for love… NAB
And I made you grow like the gross of the fields. You developed, you, YOU REACHED MARRIAGEABLE AGE. Your breasts became firm and your hair grew richly, but you were stark naked. New Jerusalem Bible
“I will increase your numbers just like plants growing in the field.” And you did increase, you developed, YOU REACHED PUBERTY, your breasts appeared, and your hair grew long; but you were naked and exposed… Again I passed by you, looked at you and saw that your time had come, the time for love… Complete Jewish Bible
I made you grow like a plant in the field. You grew up, matured, and became a young woman. Your breasts developed, and your hair grew. Yet, you were naked and bare. I went by you again and looked at you. YOU WERE OLD ENOUGH TO MAKE LOVE TO… GOD’s WORD Translation
“Grow up like a plant in the field!” And you did. You grew up. You grew tall AND MATURED AS A WOMAN, full-breasted, with flowing hair. But you were naked and vulnerable, fragile and exposed. I came by again and saw you, SO THAT YOU WERE READY FOR LOVE and a lover… The Message
I caused you [Israel] to multiply as the bud which grows in the field, and you increased and became tall AND YOU CAME TO FULL MAIDENHOOD and beauty; your breasts were formed and your hair had grown, yet you were naked and bare. Now I passed by you again and looked upon you; behold, YOU WERE MATURING AND AT THE TIME FOR LOVE… Amplified Bible
I took care of you, like someone caring for a tender, young plant. You grew up TO BE A BEAUTIFUL WOMAN with perfect breasts and long hair, but you were still naked. When I saw you again, YOU WERE OLD ENOUGH TO HAVE SEX… CEV
In light of the foregoing we conclude that the Bible does set forth the acceptable age of marriage. Yahweh’s parable to his people presupposes their prior knowledge and acceptance of the marriageable age being set sometime after a young maiden has attained puberty. Anything before this would be viewed as abnormal and unusual. Extra-biblical sources provide some support for puberty being the marriageable age, that both Jews and Christians have understood this to be the case. For instance, an early Christian writer and Church Father, Clement of Alexandria, wrote:
It is not only fornication, but also the giving in marriage prematurely, that is called fornication; when, so to speak, one not of ripe age is given to a husband, either of her own accord or by her parents. (Clement of Alexandria, IX.-Fragment of the Treatise on Marriage, Early Church Fathers – Ante-Nicene Fathers, Volume II)
The Mishnah sets the age of maturity for a female at twelve years and six months:
“she won her case in court before she matured [at the age of twelve years and six months], lo, they belong to the father.” Mishnah Ketubot, 4:1.
The Baker Encyclopedia of the Bible in volume 2, page 1407, under “Marriage”, states this about Jewish marriage customs:
“Subsequently, minimum ages (for marriage) of 13 for boys and 12 for girls were set.”
Jim West, Th.D., writes in an online article titled, “Ancient Israelite Marriage Customs”:
“The wife was to be taken from within the larger family circle (usually at the ‘outset of puberty’ or around the age of 13) in order to maintain the purity of the family line.”
The foregoing also puts to rest the slander and false claim that passages such as Numbers 31:17-18 allow men to have sex with young, prepubescent girls, something nowhere stated within the chapter itself. The passage from Ezekiel establishes the point that these young girls could not be touched until they attained the age of puberty, and even then the men had to marry them as the following citation states:
“When you go out to battle against your enemies, and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take them away captive, and see among the captives a beautiful woman, and have a desire for her and would take her as a wife for yourself, then you shall bring her home to your house, and she shall shave her head and trim her nails. She shall also remove the clothes of her captivity and shall remain in your house, and mourn her father and mother a full month; and after that you may go in to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go WHEREVER SHE WISHES; BUT YOU SHALL CERTAINLY NOT SELL HER FOR MONEY, YOU SHALL NOT MISTREAT HER, because you have humbled her.” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
Islam, however, allows for the raping and selling of captive women even if they are married! (Cf. Sura 4:24)
Williams, thanks for being so cowardly as to block my comments so I as to prevent me from obliterating the lies of KMAK and flyingstonekisser, a.k.a. Discover-The-Paganism-And-Immorality-Of-Muhammad.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the text. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
OOPS! Sorry about that Williams. You now approved of the same post which I sent about 10 different times, trying to see if it would go through. My apologies!
We look yet again at the Hebrew word ‘anah’ (inna) in relation to Deuteronomy 21:14,
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
The different translations for Deuteronomy 21:14 do not give an accurate portrayal of what happened to the slave-women. The only accurate translation for the verse is from the GNT translation. Nearly every other translation make it out that the slave-women captured in warfare were happily jumping into another man’s bed. Same men (soldiers) who murdered her husband, father, and brothers.
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“11 One man commits a terrible sin against his own neighbor’s wife. Another man has sex with his daughter-in-law and makes her unclean. Another man RAPES his father’s daughter—his very own sister.” – Ezekiel 22:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“11 One person in you does a hated act with his neighbor’s wife. Another has shamefully violated his daughter-in-law. And another RAPES his half sister.” – Ezekiel 22:11
New Living Translation (NLT)
“11 Within your walls live men who commit adultery with their neighbors’ wives, who defile their daughters-in-law, or who RAPE their own sisters.” – Ezekiel 22:11
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
“11 And ish hath committed to’evah with his neighbor’s isha; and another hath lewdly made tameh his kallah (daughter-in-law); and another in thee hath RAPED his achot, his bat aviv.” – Ezekiel 22:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“11 There are those in you who do abominable things with their neighbors’ wives, men who defile their daughters-in-law by incest, men who COERCE THEIR SISTERS TO INTERCOURSE, the daughters of their own fathers.” – Ezekiel 22:11
New Century Version (NCV)
“11 One man in you does a hateful act with his neighbor’s wife, while another has shamefully made his daughter-in-law unclean sexually. And another FORCES HIS HALF SISTER TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS with him.” – Ezekiel 22:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“11 One man in you does a ·hateful [detestable; abominable] act with his neighbor’s wife, while another has shamefully ·made his daughter-in-law unclean sexually [L defiled his daughter-in-law; C ritually]. And another FORCES HIS HALF SISTER TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS [L violates his father’s daughter] with him [C all forbidden in the Law; Lev. 18:9, 15, 20].” – Ezekiel 22:11
I know you think that by repeating your crap over and over again, much like Muhammad used to do with the Quran, you actually think you are refuting a person. Therefore, the only cure to your lies and idolatry is to repeat my response to your trash which makes Muhammad look logical over and over again as well. So enjoy!
BEGIN
For instance, the following verse permits Muslim men (which includes Muhammad himself) to sleep with married women whom they have taken captive:
Also (prohibited are) women already married, except those whom your right hands possess: Thus hath God ordained (Prohibitions) against you: Except for these, all others are lawful, provided ye seek (them in marriage) with gifts from your property, – desiring chastity, not lust, seeing that ye derive benefit from them, give them their dowers (at least) as prescribed; but if, after a dower is prescribed, agree Mutually (to vary it), there is no blame on you, and God is All-knowing, All-wise. S. 4:24 Y. Ali
Tragically, this did not remain a mere abstraction but was readily put into practice by Muhammad’s sexually craved jihadists:
Abu Sirma said to Abu Sa’id al Khadri: O Abu Sa’id, did you hear Allah’s Messenger mentioning al-‘azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah’s Messenger on the expedition to the Bi’l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing ‘azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah’s Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah’s Messenger, and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3371)
And:
Abu Said al-Khudri said: The apostle of Allah sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain. They met their enemy and fought with them. They defeated them and took them captives. Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Quranic verse, ‘And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess’. That is to say, they are lawful for them when they complete their waiting period. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Volume 2, Number 2150)
This same narration is found in all of the major hadith collections:
Chapter 36. What Has Been Related (About A Man) Who Captures A Slave Woman That Has A Husband, Is It Lawful For Him To Have Relations With Her?
1132. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri narrated: We got some captives on the day of Awtas, and they had husbands among their people. They mentioned that to the Messenger of Allah, so the following was revealed: And women who are already married, except those whom your right hands possess. (Hasan) (English Translation of Jami‘ At-Tirmidhi, Compiled by Imam Hafiz Abu ‘Eisa Mohammad Ibn ‘Eisa At-Tirmidhi, From Hadith No. 544 to 1204, translated by Abu Khaliyl (USA), ahadith edited and referenced by Hafiz Tahir Zubair ‘Ali Za’i [Darussalam Publishers & Distributors, First Edition: November 2007], Volume 2, p. 502; underline emphasis ours)
And:
1137. Jabir bin ‘Abdullah narrated: “We practiced ‘Azl while the Qur’an was being revealed.” (Sahih)
(Abu ‘Eisa said:) The Hadith of Jabir is a Hasan Sahih Hadith. It has been reported from him through other routes.
There are those among the people of knowledge, among the Companions of the Prophet and others, who permitted ‘Azl. Malik bin Anas said: “The permission of the free woman is to be requested for ‘Azl, while the slave woman’s permission need not be requested.” (Ibid., Chapter 39. What Has Been related About ‘Azl, p. 507)
Finally:
(3) 3016. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri said: “On the Day of Awtas, we captured some women who had husbands among the idolaters. SO SOME OF THE MEN DISLIKED THAT, so Allah, Most High, revealed: ‘And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess….’” (Sahih)
[Abu ‘Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan.
(4) 3017. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri said: “we captured some women on the Day of Awtas and they had husbands among their people. That was mentioned to the Messenger of Allah so Allah revealed: ‘…And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess….” (Sahih)
[Abu ‘Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan.
This is how it was reported by Ath-Thawri, from ‘Uthman Al-Batti, from Abu Al-Khalil, from Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri from the Prophet and it is similar. “From Abu ‘Alqamah” is not in this Hadith and I do not know of anyone who mentioned Abu ‘Alqamah in this Hadith except in what Hammam mentioned from Qatadah. Abu Al-Khalil’s name is Salih bin Abi Mariam. (Jami‘ At-Tirmidhi, Volume 5, From Hadith No. 2606 to 3290, Chapter 4. Regarding Surat An-Nisa’, pp. 331-332; capital and underline emphasis ours)
Thus, Muhammad and his deity condoned and encouraged men to virtually rape their female captives whether they were married or not.
Now unless this taqiyyist wants us to believe that such women whose families had just been murdered and (in some cases) whose husbands were still alive would actually consent to having sex with their captors, it should be apparent that the Islamic deity is actually permitting, and even encouraging, rape and adultery in his so-called holy book!
How truly sad and tragic for these women that Muhammad and his god did not share the shame and concern of the jihadists regarding the highly unethical nature of raping captives whose husbands were still alive. Instead, Allah and his messenger rushed to justify such a perverted and heinous crime!
Contrast this filth with what Deuteronomy teaches concerning the issue of female captives:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her.” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
Here we see that, instead of permitting men to rape captive women, the Holy Bible forces the Israelites to marry them if they wanted to have sex with them, and then letting them go free in case of a divorce. This means that the Holy Bible is actually dignifying these women by not allowing them to be treated the way Allah and his “messenger” had them treated, namely like animals. Now this is a command which predates the Quran by approximately 2200 years!
To say that such an injunction was truly shocking and revolutionary for that time period would be a wild understatement, just as the following commentaries illustrate:
“The law focuses on the rights of the woman by stating that the man who marries a female prisoner of war and subsequently becomes dissatisfied with her, for whatever reasons, is not permitted to reduce her to slavery. Such a woman had legal rights in ancient Israel, and moral obligations ensue from the fact that the man initiated a sexual relationship with her. Perhaps the most significant conclusion to draw from this text is the respect for the personhood of a captured woman. A primary concern in the laws of Deut 21–25 is for protecting the poor and vulnerable in society from exploitation on the part of the powerful.” (Duane L. Christensen, Word Biblical Commentary: Deuteronomy 21:10–34:12 [Thomas Nelson Publishers, Nashville, TN 2002], Volume 6b, p. 475; bold emphasis ours)
“Throughout the ancient Mediterranean world, captive women of vanquished peoples were assumed to be the due sexual prerogative of the victors. This law exceptionally seeks to provide for the human rights of the woman who falls into this predicament… the verb ‘inah is also sometimes used for rape, and its employment here astringently suggests that the sexual exploitation of a captive woman, even in a legally sanctioned arrangement of concubinage, is equivalent to rape.” (Robert Alter, The Five Books of Moses: A Translation with Commentary [W. W. Norton & Company, 2008], p. 982; bold emphasis ours)
“The instructions given for the treatment of female captives in Deuteronomy 21:10-14 take it for granted that a conquering army have the right to dispose of the conquered population in any way that it wishes. It is hard for those coming from a different cultural context to see this as anything other than appalling, but this approach would have been unquestioned within the ancient Near East, and we have to see these instructions within that setting. What is remarkable is that although the woman may have had no choice in the matter–the soldier who fancied her has every right to make her this wife–nevertheless her identity as a human being is at least to some extent recognized. She is not to be thrown into the new situation but must be allowed time to mourn for her parents and her past life… Within these oppressive situations the laws are geared to provide at least a level of protection for the women involved… Women who were bought as wives or captured in war and taken as wives could not be sold as slaves or even neglected (Ex 21.11; Deut 21.14).” (The IVP Women’s Bible Commentary, eds. Catherine Clark Kroeger & Mary J. Evans [InterVarsity Press, Downers Grove, IL 2002], pp. 100, 102)
“The space given for weeping is not primarily a period of mourning (though it is perhaps to be assumed that the woman’s father has died in the herem; 20:13, 15). Rather, it is given in compassionate consideration of the large adjustment she must make, and the accompanying trauma. It is an acknowledgment, too, that her former life is ended and a new life is to begin (cf. Ps. 45:10). The hints of compassion breaking through the brutality of the age reflect an awareness of divine compassion, however limited by the thought climate of the times.” (Ian Cairns, Word and Presence: A Commentary on the book of Deuteronomy (International Theological Commentary), [William B. Eerdmans Publishing Co., Grand Rapids, MI 1992], p. 189; bold emphasis ours)
For more on the humanitarian nature of this OT passage we recommend the following article: A note on the humanitarian character of Deut 21.10-14.
Unfortunately, there’s more to the story. The so-called sound ahadith report that Muhammad taught that Allah has predestined the amount of adultery a person must necessarily commit:
Narrated Ibn ‘Abbas:
I did not see anything so resembling minor sins as what Abu Huraira said from the Prophet, who said, “Allah has written for the son of Adam his INEVITABLE share of adultery whether he is aware of it or not: The adultery of the eye is the looking (at something which is sinful to look at), and the adultery of the tongue is to utter (what it is unlawful to utter), and the innerself wishes and longs for (adultery) and the private parts turn that into reality or refrain from submitting to the temptation.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 77, Number 609)
Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he OF NECESSITY MUST COMMIT (or there would be no escape from it). (Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421; see also Number 6422)
In other words, these Muslims were only carrying out the very sexual filth which their god had predestined for them!
END
And here you go flyingmutalover! Do make sure you enjoy it! And here is my demolition of his butchering of the word ana. This isn’t anything. Watch what I am going to do with your shame piece on Q. 9:29 which I am nearly finished with it. Like I said, everytime you lie through your teeth in the name of the jinn you worship and his profit I will take it out on Muhammad. So enjoy!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Thank you Williams for allowing me to respond here and expose the pathetic attempts of your fellow Muslims to justify the action of a 54 year old man having sex with a 9 year old minor to immature for sex.
Now I can return to my rebuttals by the grace of the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Judge.
Just to let you know, I just finished a 4 part rebuttal exposing the lies of liars like discover-paganism-of-islam letmeturnthestonesmoochingonmyselfandsmashmyheadwithit who tried to explain away the hadith where Muhammad beat Aisha and hurt her. You will absolutely love that one since these shameless dawagandists deliberately misused Lane’s Lexicon which I will now turn against them and use as an illustration that they have no integrity whatsoever. And watch what I am about to do to flying stone kisser’s pathetic article on Q. 9:29. I am sure he will absolutely love it!
Take care buddy ole’ pal! it was nice chatting with you again.
Here is a different translation for the exact word ‘anah’, I will expose your pagan Babble. I am no ordinary internet writer, I will find things in the Bible you have never heard of 😛
One of the verses that has been downplayed by Christian apologists as not endorsing or approving ‘rape’ is Deuteronomy 21:10-14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since YOU FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.
They claim that the word ‘anah’ used here doesn’t actually mean ‘ rape’ (forced intercourse). How can we prove that RAPE DID TAKE PLACE? Let’s read another translations for a different verses (with the exact word (anah)):
New Living Translation
“Our enemies RAPE THE WOMEN in Jerusalem and the young girls in all the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version (ESV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Standard Version (ISV)
“They have RAPED women in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
NET Bible
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
GOD’S WORD® Translation
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Women have been RAPED in Zion, young women in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“They have RAPED the women of Tziyon, virgins in the cities of Y’hudah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“On Zion and everywhere in Judah our wives and daughters are BEING RAPED.” – Lamentations 5:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“The enemy raped the women of Zion. They RAPED THE WOMEN in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“The enemy [L They] ·ABUSED [VIOLATED; RAPED] the women ·of Jerusalem [L in Zion; C the location of the Temple] and the ·girls [L virgins] in the ·cities [towns] of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Good News Translation (GNT)
“Our wives have BEEN RAPED on Mount Zion itself; in every Judean village our daughters have been forced to submit.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“The ENEMY RAPED the women of Jerusalem and the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“They RAPED women in Zion, young women[a] in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Living Bible (TLB)
“They RAPE the women of Jerusalem and the girls in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Message (MSG)
“Our wives were RAPED in the streets in Zion, and our virgins in the cities of Judah.” Lamentations 5:11
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the cities of Judah…” – Lamentations 5:11
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Voice (VOICE)
“In the place where God should be— Zion and the surrounding towns of Judah— Women, young and old alike, are BRUTALLY RAPED and violated.” – Lamentations 5:11
EVEN THE COMMENTARIES AGREE THAT ANAH MEANS RAPE:
Bridgeway Bible Commentary:
Conditions in Judah are terrible. The people have to search the barren country regions for food, and in doing so they risk death from desert bandits (9-10). Judean WOMEN ARE RAPED, former leaders are tortured, and children are forced to work like slaves (11-13). The old way of life has gone, and with it has gone all celebration and rejoicing (14-15). People everywhere are unhappy, discouraged and ashamed. They acknowledge that their sin has brought all this upon them (16-18). (Bridgeway Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible:
“They ravished the women … the virgins of the cities of Judah” (Lamentations 5:11). This is an accompanying vice of warfare that is just as much a part of modern wars as it was in antiquity. Nothing is more terrible and disgusting than the WHOLESALE RAPE of the women (all of them) by an army of enemies. The bestiality of wicked men unrestrained by any outside force is the utmost in depravity.
(Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable:
“The enemy had RAPED THE WOMEN and girls in Jerusalem and Judah. Respected princes had experienced the most humiliating deaths, and the enemy gave no respect to Judah”s elderly. Since Nebuchadnezzar evidently did not torture his victims (cf. Jeremiah 52:10-11; Jeremiah 52:24-27), it may be that the Chaldeans strung up the princes by their hands-after they had died-to dishonor them (cf. Deuteronomy 21:22-23). [Note: Keil, 2:451.]” (Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable – Lamentations 5:11 – Online source)
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah ( Lamentations 5:11 ).
The enemies had come in. It must have been a horrible thing. The fathers to see their wives and their young daughters ravished by the enemy, RAPED and all and then murdered.” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
American Old Testament scholar and the William Marcellus McPheeters Professor Emerita of Old Testament at Columbia Theological Seminary – Kathleen M. O’Connor:
“Women’s history
As symbolic figures, women convey mixed messages in Lamentations, but when the book speaks of real women, it tells of their history in painful and illuminating ways. The book brings into the open hidden victims of war who suffer long after the war’s end. Some verses mention women’s sufferings alongside those of men and other social groups. Young women have gone into captivity with young men (2:21). Young girls and elders grieve over Zion’s destruction (2:10). Other verses attend specifically to the plight of women. The male speaker grieves over ‘the fate of all the young women in my city’ (3:11). ‘WOMEN ARE RAPED in Zion’ (5:11).” (Women’s Bible Commentary: Expanded Edition [Edited by Carol Ann Newsom, Sharon H. Ringe, WJK – Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1998], by Kathleen M. O’Connor, page 190)
Dr. Charles H. Dyer:
“The first group mentioned who suffered the horrors of foreign occupation were the women of Jerusalem (Zion) and the virgins … of Judah. Women who survived the Babylonian assault on their cities were mercilessly RAPED BY THE SADISTIC SOLDIERS. In a scene of savage brutality, repeated by many conquering armies throughout history, the victors went on a wanton spree of lustful revenge against defenceless women.” (The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition Of the Scriptures By Dallas Seminary Faculty – Old Testament [Editors John F. Walvoord, Roy B. Zuck, 1983] by Charles H. Dyer, page 1222)
Professor of Old Testament David L. Petersen:
The elegant literary construction stands in constrast with the devastating destruction: much will be violated. The book of Lamentations, which reflects the fall of Jerusalem, refers to all three elements, the destruction of the city, presumably its walls (2:8); plundering (1:18) and violation of dwelling places (2:2); WOMEN RAPED (5:11).” (Zechariah 9-14 and Malachi: A Commentary [Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1995], by David L. Petersen, page 141)
Professor David W. Chapman:
“The context of 5:11-14 concentrates on the horrors that women and men faced in the exilic period. After speaking of the rape RAPE OF THE WOMEN IN 5:11, the two verses above mention in descending social order the fate of the men (a similar order is reiterated in 5:14). The Hebrew perfect verbs are translated above with the English simple past; however, many modern interpreters (going back to Lam 5:1) understand these are current afflictions for the writer. (Ancient Jewish and Christian Perceptions of Crucifixion [Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen zum Neuen Testament, 2. Reihe – Mohr Siebeck, Tubingen, Germany, 2008], by David W. Chapman, page 158)
There you have it Sham-Moon, your god you worship allows rape, and forced sexual intercourse. Enjoy there will be more articles published exposing your pagan Babble
The Bible, Jesus (God) of the Old Testament allowed rape slaves. The GNT Bible accurately described what happened to the women:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
Living Bible (TLB)
“28-29 If a man RAPES A GIRL who is not engaged and is caught in the act, he must pay a fine[a] to the girl’s father and marry her; he may never divorce her.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
The Message (MSG)
“28-29 When a man comes upon a virgin who has never been engaged and grabs and RAPES HER and they are found out, the man who RAPED HER has to give her father fifty pieces of silver. He has to marry her because he took advantage of her. And he can never divorce her.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“29 the man who had sexual intercourse with her must give the girl’s father 1¼ pounds of silver, and she will become his wife. Since he RAPED HER, he can never divorce her as long as he lives.[a]” – Deuteronomy 22:29
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“29 The man who has RAPED HER must pay her father fifty shekels of silver and she must become his wife because he has violated her; he may never divorce her as long as he lives.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
New International Reader’s Version (NIRV)
“29 Then the man must weigh out 20 ounces of silver. He must give it to her father. The man must marry the young woman, because he RAPED HER. And he can never divorce her as long as he lives.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“29 they will be forced to get married. He must give her father fifty pieces of silver as a bride-price and[a] can never divorce her.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
Footnote for CEV Translation:
“22.28,29 talks her into sleeping with him. . . bride-price and: Or “FORCES HER TO HAVE SEX.”
Expanded Bible (EXB)
29 the man who ·had sexual relations [L lay] with her must pay the girl’s father about ·one and one-fourth pounds [L fifty shekels] of silver. He must also marry the girl, because he has ·dishonored [HUMILIATED; RAPED] her, and he may never divorce her for as long as he lives [Ex. 22:16–17].” – Deuteronomy 22:29
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
“29 the man who had sexual intercourse with her must give the girl’s father 1¼ pounds of silver, and she will become his wife. SINCE HE RAPED HER, he can never divorce her as long as he lives.[a]” – Deuteronomy 22:29
Good News Translation (GNT)
“29 He is to pay her father the bride price of fifty pieces of silver, and she is to become his wife, because he FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE WITH HIM. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
“NOW, IF YOU RAPED A GIRL, and she is a virgin, and she is not betrothed to someone else, then you”re to take her as your wife to pay her father fifty shekels of silver (Deuteronomy 22:23-29).” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Deuteronomy 22:29 – online source)
Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible – Unabridged:
“But if SHE WAS FORCED, THE MAN ONLY WHO COMMITTED THE RAPE was to suffer for the violence, which was regarded as a capital crime. In the case of a maiden not betrothed being seduced, the man was OBLIGED TO MARRY HER, and he forfeited the right possessed by other husbands of giving her a divorce. …”(Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible – Unabridged – Deuteronomy 22:29 – online source)
Biblical scholars John Walton, Victor Matthew and Mark Chavalas in their The IVP Bible Background Commentary have the following on Deuteronomy 22:25-27 which is the context of verses 28 and 29:
“In this case, Israelite law adds another criterion by specifying the guiltlessness of the woman who is RAPED in the countryside, where her screams were unlikely to attract assistance. The assumption of her innocence is based on the implied resistance to the rape in this circumstance.” (Walton, J. H., Matthew, V. H., & Chavalas, M. W. (2000). The IVP Bible Background Commentary: The Old Testament. Downers Grove, Illinois: InterVarsity Press. p. 196)
Biblical scholar and historian Philip King who was professor of Biblical Studies in the Department of Theology at Boston College and Dorot Professor of the Archeology of Israel in the Department of Near Eastern Languages and Civilizations at Hardvard University Lawrence Stager write:
“RAPE IS REFERRED TO ONLY IN DEUTERONOMY, but with no sharp distinction between rape and seduction. THE RAPIST “SHALL GIVE FIFTY SHEKELS OF SILVER TO THAT YOUNG WOMAN’S FATHER, AND SHE SHALL BECOME HIS WIFE. Because he violated her, he shall not be permitted to divorce her as long as he lives.”(Deut. 22:29) The Payment in this case represents the mohar.” (King, P. J, & Stager, L. E. (2001). Life in Biblical Israel. In Douglas A. Knight (ed.), Library of Ancient Israel. Louisville, Kentucky: Westminster John Knox Press. p. 60)
The late conservative Biblical scholar Peter Craigie who held several top posts such as head of the religious studies department at the University of Calgary in his commentary on Deuteronomy 22:28-29 writes as follows:
“28-29 (iv) The RAPE OF A SINGLE WOMAN. THE MAN USES FORCE ON THE WOMAN, who is a virgin and is not betrothed to a man; the two are discovered while the crime is being committed. In this case, the man must pay damages to the father, in the amount of fifty pieces (shekels) of silver, and he must marry the woman.” (Craigie, P. C. (1976). The New International Commentary on the Old Testament: The Book of Deuteronomy. Grand Rapids, Michigan: Wm. Eerdmans Publishing Co. p. 295)
The late Biblical scholar and specialist in Hebrew studies Roger Whybray writes:
“Deuteronomy 22:22-29 deals with adultery and RAPE, and make distinctions between RAPE in the open country, where the woman is defenceless, and rape in the town, where it is held that she could have shouted for help. Rape of an unbetrothed virgin is punished by a payment to her father.” (Whybray, R. N. (2002). The Good Life in the Old Testament. Edinburgh, Scotland: T&T Clark. p. 50)
Associate Professor of Religious Studies at Salve Regina University T. J. Wray writes:
“The crime of rape in the Bible is varied and complex. In the world of biblical antiquity, RAPE is largely viewed as a crime of disordered lust. Today, we know that it is about must more, but in the Bible, if an unengaged virgin is RAPED, she may actually be required TO MARRY HER RAPIST, and the rapist may must pay the girl’s father a fee for defiling his daughter (Deuteronomy 22:28-29)! Though Deuteronomy stipulates the death penalty for the rape of an engaged female (Deut. 22:25-27, there are numerous cases of vigilante justice for victims of rape (Gen 34:25-29; Judges 19-20; 2 Sam 13:22-29), which leads us to conclude that perhaps in ancient Israel, the long arm of the law often falls short when it comes to rape.” (Wray, T. J. (2011). What the Bible Really Tells Us: The Essential Guide to Biblical Literacy. Lanham, Maryland: Rowman & Littlefield Publishers, Inc. p. 142)
Dr. Gary Hall, Professor of Old Testament and Hebrew at Lincoln Christian Seminary in his commentary on Deuteronomy 22:28-29 write:
“22:28-29 If the girl who was violated was not married or engaged, the penalty was not death but a fine and the loss of the right of divorce. The law protected both the girl (economic security) and the father (loss of bride price). The girl’s loss of virginity would have made her virtually unmarriageable. In Exodus 22:16 the father could refuse to let the girl marry the seducer. There is some question whether the act in view here was rape (NIV) or consensual. The word of verse 25 (“seize”) was not used but an apparently more mild word which meant “take hold of.” However, the explanation that the man had violated the girl POINTS TOWARD RAPE. The expression was also used of Shechem’s treatment of Dinah (Gen. 34:2).” (Hall, G. H. (2000). The College Press NIV Commentary: Deuteronomy. United States: College Press Publishing Co. p. 339)
Avid Christian pastor and Bible instructor Warren W. Wiersbe writes:
“According to the law, if a man RAPED A VIRGIN not engaged to be married, he had to pay her father a fine and marry her, and he could never divorce her (Deut. 2:28-29).” (Wiersbe, W. W. (2003). The Bible Exposition Commentary: Old Testament History. Colorado Springs, Colorado: Cook Communications Ministries. p. 342)
As can be seen, the word can mean entice, persuade, deceive etc. The following passage uses the word in a slightly similar fashion to that of Exodus, namely how God will allure or draw Israel back to his love:
“‘Therefore I am now going to allure (pathath) her; I will lead her into the desert and speak tenderly to her. There I will give her back her vineyards, and will make the Valley of Achor a door of hope. There she will sing as in the days of her youth, as in the day she came up out of Egypt. In that day,’ declares the LORD, ‘you will call me “my husband”; you will no longer call me “my master.” I will remove the names of the Baals from her lips; no longer will their names be invoked. In that day I will make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field and the birds of the air and the creatures that move along the ground. Bow and sword and battle I will abolish from the land, so that all may lie down in safety. I will betroth you to me forever; I will betroth you in righteousness and justice, in love and compassion. I will betroth you in faithfulness, and you will acknowledge the LORD.’” Hosea 2:14-20
It is clear from the context that Exodus is referring to a man persuading or enticing a woman into having sex. Hence, this passage lends support to the fact that the woman in Deuteronomy 22:28-29 consented to the sexual act, and wasn’t forced into having sex. In other words, there was no rape involved between the man and the woman.
As the following Study Bible puts it:
22:28-29 Preceding legislation dealt with cases of rape involving a woman already married or engaged. The ruling outlined here is addressed in cases of seduction IN WHICH IT IS ASSUMED THAT THE WOMAN WAS, OR MAY HAVE BEEN, CONSENTING TO THE SEXUAL RELATIONSHIP. The fact that such a relationship had taken place was nevertheless regarded as of vital concern to the community and therefore required that a requisite sum of money be paid to the woman’s father. It is assumed that the bride’s father’s rights have been violated by what had taken place and that appropriate compensation was necessary to offset the loss of the expected bride-price. A further stipulation required that the couple should then marry and that no subsequent divorce was to be permitted. In Exodus 22:16-17 the closely comparable law allows that the father need not consent to giving his daughter to the man, in which case the compensation was still to be paid to the father. Fifty shekels was a significantly large amount and may be assumed to have been equivalent to the average bride-price. (The New Interpreter’s Study Bible: New Revised Standard Version with the Apocrypha [Abingdon Press, Nashville TN 2003], pp. 278-279; underline and capital emphasis ours)
Or, as the late renowned Bible expositor John Gill explained it long ago:
If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed…
That is, meets with one in a field, which is not espoused to a man; and the man is supposed to be an unmarried man, as appears by what follows:
and lay hold on her, and lie with her,
she yielding to it, and so is not expressive of a rape, as (Deuteronomy 22:25) WHERE A DIFFERENT WORD FROM THIS IS THERE USED; which signifies taking strong hold of her, and ravishing her by force; yet this, though owing to his first violent seizure of her, and so different from what was obtained by enticing words, professions of love, and promises of marriage, and the like, as in (Exodus 22:16,17) but not without her consent:
and they be found;
in the field together, and in the fact; or however there are witnesses of it, or they themselves have confessed, it, and perhaps betrayed by her pregnancy. (The New John Gill Exposition of the Entire Bible; online source; capital and underline emphasis ours)
And this is what the late great Christian philosopher and apologist Dr. Greg L. Bahnsen wrote concerning this issue:
… “If a man finds a girl who is an unbetrothed virgin, an he lays hold of her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man lying down with her shall give to the girl’s father fifty pieces of silver, and she shall be his wife because he has humbled her; he may not put her away all his days.” [Deuteronomy 22:28-29]
This is the literal translation of the Hebrew. Unfortunately, some commentators and Bible translations … make the mistake of interpreting these words as referring to the use of force and thus to raping a virgin. Such a view is quite unacceptable, for a number of reasons. (1) This would lay a burden and penalty on the woman who had no part or consent in the act, which is as unfair and senseless as punishing the victim of attempted murder.
(2) The Hebrew word tapas (“lay hold of her,” emphasized above) simply means to take hold of something, grasp it in hand, and (by application) to capture or seize something. It is the verb used for “handling” the harp and flute (Gen. 4:21), the sword (Ezek. 21:11; 30:21), the sickle (Jer. 50:16), the shield (Jer. 46:9), the oars (Ezek. 27:29), and the bow (Amos 2:15). It is likewise used for “taking” God’s name (Prov. 30:9) or “dealing” with the law of God (Jer. 2:8). Joseph’s garment was “grasped” (Gen. 39:12; cf. I Kings 11:30), even as Moses “took” the two tablets of the law (Deut. 9:17). People are “caught” (I Kings 20:18), even as cities are “captured” (Deut. 20:19; Isa. 36:1). An adulterous wife may not have been “caught” in the act (Num. 5:13). In all of these instances it is clear that, while force may come into the picture from further description, the Hebrew verb “to handle, grasp, capture” does not in itself indicate anything about the use of force.
This verb used in Deuteronomy 22:28 is different from the verb used in verse 25 (chazak, from the root meaning “to be strong, firm”) which can mean “to seize” a bear and kill it (I Sam. 17:35; cf. 2 Sam. 2:16; Zech. 14:13), “to prevail” (2 Sam. 24:4; Dan. 11:7), “to be strong” (Deut. 31:6; 2 Sam. 2:7), etc. Deuteronomy 22:25 thus speaks of a man finding a woman and “forcing her.” Just three verses later (Deut. 25:28), the verb is changed to simply “take hold of” her – indicating an action less intense and violent than the action dealt with in verse 25 (viz., rape).
(3) The Hebrew word anah (“humble, afflict,” emphasized above) used in Deuteronomy 22:29 can sometimes be used for forcing a woman (Gen. 34:2; Jud. 20:5; 2 Sam. 13:12, 14, 22, 32; Lam. 5:11) but need not indicate a forcible rape, which is clear from the Deuteronomy passage itself at verse 24. It can simply mean to dishonor, mistreat, or afflict (e.g., Ex. 1:11; Gen. 16:6; Ex. 22:22; Deut. 8:2; Ps. 119:67), and in sexual settings can denote other kinds of sin than rape (Ezek. 22:10, 11).
We can agree with the reasoning of James Jordan: “At first sight, this seems to allow for rape of an unbetrothed girl. In Hebrew, however, the verb ‘seize’ is a weaker verb than the verb for ‘force’ used in the same passage (v. 25) to describe rape. This stronger verb is also used for the rape of Tamar (2 Sam. 13:11). Implied here is a notion of catching the girl, but not a notion that she fought back with anything more than a token resistance. Modern random rape would not be excusable under this law, and would have to come under the death penalty of Deuteronomy 22:25-27” (The Law of the Covenant, p. 149).
Accordingly, one will find that many competent authorities in Biblical interpretation understand Deuteronomy 22:28-29 to apply to cases of seduction, not forcible rape. For instance:
Meredith Kline: “The seducer of an unbetrothed virgin was obliged to take her as wife, paying the customary bride price and forfeiting the right of divorce” (Treaty of the Great King: The Covenant Structure of Deuteronomy, p. 111).
Matthew Henry: “… if he and the damsel did consent, he should be bound to marry her, and never to divorce her, how much soever she was below him and how unpleasing soever she might afterwards be to him” (Commentary on the Whole Bible, ad loc.).
J. A. Thompson: “Seduction of a young girl. Where the girl was not betrothed and no legal obligations had been entered into, the man was forced to pay the normal bride-price and marry the girl. He was not allowed, subsequently, to send her away (Deuteronomy: Introduction and Commentary, Tyndale Series, p. 237).
In Israel’s Laws and legal Precedents (1907), Charles Foster Kent (professor of Biblical Literature at Yale University) clearly distinguished between the law pertaining to rape in Dt. 22:25-27 and the law pertaining to seduction in Dt. 22:28-29 (pp. 117-118).
Keil and Delitzsch classify Deuteronomy 22:28-29 under the category of “Seduction of a virgin,” comment that the crime involved was “their deed” – implying consent of the part of both parties – and liken this law to that found in Exodus 22:16-17 (Biblical Commentary on the Old Testament, vol. 3, p. 412).
Even if one has some question about the applicability of Deuteronomy 22:28-29, the clear and decisive command from God when a man has seduced a virgin is found in Exodus 22:16-17: “If a man seduces a virgin who is not betrothed and lies with her, he shall surely pay her dowry to make her his wife. If her father absolutely refuses to give her to him, he shall weigh out money according to the dowry for virgins.”
In this text there is no question whatsoever of forcible rape. The Hebrew verb used to describe the sin (italicized in the quotation above) is patah, used elsewhere for “coaxing” (Jud. 14:15), “luring” (Jud. 16:5; Hos. 2:14), and “enticing” (Prov. 1:10; 16:29). When a man gets a virgin to consent to have sexual relations with him, he is morally obligated to marry her – as the following commentators indicate:
John Calvin: “The remedy is, that he who has corrupted the girl should be compelled to marry her, and also to give her a dowry from his own property, lest, if he should afterwards cast her off, she should go away from her bed penniless” (Commentaries on the Four Last Books of Moses Arranged in the Form of a Harmony, vol. 3, pp. 83-84.
J. C. Connell: “Although she consented, it was still his responsibility to protect her from lifelong shame resulting from the sin of the moment by marrying her, not without payment of the regular dowry” (“Exodus,” New bible Commentary, ed. F. Davidson, p. 122).
Adam Clarke: “This was an exceedingly wise and humane law, and must have operated powerfully against seduction and fornication; because the person who might feel inclined to take advantage of a young woman knew that he must marry her, and give her a dowry, if her parents consented” (The Holy Bible … with a Commentary and Critical Notes, vol. 1, p. 414).
Alan Cole: “If a man seduces a virgin: … he must acknowledge her as his wife, unless her father refuses” (Exodus: An Introduction and Commentary, Tyndale Series, p. 173).
James Jordan: “the punishment for the seducer is that he must marry the girl, unless her father objects, and that he may never divorce her (according to Dt. 22:29)” (The Law of the Covenant, p. 148).
Walter C. Kaiser, Jr.: “Exodus 22:16-17 takes up the problem of the seduction of a maiden who was not engaged …. Here the seducer must pay the ‘bride-price’ and agree to marry her” (Toward Old Testament Ethics, p. 107).
(Bahnsen, Pre-Marital Sexual Relations: What is the Moral Obligation When Repeated Incidents are Confessed?, PE152, Covenant Media Foundation, 1992)
In light of the foregoing, we feel the following rendering best captures the intended meaning of the passage which has nothing to do with a woman having to marry her rapist:
“Suppose a woman isn’t engaged to be married, and a man talks her into sleeping with him. If they are caught, they will be forced to get married. He must give her father fifty pieces of silver as a bride-price and can never divorce her.” Contemporary English Version (CEV)
This concludes our exegesis of Deuteronomy 22:28-29. We prayerfully hope that by the grace of our risen Lord and eternal Savior Jesus Christ, this short paper will be of great help to those Christians who have been confronted by Muslims with the accusation that the Holy Bible condones the raping of women. Hopefully, both Christians and Muslims will see that the Holy Bible nowhere condones rape.
And now be a good lil muta loving pagan and read this thoroughly!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Will the real rapist and adulterer please stand up!
And here you go flyingmutalover! Do make sure you enjoy it! And here is my demolition of his butchering of the word ana. This isn’t anything. Watch what I am going to do with your shame piece on Q. 9:29 which I am nearly finished with it. Like I said, everytime you lie through your teeth in the name of the jinn you worship and his profit I will take it out on Muhammad. So enjoy!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Here is a different translation for the exact word ‘anah’ 🙂
One of the verses that has been downplayed by Christian apologists as not endorsing or approving ‘rape’ is Deuteronomy 21:10-14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since YOU FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.
They claim that the word ‘anah’ used here doesn’t actually mean ‘ rape’ (forced intercourse). How can we prove that RAPE DID TAKE PLACE? Let’s read another translations for a different verses (with the exact word (anah)):
New Living Translation
“Our enemies RAPE THE WOMEN in Jerusalem and the young girls in all the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version (ESV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Standard Version (ISV)
“They have RAPED women in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
NET Bible
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
GOD’S WORD® Translation
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Women have been RAPED in Zion, young women in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“They have RAPED the women of Tziyon, virgins in the cities of Y’hudah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“On Zion and everywhere in Judah our wives and daughters are BEING RAPED.” – Lamentations 5:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“The enemy raped the women of Zion. They RAPED THE WOMEN in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“The enemy [L They] ·ABUSED [VIOLATED; RAPED] the women ·of Jerusalem [L in Zion; C the location of the Temple] and the ·girls [L virgins] in the ·cities [towns] of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Good News Translation (GNT)
“Our wives have BEEN RAPED on Mount Zion itself; in every Judean village our daughters have been forced to submit.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“The ENEMY RAPED the women of Jerusalem and the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“They RAPED women in Zion, young women[a] in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Living Bible (TLB)
“They RAPE the women of Jerusalem and the girls in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Message (MSG)
“Our wives were RAPED in the streets in Zion, and our virgins in the cities of Judah.” Lamentations 5:11
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the cities of Judah…” – Lamentations 5:11
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Voice (VOICE)
“In the place where God should be— Zion and the surrounding towns of Judah— Women, young and old alike, are BRUTALLY RAPED and violated.” – Lamentations 5:11
EVEN THE COMMENTARIES AGREE THAT ANAH MEANS RAPE:
Bridgeway Bible Commentary:
Conditions in Judah are terrible. The people have to search the barren country regions for food, and in doing so they risk death from desert bandits (9-10). Judean WOMEN ARE RAPED, former leaders are tortured, and children are forced to work like slaves (11-13). The old way of life has gone, and with it has gone all celebration and rejoicing (14-15). People everywhere are unhappy, discouraged and ashamed. They acknowledge that their sin has brought all this upon them (16-18). (Bridgeway Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible:
“They ravished the women … the virgins of the cities of Judah” (Lamentations 5:11). This is an accompanying vice of warfare that is just as much a part of modern wars as it was in antiquity. Nothing is more terrible and disgusting than the WHOLESALE RAPE of the women (all of them) by an army of enemies. The bestiality of wicked men unrestrained by any outside force is the utmost in depravity.
(Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable:
“The enemy had RAPED THE WOMEN and girls in Jerusalem and Judah. Respected princes had experienced the most humiliating deaths, and the enemy gave no respect to Judah”s elderly. Since Nebuchadnezzar evidently did not torture his victims (cf. Jeremiah 52:10-11; Jeremiah 52:24-27), it may be that the Chaldeans strung up the princes by their hands-after they had died-to dishonor them (cf. Deuteronomy 21:22-23). [Note: Keil, 2:451.]” (Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable – Lamentations 5:11 – Online source)
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah ( Lamentations 5:11 ).
The enemies had come in. It must have been a horrible thing. The fathers to see their wives and their young daughters ravished by the enemy, RAPED and all and then murdered.” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
American Old Testament scholar and the William Marcellus McPheeters Professor Emerita of Old Testament at Columbia Theological Seminary – Kathleen M. O’Connor:
“Women’s history
As symbolic figures, women convey mixed messages in Lamentations, but when the book speaks of real women, it tells of their history in painful and illuminating ways. The book brings into the open hidden victims of war who suffer long after the war’s end. Some verses mention women’s sufferings alongside those of men and other social groups. Young women have gone into captivity with young men (2:21). Young girls and elders grieve over Zion’s destruction (2:10). Other verses attend specifically to the plight of women. The male speaker grieves over ‘the fate of all the young women in my city’ (3:11). ‘WOMEN ARE RAPED in Zion’ (5:11).” (Women’s Bible Commentary: Expanded Edition [Edited by Carol Ann Newsom, Sharon H. Ringe, WJK – Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1998], by Kathleen M. O’Connor, page 190)
Dr. Charles H. Dyer:
“The first group mentioned who suffered the horrors of foreign occupation were the women of Jerusalem (Zion) and the virgins … of Judah. Women who survived the Babylonian assault on their cities were mercilessly RAPED BY THE SADISTIC SOLDIERS. In a scene of savage brutality, repeated by many conquering armies throughout history, the victors went on a wanton spree of lustful revenge against defenceless women.” (The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition Of the Scriptures By Dallas Seminary Faculty – Old Testament [Editors John F. Walvoord, Roy B. Zuck, 1983] by Charles H. Dyer, page 1222)
Professor of Old Testament David L. Petersen:
The elegant literary construction stands in constrast with the devastating destruction: much will be violated. The book of Lamentations, which reflects the fall of Jerusalem, refers to all three elements, the destruction of the city, presumably its walls (2:8); plundering (1:18) and violation of dwelling places (2:2); WOMEN RAPED (5:11).” (Zechariah 9-14 and Malachi: A Commentary [Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1995], by David L. Petersen, page 141)
Professor David W. Chapman:
“The context of 5:11-14 concentrates on the horrors that women and men faced in the exilic period. After speaking of the rape RAPE OF THE WOMEN IN 5:11, the two verses above mention in descending social order the fate of the men (a similar order is reiterated in 5:14). The Hebrew perfect verbs are translated above with the English simple past; however, many modern interpreters (going back to Lam 5:1) understand these are current afflictions for the writer. (Ancient Jewish and Christian Perceptions of Crucifixion [Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen zum Neuen Testament, 2. Reihe – Mohr Siebeck, Tubingen, Germany, 2008], by David W. Chapman, page 158)
There you have it Sham-Moon, your god you worship allows rape, and forced sexual intercourse. Enjoy there will be more articles published exposing your pagan Babble 😉 🙂
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 has been noted by some that the ‘provisions’ laid out in the passage are ‘remarkable’, ‘compassionate’ and ‘humanistic’. Let’s read:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.” https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/hebrew-word-anah-inna-carries-the-meaning-of-rape/
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“2 and Sh’khem the son of Hamor the Hivi, the local ruler, saw her, grabbed her, RAPED HER and humiliated her.” – Genesis 34:2
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“2 She was seen by Hamor’s son Shechem, the leader of the Hivites, and he grabbed her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“2 She was seen by Shechem, the son of Hamor the Hivite, who ruled that area. Shechem took Dinah and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Good News Translation (GNT)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, who was chief of that region, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, a prince of the region, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“2 Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of that land, saw Dinah. He took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
International Standard Version (ISV)
“2 When Hamor the Hivite’s son Shechem, the regional leader, saw her, he grabbed her and RAPED HER, humiliating her.” – Genesis 34:2
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“2 And Shechem, the son of Hamor the Hivite, the prince of the land, saw her. And he took her and lay with her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
The Message (MSG)
“1-2 One day Dinah, the daughter Leah had given Jacob, went to visit some of the women in that country. Shechem, the son of Hamor the Hivite who was chieftain there, saw her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“2 When Shechem, son of the local ruler Hamor the Hivite, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Living Bible (TLB)
“2 but when Shechem, son of King Hamor the Hivite, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
“2 When Shechem, son of the local ruler Hamor the Hivite, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New International Reader’s Version (NIRV)
“2 Hamor, the Hivite, was the ruler of that area. When his son Shechem saw Dinah, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New International Version (NIV)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of that area, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New International Version – UK (NIVUK)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of that area, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New Living Translation (NLT)
“2 But when the local prince, Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, saw Dinah, he seized her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Tree of Life Version (TLV)
“2 When Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, the prince of the land, saw her, he took her and lay with her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
The Voice (VOICE)
“2 But when Shechem (son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region) saw Dinah, he grabbed her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
“2 When Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, the prince of the land, saw her, he took her and LAY WITH HER [A]BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
New Century Version (NCV)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of the land, saw her, he took her and FORCED HER TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS WITH HIM.” – Genesis 34:2
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, who ruled that area, saw her, he grabbed her, FORCED HIMSELF ON HER, and SEXUALLY ASSAULTED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region, saw her, he seized her and LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region, saw her, he seized her and LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition (NRSVACE)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region, saw her, he SEIZED HER AND LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
New Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition (NRSVCE)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region, saw her, he seized her and LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
Wycliffe Bible (WYC)
“2 And when Shechem, the son of Hamor (the) Hivite, the prince of that land, had seen her, he loved her, and he ravished her, and (he) slept with her, and OPPRESSED THE VIRGIN BY VIOLENCE (and he oppressed the virgin with violence).” – Genesis 34:2
Amplified Bible (AMP)
“2 When Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, prince (sheik) of the land, saw her, he KIDNAPPED HER AND LAY [INTIMATELY] WITH HER BY FORCE [humbling and offending her].” – Genesis 34:2
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite [C one of the tribes that inhabited Canaan], the ·ruler [prince] of the land, saw her, he took her and FORCED HER TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS WITH HIM [lay with her and humiliated/violated her].” – Genesis 34:2
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“2 When Shechem, son of Hamor the Hivite,[a] the leader of the region, saw her, HE SEIZED HER AND LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
GOD WILLING I WILL BE EXPOSING YOU FILTHY PAGAN babble passages, showing how the Bible allows rape, forced sexual intercourse, all to be found in your Babble. 🙂
Let’s expose the real women raping and prostituting murderer, shall we?
And here you go flyingmutalover! Do make sure you enjoy it! And here is my demolition of his butchering of the word ana. This isn’t anything. Watch what I am going to do with your shame piece on Q. 9:29 which I am nearly finished with it. Like I said, everytime you lie through your teeth in the name of the jinn you worship and his profit I will take it out on Muhammad. So enjoy!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Now what was that about rape! Must really suck being you!
Like I said, be a good lil muta loving pagan and read this thoroughly!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Here is a different translation for the exact word ‘anah’ 🙂
One of the verses that has been downplayed by Christian apologists as not endorsing or approving ‘rape’ is Deuteronomy 21:10-14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since YOU FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.
They claim that the word ‘anah’ used here doesn’t actually mean ‘ rape’ (forced intercourse). How can we prove that RAPE DID TAKE PLACE? Let’s read another translations for a different verses (with the exact word (anah)):
New Living Translation
“Our enemies RAPE THE WOMEN in Jerusalem and the young girls in all the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version (ESV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Standard Version (ISV)
“They have RAPED women in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
NET Bible
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
GOD’S WORD® Translation
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Women have been RAPED in Zion, young women in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“They have RAPED the women of Tziyon, virgins in the cities of Y’hudah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“On Zion and everywhere in Judah our wives and daughters are BEING RAPED.” – Lamentations 5:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“The enemy raped the women of Zion. They RAPED THE WOMEN in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“The enemy [L They] ·ABUSED [VIOLATED; RAPED] the women ·of Jerusalem [L in Zion; C the location of the Temple] and the ·girls [L virgins] in the ·cities [towns] of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Good News Translation (GNT)
“Our wives have BEEN RAPED on Mount Zion itself; in every Judean village our daughters have been forced to submit.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“The ENEMY RAPED the women of Jerusalem and the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“They RAPED women in Zion, young women[a] in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Living Bible (TLB)
“They RAPE the women of Jerusalem and the girls in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Message (MSG)
“Our wives were RAPED in the streets in Zion, and our virgins in the cities of Judah.” Lamentations 5:11
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the cities of Judah…” – Lamentations 5:11
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Voice (VOICE)
“In the place where God should be— Zion and the surrounding towns of Judah— Women, young and old alike, are BRUTALLY RAPED and violated.” – Lamentations 5:11
EVEN THE COMMENTARIES AGREE THAT ANAH MEANS RAPE:
Bridgeway Bible Commentary:
Conditions in Judah are terrible. The people have to search the barren country regions for food, and in doing so they risk death from desert bandits (9-10). Judean WOMEN ARE RAPED, former leaders are tortured, and children are forced to work like slaves (11-13). The old way of life has gone, and with it has gone all celebration and rejoicing (14-15). People everywhere are unhappy, discouraged and ashamed. They acknowledge that their sin has brought all this upon them (16-18). (Bridgeway Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible:
“They ravished the women … the virgins of the cities of Judah” (Lamentations 5:11). This is an accompanying vice of warfare that is just as much a part of modern wars as it was in antiquity. Nothing is more terrible and disgusting than the WHOLESALE RAPE of the women (all of them) by an army of enemies. The bestiality of wicked men unrestrained by any outside force is the utmost in depravity.
(Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable:
“The enemy had RAPED THE WOMEN and girls in Jerusalem and Judah. Respected princes had experienced the most humiliating deaths, and the enemy gave no respect to Judah”s elderly. Since Nebuchadnezzar evidently did not torture his victims (cf. Jeremiah 52:10-11; Jeremiah 52:24-27), it may be that the Chaldeans strung up the princes by their hands-after they had died-to dishonor them (cf. Deuteronomy 21:22-23). [Note: Keil, 2:451.]” (Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable – Lamentations 5:11 – Online source)
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah ( Lamentations 5:11 ).
The enemies had come in. It must have been a horrible thing. The fathers to see their wives and their young daughters ravished by the enemy, RAPED and all and then murdered.” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
American Old Testament scholar and the William Marcellus McPheeters Professor Emerita of Old Testament at Columbia Theological Seminary – Kathleen M. O’Connor:
“Women’s history
As symbolic figures, women convey mixed messages in Lamentations, but when the book speaks of real women, it tells of their history in painful and illuminating ways. The book brings into the open hidden victims of war who suffer long after the war’s end. Some verses mention women’s sufferings alongside those of men and other social groups. Young women have gone into captivity with young men (2:21). Young girls and elders grieve over Zion’s destruction (2:10). Other verses attend specifically to the plight of women. The male speaker grieves over ‘the fate of all the young women in my city’ (3:11). ‘WOMEN ARE RAPED in Zion’ (5:11).” (Women’s Bible Commentary: Expanded Edition [Edited by Carol Ann Newsom, Sharon H. Ringe, WJK – Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1998], by Kathleen M. O’Connor, page 190)
Dr. Charles H. Dyer:
“The first group mentioned who suffered the horrors of foreign occupation were the women of Jerusalem (Zion) and the virgins … of Judah. Women who survived the Babylonian assault on their cities were mercilessly RAPED BY THE SADISTIC SOLDIERS. In a scene of savage brutality, repeated by many conquering armies throughout history, the victors went on a wanton spree of lustful revenge against defenceless women.” (The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition Of the Scriptures By Dallas Seminary Faculty – Old Testament [Editors John F. Walvoord, Roy B. Zuck, 1983] by Charles H. Dyer, page 1222)
Professor of Old Testament David L. Petersen:
The elegant literary construction stands in constrast with the devastating destruction: much will be violated. The book of Lamentations, which reflects the fall of Jerusalem, refers to all three elements, the destruction of the city, presumably its walls (2:8); plundering (1:18) and violation of dwelling places (2:2); WOMEN RAPED (5:11).” (Zechariah 9-14 and Malachi: A Commentary [Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1995], by David L. Petersen, page 141)
Professor David W. Chapman:
“The context of 5:11-14 concentrates on the horrors that women and men faced in the exilic period. After speaking of the rape RAPE OF THE WOMEN IN 5:11, the two verses above mention in descending social order the fate of the men (a similar order is reiterated in 5:14). The Hebrew perfect verbs are translated above with the English simple past; however, many modern interpreters (going back to Lam 5:1) understand these are current afflictions for the writer. (Ancient Jewish and Christian Perceptions of Crucifixion [Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen zum Neuen Testament, 2. Reihe – Mohr Siebeck, Tubingen, Germany, 2008], by David W. Chapman, page 158)
There you have it Sham-Moon, your god you worship allows rape, and forced sexual intercourse. Enjoy there will be more articles published exposing your pagan Babble 😉 🙂
For all christians who copy from David Wood’s site.
(Deut 21:11-14) has nothing to do with marriage .
Satanic Christians have been always playing with the translations.
If the (Deut 21:11-14) had anything to do with marriage, why would God command that Israeli man to (release )that captive woman and not to (divorce) her?
We read in (Deut 21:14) “But if you marry her and she does not please you, you must let her go free. You may not sell her or treat her as a slave, for you have humiliated her”
Why would God command that man not to SELL her ? Wasn’t that the normal situation when a husband divorces his wife? Why was there a need to instruct that man?
Then, what kind of (Humiliation) that man did for that woman?
If we read the Hebrew text, we will find the answer.
The term which is used in Hebrew is (עִנִּיתָֽהּ׃)!!
Guess what?
The same term (עִנִּיתָֽהּ׃) has been used in Genesis 34:2 in the story of Dinah which has been translated to (Rape).
The term in Hebrew is pronounced as (anah). in Arabic is (anna)
I’m an Arabic man, and I know how that term is used. It’s used to describe any act which has been done by FORCE.
Note (Deut21:11-14) has nothing to do with Marriage. Baal could be used as (husband). However, it means the (owner) in Arabic and Hebrew.
More rape passages from the pagan god Sha-moon worships 🙂
One of the best translations to illustrate that rape did indeed take place in Deuteronomy, is the GNT translation. It reads:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
Amplified Bible (AMP)
“5 But the men of Gibeah rose up against me and surrounded the house at night because of me. They intended to kill me, but instead they RAPED my concubine [so brutally] that she died.” – Judges 20:5
Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)
“5 And the men of Gibeah rose against me and beset the house round about me by night; they meant to kill me and they RAPED my concubine, and she is dead.” – Judges 20:5
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“5 and the men in Giv‘ah attacked me and surrounded the house I was staying in at night. They wanted to kill me, but instead they RAPED my concubine to death.” – Judges 20:5
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“5 Later that night, the men of Gibeah surrounded the house. They wanted to kill me, but instead they RAPED and killed my wife.” – Judges 20:5
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
“5 And behold the men of that city in the night beset the house wherein I was, intending to kill me, and abused my wife with an incredible FURY OF LUST, so that at last she died.” – Judges 20:5
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“5 But during the night the men of the city of Gibeah came to the house where I was staying. They surrounded the house, and they wanted to kill me. They RAPED my slave woman, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“5 During the night the ·men [leaders; lords] of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house and wanted to kill me. They FORCED MY SLAVE WOMAN TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS [abused/RAPED my concubine] and she died.” – Judges 20:5
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
“5 The citizens of Gibeah came to attack me. They surrounded the house where I was staying that night. They intended to kill me, but instead, they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
Good News Translation (GNT)
“5 The men of Gibeah came to get me and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me; instead they RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“5 Citizens of Gibeah ganged up on me and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, but they RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house and wanted to kill me. They RAPED my slave woman. And she died!” – Judges 20:5
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
Living Bible (TLB)
“5 “That night the men of Gibeah surrounded the house, planning to kill me, and they RAPED my wife until she was dead.” – Judges 20:5
The Message (MSG)
“That night the men of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house, intending to kill me. They GANG-RAPED my concubine and she died.” – Judges 20:5
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“5 The citizens of Gibeah came to attack me. They surrounded the house where I was staying that night. They intended to kill me, but instead, they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Century Version (NCV)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house and wanted to kill me. They FORCED MY SLAVE WOMAN TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS and she died.” – Judges 20:5
New International Reader’s Version (NIRV)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house. They were planning to kill me. They RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
New International Version (NIV)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me and surrounded the house, intending to kill me. They RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
New International Version – UK (NIVUK)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me and surrounded the house, intending to kill me. They RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Living Translation (NLT)
“5 That night some of the leading citizens of Gibeah surrounded the house, planning to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she was dead.” – Judges 20:5
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me, and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me, and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition (NRSVACE)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me, and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition (NRSVCE)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me, and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
“5 And the ba’alei haGiv’ah rose against me, and surrounded the bais upon me by lailah, and intended to have murdered me; and my pilegesh have they RAPED, that she is dead.” – Judges 20:5
Tree of Life Version (TLV)
“5 Then men of Gibeah rose against me and surrounded the house over me at night. They intended to kill me, but instead, they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
The Voice (VOICE)
“5 but the leaders of the city came to the house where we were staying and surrounded it, wanting to attack me. They intended to kill me, but they RAPED my mistress until she died.” – Judges 20:5
World English Bible (WEB)
“5 The men of Gibeah rose against me, and surrounded the house by night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine, and she is dead.” – Judges 20:5
There will be a further 10 articles coming soon exposing your Babble for what it is 🙂
And now be a good lil muta loving pagan and read this thoroughly!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
You need to stop confusing the Bible with your book of filth and porn. And let’s again expose the real women raping and prostituting murderer, shall we?
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Now what was that about rape! Must really suck being you!
Here is a different translation for the exact word ‘anah’ , Sham-moon make sure to read through all the evidence that is presented. Don’t get a heart attack 😉
One of the verses that has been downplayed by Christian apologists as not endorsing or approving ‘rape’ is Deuteronomy 21:10-14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since YOU FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.
They claim that the word ‘anah’ used here doesn’t actually mean ‘ rape’ (forced intercourse). How can we prove that RAPE DID TAKE PLACE? Let’s read another translations for a different verses (with the exact word (anah)):
New Living Translation
“Our enemies RAPE THE WOMEN in Jerusalem and the young girls in all the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version (ESV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Standard Version (ISV)
“They have RAPED women in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
NET Bible
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
GOD’S WORD® Translation
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Women have been RAPED in Zion, young women in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“They have RAPED the women of Tziyon, virgins in the cities of Y’hudah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“On Zion and everywhere in Judah our wives and daughters are BEING RAPED.” – Lamentations 5:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“The enemy raped the women of Zion. They RAPED THE WOMEN in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“The enemy [L They] ·ABUSED [VIOLATED; RAPED] the women ·of Jerusalem [L in Zion; C the location of the Temple] and the ·girls [L virgins] in the ·cities [towns] of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Good News Translation (GNT)
“Our wives have BEEN RAPED on Mount Zion itself; in every Judean village our daughters have been forced to submit.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“The ENEMY RAPED the women of Jerusalem and the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“They RAPED women in Zion, young women[a] in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Living Bible (TLB)
“They RAPE the women of Jerusalem and the girls in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Message (MSG)
“Our wives were RAPED in the streets in Zion, and our virgins in the cities of Judah.” Lamentations 5:11
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the cities of Judah…” – Lamentations 5:11
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Voice (VOICE)
“In the place where God should be— Zion and the surrounding towns of Judah— Women, young and old alike, are BRUTALLY RAPED and violated.” – Lamentations 5:11
EVEN THE COMMENTARIES AGREE THAT ANAH MEANS RAPE:
Bridgeway Bible Commentary:
Conditions in Judah are terrible. The people have to search the barren country regions for food, and in doing so they risk death from desert bandits (9-10). Judean WOMEN ARE RAPED, former leaders are tortured, and children are forced to work like slaves (11-13). The old way of life has gone, and with it has gone all celebration and rejoicing (14-15). People everywhere are unhappy, discouraged and ashamed. They acknowledge that their sin has brought all this upon them (16-18). (Bridgeway Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible:
“They ravished the women … the virgins of the cities of Judah” (Lamentations 5:11). This is an accompanying vice of warfare that is just as much a part of modern wars as it was in antiquity. Nothing is more terrible and disgusting than the WHOLESALE RAPE of the women (all of them) by an army of enemies. The bestiality of wicked men unrestrained by any outside force is the utmost in depravity.
(Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable:
“The enemy had RAPED THE WOMEN and girls in Jerusalem and Judah. Respected princes had experienced the most humiliating deaths, and the enemy gave no respect to Judah”s elderly. Since Nebuchadnezzar evidently did not torture his victims (cf. Jeremiah 52:10-11; Jeremiah 52:24-27), it may be that the Chaldeans strung up the princes by their hands-after they had died-to dishonor them (cf. Deuteronomy 21:22-23). [Note: Keil, 2:451.]” (Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable – Lamentations 5:11 – Online source)
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah ( Lamentations 5:11 ).
The enemies had come in. It must have been a horrible thing. The fathers to see their wives and their young daughters ravished by the enemy, RAPED and all and then murdered.” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
American Old Testament scholar and the William Marcellus McPheeters Professor Emerita of Old Testament at Columbia Theological Seminary – Kathleen M. O’Connor:
“Women’s history
As symbolic figures, women convey mixed messages in Lamentations, but when the book speaks of real women, it tells of their history in painful and illuminating ways. The book brings into the open hidden victims of war who suffer long after the war’s end. Some verses mention women’s sufferings alongside those of men and other social groups. Young women have gone into captivity with young men (2:21). Young girls and elders grieve over Zion’s destruction (2:10). Other verses attend specifically to the plight of women. The male speaker grieves over ‘the fate of all the young women in my city’ (3:11). ‘WOMEN ARE RAPED in Zion’ (5:11).” (Women’s Bible Commentary: Expanded Edition [Edited by Carol Ann Newsom, Sharon H. Ringe, WJK – Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1998], by Kathleen M. O’Connor, page 190)
Dr. Charles H. Dyer:
“The first group mentioned who suffered the horrors of foreign occupation were the women of Jerusalem (Zion) and the virgins … of Judah. Women who survived the Babylonian assault on their cities were mercilessly RAPED BY THE SADISTIC SOLDIERS. In a scene of savage brutality, repeated by many conquering armies throughout history, the victors went on a wanton spree of lustful revenge against defenceless women.” (The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition Of the Scriptures By Dallas Seminary Faculty – Old Testament [Editors John F. Walvoord, Roy B. Zuck, 1983] by Charles H. Dyer, page 1222)
Professor of Old Testament David L. Petersen:
The elegant literary construction stands in constrast with the devastating destruction: much will be violated. The book of Lamentations, which reflects the fall of Jerusalem, refers to all three elements, the destruction of the city, presumably its walls (2:8); plundering (1:18) and violation of dwelling places (2:2); WOMEN RAPED (5:11).” (Zechariah 9-14 and Malachi: A Commentary [Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1995], by David L. Petersen, page 141)
Professor David W. Chapman:
“The context of 5:11-14 concentrates on the horrors that women and men faced in the exilic period. After speaking of the rape RAPE OF THE WOMEN IN 5:11, the two verses above mention in descending social order the fate of the men (a similar order is reiterated in 5:14). The Hebrew perfect verbs are translated above with the English simple past; however, many modern interpreters (going back to Lam 5:1) understand these are current afflictions for the writer. (Ancient Jewish and Christian Perceptions of Crucifixion [Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen zum Neuen Testament, 2. Reihe – Mohr Siebeck, Tubingen, Germany, 2008], by David W. Chapman, page 158)
There you have it Sham-Moon, your god you worship allows rape, and forced sexual intercourse. Enjoy there will be more articles published exposing your pagan Babble 😉 🙂
One of uneducated Shamoun’s tricks is to make long posts so as to give the impression that he has a bevy of evidence for his claims when in reality a good portion of his posts are nothing more than his emotionally disturbed rants. Another purpose served by these long posts is to spam his opponents out of a debate. Anyway,
Uneducated Shamoun: So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Can you name one scholar who says ‘the age of remembering things’ isn’t a description of puberty?
Uneducated Shamoun: Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO!
Where does Bukhari say 65:4 allows men to consummate marriages with prepubescent wives? Also, to what extent did classical jurists allow men to consummate marriages to prepubescent wives based on the hadith in question? To what extent did classical scholars understand 65.4 as permitting prepubescent intercourse? Please don’t run from these questions.
Shi’t: And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
(1) Your statement about Ibn Hajar doesn’t make sense. (2) To what extent was Aisha traumatized by her relationship with Muhammad?
Dude, talk about a guy who is really mentally challenged. Where does Bukhari talk abotu marriages with minors? You serious? DID YOU NOT READ THE HADITH CAREFULLY? Here it is again:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Do you see the verse he is quoting? QURAN 65:4. Now was is that important. Here’s why:
And if you are in doubt as to the prescribed period for such of your women as have despaired of monthly courses, then know that the prescribed period for them is three months, and also for such AS DO NOT HAVE not have their monthly courses YET.. And as for those who are with child, their period shall be until they are delivered of their burden. And whoso fears ALLAH, HE will provide facilities for him in his affair. S. 65:4 Sher Ali
The surrounding context deals with the issue of the waiting period for divorce, and remarriage. The Quran is telling Muslims to wait for a certain period of time before making the divorce final or deciding to forego it. The Quran exhorts men to wait a period of three months in the case of women who either are no longer menstruating or haven’t even started their menstrual cycles! Thus, Islam permits men to marry prepubescent girls and even divorce them if they so choose!
This is further confirmed by the fact that according to Quran 33:49 THERE IS NO WAITING PERIOD FOR A WOMAN WHOSE MARRIAGE HASN’T BEEN CONSUMMATED BY SEXUAL INTERCOURSE!
Now note the narration in Sahih Al-Bukhari ONCE AGAIN:
Narrated Sahl bin Sad:
While we were sitting in the company of the Prophet a woman came to him and presented herself (for marriage) to him. The Prophet looked at her, lowering his eyes and raising them, but did not give a reply. One of his companions said, “Marry her to me O Allah’s Apostle!” The Prophet asked (him), “Have you got anything?” He said, “I have got nothing.” The Prophet said, “Not even an iron ring?” He said, “Not even an iron ring, but I will tear my garment into two halves and give her one half and keep the other half.” The Prophet; said, “No. Do you know some of the Quran (by heart)?” He said, “Yes.” The Prophet said, “Go, I have agreed to marry her to you with what you know of the Qur’an (as her Mahr).” ‘And for those who have no courses (i.e. they are still immature). (65.4) AND THE ‘IDDAT FOR THE GIRL BEFORE PUBERTY IS THREE MONTHS (in the above Verse). (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 63; emphasis ours)
Ibn Kathir writes regarding this verse:
, “The `Iddah is made up of cleanliness and the menstrual period.” So he divorces her while it is clear that she is pregnant, or he does not due to having sex, or since he does not know if she is pregnant or not. This is why the scholars said that there are two types of divorce, one that conforms to the Sunnah and another innovated. The divorce that conforms to the Sunnah is one where the husband pronounces one divorce to his wife when she is not having her menses and without having had sexual intercourse with her after the menses ended. One could divorce his wife when it is clear that she is pregnant. As for the innovated divorce, it occurs when one divorces his wife when she is having her menses, or after the menses ends, has sexual intercourse with her and then divorces her, even though he does not know if she became pregnant or not. There is a third type of divorce, which is neither a Sunnah nor an innovation where one divorces A YOUNG WIFE WHO HAS NOT BEGUN TO HAVE MENSES, the wife who is beyond the age of having menses, and divorcing one’s wife before the marriage was consummated.
And:
The `Iddah of Those in Menopause and Those Who do not have Menses
Allah the Exalted clarifies the waiting period of the woman in menopause. And that is the one whose menstruation has stopped due to her older age. Her `Iddah is three months instead of the three monthly cycles for those who menstruate, which is based upon the Ayah in (Surat) Al-Baqarah. [see 2:228] The same for THE YOUNG, WHO HAVE NOT REACHED THE YEARS OF MENSTRUATION…
Ibn Abi Hatim recorded a simpler narration than this one from Ubay bin Ka`b who said, “O Allah’s Messenger! When the Ayah in Surat Al-Baqarah was revealed prescribing the `Iddah of divorce, some people in Al-Madinah said, `There are still some women whose `Iddah has not been mentioned in the Qur’an. There are THE YOUNG, the old whose menstruation is discontinued, and the pregnant.’ Later on, this Ayah was revealed…
Still not convinced that your wicked religion allows men to have sex with minors before they attain puberty? Well then, here goes:
Tafsir al-Jalalayn
And [as for] those of your women who (read allā’ī or allā’i in both instances) no longer expect to menstruate, if you have any doubts, about their waiting period, their prescribed [waiting] period shall be three months, and [also for] those who have not yet menstruated, BECAUSE OF THEIR YOUNG AGE, their period shall [also] be three months — both cases apply to other than those whose spouses have died; for these [latter] their period is prescribed in the verse: they shall wait by themselves for four months and ten [days] [Q. 2:234]. …
Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs
(And for such of your women as despair of menstruation) because of old age, (if ye doubt) about their waiting period, (their period (of waiting) shall be three months) upon which another man asked: “O Messenger of Allah! What about the waiting period of those who do not have menstruation BECAUSE THEY ARE TOO YOUNG?” (along with those who have it not) because of young age, their waiting period is three months.
Asbab Al-Nuzul by Al-Wahidi
(And for such of your women as despair of menstruation…) [65:4]. Said Muqatil: “When the verse (Women who are divorced shall wait, keeping themselves apart…), Kallad ibn al-Nu‘man ibn Qays al-Ansari said: ‘O Messenger of Allah, what is the waiting period of the woman who does not menstruate and the woman who has not menstruated yet? And what is the waiting period of the pregnant woman?’ And so Allah, exalted is He, revealed this verse”. Abu Ishaq al-Muqri’ informed us> Muhammad ibn ‘Abd Allah ibn Hamdun> Makki ibn ‘Abdan> Abu’l-Azhar> Asbat ibn Muhammad> Mutarrif> Abu ‘Uthman ‘Amr ibn Salim who said: “When the waiting period for divorced and widowed women was mentioned in Surah al-Baqarah, Ubayy ibn Ka‘b said: ‘O Messenger of Allah, some women of Medina are saying: there are other women who have not been mentioned!’ He asked him: ‘And who are they?’ He said: ‘THOSE WHO ARE TOO YOUNG [SUCH THAT THEY HAVE NOT STARTED MENSTRUATING YET], those who are too old [whose menstruation has stopped] and those who are pregnant’. And so this verse (And for such of your women as despair of menstruation…) was revealed”.
Tafsir al-Kabir by Ar-Razi
{and those who have not menstruated yet} A man stood and asked: ‘O messenger of Allah, what is the period (Iddah) of THE YOUNG GIRL WHO HAS NOT YET MENSTRUATED?’ Then Allah revealed {and those who have not menstruated yet}, meaning that her Iddah is like the old-aged woman who reached her menopause. (Arabic Source; translation by Mutee’a Al-Fadi)
Tafsir Al-Qurtubi
{and those who have not menstruated yet} Meaning the young girl.(*)
[Note: * Here “young” (as-sagheerah) denotes a girl who did not reach the age of puberty yet.]
It is noteworthy that Al-Baidawi simply repeats the Quranic phrase, i.e. the explanation is identical to the phrase that is to be explained. Maybe Al-Baidawi felt the need to comment because the issue is controversial, but since the statement itself is clear, you better accept it as it is. Perhaps this is an attempt of persuasion by repetition?
Tafsir al-Qur’an by Al-Fayrooz Abadi
{and those who have not menstruated yet} Those who did not menstruate DUE TO THEIR YOUNG AGE.
Al-dar al-manthour fi al-tafseer bil ma’thour by As-Suyuti
{and those who have not menstruated yet} They are THE YOUNG GIRLS (jawari) WHO HAVE NOT MENSTRUATED YET.
Tafsir Muqatil ibn Sulayman
{and those who have not menstruated yet} … means the Iddah of THE YOUNG GIRLS (jawari) WHO HAVE NOT MENSTRUATED YET, and they were married and then divorced.
We conclude with excerpts from two important commentaries from the 20th century.
English Tafsir Ma’ariful Qur’an by Maulana Mufti Muhammad Shafi‘ and Mufti Muhammad Taqi Usmani
… and in the terminology of Shari’ah the term ‘‘iddah means the waiting period prescribed for a divorced woman before she can marry another man. [p. 493] … Women who do not menstruate, BECAUSE THEY HAVE NOT YET ATTAINED PUBERTY, or because they have attained menopausal age, … [p. 494] … This procedure applies in the case of the women whose ‘‘iddah is calculated by menstrual cycles or clean cycles. It does not apply to women for whom waiting-period is not compulsory, as in the case of a woman who did not have privacy with her husband. If a man and a woman got married but they did not get together in privacy, ‘‘iddah is not necessary for her at all when she is divorced. Therefore, it is permissible to divorce such women during their monthly courses. Likewise, ‘‘iddah for a woman who does not menstruate ON ACCOUNT OF MINORITY OF AGE, or because she has attained menopausal age, is computed on monthly basis. Their ‘‘iddah is three months. [pp. 495-6]
Finally, Tafhim al-Qur’an by Abu-Ala’ Maududi:
“Therefore, making mention of the waiting-period for girls WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED, clearly proves that it is not only permissible to give away the girl at this age BUT IT IS PERMISSIBLE FOR THE HUSBAND TO CONSUMMATE MARRIAGE WITH HER. Now, obviously NO MUSLIM HAS THE RIGHT TO FORBID A THING which the Qur’an HAS HELD AS PERMISSIBLE.” (Maududi, volume 5, p. 620, note 13, emphasis added)
Moreover, you don’t need to reach puberty to be able to recall events in your life, since you have children as young as five or six who start understanding things and are able to remember them later in life. Talk about desperate and outright laughable!
Time for you to find another religion and abandon this filthy deen once and for all, just like your former brother Converted2Islam has done, all glory to the Lord Jesus!
Shamoun is INFERRING HIS OWN PERVERTED SICKENING interpretation on to the verse. He sees everything in sexual way. He got that perverted mind attached to him as a result of the Bible.
Shamoun as usual. He has no problem with his Jesus (God) allowing and permitting (BIBLE) his soldiers to penetrate (rape) pre-pubescent girls, yet has the cheek to talk about Aisha’s marriage:
TWO accurate translations which clearly show that the passage only speaks about ‘female children’ are as follows:
Jubilee Bible 2000 – “But all the FEMALE CHILDREN children that have not known a man by lying with him keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Webster’s Bible – “Translation But all the FEMALE CHILDREN that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Christian scholars say MARRIAGE with pre-pubescent was allowed:
Whedon’s Commentary on the Bible:
Verse 17-18.
The little ones — The object of the command to kill every male was to exterminate the whole nation, the cup of whose iniquity was full. For the righteousness of the mode see Joshua 6:21, note. Every woman who might possibly have been engaged in the licentious worship of Peor was to share the fate of the male children, to preserve Israel from all taint of that abomination. The pure maidens could be incorporated into Israel without peril to the national religion. Joshua 6:23-25, notes. They could not be treated as concubines, since the law against fornication was in full force, (Deuteronomy 22:25-29,) but THEY COULD BE LAWFULLY MARRIED TO THEIR CAPTORS (DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14).
Peter Pett’s Commentary on the Bible:
Numbers 31:18
‘But all the women-children, who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.’ But the young women children were a different matter. THEY COULD BE TAKEN IN MARRIAGE or as servants and would expect to accept the religion of their new husbands or masters. They would gradually be merged into Israel. Compare DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14. They would not feel the same responsibility for blood vengeance which was mainly incumbent on the males.[2]
Notice both commentaries direct readers to READ Deuteronomy 21:14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
There you have it, Jesus, who is God of the Old Testament allowed marriage and the rape of pre-pubescent girls. Deuteronomy is about RAPE, this fact is referenced in the following five articles;
GOD willing there will be more articles published how the filthy, made up god Sham-moon worships allows and permits rape all throughout the Bible, from the Old Testament to the Testament. 😉 :p
Sam’s lack of education clearly shows. I asked him to name me a scholar who doesn’t equate the age of remembering things with pubertyand he gives me his own opinion, as if the opinion of an uneducated piece of crap with bi polar disorder matters. I asked him to show me where Bukhari infers from 65.4 that sex with prepubescent wives are allowed and he copy and pastes stuff after stuff about the ‘Idda’ of prepubescent girls which is not what I asked for. I asked him to what extent Muslim jurists understood the Hadith of Aisha’s age as sanctioning sex with prepubescent wives which he ignored. I asked him to what extent Muslim jurists understood 65.4 as permitting men to have sex with prepubescent wives which again is met with a deluge of copy and pasted stuff on idda that I didn’t bother to read. I asked him to prove Aisha was traumatized which he again ignored.
As I said, one of Shamoun’s tricks is to make exceedingly long posts so as to fool readers into thinking he has an unlimited supply of evidence for his position when in reality a great portion of his posts are just disturbed rants.
Let me make this simple for you. What is the standard position among classical Muslim jurists regarding the consummation of marriage with prepubescent girls?
Your God became man and had sex a minor(Mary) and gave birth to himself. Your God himself(Jesus Christ) according to you had to stay and feritized by the womb of a minor(Mary) and you are ok. with that.
You just keep spamming this page with your uneducated and unresearched posts. Dr. Browm reminded anyone that both Christians and Jews marry young women at the time of our prophet and they did not see anything wrong with his marriage to Aisha(RA).
Untill in the 1900’s, there was no age limitations when it comes to marriage but most religious people follow the puberty and adolescence in people. It was until last century when the age limit of 14,15,16etc. was made standard by some countries.
These 14,15,16 etc. are allowed to have sex among their age groups and it brings teenage pregnancies, prostitution, lack of respect from such people, drug, rape, murder, school drop out etc.
It is better for a adolescent person to get some one who will take care of him to marry whether young or old, than to restrict sex to young people which is really causing problems and one of our problems now a days.
Our prophets and Jews and Christians married young women and we did not read about teenage pregnancy, drug, gangs etc. among youth at their time.
It is only fools like Sam Shamoun who has no proper education who will use his time without his brain to be writing nonsense,. I am happy some Christians do not take Sam Shamoun serious any more. It is Chrstians who reduced Sam Shamoun to rabble with the help of some Muslims. He is a liar like Dr.Nabeel Quraish; At least Nabeel is a Doctor and we respect him for that. Sam Shamoun status = 0. Sam has nothing to boast of except big stomach full of filth and shit.
I believe Aisha was 9, therefore she was a child when it happened. However there are a lot of factors that people should think about before jumping to conclusions.
Abu Bakr her father, approved of the marriage so he clearly did not see anything wrong with it. I haven’t come across any hadiths criticising Muhammad for marrying Aisha at a young age (if there is one perhaps someone can show me). Muhammad had at least 13 wives who were grown women (apart from Aisha), so he clearly wasn’t a paedophile nor did he have some kind of fetish for little girls. His marriage to Aisha was for political reasons as it strengthened his position in Arabia. Of course he did eventually love Aisha very much but there’s no indication of when that happened. My opinion is that it happened when she grew older, perhaps 14, 16 or 18 I don’t know.
People in ancient times used to marry quite young. It was common for Royal heirs to be married around the age of 12 and 14 across many different cultures, even in Europe. Lifespans have always fluctuated throughout history but the general trend is that people had shorter lifespans in ancient times and only recently have we been able to find people on a larger scale worldwide living up til their 80s and 90s.
Times have changed though, and I don’t think it would be normal for a man in his 50s to marry a 9 year old today but sadly it does happen and for many of these young girls it is a sad and painful process that has on occasion led to death. One thing to note, even though the hadiths say Aisha was 6 or 9, from what I’ve seen there is no mention as to what age she was when she first had sex with Muhammad. My opinion is that Muhammad waited until she was older and those men today who marry little girls should be patient and wait until their bride is much older before putting them through such a painful process at a young age. Ultimately this is a cultural issue, as our cultures have changed so have our views. In England a few centuries ago it would have been normal for 12 and 14 year olds to be married, but now that’s changed. Perhaps as someone mentioned above, our society has become less mature so it takes longer for the younger generation to grow mentally compared to times before.
I think the modern Muslim commentators who say Aisha was much older are simply embarrassed about the facts and struggle with the abuse that non-Muslims throw at them about Aisha’ age. I can’t blame them though, it’s hard to be honest with people who simply want to attack you or your beliefs without considering the circumstances or context, so you may end up sugar coating to prevent further criticism or damage. I’m not here to argue about whether this marriage was right or wrong, just that we need more honest discourse between all the Abrahamic faiths, we are after all, brothers and sisters who all believe in the same God. The Quran says it well in Surah 29:46, that we all surrender or submit to God, whether we are Jew, Christian or Muslim. Likewise Jesus also said “For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.” (Matthew 12:50)
@Paul’s Pal
For all christians who copy from David Wood’s site.
(Deut 21:11-14) has nothing to do with marriage .
Satanic Christians have been always playing with the translations.
If the (Deut 21:11-14) had anything to do with marriage, why would God command that Israeli man to (release )that captive woman and not to (divorce) her?
We read in (Deut 21:14) “But if you marry her and she does not please you, you must let her go free. You may not sell her or treat her as a slave, for you have humiliated her”
Why would God command that man not to SELL her ? Wasn’t that the normal situation when a husband divorces his wife? Why was there a need to instruct that man?
Then, what kind of (Humiliation) that man did for that woman?
If we read the Hebrew text, we will find the answer.
The term which is used in Hebrew is (עִנִּיתָֽהּ׃)!!
Guess what?
The same term (עִנִּיתָֽהּ׃) has been used in Genesis 34:2 in the story of Dinah which has been translated to (Rape).
The term in Hebrew is pronounced as (anah). in Arabic is (anna)
I’m an Arabic man, and I know how that term is used. It’s used to describe any act which has been done by FORCE.
Note (Deut21:11-14) has nothing to do with Marriage. Baal could be used as (husband). However, it means the (owner) in Arabic and Hebrew.
Things are not looking for the uneducated, filthy piece of garbage, Shamoun. I asked him to name one scholar who says age of remembering doesn’t imply puberty, and all Shamoun could do was give me his own silly opinion not realizing that the opinions of an uneducated piece of shi’t doesn’t matter. Ladies and gentleman, here’s a classically trained, Syrian Hadith scholar, Salah Al Din Al Idlibi’s examination of the Hadith in question:
Bukhari narrated by way Aisha that she said “by the time I could make out the world, my parents were Muslim, during that time, no day would pass except with the visit of the prophet during the day and the night. So when the Muslims were tested (prosecuted), Abu Bakr left in migration towards Alhabasha (Ethiopia), and when he reached the area of Alghimad he was met by Ibn Aldaghna…”
There are two arguments to be made from this narration:
1- A child would generally not comprehend something as intangible as religiosity of others by the age of four. Had Aisha been born in the 4th year before the message, and her first comprehension would have been at 8 years old, she statement “I was aware of my parents’ religiosity” irrelevant. Since Abu Bakr was known to have been one of the earliest converts to Islam, and Um Ruman became Muslim in Mecca long before, as narrated by Ibn Saa’ad.
However if she was born before the Message by 4 years, and her first comprehension of the world at the first year of the message, that statement would make sense. That her first comprehension of the world was that of both her parents’ religiousity rather than just one parent. This proves that she was born before the message by four years, and this is confirmed in other evidences and sources.
The above evidence shows that YHWH approved Jacob to give her SEVEN YEAR OLD DAUGHTER DINAH to Shechem in MARRIAGE. This account is related in Genesis.
Now sine flyingmutalover seems to have a “penis” fixation it seems I am going to need to humiliate his wicked profit and demon whom he worshiped.
First, I challenge flyingstonekisser to quote a single passage where it says that Dinah was seven years old. He again reads the Bible as if it is his filthy Quran and sunn which enshrines grown jihadi thugs to have sex with young minors. See the above quotes for the proof.
Now let’s see who really worshiped “penises,” “vulvas/vaginas,” piss, saliva etc. In the following examples we see Muhammad’s followers drinking the piss that came out of his “penis” which he used to physically violate a young minor, and also drinking his blood and dirty water, as well as smear his filthy saliva all over their bodies:
The worship which Muslims gave (give) to Muhammad can be seen from situations where his followers would drink Muhammad’s urine and smear his spittle on themselves, thinking that they would receive a blessing or a cure as a result of it!
One of the scholars concerned with reports about the Prophet and his qualities related that when he wanted to defecate, the earth split open and swallowed up his faeces and urine, and it gave off a fragrant smell.
Muhammad ibn Sa’d, al-Waqidi’s scribe, related that ‘A’isha said to the Prophet, “When you come from relieving yourself, we do not see anything noxious from you.” He said, “‘A’isha, don’t you know that the earth swallows up what comes out of the prophets so that none of it is seen?”
Although this tradition is not famous, the people of knowledge still mention the purity of his faeces and urine…
There was also a time when Malik ibn Sinan DRANK HIS BLOOD on the Day of Uhud and licked it up. The Prophet allowed him to do that and then said, “The Fire will not touch you.”
Something similar occurred when ‘Abdullah ibn az-Zubayr drank cupped blood. The Prophet said, “Woe to you from the people and woe to the people from you,” but he did not object to what he had done.
Something similar is related about when a woman DRANK SOME OF HIS URINE. He told her, “You will never complain of a stomach-ache.”
He did not order any of them to wash their mouths out nor did he forbid them to do it again.
The hadith of the woman drinking the urine is sound. Ad-Daraqutni follows Muslim and al-Bukhari who relate it in the Sahih. The name of this woman was Baraka, but they disagree about her lineage. Some say that it was Umm Ayman, a wooden cup he placed under his bed in which he would urinate during the night. One night he urinated in it and when he examined it in the morning there was nothing in it. He asked Baraka about that. She said, “I got up and felt thirsty, so I drank it without knowing.” The hadith is related by Ibn Jurayj and others.
The Prophet was born circumcised with his umbilical cord cut… (pp. 35-37)
yad continues:
When Quraysh sent ‘Urwa ibn Mas’ud to the Messenger of Allah in the year of al-Hudaybiyya, he saw the unparalleled respect which his Companions displayed towards him. Whenever he did ‘wudu THEY RAN TO GET HIS LEFTOVER ‘WUDU WATER AND NEARLY FOUGHT OVER IT. IF HE SPAT THEY TOOK IT WITH THEIR HANDS AND WIPED IT ON THEIR FACES AND BODIES. If a hair of his fell they ran to get it. If he commanded them to do something, they ran to do his command. If he spoke, they lowered their voices in his presence. They did not stare at him due to their respect for him. When he returned to Quraysh, he said, “People of Quraysh! I have been to Chosroes in his kingdom, and Caesar in his kingdom and the Negus in his kingdom, but by Allah, I have not seen any king among his people treated anything like the way Muhammad is treated by his Companions.” …
Anas said, “I saw the Messenger when his hair was being shaved. His companions were around him and whenever a lock fell, a man picked it up.” (Iyad, pp. 236-237)
The sahih ahadith narrate the same thing:
… Before embracing Islam Al-Mughira was in the company of some people. He killed them and took their property and came (to Medina) to embrace Islam. The Prophet said (to him, “As regards your Islam, I accept it, but as for the property I do not take anything of it. (As it was taken through treason). Urwa then started looking at the Companions of the Prophet. By Allah, whenever Allah’s Apostle spat, the spittle would fall in the hand of one of them (i.e. the Prophet’s companions) WHO WOULD RUB IT ON HIS FACE AND SKIN; if he ordered them they would carry his orders immediately; if he performed ablution, they would struggle to take the remaining water; and when they spoke to him, they would lower their voices and would not look at his face constantly out of respect. Urwa returned to his people and said, “O people! By Allah, I have been to the kings and to Caesar, Khosrau and An-Najashi, yet I have never seen any of them respected by his courtiers as much as Muhammad is respected by his companions. By Allah, if he spat, the spittle would fall in the hand of one of them (i.e. the Prophet’s companions) who would rub it on his face and skin; if he ordered them, they would carry out his order immediately; if he performed ablution, they would struggle to take the remaining water; and when they spoke, they would lower their voices and would not look at his face constantly out of respect.” (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 50, Number 891)
And you pagans claim that you don’t worship this vile false profit!
Could you Shamoun please answer some of my questions:
1. Why did God (Jesus) allow Jacob to give his 7-year-old daughter away in marriage to Shechem?
2. Why didn’t Jesus (God) stop child marriages in Jacob’s time, if it was something he was against, as YOU claim shamoun??
3. You said ‘show’, the evidence it is ALL in there. Try do a response to this article, you will dig a bigger whole for yourself ;p 😉
Here in the following article, there is a number of proofs from GENESIS where Jacob gave away her daughter in marriage when she was 7 (SEVEN) YEARS OLD, yes you heard it right. I was actually being generous with the number 7, it was a lot lower:
Now let me make it easier for you. QUOTE A VERSE FROM GENESIS WHERE IT SAYS THAT DINAH WAS SEVEN YEARS OLD. I know you see the filth, pornography and pedophilia of your profit all over the Holy Bible, but I am sorry to burst your bubble, the Bible is not the filthy porn you call Quran and Sunna.
ONCE AGAIN. PLEASE QUOTE THE VERSE WHERE IT SAYS SHE WAS SEVEN.
Man you really must feel stupid for giving me the chance to expose your profit to such shame and humiliation on a blog that is supposed to be about Islam! ROFL!
Flyingibnmuta’s love for “penises” is simply the result of his being influenced by his profit and jinn. The following quotes show that Flyinghourilover’s god is so fascinated with “penises” and “vulvas/vaginas” that he turned his paradise into a whore house where he created and placed swelling breasted whores for jihadi thugs like him to spend all eternity deflowering with erect “penises”:
Wherein both will be those (maidens) restraining their glances upon their husbands, whom no man or jinn YATMITHUNNA (HAS OPENED THEIR HYMENS WITH SEXUAL INTERCOURSE) before them… Houris (beautiful, fair females) restrained in pavilions; Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinns and men) deny? Whom no man or jinn YATMITHUNNA (HAS OPENED THEIR HYMENS WITH SEXUAL INTERCOURSE) before them. S. 55:56, 72-74 Hilali-Khan
Surely for the godfearing awaits a place of security, gardens and vineyards and maidens WITH SWELLING BREASTS, like of age, and a cup overflowing. S. 78:31-34 Arberry
Thus, the Quran speaks of heavenly creatures who have swelling breasts and who shall be physically penetrated, or deflowered, by both men and jinn!
Lest this child of Lucifer deny that the Quran describes Allah’s abode as a whore house we will cite some of Islam’s premier scholars to refute him:
meaning, wide-eyed maidens WITH FULLY DEVELOPED BREASTS. Ibn ‘Abbas, Mujahid and others have said, …
“This means ROUND BREASTS. They meant by this THAT THE BREASTS OF THESE GIRLS WILL BE FULLY ROUNDED AND NOT SAGGING, because they will be virgins, equal in age…” (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Abridged), (Surat At-Tagabun to the end of the Qur’an), First Edition: September 2000, Volume 10, pp. 333-334; capital emphasis ours)
Interestingly, there is one Sunni Muslim writer that quotes certain Muslim authorities who admit that the Quran’s language here is quite erotic and that this particular reference even causes persons to get aroused. In response to the unfairness of men having up to 70 wives whereas women will only have one husband in paradise, Shaykh G.F. Haddad states:
We do not know with certainty that there will be such a restriction on women even if the reverse would hardly be mentionable to a decent woman. A woman in the traditional world would and does consider it a horrible thing to say to her that “You can have all the men you want”! The Qur’an would never use inappropriate language. However, the Qur’an does mention that for the inhabitants of Paradise – male and female – {There wait on them immortal youths} (56:17), {There serve them youths of everlasting youth, whom, when you see them, you would take for scattered pearls} (76:19). If this does not make a believing woman happy then, as Imam al-Shafi`i said to the one WHO IS NOT MOVED BY EROTIC POETRY, “You have no feelings.” As for the believing men, as one of the Awliya said, some of them will need GHUSL just FOR HEARING THE VERSE {Same-age young-bosomed girls} (78:33). As for us hard-hearted analphabets we may read it and read it without effect. (Haddad, Sex with slaves and women’s rights; capital emphasis ours)
Ghusl refers, in this specific context, to the ritual bathing of the body that a Muslim must perform after sexual intercourse or because of a seminal discharge. What the author is essentially saying is that Surah 78:33 can cause a person to be aroused to such an extent that he ends up having an emission!
In other words, this Muslims is admitting that reading flyingstonekisser’s filthy book can cause a man to ejaculate all over himself! YUCK!!!!
Another famous commentator, ar-Razi, stated in his Tafsir (Volume 8, p. 311) that:
“The kawa`ib are the buxom girls (nawahid) whose breasts have become FULL (taka“abat) and ROUND (tafallakat).” (bold and capital emphasis ours)
Ibn Kathir said of Q. 55:56 that:
meaning they are delightful virgins of comparable age who never had sexual intercourse with anyone, whether from mankind or Jinns, before their husbands. This is also a proof that the believers among the Jinns will enter Paradise. Artat bin Al-Mundhir said, “Damrah bin Habib was asked if the Jinns will enter Paradise and he said, `Yes, and they will get married. The Jinns will have Jinn women and the humans will have female humans.’” Allah’s statement, …
Then Allah describes these women for the proposed…
Mujahid, Al-Hasan, Ibn Zayd and others said, “They are as pure as rubies and white as Marjan.” So here they described Marjan as pearls… (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Abridged), (Surat Al-Jathiyah to the end of Surat Al-Munafiqun), First Edition: September 2000, Volume 9, pp. 400-401)
He also wrote in respect to Q. 56:35-37 that flyingibnmuta’s jinn will give sexual perverts like him the sex drive of a hundred men so he can spend all eternity deflowering the whores of paradise:
Abu Dawud At-Tayalisi recorded that Anas said that the Messenger of Allah said…
Anas said, “I asked, ‘O Allah’s Messenger! Will one be able to do that? He said,
((He will be given the strength OF A HUNDRED (MEN).))
At-Tirmidhi also recorded it and said, “Sahih Gharib.” Abu Al-Qasim At-Tabarani recorded that Abu Hurayrah said that the Messenger of Allah was asked, “O Allah’s Messenger! Will we have sexual intercourse with our wives in Paradise?” He said…
((The man will be able to have sexual intercourse WITH A HUNDRED VIRGINS IN ONE DAY.))
Al-Hafiz Abu ‘Abdullah Al-Maqisi said, “In my view, the Hadith meets the criteria of the Sahih, and Allah knows best.” (Ibid., pp. 429-430; capital emphasis ours)
The two Jalals noted in reference to Q. 56:36 that,
and made them virgins, immaculate – every time their spouses enter them they find them virgins, NOR IS THERE ANY PAIN [OF DEFLORATION] – (Tafsir al-Jalalayn; capital emphasis ours)
And regarding Q. 36:55 they say:
Indeed today the inhabitants of Paradise are busy (read fi shughlin or fi shughulin), [oblivious] to what the inhabitants of the Fire are suffering, [busy] delighting in pleasures such as DEFLOWERING VIRGINS – not busy with anything wearisome, as there is no toil in Paradise – rejoicing, blissful (fakihuna is a second predicate of inna, the first being fi shugulin, ‘busy’); (Tafsir al-Jalalayn; capital emphasis ours)
And here is what the hadith compiler Ibn Majah stated about the sexual organs of the men and the maidens of paradise:
4337. Abu ‘Umama (Allah be pleased with him) reported that Allah’s Messenger (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said, “Allah will not admit anyone in the Paradise but Allah, the Mighty and Glorious, will marry him with seventy two wives: two will be from virgins (haurine) with big eyes and seventy will be his inheritance from the people of the Hell-Fire (1). Everyone of them will have A PLEASANT VAGINA and HE (the man) WILL HAVE A SEXUAL ORGAN THAT DOES NOT BEND DOWN (during sexual intercourse).”
Hisham b. Khalid says, “The words ‘out of his inheritance (due) from the denizens of the Fire’, many men who will enter the Fire and the inmates of the Paradise will inherit their wives just as Faraoh’s[sic] wife will be inherited (by the believer).”
According to al-Zawa’id, its isnad has some controversy. Al-‘Ajali has declared Khalid b. Yazid b. Abi Malik reliable while Imam Ahmad, Ibn Mu’in, Abu Dawud, Nasa’i, Ibn Jarud Sahi, ‘Uqail etc., have declare[sic] Ahmad b. Salih al-Misri da’if. (Sunan Ibn-I-Majah (Imam Abu Abdullah Muhammad b. Yazid Ibn-I-Maja Al-Qazwini), English version by Muhammad Tufail Ansari [Kazi Publications, Lahore (Pakistan), 1st edition 1995], Chapter NO. XXXIX, “The Description of the Paradise”, Volume V, p. 546; capital emphasis ours)
Now let’s see what the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer, says about this filthy trash book you guys call holy and about turning paradise into a whore house:
“Jesus answered them, ‘Do you not err, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God? When they rise from the dead, THEY NEITHER MARRY NOR ARE GIVEN IN MARRIAGE, but are like angels in heaven.'” Mark 12:24-25
“Jesus answered, ‘You err, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God. For in the resurrection THEY NEITHER MARRY NOR ARE GIVEN IN MARRIAGE, but are like the angels of God in heaven.” Matthew 22:29-30
“Jesus answered them, ‘The sons of this age marry and are given in marriage. But those who are counted worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, NEITHER MARRY NOR ARE GIVEN IN MARRIAGE. For they cannot die any more, for they are equal to the angels and are the sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.'” Luke 20:34-36
I have more filth for flyingmutalover in the next post. So enjoy!
FLYINGHOURIDEFLOWERER will really love this since it shows his god’s fascination with the private parts of women whom he likes to blow into!
And (remember) her who guarded her SEXUAL ORGAN (Arabic- farjahaa): We breathed into her from Our Spirit, and We made her and her son a Sign for all people. S. 21:91
And Mary the daughter of ‘Imran, who guarded her SEXUAL ORGAN (Arabic- farjahaa) and We breathed INTO IT of Our spirit; and she testified to the truth of the words of her Lord and of His revelations, and was one of the devout (servants). S. 66:12
The word farjahaa, from farj, refers to a person’s private area, to their private parts.
Mahmoud M. Ayoub contrasts the birth narratives of the Gospel of Luke with that mentioned in the Quran. All capital emphasis is ours:
“The language of this verse (author- Luke 1:35) is clearly circumspect. It implies no sexual union or divine generation of any kind. Furthermore, while Luke’s description agrees both in form and spirit with the Qur’anic idea of the conception of Christ, the language of the Qur’an IS FAR MORE GRAPHIC AND OPEN TO INTERPRETATION.” (Christian-Muslim Encounters, ed. Yvonne Yazbeck Haddad & Wadi Z. Haddad [University Press of Florida, 1995], p. 67)
He goes on to say:
“… Then of Mary He (author-allegedly God) continues: ‘And she who guarded well [lit. fortified] her chastity [lit. GENERATIVE ORGAN], and thus We breathed INTO HER of our spirit, and We made her and her son a sign [or miracle, ‘Aya] for all beings’ (S. 21:90-91) …
“In the second instance the Qur’an speaks of Mary as a righteous woman who lived in strict chastity and obedience to God: ‘And Mary daughter of ‘Imran who guarded well her GENERATIVE ORGAN farjaha, and thus We breathed INTO HER of our spirit’ (S. 66:12). THE BOLD AND GRAPHIC STATEMENT APPEARS TO HAVE SHOCKED TRADITIONISTS AND COMMENTATORS, so that most of them tried to cover it up with different and FARFETCHED significations or glossed over it with out comment…
“Ibn Kathir interprets the phrase ‘guarded well her generative organ’ to mean: ‘safeguarded and protected it. Guarding well ihsan signifies chastity and high birth.’ He comments on the phrase, ‘and thus We breathed into it of our spirit’ thus ‘that is, through the angel Gabriel. This is because God sent him to her, and he took for her the form of a man of good stature (S. 19:17). God commanded him to breathe INTO THE BREAST OF HER CHEMISE. HIS BREATH WENT DOWN AND PENETRATED HER GENERATIVE ORGAN, AND THUS CAUSED HER TO CONCEIVE JESUS …’” (Ibid.)
Finally:
“Abu Ja’far al-Tusi, the jurist doctor of the Shi’i community, as well as his well known disciple al-Tabarsi, read the words, ‘We breathed INTO IT’ literally. Al-Tusi says: ‘It has been held that Gabriel BREATHED INTO MARY’S GENERATIVE ORGAN then God created Christ in it’ …” (Ibid., p. 68)
And here is how one lexical source defines the term:
Fa-Ra-Jiim = To open, separate, cleave, split, enlarge, part, let a space between, make a room, comfort anything in, dispel cares. An opening, intervening space [gap or breach] between two things. Ex: Parting hind legs or intervening spaces between fingers.
He opened, made room, ample space.
Furijat – Cloven, split, rent, opened.
Farjun (Pl. Furuj) – PUDENDA (SEX ORGAN); chastity, space between legs (of horse or mare), part/s of a person (male/female) INDECENT TO EXPOSE, EXTERNAL PORTIONS OF THE ORGANS OF GENERATION [OF A MALE/FEMALE]. ALSO THE POSTERIOR OF PUDENDUM because it is a place of opening, of between the legs.
Here is the second part of my post showing that flyinghourideflowerer’s deity loves women’s private parts.
Here are some Quranic verses where the word farj clearly refers to sexual organs:
Prosperous are the believers who in their prayers are humble … and guard their private parts (lifuroojihim). S. 23:1-2,5 Arberry
Say to the believers, that they cast down their eyes and guard their private parts (furoojahum); that is purer for them. God is aware of the things they work. And say to the believing women, that they cast down their eyes’ and guard their private parts (furoojahunna), and reveal not their adornment save such as is outward; and let them cast their veils over their bosoms, and not reveal their adornment save to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husbands’ fathers, or their sons, or their husbands’ sons, or their brothers, or their brothers’ sons, or their sisters’ sons, or their women, or what their right hands own, or such men as attend them, not having sexual desire, or children who have not yet attained knowledge of women’s private parts; nor let them stamp their feet, so that their hidden ornament may be known. And turn all together to God, O you believers; haply so you will prosper. S. 24:30-31 Arberry
Men and women who have surrendered, believing men and believing women, obedient men and obedient women, truthful men and truthful women, enduring men and enduring women, humble men and humble women, men and women who give in charity, men who fast and women who fast, men and women who guard their private parts (furoojahum), men and women who remember God oft — for them God has prepared forgiveness and a mighty wage. S. 33:35 Arberry
and guard their private parts (lifuroojihim). S. 70:29 Arberry
Ibn Kathir makes the following comments in reference to S. 19:22-23:
“Allah, the Exalted, informs about Maryam that when Jibril had spoken to her about what Allah said, she accepted the decree of Allah. Many scholars of the predecessors (Salaf) have mentioned that at this point the angel (who was Jibril) blew into the opening of her garment that she was wearing. Then the breath descended until it entered INTO HER VAGINA and she conceived by the leave of Allah.” (Tafsir Ibn Kathir, Abridged, Volume 6, Surat Al-Isra’, Verse 39 To the end of Surat Al-Mu’minun, first edition July 2000, p. 244; bold and capital emphasis ours)
Ibn Kathir’s notes on S. 2:223 also help us to see the very graphic nature of the term farj:
this refers to Al-Farj (THE VAGINA), as Ibn ‘Abbas, Mujahid and other scholars have stated. Therefore, anal sex is prohibited, as we will further emphasize afterwards, Allah willing …
Ibn Jurayj (one of the reporters of the Hadith) said that Allah’s Messengers said …
((From the front or from behind, as long as it occurs IN THE FARJ (VAGINA).)) …
Abu Bakr bin Ziyad Naysaburi reported that Isma’il bin Ruh said that he asked Malik bin Anas, “What do you say about having sex with women in the anus?” He said, “You are not an Arab? Does sex occur but in the place of pregnancy? Do it only IN THE FARJ (VAGINA).” (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Abridged), Volume 1, Parts 1 and 2 (Surat Al-Fatihah to Verse 252 of Surat Al-Baqarah), first edition January 2000, pp. 618, 619, 622; capital emphasis ours)
With that said, we turn to Ibn Kathir who provides additional evidence for the very graphic and distasteful nature of the Quranic depiction of the birth of Jesus. In his comments on S. 66:12, Ibn Kathir writes:
meaning who protected and purified her honor, by being chaste and free of immorality,
meaning, through the angel Jibril. Allah sent the angel Jibril to Maryam, and he came to her in the shape of a man in every respect. Allah commanded him TO BLOW into a gap of her garment and that breath went into her womb THROUGH HER PRIVATE PART; this is how ‘Isa was conceived. This is why Allah said here,
meaning His decree and His legislation. (Tafsir Ibn Kathir – Abridged, Volume 10, Surat At-Tagabun to the end of the Qur’an, pp. 75-76; capital emphasis ours)
In the above references which speak of Christ’s conception, we see how this word is used to describe Allah’s penetrating Mary’s private area by blowing his Spirit into it. Talk about a filthy and disgusting way of speaking of the glorious conception and birth of the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer!
There’s more. In responding to the Shia position regarding the permissibility of temporary marriages (mutah), this Sunni writer defines farj as:
I’arat al-Furuj (LOANING OF VAGINAS)
The Shi’ah books of fiqh carry a separate chapter entitled “I’arat al-Furuj.” This could literally be translated as “The Loaning of Vaginas.” … (Dr. Ahmad ‘Abdullah Salamah, Shi’ah Concept of Temporary Marriage (Mut’ah); capital emphasis ours)
YIKES!
Here is the final Muslim example showing that farj refers to the female organ:
Narrated Basrah:
A man from the Ansar called Basrah said: I married a virgin woman in her veil. When I entered upon her, I found her pregnant. (I mentioned this to the Prophet). The Prophet said: She will get the dower, for you made her VAGINA (farj) lawful for you. The child will be your slave. When she has begotten (a child), flog her (according to the version of al-Hasan). The version of Ibn AbusSari has: You people, flog her, or said: inflict hard punishment on him. (Sunan of Abu Dawud, Book 11, Number 2126)
Christian writer Abd al-Masih helps to put this in perspective. Commenting on S. 21:91, al-Masih notes:
“Whoever reads verse 91 of Sura al-Anbiya’ 21 carefully could be embarrassed. It is scandalous how Muhammad and his spirit of revelation lift Mary up as the most important of all women, and at the same time tear away her veil of chastity. Her self-protection is not described in a euphemism, but is calculated brutally, as in a business deal:
And she guraded her vagina [farj] so we breathed into her of our spirit. (Sura al-Anbiya’ 21:91)
This revelation is not an honour, but an exposition. Maybe it was customary among Bedouins to speak contemptuously and carelessly about women. But this only shows the rule of Arabic men and their contempt for women. If the best of women is spoken about like this, what about others! The men are never written about like this. They remain covered, holier-than-thou and self-righteous.” (Abd al-Masih, Who Is The Spirit From Allah In Islam? [Light of Life, P.O. Box 13, A-9503, VILLACH AUSTRIA], pp. 46-47)
He notes regarding S. 66:12:
“The second problem is caused by the Arabic language. In Arabic, Allah does not say: ‘so we breathed into her of our spirit’, but ‘into him’. Who is it, into whom the spirit was breathed? The embryo ‘Isa? That is difficult to accept, for then ‘Isa would have existed in Mary’s womb already before the spirit was breathed into her. That would mean that Allah created ‘Isa beforehand or that he existed before he was conceived. Both options are out of the question for Islamic scholars.
Who is it then, into whom the Spirit from Allah was breathed? IT IS ALMOST UNSPEAKABLE, but the last expression in the previous sentence, which is masculine in Arabic, IS THE EXPRESSION FOR MARY’S GENITALS.[43] The literal meaning of Allah’s statement in Arabic is then, ‘so we breathed into her vagina [farj] of our spirit.’ This turns the stomachs of some of our readers.
Rudi Paret, the best translator of the Qur’an into German, confirms the meaning of this phrase in a footnote. This seems not only to us, but also to many Islamic scholars to be a blasphemy. Ibn Mas’ud went so far as to suggest that the Qur’anic text should be changed to read ‘so we breathed into her [Mary] of our spirit.’ It is comforting to see that there are Muslims who prefer the possibility of a fallible Qur’an to a blasphemy like this.
Other commentators explain the expression into him as Mary’s heart or body, which are masculine in Arabic, but not mentioned in the text. These are nothing but attempts to cover up the problem, but the problem itself remains. The assumption that it was an unclean spirit that spoke through Muhammad is obvious. It is almost impossible to imagine that Muslims claim that Jibril himself did this. Here the false statement of an unclean spirit stands against the noble Holy Spirit.” (Ibid., pp. 53-54; capital emphasis ours)
In the above indicated footnote, the author states:
43. According to al-Nasafi: “in her vagina” (Madarik al-Tanzil, vol. 4, p. 272). (Ibid., p. 53)
So now flyingibnmuta, what was that about “penises” and seven year old girls?
Like I said, keep barking your filth and watch how I muzzle you. Even though you desire to be Muhammad’s dog, you need to watch out for yourself since you know what your child sleeping profit did to dogs? He ordered them to be murdered!
What a demented vile human being! No wonder you are so wicked, vile and demented! You can’t be any better than your profit and his jinn.
So now flyingibnmuta, what was that about “penises” and seven year old girls?
Like I said, keep barking your filth and watch how I muzzle you. Even though you desire to be Muhammad’s dog, you need to watch out for yourself since you know what your child sleeping profit did to dogs? He ordered them to be murdered!
Chapter 19: ANGELS DO NOT ENTER A HOUSE IN WHICH THERE IS A DOG OR A PICTURE
A’isha reported that Gabriel made a promise with Allah’s Messenger to come at a definite hour; that hour came but he did not visit him. And there was in his hand (in the hand of Allah’s Apostle) a staff. He threw it from his hand and said: Never has Allah or His messengers (angels) ever broken their promise. Then he cast a glance (and by chance) found a puppy under his cot and said: ‘A’isha, when did this dog enter here? She said: By Allah, I don’t know. He then commanded and it was turned out. Then Gabriel came and Allah’s Messenger said to him: You promised me and I waited for you, but you did not come, whereupon he said: It was the dog in your house which prevented me (to come), for we (angels) do not enter a house in which there is a dog or a picture. (Sahih Muslim, Book 024, Number 5246)
And because of this, “Allah’s Apostle ordered that the dogs should be killed” (Vol. 4, No. 540).
Later, after realizing that dogs were a necessity for hunting and guarding sheep, Muhammad changed his mind:
Maimuna reported that one morning Allah’s Messenger was silent with grief. Maimuna said: Allah’s Messenger, I find a change in your mood today. Allah’s Messenger said: Gabriel had promised me that he would meet me tonight, but he did not meet me. By Allah, he never broke his promises, and Allah’s Messenger spent the day in this sad (mood). Then it occurred to him that there had been a puppy under their cot. He commanded and it was turned out. He then took some water in his hand and sprinkled it at that place. When it was evening Gabriel met him and he said to him: you promised me that you would meet me the previous night. He said: Yes, but we do not enter a house in which there is a dog or a picture. Then on that very morning he commanded the killing of the dogs until he announced that the dog kept for the orchards should also be killed, but he spared the dog meant for the protection of extensive fields (or big gardens). (Sahih Muslim, Book 024, Number 5248)
Chapter 31: COMMAND OF KILLING DOGS AND THEN ITS ABROGATION, AND PROHIBITION OF KEEPING THEM BUT FOR HUNTING AND PROTECTION OF LANDS OR CATTLE OR LIKE THAT…
Ibn Umar reported that Allah’s messenger ordered the killings of dogs except the dog tamed for hunting, or watching of the herd of sheep or other domestic animals…” (Sahih Muslim, Book 010, Number 3812)
Abu Zubair heard Jabir b. Abdullah saying: Allah’s messenger ordered us to kill dogs, and we carried out this order so much that we also killed the dog coming with a woman from the desert. Then Allah’s Apostle forbade their killing. He (the Holy Prophet) further said: It is your duty to kill the jet black (dog) having two spots (on the eyes), for it is a devil. (Sahih Muslim, Book 010, Number 3813)
What a demented vile human being! No wonder you are so wicked, vile and demented! You can’t be any better than your profit and his jinn.
I guess it never dawned on Muhammad’s “Gabriel” to appear to Muhammad once he left his house, as opposed to making Allah’s profit-making messenger all that time for another seizure to hit him in order for him to receive more “revelations”. But that’s not all. These narrations raise a few questions. First, if Allah’s angels are capable of withstanding Satan himself, how can dogs or pictures stop them from accomplishing their tasks? Second, if dogs are really devils then why does the Quran say that Allah protected a dog along with the Companions of the Cave (Q. 18:18 and 18:20)? Is Allah in the business of preserving evil animals as they lay asleep for centuries only to awaken them again? More importantly, what were these righteous servants doing with a dog in the first place? Third, didn’t Allah give Solomon power over the Jinn to build statues or images (Q. 34:13)? And didn’t the temple which Solomon built for the worship of God contain images (1 Kings 6:23-35; 7:27-37; 2 Chronicles 3:10-14)? Does this therefore mean that the angels never entered Solomon’s palace or temple?
The stupidity of the Sunna gets even more laughable. The translator of Sahih Muslim, Abdul Hamid Siddiqui, tries to desperately explain away the obvious problems with Muhammad’s stance on dogs,
“The Hadith gives us an idea why the Holy Prophet commanded to kill dogs. There must have been an excess of stray dogs and thus the danger of rabies in the city of Medina and its suburbs. The Holy Prophet, therefore, ordered to kill them. Later on when it was found that his companions were killing them indiscriminately, he forbade them to do so and told them that only ferocious beasts which were a source of danger to life should be killed. The word ‘devil’ clarifies this point. Here devil stands for ferocious…” (Sahih Muslim by Imam Muslim, rendered into English by Abdul Hamid Siddiqui [Kitab Bhavan, New Delhi, India, 11th Reprint 1995], Volume III & IV, Book X. Kitab Al-Buyu’ (Pertaining To Business Transactions), p. 825, fn. 2012; italic emphasis ours)
One senses Siddiqui’s desperation to defend the killing of dogs. He tries to justify this by assuming that there was an excess of stray and rabid dogs in Medina, yet provides no proof for such a claim. Secondly, even if his assumption was correct, why did Muhammad allow both hunting and sheep dogs to remain alive? After all, these dogs would be just as deadly since they would come in contact with ferocious disease-infested animals that could have easily transmitted these diseases to humans. Furthermore, we are still left to grapple with the problem of jet-black dogs with two spots being devils. If “devil”, as Sidiqqi states, means ferocious, then why single out these dogs as devils when there were other dogs just as, or even more, ferocious than they? It would seem that Muhammad believed that these animals were literally possessed by devils.
What makes this all the more sadder is that there are clowns like you K’SBRAINEDGOTSMACKEDANDBRAINDAMAGEDBYISLAM that actually believe this garbage.
Now that I have exposed you and your profit to further shame and disgrace time for me to return to the rest of my rebuttals. Until I return to humiliate you again, enjoy all the posts that I wrote in your honor!
Like I said, you guys are desperate jokes who think you are refuting arguments when in reality you are exposing yourselves as the inept pagans who couldn’t defend your lies if your eternal lives depended on it. The fact is that THIS IS A SUNNI ARTICLE DEFENDING THE FACT THAT THE NARRATIONS OF THE WOMAN DRINKING MUHAMMAD’S PISS WITH MUHAMMAD APPROVING IT!
Now since you cite this liar, I just published a three part rebuttal exposing him for being a liar like you.
In this article, your fellow stone worshiper wrote:
Now for the meaning of the word, ‘lahad, let’s refer to Lane’s Lexicon. He writes…
Because you guys are so demonized you cannot help but lie and think you will get away with it.
However, because we serve the true God who hates lies and deceit he ends up enabling us to expose your lies and blasphemies in order to shame you for the world to see just how evil your deen is.
Here is what the lexicon actually says IN CONTEXT:
“… He pushed, pushed away, or REPELLED, HIM: or pushed him VIOLENTLY UPON THE CHEST: (L 🙂 or he pushed him, pushed him away, or repelled him, ON ACCOUNT OF HIS BASENESS, OR DESPICABLENESS: (S, L, K 🙂 OR HE STRUCK HIM IN THE BREASTS, (L,), OR IN THE BASES OF THE BREASTS, (K,), and in the bases of the shoulder-blades: (L, K) or he pressed, or squeezed, him…” (Edward William Lane, Arabic-English Lexicon, p. 2676; bold, capital and underline emphasis ours)
Lane goes on to list “struck” as one of the meanings of this specific Arabic word! How, then, could the author have failed to include this portion of the lexicon in his “response” seeing that this is the whole point of the objection against Muhammad? And how could some of the other Muslim dawagandists claim that “struck” is not an accurate definition of the word lahada when this is precisely the meaning that is given?
In fact, notice how the following lexicon defines this term:
“… lahad, INF. lahd, oppress; jade; BEAT, push.” (Francis Joseph Steingass, Arabic-English Dictionary, p. 929; bold, capital and underline emphasis ours)
This shows that Muslims have no problem with deliberately lying and distorting the facts of a matter, so long as it helps them to justify the morally objectionable and reprehensible actions of their false prophet.
So I want to again thank you for helping us glorify the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer, and expose your profit for what he truly was. Much appreciated!
nope sorry sammy..wrong again!..lol..here is the hadith linked to the corret contextual understanding about the Prophet poking Aisha on the chest..lol..
The hadeeth mentioned in the question is that which was narrated from ‘Aa’ishah (may Allah be pleased with her), who said:
When it was my night when the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) was with me, he came in and took off his cloak, took off his shoes and put them by his feet, spread the edge of his waist wrapper on his bed and lay down. He waited until he thought that I had gone to sleep, then he picked up his cloak slowly, put on his shoes slowly, opened the door slowly, and went out, then he closed it slowly. I put my chemise over my head and veiled myself, and wrapped my waist wrapper around me, then I set out following him, until he reached al-Baqee‘ where he stood for a long time, then he raised his hands three times. Then he set off, so I set off, then he hastened, so I hastened, then he jogged, so I jogged, then he ran so I ran, then I reached home before him and went in. No sooner had I laid down but he came in and said: “What is the matter, O ‘Aa’ishah? Why are you out of breath?” I said: It is nothing. He said: “Either you tell me or the Subtle One, the All-Aware will tell me.” I said: O Messenger of Allah, may my father and mother be sacrificed for you! And I told him. He said: “So you were the person that I saw in front of me?” I said: Yes. He gave me a painful shove on the chest, then he said: “Did you think that Allah and His Messenger would be unjust to you?” She said: Whatever the people conceal, Allah knows it; yes. He said: “Jibreel came to me when you saw. He called me but he concealed it from you, and I answered him but I concealed it from you. He would not enter upon you when you were not fully dressed. I thought that you had gone to sleep and I did not want to wake you up, and I was afraid that you might be frightened. He said: “Your Lord is commanding you to go to the people of al-Baqee’ and pray for forgiveness for them.” I said: What should I say to them, O Messenger of Allah? He said: “Say: Peace be upon the people of these abodes, believers and Muslims. May Allah have mercy on those of us who have gone on before and those who come later, and we will – if Allah wills – join you soon.”
Furthermore John Louis Esposito who is a professor of International Affairs and Islamic Studies at Georgetown University. Professor John L. Esposito is a Catholic Christian also cites the above hadith mentioned and makes it clear that nowhere in the Hadith or Quran is there any record of Muhammed (p) ever mistreating any of his wives, it does not exist. He writes:
“….the hadith (Prophetic traditions) note Muhammad’s respect for and protection of women. Muhammad said, ‘The best of you is he who is best to his wife.’ Muhammad’s wife Aisha narrated that Muhammad never hit any servant or woman and never physically struck anyone with his own hand. Neither the Quran nor the hadith record Muhammad as ever mistreating or losing temper with any of his wives, even when he was unhappy or dissatisfied”
The word that is used in above Hadith as “Struck” is false; the word in Arabic that is used is “Lahada.” Edward William Lane explains that the Arabic word “Lahada” means “pushed away”…
Do you think a pagan like you would know more than Aisha HERSELF who said Prophet Muhammed NEVER hit her?:
Aisha said: “Allaah’s Messenger (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING with his hand ever, except when fighting in the path of Allaah. Nor did he ever hit a servant or a woman.” [Recorded In Ibn Majah. Al-Albani graded it Sahih.]
AND
‘Aisha (May Allah be pleased with her) reported: Messenger of Allah (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING WITH HIS HAND neither a servant NOR A WOMAN but of course, he did fight in the Cause of Allah. He never took revenge upon anyone for the wrong done to him, but of course, he exacted retribution for the sake of Allah in case the Injunctions of Allah about unlawful acts were violated. [Muslim Arabic/English book reference : Book 1, Hadith 644]
Now compare this with your Babble, where Jesus (god) encourages Christians like you to BEAT your child with a ROD as sanctioned from your Bible:
“Proverbs 23:13-14 Withhold not correction from the child: for ifIF THOU BEATEST HIM WITH A ROD, HE SHALL NOT DIE. THOU SHALT BEAT HIM WITH A ROD, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.”
A commentary from a Christian, Dr. Philip Ayers says:
The same principles are true for parents. We must apply strict rules and consequences for our children, or they will run from us when the opportunity comes. WE MUST SPANK OUR CHILDREN AT TIMES. THE WORLD CALLS THIS UNUSUAL AND UNACCEPTABLE PUNISHMENT: CORPORAL IN NATURE. GOD CALLS IT DIVINE LOVE. Genuine affection for children will not withhold corporal punishment. Parental discipline will produce Godly virtue, parental joy, and blessed children. (A Proverb a Day Keeps the Devil Away Dr Philip Ayers page 357)
New Testament (BIBLE) PERMITS/encourages Christians to rape their own wifes:
“4 The WIFE DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY over her own body (private part), but HER HUSBAND DOES. …” – I Corinthians 7:4
This verse commands that a Christian wife has no authority over her body. The ‘body’ part mentioned here is reference to her ‘private parts’. Basically, the husband has full right to have sexual relations with his wife even when she refuses. The Christian husband can have forceful sexual intimacy even if the wife refuses. For the wife to refuse this, is a major sin. This in modern terms would be called ‘marital rape’.
A COMMNETARY on 1 Corinthians 7:4 and Marital rape:
Pastor and Bible teacher David Guzik:
“b. On the same idea, also the wife to her husband: The wife is not to withhold marital affection from her husband. Paul strongly puts forth the idea that there is a mutual sexual responsibility in marriage. The husband has obligations toward his wife, and the wife has obligations toward her husband.
i. Render to his wife: The emphasis is on giving, on “I owe you” instead of “you owe me.” In God’s heart, sex is put on a much higher level than merely the husband’s privilege and the wife’s duty.
c. The wife does not have authority over her own body: In fact, these obligations ARE SO CONCRETE, IT COULD BE SAID THAT THE WIFE’S BODY DOES NOT EVEN BELONG TO HERSELF, BUT TO HER HUSBAND. The same principle is true of the husband’s body in regard to his wife. …”
(David Guzik Commentary on the Bible – online source)
AND
Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges:
“Verse 4
4. οὐκ ἐξουσιάζει. A.V. hath not power. Better, HATH NO RIGHT. ἐξουσία sometimes stands for power, as in Revelation 9:3. But the more usual sense of the word is AUTHORITY. τοῦ ἰδίου σώματος. OVER HER OWN BODY. Because in everything connected with the duties of married life each should consult the comfort, well-being, and happiness of the other before their own, and should be especially careful that they do not, by any selfishness on the part of either, ‘cause their brother to offend’” (Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges – online source)
So sam we want to again thank you for helping us glorify Allah, Jesus’s God and Destroyer, and expose your lies and twisting of truth ..Much appreciated!
I know that being a Muhammadan, illiteracy is common among you folk. Let me repeat the quote from Edward William Lane’s Lexicon:
“… He pushed, pushed away, or REPELLED, HIM: or pushed him VIOLENTLY UPON THE CHEST: (L or he pushed him, pushed him away, or repelled him, ON ACCOUNT OF HIS BASENESS, OR DESPICABLENESS: (S, L, K) OR HE STRUCK HIM IN THE BREASTS, (L,), OR IN THE BASES OF THE BREASTS, (K,), and in the bases of the shoulder-blades: (L, K) or he pressed, or squeezed, him…” (Edward William Lane, Arabic-English Lexicon, p. 2676; capital and underline emphasis ours)
Do you think a pagan like you would know more than Aisha HERSELF who said Prophet Muhammed NEVER hit her?:
Aisha said: “Allaah’s Messenger (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING with his hand ever, except when fighting in the path of Allaah. Nor did he ever hit a servant or a woman.” [Recorded In Ibn Majah. Al-Albani graded it Sahih.]
AND
‘Aisha (May Allah be pleased with her) reported: Messenger of Allah (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING WITH HIS HAND neither a servant NOR A WOMAN but of course, he did fight in the Cause of Allah. He never took revenge upon anyone for the wrong done to him, but of course, he exacted retribution for the sake of Allah in case the Injunctions of Allah about unlawful acts were violated. [Muslim Arabic/English book reference : Book 1, Hadith 644]
Now compare this with your Babble, where Jesus (god) encourages Christians like you to BEAT your child with a ROD as sanctioned from your Bible:
“Proverbs 23:13-14 Withhold not correction from the child: for ifIF THOU BEATEST HIM WITH A ROD, HE SHALL NOT DIE. THOU SHALT BEAT HIM WITH A ROD, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.”
A commentary from a Christian, Dr. Philip Ayers says:
The same principles are true for parents. We must apply strict rules and consequences for our children, or they will run from us when the opportunity comes. WE MUST SPANK OUR CHILDREN AT TIMES. THE WORLD CALLS THIS UNUSUAL AND UNACCEPTABLE PUNISHMENT: CORPORAL IN NATURE. GOD CALLS IT DIVINE LOVE. Genuine affection for children will not withhold corporal punishment. Parental discipline will produce Godly virtue, parental joy, and blessed children. (A Proverb a Day Keeps the Devil Away Dr Philip Ayers page 357)
New Testament (BIBLE) PERMITS/encourages Christians to rape their own wifes:
“4 The WIFE DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY over her own body (private part), but HER HUSBAND DOES. …” – I Corinthians 7:4
This verse commands that a Christian wife has no authority over her body. The ‘body’ part mentioned here is reference to her ‘private parts’. Basically, the husband has full right to have sexual relations with his wife even when she refuses. The Christian husband can have forceful sexual intimacy even if the wife refuses. For the wife to refuse this, is a major sin. This in modern terms would be called ‘marital rape’.
A COMMNETARY on 1 Corinthians 7:4 and Marital rape:
Pastor and Bible teacher David Guzik:
“b. On the same idea, also the wife to her husband: The wife is not to withhold marital affection from her husband. Paul strongly puts forth the idea that there is a mutual sexual responsibility in marriage. The husband has obligations toward his wife, and the wife has obligations toward her husband.
i. Render to his wife: The emphasis is on giving, on “I owe you” instead of “you owe me.” In God’s heart, sex is put on a much higher level than merely the husband’s privilege and the wife’s duty.
c. The wife does not have authority over her own body: In fact, these obligations ARE SO CONCRETE, IT COULD BE SAID THAT THE WIFE’S BODY DOES NOT EVEN BELONG TO HERSELF, BUT TO HER HUSBAND. The same principle is true of the husband’s body in regard to his wife. …”
(David Guzik Commentary on the Bible – online source)
AND
Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges:
“Verse 4
4. οὐκ ἐξουσιάζει. A.V. hath not power. Better, HATH NO RIGHT. ἐξουσία sometimes stands for power, as in Revelation 9:3. But the more usual sense of the word is AUTHORITY. τοῦ ἰδίου σώματος. OVER HER OWN BODY. Because in everything connected with the duties of married life each should consult the comfort, well-being, and happiness of the other before their own, and should be especially careful that they do not, by any selfishness on the part of either, ‘cause their brother to offend’” (Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges – online source)
*or* he pushed him, pushed him away, *or*repelled him,… lolol… however contextually sammy the prophet was not a wife beater..lol.. nope… the hadith contextually does not mean what your implying about the prophet lol…
Omar, Aisha herself debunked the pagan Shammy-sham-scam, in the following Hadith:
Aisha said: “Allaah’s Messenger (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING with his hand ever, except when fighting in the path of Allaah. Nor did he ever hit a servant or a woman.” [Recorded In Ibn Majah. Al-Albani graded it Sahih.]
AND
‘Aisha (May Allah be pleased with her) reported: Messenger of Allah (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING WITH HIS HAND neither a servant NOR A WOMAN but of course, he did fight in the Cause of Allah. He never took revenge upon anyone for the wrong done to him, but of course, he exacted retribution for the sake of Allah in case the Injunctions of Allah about unlawful acts were violated. [Muslim Arabic/English book reference : Book 1, Hadith 644]
Now let me further humiliate and muzzle Muhammad’s dog, flyingibnmuta:
“Now concerning the things about which you wrote to me: ‘It is good for a man not to touch a woman.’ Nevertheless, because of sexual immorality, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. Let the husband render to the wife due affection, and likewise the wife to the husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does. LIKEWISE, THE HUSBAND DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY OVER HIS OWN BODY, BUT THE WIFE DOES. Do not deprive one another except with consent for a time, that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer. Then come together again, so that Satan does not tempt you for lack of self-control.” 1 Corinthians 7:1-5
Being a wicked demon you can’t help but twist the Bible to your profit’s shame and humiliation. You could only wish that your wicked profit taught something similar to what Paul did. But as we know, Muhammad is under the sandals of Paul, Jesus’ Slave and Muhammad’s Master.
Now let us see how your profit compared women to fields and dogs and asses:
Your women ARE A TILLAGE for you; so come unto your tillage AS YOU WISH, and forward for your souls; and fear God, and know that you shall meet Him. Give thou good tidings to the believers. S. 2:223 Arberry
The hadiths provide the reason why this passage was given:
Narrated Jabir:
Jews used to say: “If one has sexual intercourse with his wife from the back, then she will deliver a squint-eyed child.” So this Verse was revealed:– “Your wives are a tilth unto you; so go to your tilth when or how you will.” (2.223) (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 51)
The hadiths even tell us how Allah and his angels feel about a woman that refuses to allow her husband to enter her when and how he wants:
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah’s Apostle said, “If a husband calls his wife to his bed (i.e. to have sexual relation) and she refuses and causes him to sleep in anger, the angels will curse her till morning.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 54, Number 460)
Abu Huraira reported Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: By Him in Whose Hand is my life, when a man calls his wife to his bed, and she does not respond, the One Who is in the heaven is displeased with her until he (her husband) is pleased with her. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3367)
Narrated ‘Aisha:
The things which annul the prayers were mentioned before me. They said, “Prayer is annulled by a dog, a donkey AND A WOMAN (if they pass in front of the praying people).” I said, “You have made us (i.e. women) dogs. I saw the Prophet praying while I used to lie in my bed between him and the Qibla. Whenever I was in need of something, I would slip away, for I disliked to face him.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 9, Number 490)
Abu Dharr reported: THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH (may peace be upon him) SAID: When any one of you stands for prayer and there is a thing before him equal to the back of the saddle that covers him and in case there is not before him (a thing) equal to the back of the saddle, HIS PRAYER WOULD BE CUT OFF BY (passing of an) ASS, WOMAN, AND BLACK DOG. I said: O Abu Dharr, what feature is there in a black dog which distinguish it from the red dog and the yellow dog? He said: O, son of my brother, I asked the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) as you are asking me, and he said: The black dog is a devil. (Sahih Muslim, Book 004, Number 1032)
Abu Huraira reported: THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH SAID: A WOMAN, AN ASS AND A DOG DISRUPT THE PRAYER, but something like the back of a saddle guards against that. (Sahih Muslim, Book 004, Number 1034)
So here we see how your profit placed your mother, sisters, wives and daughters on the same level as fields, dogs and asses!
Man, it really must suck being a black stone kisser who keeps getting humiliated, no thanks to your vile, wicked profit!
With that said, have a good night knowing how your profit just got exposed for all to read.
Almost forgot to place Muhammad under the shoes of Paul, his master. Now let’s see who the wicked lying agent of Satan really was.
Paul on Lying
Muslims often claim that Paul admitted to lying in Romans 3:7-8. Yet when we actually read these verses in context, a different picture altogether arises. It is clear that Paul was speaking figuratively. Paul was addressing how man’s unrighteousness manifests God’s righteous judgment more clearly. Paul then addresses a hypothetical question a person might ask that if in fact one’s falsehood proves that God is righteous, then why does God condemn the individual? Here is the passage in question:
“But if our unrighteousness brings out God’s righteousness more clearly, what shall we say? That God is unjust in bringing his wrath on us? (I am using a human argument.) Certainly not! If that were so, how could God judge the world? ‘If my falsehood enhances God’s truthfulness and so increases his glory, why am I still condemned as a sinner?’ Why not say – as we are being slanderously reported as saying and as some claim that we say – ‘Let us do evil that good may result’? Their condemnation is deserved.” Romans 3:5-8
Interestingly, Paul indicates that it was deceitful men who were slanderously accusing the Apostle of condoning sin and falsehood, a charge to which Paul places under the condemnation of God.
Here is Paul’s views regarding lying and deception:
“Unlike so many, we do not peddle the word of God for profit. On the contrary, in Christ we speak before God with sincerity, like men sent from God.” 2 Corinthians 2:17
“Rather, we have renounced secret and shameful ways; we do not use deception, nor do we distort the word of God. On the contrary, by setting forth the truth plainly we commend ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God.” 2 Corinthians 4:2
“Am I now trying to win the approval of men, or of God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ.” Galatians 1:10 “Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth?” Galatians 4:16
“You know, brothers, that our visit to you was not a failure. We had previously suffered and been insulted in Philippi, as you know, but with the help of our God we dared to tell you his gospel in spite of strong opposition. For the appeal we make does not spring from error or impure motives, nor are we trying to trick you. On the contrary, we speak as men approved by God to be entrusted with the gospel. We are not trying to please men but God, who tests our hearts. You know we never used flattery, nor did we put on a mask to cover up greed-God is our witness. We were not looking for praise from men, not from you or anyone else. As apostles of Christ we could have been a burden to you, but we were gentle among you, like a mother caring for her little children. We loved you so much that we were delighted to share with you not only the gospel of God but our lives as well, because you had become so dear to us. Surely you remember, brothers, our toil and hardship; we worked night and day in order not to be a burden to anyone while we preached the gospel of God to you. You are witnesses, and so is God, of how holy, righteous and blameless we were among you who believed.” 1 Thessalonians 2:1-10
“Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature: sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed, which is idolatry. Because of these, the wrath of God is coming. You used to walk in these ways, in the life you once lived. But now you must rid yourselves of all such things as these: anger, rage, malice, slander, and filthy language from your lips. Do not lie to each other, since you have taken off your old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its Creator.” Colossians 3:5-10
“For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.” 2 Corinthians 11:13-15
Now let’s compare Paul’s moral integrity with Muhammad’s wickedness and deceitfulness.
Muhammad on Lying
It might surprise our readers to discover that it is Muhammad who condoned deception and lying to achieve one’s aim, as the following verses demonstrate:
“Whoso disbelieves in God, after he has believed – excepting him who has been compelled, and in his heart is still at rest in his belief – but whosoever’s heart is expanded in unbelief, upon them shall rest anger from God, and there awaits them a mighty chastisement.” S. 16:106
Al-Tabari comments:
“It has been reported that the Quraish compelled ‘Ammar, his father Yasir, and his mother Sumayya to renounce Islam. So they tied Sumayyya to two camels and pointed a spear to her heart, saying to her that she converted for the men, and killed her. Later they killed Yasir. Thus, these two were the first martyrs in Islam. As for ‘Ammar, he told them, unwillingly, what they wanted to hear. So it was told the Messenger of God that ‘Ammar disbelieved. He said, ‘No, ‘Ammar is full of faith from the top of his head to the bottom of his feet; belief has been mingled with his flesh and blood.’ ‘Ammar came weeping to the Messenger of God. Therefore, the Messenger of God started to wipe his tears, and said, ‘If they come back to you, REPEAT TO THEM WHAT YOU SAID.’ This is the evidence for the admissibility of speaking unbelief under compulsion.” (‘Abdallah ‘Abd al-Fadi, Is the Qur’an Infallible? [Light of Life PO Box 13 A-9503 Villach, Austria], p. 97; capital emphasis ours)
The Traditions tell us that there are at least four instances where deception can be used:
Humaid b. ‘Abd al-Rahman b. ‘Auf reported that his mother Umm Kulthum daughter of ‘Uqba b. Abu Mu’ait, and she was one amongst the first emigrants who pledged allegiance to Allah’s Apostle, as saying that she heard Allah’s Messenger as saying: A liar is not one who tries to bring reconciliation amongst people and speaks good (in order to avert dispute), or he conveys good. Ibn Shihab said he did not hear that exemption was granted in anything what the people speak as lie but in three cases: in battle, for bringing reconciliation amongst persons and the narration of the words of the husband to his wife, and the narration of the words of a wife to her husband (in a twisted form in order to bring reconciliation between them). (Sahih Muslim, Book 032, Number 6303)
More information is provided by William Muir’s “Life of Mahomet”, Volume I, footnote 88:
The common Moslem belief is that it is allowable to tell a falsehood on four occasions:
1st, to save one’s life;
2nd, to effect a peace or reconciliation;
3rd, to persuade a woman;
4th, on the occasion of a journey or expedition.
To save one’s life
The first is borne out by Mahomet’s express sanction. Ammar ibn Yasir was sorely persecuted by the pagans of Mecca, and denied the faith for his deliverance. The Prophet approved of his conduct: – “If they do this again, then repeat the same recantation to them again.” Katib al Wackidi; p. 227 ½.
Another tradition preserved in the family of Yasir, is as follows: – “The idolators seized Ammar, and they let him not go until he had abused Mahomet and spoken well of their gods. He then repaired to the Prophet, who asked of him what had happened.” – “Evil, oh Prophet of the Lord! I was not let go until I had abused thee, and spoken well of their gods.” – “But how,” replied Mahomet, “dost thou find thins own heart?” – “Secure and steadfast in the faith.” – “Then,” said Mahomet, “if they repeat the same, do thou too repeat the same.” Ibid. Mahomet also said that Ammar’s lie was better than Aba Jahl’s truth.
To effect a peace or reconciliation
The second is directly sanctioned by the following tradition:- “That person is not a liar who makes peace between two people, and speaks good words to do away their quarrel, although they should be lies.” Mishcat, vol ii. p.427
To persuade a woman
As to the third, we have a melancholy instance that Mahomet did not think it wrong to make false promises to his wives, in the matter of Mary his Egyptian maid.
On the occasion of a journey or expedition
And regarding the fourth, it was his constant habit in projecting expeditions (excepting only that to Tabuk) to conceal his intentions, and to give out that he was about to proceed in another direction from the true one. (Hishami, p. 392; Katib al Wackidi, p. 133 ½.)
Hence, Muhammad treated truth and deception according to his own style of situational ethics. Muhammad condoned, and actually permitted lying to further his goals.
We are told in Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Number 361:
Narrated Zahdam:
Once we were in the house of Abu Musa who presented a meal containing cooked chicken. A man from the tribe of Bani Taim Allah with red complexion as if he were from the Byzantine war prisoners, was present. Abu Musa invited him to share the meal but he (apologized) saying. “I saw chickens eating dirty things and so I have had a strong aversion to eating them, and have taken an oath that I will not eat chickens.” Abu Musa said, “Come along, I will tell you about this matter (i.e. how to cancel one’s oath). I went to the Prophet in the company of a group of Al-Ashariyin, asked him to provide us with means of conveyance. He said, ‘By Allah, I will not provide you with any means of conveyance and I have nothing to make you ride on.’ Then some camels as booty were brought to Allah’s Apostle and he asked for us saying. ‘Where are the group of Al-Ash’ariyun?’ Then he ordered that we should be given five camels with white humps. When we set out we said, ‘What have we done? We will never be blessed (with what we have been given).’ So, we returned to the Prophet and said, ‘We asked you to provide us with means of conveyance, but you took an oath that you would not provide us with any means of conveyance. Did you forget (your oath when you gave us the camels)?’ He replied. ‘I have not provided you with means of conveyance but Allah has provided you with it, and by Allah, Allah willing, if ever I take an oath to do something, and later on I find that it is more beneficial to do something different, I will do the thing which is better, and give expiation for my oath.'”
The Quran testifies that even Allah is a deceiver:
The Hypocrites – they seek to deceive Allah but it is Allah Who DECEIVES them. When they stand up to prayer, they stand without earnestness, to be seen of men, but little do they hold Allah in remembrance; S. 4:142
Ibn Kathir comments:
In verse nine of Al-Baqarah, Allah says: While in the above verse, Allah says: There is no doubt that Allah does not deceive as He is All-Aware of secrets. But, the hypocrites, owing to their ignorance, believe that they can trick Allah on the Day of Judgment them with the same external shows of piety and honesty that they used to gain advantage with the people and to get verdicts in the law courts in this world. Allah knows their intentions. Similarly, Allah says in the following verse: (58:18).
After claiming that Allah does not deceive, Ibn Kathir goes on to say:
It is Allah Who tempts them in their going over the limits and their misguidance, and DECEIVES them into reaching false perceptions regarding the purpose of this life and the trial on the Day of Judgment when their falsehood will fail. It is reported in a hadith that: ‘Allah commands that a servant enter Paradise, as it may seem to people, then takes him to Fire.’” (Tafsir Ibn Kathir, Sura An-Nisa, ayat 24-147, abridged by Sheikh Muhammad Nasib Ar-Rafa’i [Al-Firdous Ltd., London 2000], pp. 207-208; capital emphasis ours)
Therefore, Muslims themselves admit that their God is a deceiver.
Further passages from the Qur’an about the deceiving nature of Allah:
And (the unbelievers) schemed and planned, and Allah schemed also, and the best of schemers is Allah. S. 3:54
Remember how the unbelievers schemed against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or to slay thee, or get thee out (of thy home). They scheme and plot, but the best of schemers is Allah. S. 8:30
The term for scheme in Arabic is makr and denotes one who is a deceiver, a conniver, a schemer. It is always used in a negative sense. Allah is thus seen as the best of deceivers, the premiere schemer and conniving one.
Muslim theologians themselves admit to the negative connotation of the Arabic term. For example Dr. Mahmoud M. Ayoub in his book, The Quran and Its Interpreters, Volume II, The House of Imran, brings up the question of,
“how the word makr (scheming or plotting), WHICH IMPLIES DECEITFULNESS OR DISHONESTY could be attributed to God.” (Ibid. [1992 State University of New York Press, Albany], p. 165; capital emphasis ours)
After listing several Muslim sources he quotes ar-Razi as arguing that “scheming (makr) is actually AN ACT OF DECEPTION AIMING AT CAUSING EVIL. It is not possible to attribute deception to God. Thus the word is one of the muttashabihat [multivalent words of the Quran].” (Ibid., p. 166; capital emphasis ours)
Like I said, keep blaspheming Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer, and watch me keep muzzling you and humiliating Muhammad.
Let me quote what Shammy-sham-Scam quoted from 1Corinthians 7:
“Now concerning the things about which you wrote to me: ‘It is good for a man not to touch a woman.’ Nevertheless, because of sexual immorality, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. Let the husband render to the wife due affection, and likewise the wife to the husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does. LIKEWISE, THE HUSBAND DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY OVER HIS OWN BODY, BUT THE WIFE DOES. Do not deprive one another except with consent for a time, that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer. Then come together again, so that Satan does not tempt you for lack of self-control.” 1 Corinthians 7:1-5
SHAMMY DO YOU EVEN READ BEFORE YOU PASTE IT HERE? CANT YOU READ THAT THE WIFE CAN ALSO RAPE THE HUSBAND FROM YOUR BIBLE?????
New Testament (BIBLE) PERMITS/encourages Christians to rape their own wife:
“4 The WIFE DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY over her own body (private part), but HER HUSBAND DOES. …” – I Corinthians 7:4
This verse commands that a Christian wife has no authority over her body. The ‘body’ part mentioned here a reference to her ‘private parts’. Basically, the husband has full right to have sexual relations with his wife even when she refuses. The Christian husband can have forceful sexual intimacy even if the wife refuses. For the wife to refuse this, is a major sin. This in modern terms would be called ‘marital rape’.
A COMMENTARY on 1 Corinthians 7:4 and Marital rape:
Pastor and Bible teacher David Guzik:
“b. On the same idea, also the wife to her husband: The wife is not to withhold marital affection from her husband. Paul strongly puts forth the idea that there is a mutual sexual responsibility in marriage. The husband has obligations toward his wife, and the wife has obligations toward her husband.
i. Render to his wife: The emphasis is on giving, on “I owe you” instead of “you owe me.” In God’s heart, sex is put on a much higher level than merely the husband’s privilege and the wife’s duty.
c. The wife does not have authority over her own body: In fact, these obligations ARE SO CONCRETE, IT COULD BE SAID THAT THE WIFE’S BODY DOES NOT EVEN BELONG TO HERSELF, BUT TO HER HUSBAND. The same principle is true of the husband’s body in regard to his wife. …”
(David Guzik Commentary on the Bible – online source)
AND
Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges:
“Verse 4
4. οὐκ ἐξουσιάζει. A.V. hath not power. Better, HATH NO RIGHT. ἐξουσία sometimes stands for power, as in Revelation 9:3. But the more usual sense of the word is AUTHORITY. τοῦ ἰδίου σώματος. OVER HER OWN BODY. Because in everything connected with the duties of married life each should consult the comfort, well-being, and happiness of the other before their own, and should be especially careful that they do not, by any selfishness on the part of either, ‘cause their brother to offend’” (Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges – online source)
Shammy-sham-Scam on your Lord paul encouraging Christians ike you to lie and deceive non-Christians:
“Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. TO THE JEWS I BECAME A LIKE A JEW, TO WIN THE JEWS. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. I do it all for the sake of the gospel, that I may share with them in its blessings.” – 1 Corinthians 9:19-23
Paul confesses here that he acted as a Jew in order to convert them to his faith. He even acted as a pagan so that he can lure them to his religion. The above verse shows that Paul would go in great lengths to spread his religion by deception. Let’s see now what the experts have to say on the above passage.
Saint John Cassian (B. 360 – D. 435) was a Christian monk and theologian. He is another in line of the early Church fathers who stated that, what Paul said in 1 Corinthians 9:20, was deception. The title of the chapter begins by “How even Apostles thought that a lie was often useful and the truth injurious”. He writes,
Chapter 20
“How even Apostles thought that a lie was often useful and the truth injurious.
“Instructed by which examples, the blessed James also, and all the chief princess of the primitive Church urged the Apostle Paul in consequence of the weakness of feeble persons to condescend to a fictitious arrangement and insisted on his purifying himself according to the requirements of the law, and shaving his head and paying his vows, as they THOUGHT THAT THE PRESENT HARM WHICH WOULD COME FROM THIS HYPOCRISY WAS OF NO ACCOUNT, but had regard rather to the gain which would result from his still continued preaching. For the gain to the Apostle Paul from his strictness would not have counterbalanced the loss to all nations from his speedy death. AND THIS WOULD CERTAINLY HAVE BEEN THEN INCURRED BY THE WHOLE CHURCH UNLESS THIS GOOD AND SALUTARY HYPOCRISY HAD PRESERVED HIM FOR THE PREACHING OF THE GOSPEL. FOR THEN WE MAY RIGHTLY AND PARDONABLY ACQUIESCE IN THE WRONG OF A LIE, WHEN, AS WE SAID, A GREATER HARM DEPENDS ON TELLING THE TRUTH, AND WHEN THE GOOD WHICH RESULTS TO US FROM SPEAKING THE TRUTH CANNOT COUNTERBALANCE THE HARM WHICH WILL BE CAUSED BY IT. …” https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/11/28/1-corinthians-9-apostle-pauls-missionary-deception-taqiyya/
On Jesus (god) deceiving people “BEST OF DECEIVERS”,
King James 2000 Bible Jeremiah 23:39 Therefore, behold, I, even I, will utterly DECEIVE (Nasha) YOU, and I will forsake you, and the city that I gave you and your fathers, and cast you out of my presence:
The Hebrew word ‘Nasha’ has the following meanings:
1) to beguile, deceive
A)(Niphal) to be beguiled
B)(Hiphil) to beguile, deceive
C)(Qal) utterly (infinitive)
MORE MASS DECEPTION FROM JESUS,
1 Kings 22:20-22: 20 And the LORD said, ‘WHO WILL ENTICE AHAM into attacking Ramoth Gilead and going to his death there?’ “One suggested this, and another that. 21 Finally, a spirit came forward, stood before the LORD and said, ‘I will entice him.’22 ” ‘By what means?’ the LORD asked. “‘I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouths of all his prophets,’ he said.” ‘You will succeed in enticing him,’ said the LORD. ‘Go and do it.’ Here we see that the man said that he would resort to lying in order to entice Ahab and God supported the idea and told him to go ahead and do it!
professor George Alexander Kennedy says the following on the passage,
…words for eloquence, speaking, and persuading in the Hebrew text of the Old Testament, there is no Hebrew transitive verb to express the thought ‘He persuades someone’ in a positive sense. The closest is the verb pata, which carries the connotation of enticement, seduction, and DECEPTION. EVEN THE LORD IS, SAID TO ENGAGE OCCASSIONALY IN THIS KIND OF RHETORIC (1 kings 22:20-22; 2 Chronicles 18:19-21; Ezekiel 14:9). Active persuasion in this sense is generally thought of as negative. [16] https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/08/28/bible-yahweh-best-of-deceivers/
The dog is barking again. Better question do you understand what you read SINCE IF WE GO WITH YOUR SICK, PERVERTED MISREADING OF 1 CORINTHIANS 7 THEN THAT MEANS THAT WIVES HAVE THE SAME RIGHT TO RAPE THEIR HUSBANDS?
You really must feel so stupid right now for shamelessly perverting Paul’s words, Muhammad’s Master, since you keep thinking you are reading the filth you call the Quran. But since you want to talk about rape, let’s see what your women enslaving and raping profit did with women like your mother, sisters, wives, and/or daughters.
The following verse permits Muslim men (which includes Muhammad himself) to sleep with married women whom they have taken captive:
Also (prohibited are) women already married, except those whom your right hands possess: Thus hath God ordained (Prohibitions) against you: Except for these, all others are lawful, provided ye seek (them in marriage) with gifts from your property, – desiring chastity, not lust, seeing that ye derive benefit from them, give them their dowers (at least) as prescribed; but if, after a dower is prescribed, agree Mutually (to vary it), there is no blame on you, and God is All-knowing, All-wise. S. 4:24 Y. Ali
Tragically, this did not remain a mere abstraction but was readily put into practice by Muhammad’s sexually craved jihadists:
Abu Sirma said to Abu Sa’id al Khadri: O Abu Sa’id, did you hear Allah’s Messenger mentioning al-‘azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah’s Messenger on the expedition to the Bi’l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing ‘azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah’s Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah’s Messenger, and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3371)
And:
Abu Said al-Khudri said: The apostle of Allah sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain. They met their enemy and fought with them. They defeated them and took them captives. Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Quranic verse, ‘And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess’. That is to say, they are lawful for them when they complete their waiting period. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Volume 2, Number 2150)
Thus, Muhammad and his deity condoned and encouraged men to virtually rape their female captives whether they were married or not.
Now unless this taqiyyist wants us to believe that such women whose families had just been murdered and (in some cases) whose husbands were still alive would actually consent to having sex with their captors, it should be apparent that the Islamic deity is actually permitting, and even encouraging, rape and adultery in his so-called holy book!
How truly sad and tragic for these women that Muhammad and his god did not share the shame and concern of the jihadists regarding the highly unethical nature of raping captives whose husbands were still alive. Instead, Allah and his messenger rushed to justify such a perverted and heinous crime!
Contrast this filth with what Deuteronomy teaches concerning the issue of female captives:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her.” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
Here we see that, instead of permitting men to rape captive women, the Holy Bible forces the Israelites to marry them if they wanted to have sex with them, and then letting them go free in case of a divorce. This means that the Holy Bible is actually dignifying these women by not allowing them to be treated the way Allah and his “messenger” had them treated, namely like animals. Now this is a command which predates the Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Unfortunately, there’s more to the story. The so-called sound ahadith report that Muhammad taught that Allah has predestined the amount of adultery a person must necessarily commit:
Narrated Ibn ‘Abbas:
I did not see anything so resembling minor sins as what Abu Huraira said from the Prophet, who said, “Allah has written for the son of Adam his INEVITABLE share of adultery whether he is aware of it or not: The adultery of the eye is the looking (at something which is sinful to look at), and the adultery of the tongue is to utter (what it is unlawful to utter), and the innerself wishes and longs for (adultery) and the private parts turn that into reality or refrain from submitting to the temptation.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 77, Number 609)
Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he OF NECESSITY MUST COMMIT (or there would be no escape from it). (Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421; see also Number 6422)
In other words, these Muslims were only carrying out the very sexual filth which their god had predestined for them! I have more for you in the next post.
As if Islam’s teachings couldn’t get any more morally repugnant, Allah goes ahead and permits his followers to pay women to marry them temporarily for the sole purpose of gratifying their sexual desires. This is typically referred to as “pleasure marriages” (zawaj al-mut’a).
According to the Muslim expositors, the following passage:
O you who believe! Make not unlawful the Taiyibat (all that is good as regards foods, things, deeds, beliefs, persons, etc.) which Allah has made lawful to you, and transgress not. Verily, Allah does not like the transgressors. S. 5:87 Hilali-Khan
Was “revealed” to condone the practice of marrying women for a short period of time:
Narrated Abdullah:
We used to participate in the holy wars carried on by the Prophet and we had no women (wives) with us. So we said (to the Prophet). “Shall we castrate ourselves?” But the Prophet forbade us to do that and thenceforth he allowed us to marry a woman (temporarily) by giving her even a garment, and then he recited: “O you who believe! Do not make unlawful the good things which Allah has made lawful for you.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 139)
Narrated Abdullah:
We used to participate in the holy battles led by Allah’s Apostle and we had nothing (no wives) with us. So we said, “Shall we get ourselves castrated?” He forbade us that and then allowed us to marry women with a temporary contract and recited to us: — ‘O you who believe! Make not unlawful the good things which Allah has made lawful for you, but commit no transgression.’ (5.87) (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 13o)
Pay attention to the fact that, instead of teaching his men abstinence and self-control, Muhammad actually goes ahead and encourages his band of murdering thugs to find women to have sex with!
Sadly, there were instances in which women actually got pregnant through such unions:
Yahya related to me from Malik from Ibn Shihab from Urwa ibn az-Zubayr that Khawla ibn Hakim came to Umar ibn al-Khattab and said, “Rabia ibn Umayya made a temporary marriage with a woman and she is pregnant by him.” Umar ibn al-Khattab went out in dismay dragging his cloak, saying, “This temporary marriage, had I come across it, I would have ordered stoning and done away with it!” (Malik’s Muwatta, Book 28, Number 28.18.42)
Certain traditions claim that Muhammad abrogated this form of prostitution:
Narrated Jabir bin ‘Abdullah and Salama bin Al-Akwa’: While we were in an army, Allah’s Apostle came to us and said, “You have been allowed to do the Mut’a (marriage), so do it.” Salama bin Al-Akwa’ said: Allah’s Apostle’s said, “If a man and a woman agree (to marry temporarily), their marriage should last for three nights, and if they like to continue, they can do so; and if they want to separate, they can do so.” I do not know whether that was only for us or for all the people in general. Abu Abdullah (Al-Bukhari) said: ‘Ali made it clear that the Prophet said, “The Mut’a marriage has been cancelled (made unlawful).” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 52)
However, there are other narrations which claim that Muslims continued to observe temporary marriages until the caliphate of Umar b. al-Khattab:
Ibn Uraij reported: ‘Ati’ reported that Jabir b. Abdullah came to perform ‘Umra, and we came to his abode, and the people asked him about different things, and then they made a mention of temporary marriage, whereupon he said: Yes, we had been benefiting ourselves by this temporary marriage during the lifetime of the Holy Prophet and during the time of Abu Bakr and ‘Umar. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3248)
Even sadder, and more shamefully, is the fact that the Shiite sect of Islam continues to observe this practice till this day. They even attempt to use the Sunni sources themselves to establish that this morally repugnant form of prostitution is still permissible since Muhammad and his followers never abrogated it! For the details and arguments we recommend the following online booklet.
Suffice it to say, such a practice is nothing more than prostitution and it is an outright insult to even label this filth as marriage.
With that said, here are my questions for you.
1. Would your mother, wives, sisters, daughters be ok with having sex with their Muslim captors, men who have taken them captive?
2. Would you be ok with Muhammad and his money treating your mother, sisters, or daughters as prostitutes by contracting muta with them?
Please answer the questions so I can post your answers for all to see.
What a joy it is to muzzle you and shame your profit! Thanks for helping me do so. 😉
Now let’s see who the deceiver really is, shall we?
In response to these charges, Muslims oftentimes point to certain biblical passages in order to turn the tables on Christians. They hope that by citing specific biblical verses which seem to teach that Yahweh is also a deceiver this will then justify the Quranic portrait of Allah being a schemer and liar. The passages that Muslims often appeal to are Ezekiel 14:9-10 and 20:25-26.
There are at least a couple of problems with the Muslim logic. First, the only thing this would prove is that neither Yahweh of the Bible nor Allah of the Quran is worthy of being viewed or worshiped as God. It does nothing to justify the Quran’s picture of God.
Second, a careful examination of the biblical texts in question shows that there is no comparison with the Quran. The Muslims are comparing apples and oranges at this point. An analysis of the immediate (as well as the greater biblical) contexts will help explain why we say this.
We include here the two passages along with some of the immediate context for further clarification:
“Then certain of the elders of Israel came to me and sat before me. And the word of the LORD came to me: ‘Son of man, these men have taken their idols into their hearts, and set the stumbling block of their iniquity before their faces. Should I indeed let myself be consulted by them? Therefore speak to them and say to them, Thus says the Lord GOD: Any one of the house of Israel who takes his idols into his heart and sets the stumbling block of his iniquity before his face, and yet comes to the prophet, I the LORD will answer him as he comes with the multitude of his idols, that I may lay hold of the hearts of the house of Israel, who are all estranged from me through their idols. Therefore say to the house of Israel, Thus says the Lord GOD: Repent and turn away from your idols, and turn away your faces from all your abominations. For any one of the house of Israel, or of the strangers who sojourn in Israel, who separates himself from me, taking his idols into his heart and putting the stumbling block of his iniquity before his face, and yet comes to a prophet to consult me through him, I the LORD will answer him myself. And I will set my face against that man; I will make him a sign and a byword and cut him off from the midst of my people, and you shall know that I am the LORD. And if the prophet is deceived (pathath) and speaks a word, I, the LORD, have deceived (pathath) that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand against him and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel. And they shall bear their punishment–the punishment of the prophet and the punishment of the inquirer shall be alike–that the house of Israel may no more go astray from me, nor defile themselves anymore with all their transgressions, but that they may be my people and I may be their God, declares the Lord GOD.’” Ezekiel 14:1-10
“Moreover, I swore to them in the wilderness that I would scatter them among the nations and disperse them through the countries, because they had not obeyed my rules, but had rejected my statutes and profaned my Sabbaths, and their eyes were set on their fathers’ idols. Moreover, I gave them statutes that were not good and rules by which they could not have life, and I defiled them through their very gifts in their offering up all their firstborn, that I might devastate them. I did it that they might know that I am the LORD.” Ezekiel 20:23-26
In light of the contexts we can now proceed to analyze the implications of these texts. To begin with, God is not causing innocent or blameless people to be deceived and go astray. God, instead, is handing godless and rebellious sinners over to the desires of their evil, unregenerate hearts. In other words, God is giving the people exactly what their wicked hearts were craving, what their sinful natures desired. The following texts bring this out more clearly:
“But my people did not listen to my voice; Israel would not submit to me. So I gave them over to their stubborn hearts, to follow their own counsels. Psalm 81:11-12
“Who has spoken and it came to pass, unless the Lord has commanded it? Is it not from the mouth of the Most High that good and bad come? Why should a living man complain, a man, about the punishment of his sins?” Lamentations 3:37-39
“For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles. Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of THEIR hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, BECAUSE they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen. For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error. And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.” Romans 1:21-28
“The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.” 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12
Now the question becomes how does Yahweh deceive the false prophets so as to mislead sinners who do not want to obey? Does he directly inspire lies through these prophets, does he directly cause the persons to deceive? Or is he indirectly the cause of the deception, i.e. is Yahweh permitting a lying and deceptive agent to cause the false prophets to utter lies and falsehood?
To answer that we need to first see what the Holy Bible says about Yahweh’s character:
“The Rock, his work is perfect, for all his ways are justice. A God of faithfulness and without iniquity, just and upright is he.” Deuteronomy 32:4
“This God–his way is perfect; the word of the LORD proves true; he is a shield for all those who take refuge in him.” Psalm 18:30
“in hope of eternal life, which God, who never lies, promised before the ages began” Titus 1:2
“So when God desired to show more convincingly to the heirs of the promise the unchangeable character of his purpose, he guaranteed it with an oath, so that by two unchangeable things, in which it is IMPOSSIBLE for God to lie, we who have fled for refuge might have strong encouragement to hold fast to the hope set before us.” Hebrews 6:17-18
“Let no one say when he is tempted, ‘I am being tempted by God,’ for God CANNOT be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one. But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire. Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death. Do not be deceived, my beloved brothers. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.” James 1:13-17
The citations above make it plain for all to see that God CANNOT lie since it is IMPOSSIBLE for him to do so, and won’t directly cause anyone to lie either. Hence, both the Old and New Testaments concur on this point: God himself cannot lie and isn’t the direct cause of any lie or deceit.
I continue my discussion of whether Yahweh is like your satan whom you worship.
We still need to answer the question of how can Yahweh say he has deceived the prophet when the same Scriptures say that Yahweh cannot deceive anyone. Is this a contradiction in the Scriptures? Not at all, as we shall now prove by God’s grace.
According to the Holy Bible, all agents are under God’s sovereign control and can only do what God permits:
“With him are strength and sound wisdom; the deceived and the deceiver are his.” Job 12:16
“Behold, I have created the smith who blows the fire of coals and produces a weapon for its purpose. I have also created the ravager to destroy; no weapon that is fashioned against you shall succeed, and you shall confute every tongue that rises against you in judgment. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD and their vindication from me, declares the LORD.” Isaiah 54:16-17
These texts imply that the deceiver, the deceived, the smith and the wielder of the sword are all under God’s complete control to do as he sees fit.
“Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift you as wheat. But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers.” Luke 22:31-32
Jesus says that Satan has asked to sift through the disciples, which obviously means that he had to get permission from God first before he could anything.
What the above verses imply is that even Satan and the demons can only do what God permits them.
God often permits them to deceive or wreck havoc in order to accomplish his perfect and just purposes:
“The LORD has made everything for its purpose, even the wicked for the day of trouble.” Proverbs 16:4
“In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,” Ephesians 1:11
His purposes in permitting these evil entities to act in accord with their evil intent may be the result of judgment falling on sinful and rebellious people as in the case of the Ezekiel texts, or to accomplish a greater good as in the case of Christ being handed over to death for the salvation of God’s people. Please note the following texts carefully since they help to illuminate these points:
“And Micaiah said, ‘Therefore hear the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing beside him on his right hand and on his left; and the LORD said, “Who will entice (pathath) Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramoth-gilead?” And one said one thing, and another said another. Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, saying, “I will entice (pathath) him.” And the LORD said to him, “By what means?” And he said, “I will go out, and will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.” And he said, “You are to entice (pathath) him, and you shall succeed; go out and do so.” Now therefore behold, the LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these your prophets; the LORD has declared disaster for you.’ Then Zedekiah the son of Chenaanah came near and struck Micaiah on the cheek and said, ‘How did the Spirit of the LORD go from me to speak to you?’ And Micaiah said, ‘Behold, you shall see on that day when you go into an inner chamber to hide yourself.’ And the king of Israel said, ‘Seize Micaiah, and take him back to Amon the governor of the city and to Joash the king’s son, and say, “Thus says the king, ‘Put this fellow in prison and feed him meager rations of bread and water, until I come in peace.’”’ And Micaiah said, ‘If you return in peace, the LORD has not spoken by me.’ And he said, ‘Hear, all you peoples!’” 1 Kings 22:19-28
God caused the prophets to prophecy lies by permitting a lying spirit to inspire these lies through them. Notice that God himself didn’t lie, but permitted the spirit to lie through the prophets.
Interestingly, this passage uses the same Hebrew word for deception, pathath, which is found in the Ezekiel 14 text.
Further insight is found in the story of Job.
“Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them. The LORD said to Satan, ‘From where have you come?’ Satan answered the LORD and said, ‘From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it.’ And the LORD said to Satan, ‘Have you considered my servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, who fears God and turns away from evil?’ Then Satan answered the LORD and said, ‘Does Job fear God for no reason? Have you not put a hedge around him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. But stretch out your hand and touch all that he has, and he will curse you to your face.’ And the LORD said to Satan, ‘Behold, all that he has is in your hand. Only against him do not stretch out your hand.’ So Satan went out from the presence of the LORD. Now there was a day when his sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother’s house, and there came a messenger to Job and said, ‘The oxen were plowing and the donkeys feeding beside them, and the Sabeans fell upon them and took them and struck down the servants with the edge of the sword, and I alone have escaped to tell you.’ While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, ‘The fire of God fell from heaven and burned up the sheep and the servants and consumed them, and I alone have escaped to tell you.’ While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, ‘The Chaldeans formed three groups and made a raid on the camels and took them and struck down the servants with the edge of the sword, and I alone have escaped to tell you.’ While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, ‘Your sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother’s house, and behold, a great wind came across the wilderness and struck the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young people, and they are dead, and I alone have escaped to tell you.’ Then Job arose and tore his robe and shaved his head and fell on the ground and worshiped. And he said, ‘Naked I came from my mother’s womb, and naked shall I return. The LORD gave, and the LORD has taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD.’” Job 1:6-22
“Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them to present himself before the LORD. And the LORD said to Satan, ‘From where have you come?’ Satan answered the LORD and said, ‘From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it.’ And the LORD said to Satan, ‘Have you considered my servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, who fears God and turns away from evil? He still holds fast his integrity, although you incited me against him to destroy him without reason.’ Then Satan answered the LORD and said, ‘Skin for skin! All that a man has he will give for his life. But stretch out your hand and touch his bone and his flesh, and he will curse you to your face.’ And the LORD said to Satan, ‘Behold, he is in your hand; only spare his life.’ So Satan went out from the presence of the LORD and struck Job with loathsome sores from the sole of his foot to the crown of his head. And he took a piece of broken pottery with which to scrape himself while he sat in the ashes. Then his wife said to him, ‘Do you still hold fast your integrity? Curse God and die.’ But he said to her, ‘You speak as one of the foolish women would speak. Shall we receive good from God, and shall we not receive evil?’ In all this Job did not sin with his lips.” Job 2:1-10
Even though God permitted Satan to wreck havoc on Job, both God and Job attribute this calamity to God. The reason why should now be clear… Satan couldn’t have come near Job if God hadn’t allowed it. Hence, since God permitted Satan to do what he did it can therefore be said that these disasters came from Yahweh.
“Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a man attested to you by God with mighty works and wonders and signs that God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves know– this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men. God raised him up, loosing the pangs of death, because it was not possible for him to be held by it.” Acts 2:22-24
“for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place.” Acts 4:27-28
Again, it was God who decreed that the Lord Jesus would be betrayed and killed by lawless and godless men so as to accomplish the salvation of God for mankind.
The foregoing should make it apparent that the Holy Bible is not asserting that God is the direct cause of deceptions or lies. Rather, Yahweh is the indirect cause in the sense that he has decreed and permitted that liars and deceivers will deceive in order to accomplish God’s perfect and righteous will.
Putting it in another way, Yahweh doesn’t actually deceive or inspire deception. Rather, Yahweh permits, allows, decrees that lying spirits or humans will act in accord with their own deceptive hearts and mislead sinners and rebels who refuse to obey the true God. In so doing, God is simply handing over these individuals to their own desires since this is what they deserve.
This is the third part of my post showing that Yahweh is not like the demon who inspired your profit.
Furthermore, and this is important, in both cases cited above, i.e. Ezekiel and Micaiah, God does not leave these sinners with deceived prophets only. The true prophet, with the true message of God, warns both groups also and then they decide for themselves that they want to follow the deceptive spirits. They followed those who said what they wanted to hear. They were given what they wanted. They were not deceived without an alternative and without a strong warning from God that this is what would take place when they insist on their idolatrous ways. These deceptions are not in the mouth of the true prophet (in distinction to Muhammad’s satanic verses), but only in the mouth of self-appointed false prophets who work for their own gain.
God had told his people to make a choice, to choose life over death:
“For this commandment that I command you today is not too hard for you, neither is it far off. It is not in heaven, that you should say, ‘Who will ascend to heaven for us and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it?’ Neither is it beyond the sea, that you should say, ‘Who will go over the sea for us and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it?’ But the word is very near you. It is in your mouth and in your heart, so that you can do it. See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil. If you obey the commandments of the LORD your God that I command you today, by loving the LORD your God, by walking in his ways, and by keeping his commandments and his statutes and his rules, then you shall live and multiply, and the LORD your God will bless you in the land that you are entering to take possession of it. But if your heart turns away, and you will not hear, but are drawn away to worship other gods and serve them, I declare to you today, that you shall surely perish. You shall not live long in the land that you are going over the Jordan to enter and possess. I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse. Therefore choose life, that you and your offspring may live, loving the LORD your God, obeying his voice and holding fast to him, for he is your life and length of days, that you may dwell in the land that the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, to give them.” Deuteronomy 30:11-20
To this day, life and death is an option before us. God does not only put death before them and they have no option but to take it as if that is what God wanted for them. The prophet Ezekiel, as well as the others, shows that what God wants for his people, and for us, is to turn and live, not die:
“The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not suffer for the iniquity of the father, nor the father suffer for the iniquity of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself. But if a wicked person turns away from all his sins that he has committed and keeps all my statutes and does what is just and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die. None of the transgressions that he has committed shall be remembered against him; for the righteousness that he has done he shall live. Have I any pleasure in the death of the wicked, declares the Lord GOD, and not rather that he should turn from his way and live?” Ezekiel 18:20-23
“Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, declares the Lord GOD. Repent and turn from all your transgressions, lest iniquity be your ruin. Cast away from you all the transgressions that you have committed, and make yourselves a new heart and a new spirit! Why will you die, O house of Israel? For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Lord GOD; so turn, and live.” Ezekiel 18:30-32
“So you, son of man, I have made a watchman for the house of Israel. Whenever you hear a word from my mouth, you shall give them warning from me. If I say to the wicked, O wicked one, you shall surely die, and you do not speak to warn the wicked to turn from his way, that wicked person shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand. But if you warn the wicked to turn from his way, and he does not turn from his way, that person shall die in his iniquity, but you will have delivered your soul. And you, son of man, say to the house of Israel, Thus have you said: ‘Surely our transgressions and our sins are upon us, and we rot away because of them. How then can we live?’ Say to them, As I live, declares the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live; turn back, turn back from your evil ways, for why will you die, O house of Israel?” Ezekiel 33:7-11
“The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.” 2 Peter 3:9
Let us now contrast this biblical portrait of God with the Quran’s depiction of Allah.
Yahweh doesn’t lie and is not the direct cause of deception. Allah, on the other hand, both lies and directly causes deception as in the case of making it appear as though Jesus had been crucified when in fact he hadn’t been (cf. Sura 4:157), or commanding people to do evil and then punishing them for their obedience (Sura 17:16).
In accord with justice, Yahweh permits evil agents to mislead sinners and rebels who refuse to repent and obey God’s commands. He may even use the evil of the people to accomplish a greater good such as in the case of Christ’s crucifixion. He doesn’t cause righteous servants or the godly to be led astray, but protects them from the evil one (cf. Luke 10:17-20; 1 John 2:13-14; 4:1-4; 5:4-5, 18-19). Allah, on the other hand, deceives both believers and unbelievers (cf. Suras 4:142; 8:30, 43-44).
These points should make it clear to any open-minded reader that the Holy Bible and the Quran are not the same in their depiction of God’s character.
Here is another passage which Muslims often use to prove their assertion that Yahweh is a deceiver:
“O LORD, thou hast deceived me, and I was deceived; thou art stronger than I, and thou hast prevailed. I have become a laughingstock all the day; every one mocks me.” Jeremiah 20:7
Much like Ezekiel 14 and 1 Kings, the word for deceive here is pathath. But unlike those specific contexts, the word has nothing to do with deception. Words must be defined within a specific context, since the same word can mean different things in different contexts. Depending upon the context pathath can mean a host of things just as the following lexicon demonstrates:
pathah {paw-thaw’} # 06601
1) to be spacious, be open, be wide
a) (Qal) to be spacious or open or wide
b) (Hiphil) to make spacious, make open
2) to be simple, entice, deceive, persuade
a) (Qal)
1) to be open-minded, be simple, be naive
2) to be enticed, be deceived
b) (Niphal) to be deceived, be gullible
c) (Piel)
1) to persuade, seduce
2) to deceive
d) (Pual)
1) to be persuaded
2) to be deceived (Source)
We therefore must take a look at the immediate context to see what pathath exactly means. It is clear from the text that the word can only mean “persuade”:
“O LORD, You induced me, and I was persuaded; YOU ARE STRONGER THAN I, AND HAVE PREVAILED. I am in derision daily; Everyone mocks me. For when I spoke, I cried out; I shouted, ‘Violence and plunder!’ Because the word of the LORD was made to me A reproach and a derision daily. Then I said, ‘I will not make mention of Him, Nor speak anymore in His name.’ But His word was in my heart like a burning fire Shut up in my bones; I was weary of holding it back, And I could not.” Jeremiah 20:8-9 NKJV
God was persuading Jeremiah to continue the work which he was sent to do even though the latter didn’t want to. God had already warned Jeremiah beforehand what the response of the people would be to his preaching:
“Now the word of the LORD came to me, saying, ‘Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations.’ Then I said, ‘Ah, Lord GOD! Behold, I do not know how to speak, for I am only a youth.’ But the LORD said to me, ‘Do not say, “I am only a youth”; for to all to whom I send you, you shall go, and whatever I command you, you shall speak. Do not be afraid of them, for I am with you to deliver you, declares the LORD.’ Then the LORD put out his hand and touched my mouth. And the LORD said to me, ‘Behold, I have put my words in your mouth. See, I have set you this day over nations and over kingdoms, to pluck up and to break down, to destroy and to overthrow, to build and to plant.’ And the word of the LORD came to me, saying, ‘Jeremiah, what do you see?’ And I said, ‘I see an almond branch.’ Then the LORD said to me, ‘You have seen well, for I am watching over my word to perform it.’ The word of the LORD came to me a second time, saying, ‘What do you see?’ And I said, ‘I see a boiling pot, facing away from the north.’ Then the LORD said to me, ‘Out of the north disaster shall be let loose upon all the inhabitants of the land. For behold, I am calling all the tribes of the kingdoms of the north, declares the LORD, and they shall come, and every one shall set his throne at the entrance of the gates of Jerusalem, against all its walls all around and against all the cities of Judah. And I will declare my judgments against them, for all their evil in forsaking me. They have made offerings to other gods and worshiped the works of their own hands. But you, dress yourself for work; arise, and say to them everything that I command you. Do not be dismayed by them, lest I dismay you before them. And I, behold, I make you this day a fortified city, an iron pillar, and bronze walls, against the whole land, against the kings of Judah, its officials, its priests, and the people of the land. They will fight against you, but they shall not prevail against you, for I am with you, declares the LORD, to deliver you.’” Jeremiah 1:4-19
“To whom shall I speak and give warning, that they may hear? Behold, their ears are uncircumcised, they cannot listen; behold, the word of the LORD is to them an object of scorn; they take no pleasure in it.” Jeremiah 6:10
God promises him that his message will basically fall on deaf ears, that he will have strong opposition and even suffer persecution. So God never promised him a smooth sailing if he would be his prophet. He knew that it would be tough, God told him beforehand. Still, Jeremiah wants to give up. He is exhausted and his strength is gone. He doesn’t want to be a warner anymore who is constantly ridiculed. So he laments to God that he had induced and persuaded him to take this position, but he does not and could not say that God deceived him, since God had indeed told him beforehand. The verse has nothing to do with deception whatsoever.
We now turn to one final text that is used to prove that Yahweh deceives:
“Then I said, ‘Ah, Sovereign LORD, how completely you have deceived this people and Jerusalem by saying, ‘You will have peace,’ when the sword is at our throats.’” Jeremiah 4:10
Jeremiah accused God of deceiving the people into thinking that he was going to grant them peace.
There are several problems with appealing to this text to prove that God is a deceiver. In the first place, God never promised his people unconditional peace, but promised to grant them peace provided that they obeyed him. God also warned them of disaster if they failed to live by his instructions:
“If you fully obey the LORD your God and carefully follow all his commands I give you today, the LORD your God will set you high above all the nations on earth. All these blessings will come upon you and accompany you if you obey the LORD your God… However, if you do not obey the LORD your God and do not carefully follow all his commands and decrees I am giving you today, all these curses will come upon you and overtake you:” Deuteronomy 28:1-2, 15
“‘If you will return, O Israel, return to me,’ declares the LORD. If you put your detestable idols out of my sight and no longer go astray, and if in a truthful, just and righteous way you swear, “As surely as the LORD lives,” then the nations will be blessed by him and in him they will glory.’ This is what the LORD says to the men of Judah and to Jerusalem: ‘Break up your unplowed ground and do not sow among thorns. Circumcise yourselves to the LORD, circumcise your hearts, you men of Judah and people of Jerusalem, or my wrath will break out and burn like fire because of the evil you have done— burn with no one to quench it. Announce in Judah and proclaim in Jerusalem and say: “Sound the trumpet throughout the land!” Cry aloud and say: “Gather together! Let us flee to the fortified cities!” Raise the signal to go to Zion! Flee for safety without delay! For I am bringing disaster from the north, even terrible destruction. A lion has come out of his lair; a destroyer of nations has set out. He has left his place to lay waste your land. Your towns will lie in ruins without inhabitant. So put on sackcloth, lament and wail, for the fierce anger of the LORD has not turned away from us. In that day,’ declares the LORD, ‘the king and the officials will lose heart, the priests will be horrified, and the prophets will be appalled.’” Jeremiah 4:1-9
Second, it was the false prophets who deceived the people into believing that God had promised to give them peace in spite of their rebellion against the Lord:
“Then the LORD said to me, ‘Do not pray for the well-being of this people. Although they fast, I will not listen to their cry; though they offer burnt offerings and grain offerings, I will not accept them. Instead, I will destroy them with the sword, famine and plague.’ But I said, ‘Ah, Sovereign LORD, the prophets keep telling them, “You will not see the sword or suffer famine. Indeed, I will give you lasting peace in this place.’” Then the LORD said to me, ‘The prophets are prophesying lies in my name. I have not sent them or appointed them or spoken to them. They are prophesying to you false visions, divinations, idolatries and the delusions of their own minds. Therefore, this is what the LORD says about the prophets who are prophesying in my name: I did not send them, yet they are saying, “No sword or famine will touch this land.” Those same prophets will perish by sword and famine. And the people they are prophesying to will be thrown out into the streets of Jerusalem because of the famine and sword. There will be no one to bury them or their wives, their sons or their daughters. I will pour out on them the calamity they deserve.’” Jeremiah 14:11-16
This may account for Jeremiah falsely assuming that it was God who told the people that he would grant them peace when in fact he never made such a claim.
Third and more importantly, Jeremiah wasn’t always speaking by inspiration or conveying God’s thoughts, but spoke at times out of his own sinful flesh and frustrations. In fact, at one point Jeremiah had to be told to repent because he had fallen so far away due to the anger and disappointment he felt at the response he was receiving from the people:
“You understand, O LORD; remember me and care for me. Avenge me on my persecutors. You are long-suffering—do not take me away; think of how I suffer reproach for your sake. When your words came, I ate them; they were my joy and my heart’s delight, for I bear your name, O LORD God Almighty. I never sat in the company of revelers, never made merry with them; I sat alone because your hand was on me and you had filled me with indignation. Why is my pain unending and my wound grievous and incurable? Will you be to me like a deceptive brook, like a spring that fails? Therefore this is what the LORD says: ‘IF YOU REPENT, I will restore you that you may serve me; if you utter worthy, NOT WORTHLESS, words, you will be my spokesman. Let this people turn to you, but you must not turn to them. I will make you a wall to this people, a fortified wall of bronze; they will fight against you but will not overcome you, for I am with you to rescue and save you,’ declares the LORD. ‘I will save you from the hands of the wicked and redeem you from the grasp of the cruel.’” Jeremiah 15:15-21
Notice carefully how God expressly commanded Jeremiah to repent of his sins, for speaking and saying things that were wrong, in order that he may be restored as God’s prophet and agent.
The objector has erroneously assumed that just because Jeremiah recorded his own statements where he accused God of being a deceiver that this somehow means that he was reflecting God’s view of the situation. On the contrary, even though the entire book of Jeremiah is the inspired Word of God not everything stated within its pages necessarily reflects God’s mind. After all, the Bible accurately records historical events and speeches without this implying that it approves of them. To put it simply, the Bible doesn’t always support or condone the statements and actions it records since they do not always reflect God’s view. This essentially means that all the speeches and deeds of specific individuals that are found in the Bible must be viewed in light of the revealed will and words of God to see whether God approves of them or not.
By God’s grace, this concludes our analysis. In the service of the holy and pure sovereign Triune God, Yahweh Almighty. Amen. Come Lord Jesus, come. By your sovereign grace we will love you for ever and ever. Amen.
Now let me prove to you that Allah and Satan are twin brothers (or more correctly, Allah is satan!). Enjoy!
The Quran claims that there is no one that is like Allah, none that are comparable to him.
(He is) the Creator of the heavens and the earth: He has made for you pairs from among yourselves, and pairs among cattle: by this means does He multiply you: there is nothing whatever like unto Him, and He is the One that hears and sees (all things). S. 42:11 Abdullah Yusuf Ali
And there is none like unto Him. S. 112:4 Y. Ali
Shockingly, however, there is one specific individual that is a lot like Allah according to the Muslim Scripture. We say shockingly because that someone happens to be the Devil himself!
In this article, we are going to list some of the many characteristics and functions which the Islamic deity shares in common with Satan. A comparison of the Arabic text of these passages will confirm that the very same exact qualities and abilities are ascribed to both Allah and the Devil.(1)
1. The Proud/Arrogant One
A. Satan
And when We said to the angels: Make obeisance to Adam they did obeisance, but Iblis (did it not). He refused and he was proud, and he was one of the unbelievers. S. 2:34 Shakir
(Allah) said: “(O Iblis) get down from this (Paradise), it is not for you to be arrogant here. Get out, for you are of those humiliated and disgraced.” S. 7:13 Hilali-Khan
B. Allah hates the Proud and sends them to hell
Assuredly Allah knoweth that which they keep hidden and that which they proclaim. Lo! He loveth not the proud… So enter the gates of hell, to dwell therein for ever. Woeful indeed will be the lodging of the arrogant. S. 16:23, 29 Pickthall
And on the day of resurrection you shall see those who lied against Allah; their faces shall be blackened. Is there not in hell an abode for the proud? S. 39:60 Shakir
C. Allah
It is Allah, except Whom there is no God; the King, the Pure, the Giver of Peace, the Bestower of Safety, the Protector, the Most Honourable, the Compeller, the Proud; Purity is to Allah from all what they ascribe as partners (to Him)! S. 59:23 Faridul Haque
Interestingly, the Arabic word for “the Proud”, Al-Mutakabbir, happens to be one of the ninety-names of Allah:
Al-Mutakabbir: The Supremely Great
Everything which is not Him is insignificant; He is the Great in Majesty or Most Excellent of beings, who has rights which no other possesses, the Possessor of power and excellence the like of which no other has; He who acts are good, exceeding the good acts of any other; the Majestic; He who disdains having the attributes of created beings; He who magnifies Himself against the proud among His creatures.
Al-Mutakabbir is one of the Ninety-Nine Names. (Aisha Bewley, Divine Names)
Now this puts Muslims in a dilemma since this basically means that Allah must not love himself, and has no choice but to punish himself in hell if he is going to be consistent. Note how this logically works out:
a. Allah hates all the proud and casts them into hell.
b. Allah is proud, in fact the most proud of them all.
c. Therefore, Allah must hate himself and will eventually cast himself into hell.
2. The Seducer/Perverter
A. Satan
Recite to them the history of him to whom we vouchsafed our signs, and who departed from them, so that Satan followed him, and he became one of the seduced. S. 7:175 Rodwell
[Eblis] said, by thy might [do I swear], I will surely seduce them all, S. 38:82 Rodwell
B. Allah sends all seducers/perverts to hell
Verily [as to] my servants, thou shalt have no power over them; but [over] those only who shall be seduced, and who shall follow thee. And hell is surely denounced unto them all: S. 15:42-43 Sale
But they were succeeded by an evil posterity who neglected the prayer, and followed [their base] appetites. So they will soon encounter [the reward of] perversity, S. 19:59 Ali Quli Qara’i
And hell will appear plainly to the erring. And it will be said unto them: Where is (all) that ye used to worship Instead of Allah? Can they help you or help themselves? Then will they be hurled therein, they and the seducers And the hosts of Iblis, together. S. 26:91-95 Pickthall
And those against whom the sentence is due shall say, ‘Our Lord! these are those whom we have seduced; we seduced them as we were seduced ourselves: but we clear ourselves to thee;- they, did not worship us!’ S. 28:63 Palmer
So our Lord’s Word is realised against us; we are tasting it. Therefore we perverted you, and we ourselves were perverts.’ So all of them on that day are sharers in the chastisement. S. 37:31-33 Arberry
C. Allah
[The devil] said, because thou hast depraved me, I will lay wait for [men] in thy strait way; S. 7:16 Sale
And my sincere counsel will not profit you, if I desire to counsel you sincerely, if God desires to pervert you; He is your Lord, and unto Him you shall be returned.’ S. 11:34 Arberry
Said he, ‘My Lord, for Thy perverting me I shall deck all fair to them in the earth, and I shall pervert them, all together, S. 15:39 Arberry
Just as we saw with the previous name/characteristic, the Quran’s teaching at this point again places Muslims in a dilemma. Since Allah assigns all seducers/perverters to fiery torment, this again means that he must also punish himself in hell as well. Note again the logic behind this argument:
a. Allah sends all seducers/perverts to hell.
b. Allah seduces and perverts people.
c. Therefore, Allah has to cast himself into hell if he is to be true to himself and faithful to his own laws.
Here is my second post proving from the Quran that your Allah is Satan since they are one and the same.
3. The Schemer/Beguiler
A. Satan
Those who believe fight in the cause of God, and those who reject Faith Fight in the cause of Evil: So fight ye against the friends of Satan: feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan. S. 4:76 Y. Ali
B. Allah
and I respite them — assuredly My guile is sure. S. 7:183 Arberry
First, he searched the baggage of others. Then came to his brother and produced it (peg) from his baggage! Thus, We played a trick on them, and found an excuse for Yusuf. The law of the king did not allow Yusuf to keep his brother! We elevate in status, whomever We please! And over all those with knowledge, there is the One Who is the all-Knowing!” S. 12:76 Dr. Munir Munshey
“… In that way We devised a cunning scheme for Yusuf…” Aisha Bewley
So leave Me with him who cries lies to this discourse! We will draw them on little by little whence they know not; and I shall respite them — assuredly My guile is sure. S. 68:44-45 Arberry
surely it is a decisive word; it is no merriment. They are devising guile, and I am devising guile. Arberry
4. The Deceiver/Conniver
A. Satan
Amazingly, the Quran never employs the specific Arabic words meaning deceiver/conniver, e.g., makara and khada, for Satan.
B. Allah
Shockingly, even though it never uses these particular terms in reference to Satan the Quran does, however, repeatedly employ them in respect to the Muslim deity!
Verily, the hypocrites seek to deceive God, but He deceives them; and when they rise up to pray, they rise up lazily to be seen of men, and do not remember God, except a few; S. 4:142 Palmer
And they deceived a deception, and we deceived a deception. And they did not feel. S. 27:50 The Generous Qur’an (GQ)
In fact, the Islamic scripture even goes as far as to describe Allah as the best deceiver/conniver of them all!
And they deceived, and Allah deceived. And Allah is the best deceiver. S. 3:54 GQ – cf. Q. 8:30
What makes this all the more shocking is that the Muslim scripture not only emphatically proclaims that all deception belongs to Allah,
And indeed, those before them deceived, so to Allah [belongs] all the deception. He knows what every soul earns, and the infidels will know to whom is the reward of the final home. S. 13:42 GQ
It further emphasizes that the only ones who think that they can ever be safe or secure from Allah’s deception are the unbelievers!
Are they secure from the deception of Allah? So no one can be secure from the deception of Allah except the losing people. S. 7:99 GQ
This means that the believers know better than to ever trust Allah enough to feel secure from his ever deceiving and misleading them. This brings us to our next point.
5. The Misleader/The one who leads people astray
A. Satan
And he entered the city at a time of carelessness of its folk, and he found therein two men fighting, one of his own caste, and the other of his enemies; and he who was of his caste asked him for help against him who was of his enemies. So Moses struck him with his fist and killed him. He said: This is of the devil’s doing. Lo! he is an enemy, a mere misleader. S. 28:15 Pickthall
B. Allah
Then what is the matter with you that you are divided into two parties about the hypocrites? Allah has cast them back (to disbelief) because of what they have earned. Do you want to guide him whom Allah has made to go astray? And he whom Allah has made to go astray, you will never find for him any way (of guidance). S. 4:88 Hilali-Khan
And whomsoever Allah wills to guide, He opens his breast to Islam, and whomsoever He wills to send astray, He makes his breast closed and constricted, as if he is climbing up to the sky. Thus Allah puts the wrath on those who believe not. S. 6:125 Hilali-Khan
And We sent not a Messenger except with the language of his people, in order that he might make (the Message) clear for them. Then Allah misleads whom He wills and guides whom He wills. And He is the All-Mighty, the All-Wise. S. 14:4 Hilali-Khan
If you (O Muhammad) covet for their guidance then verily Allah guides not those whom He makes to go astray (or none can guide him whom Allah sends astray). And they will have no helpers. S. 16:37 Hilali-Khan
6. The Tempter/Enticer
A. Satan
Children of Adam! Let not Satan tempt you as he brought your parents out of the Garden, stripping them of their garments to show them their shameful parts. Surely he sees you, he and his tribe, from where you see them not. We have made the Satans the friends of those who do not believe. S. 7:27 Arberry
Said, “Get out of here! Hell is the just recompense, a plentiful penalty for both _ you and those of them who follow you. Tempt and allure them _ anyone among them you can _ with your sly talk. Raid them with your horses and men, bamboozle a share in their wealth and children, and hold out (false) promises for them.” Surely Shaitan’s promise is nothing but an illusion. S. 17:63-64 Munshey
B. Allah
Do you not notice? WE SEND the Shaitans upon the disbelievers, and they continually incite and instigate them. S. 19:83 Munshey
That HE MAY MAKE that which the devil proposeth a temptation for those in whose hearts is a disease, and those whose hearts are hardened – Lo! the evil-doers are in open schism – S. 22:53 Pickthall
indeed ate food and walked in the markets. And We have made some of you to be a temptation for (some) others. “Will you (endure) patiently?” And your Lord
Here is the final part proving that Allah and Satan are identical.
7. The one who makes people filthy and unclean
A. Satan
Oh you who believe! The liquor (and all intoxicants), the games of chance, idols (and shrines), and all divining devices _ (lots, cards, dices, crystal balls) _ are the filthy handiwork of Shaitan, stay away from them, so that you may succeed. In fact, by means of intoxicants and gambling, Shaitan seeks to sow hatred and hostility among you, and seeks to keep you from the remembrance of Allah and the ‘salat’. So, will you quit (these vices) now? S. 5:90-91 Munshey
B. Allah
Allah unlocks and exposes to Islam the heart of the one whom He wishes to guide. (Conversely) He constricts and squeezes the heart of the one whom He wishes to mislead _ squeezes it so hard, he feels as if he was surging up in the sky. Thus, Allah lobs filth upon those who do not believe! S. 6:125
No soul can believe except with Allah’s permission! And He hurls filth upon those who refuse to think and pay attention! S. 10:100 Munshey
8. The one who commands people to commit indecencies/lewdness
A. Satan
Satan threatens you with poverty and enjoins upon you what is foul, whereas ALLAH promises you forgiveness from Himself and bounty. And ALLAH is Bountiful, All-Knowing. S. 2:268 Sher Ali
O ye who believe! Follow not the footsteps of the devil. Unto whomsoever followeth the footsteps of the devil, lo! he commandeth filthiness and wrong. Had it not been for the grace of Allah and His mercy unto you, not one of you would ever have grown pure. But Allah causeth whom He will to grow. And Allah is Hearer, Knower. S. 24:21 Pickthall
B. Allah
And WE DECREED for the Children of Israel in the Scripture: Ye verily will work corruption in the earth twice, and ye will become great tyrants. S. 17:4 Pickthall
And when We desire to destroy a city, We command its men who live at ease, and they commit ungodliness therein, then the Word is realized against it, and We destroy it utterly. S. 17:16 Arberry
9. The one who makes evil deeds seem fair and enticing
A. Satan
When the suffering reached them from us, why then did they not learn humility? On the contrary their hearts became hardened, and Satan made their (sinful) acts seem alluring to them. S. 6:43 Y. Ali
By Allah, We verily sent messengers unto the nations before thee, but the devil made their deeds fairseeming unto them. So he is their patron this day, and theirs will be a painful doom. S. 16:63 Pickthall
B. Allah
As to those who believe not in the Hereafter, We have made their deeds pleasing in their eyes; and so they wander about in distraction. S. 27:4 Y. Ali
Is he, then, to whom the evil of his deeds made fairseeming, so that he considers it as good (equal to one who is rightly guided)? Verily, Allah sends astray whom He wills, and guides whom He wills. So destroy not yourself (O Muhammad) in sorrow for them. Truly, Allah is the All-Knower of what they do! S. 35:8 Hilali-Khan
10. The Wrathful/He who brings wrath
A. Satan
When sleep covers you, it is assurance from him, and he sent down water from the heaven on you to purify you by it and cause the wrath of Satan to pass from you, and that he might tie on your heart and strengthen by it the feet. S. 8:11 GQ
B. Allah
But those who did wrong changed the word which had been told them for another saying, and We sent down upon the evil-doers wrath from heaven for their evil-doing. S. 2:59 Pickthall
He said: “Punishment and wrath have already come upon you from your Lord: dispute ye with me over names which ye have devised – ye and your fathers,- without authority from God? then wait: I am amongst you, also waiting.” S. 7:71 Y. Ali
But those of them who did wrong changed the word which had been told them for another saying, and We sent down upon them wrath from heaven for their wrongdoing. S. 7:162 Pickthall
11. He who causes people to forget
A. Satan
When you come across people who speak with scorn about Our revelations, turn away from them until they move on to another topic. If Satan should make you forget, then, when you have remembered, do not sit with those who are doing wrong. S. 6:68 Abdel Haleem
B. Allah
Any revelation We cause to be superseded or forgotten, We replace with something better or similar. Do you [Prophet] not know that God has power over everything? S. 2:106 Abdel Haleem
S. We shall make thee read (O Muhammad) so that thou shalt not forget Save that which Allah willeth. Lo! He knoweth the disclosed and that which still is hidden; 87:6-7 Pickthall
12. The one who inspires men
A. Satan/Devils
And eat not of that whereon Allah’s name hath not been mentioned, for lo! it is abomination. Lo! the devils do inspire their minions to dispute with you. But if ye obey them, ye will be in truth idolaters. S. 6:121 Pickthall
We have sent no messenger or apostle before you with whose recitations Satan did not tamper. Yet God abrogates what Satan interpolates; then He confirms His revelations, for God is all-knowing and all-wise. S. 22:52 Ahmed Ali
Here is how another version translates this verse:
We have sent no apostle, or prophet, before thee, but, when he read, Satan suggested some error in his reading. But God shall make void that which Satan hath suggested: Then shall God confirm his signs; for God is knowing and wise. Sale
B. Allah
And We sent not (as Our messengers) before thee other than men, whom We inspired. Ask the followers of the Reminder if ye know not? S. 21:7 Pickthall
Concluding Remarks
The striking, in fact shocking, similarities between Allah and the Devil leave Muslims with one of the following options. Either Satan desires to mimic the Islamic deity in an attempt to get people to think that he is actually Allah himself. Or Allah is simply the Devil masquerading as the true God of Abraham. This means that the Satan which the Quran warns Muslims of is nothing other than a counterfeit, a decoy which the arch-enemy of God set up in order to dupe Muslims into thinking that he and the Allah who inspired Muhammad could not possibly be one and the same individual. After all, how could the Muslim deity be Satan when the Quran goes out of its way to condemn him as a foe that Muslims must avoid at all costs?
As far as the Holy Bible is concerned, there can be doubt whatsoever that the true source of Muhammad’s revelations was not the God revealed in the Person of the Lord Jesus Christ. After all, the Quran plainly denies that Muhammad’s deity is a father to anyone,
And they say: The Beneficent hath taken unto Himself a son. Assuredly ye utter a disastrous thing Whereby almost the heavens are torn, and the earth is split asunder and the mountains fall in ruins, That ye ascribe unto the Beneficent a son, When it is not meet for (the Majesty of) the Beneficent that He should choose a son. There is none in the heavens and the earth but cometh unto the Beneficent as a slave. S. 19:88-93 Pickthall
And curses anyone who would claim that Christ is the Son of Allah:
And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they! S. 9:30 Pickthall
As such, this identifies Muhammad one of the antichrists that the God-breathed Scriptures warns true believers about,
“Little children, it is the last hour. As you have heard that the antichrist will come, even now there are many antichrists. By this we know that it is the last hour… Who is a liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? Whoever denies the Father and the Son is the antichrist. No one who denies the Son has the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father.” 1 John 2:18, 22-23
Which in turn makes the spirit that spoke to and through Muhammad the spirit of antichrist, e.g., the Devil himself.
So flyinghourilover, I again want to thank you for allowing me to muzzle you and to expose Muhammad by placing him under the sandals of the blessed Apostle Paul, the slave of the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer. Much appreciated! 😉
Now with that said, I do must return to more important matters such as writing more rebuttals and doing more teaching sessions exposing your wicked profit and glorifying the Lord Jesus, your Master and Muhammad’s Judge.
Fat boy? You must be talking about your profit and his wife Sauda, whom the hadiths describe as being fat obese pigs. Enjoy!
Narrated AbuBarzah: AbdusSalam ibn AbuHazim AbuTalut said: I saw AbuBarzah who came to visit Ubaydullah ibn Ziyad. Then a man named Muslim who was there in the company mentioned it to me. When Ubaydullah saw him, he said: This Muhammad of yours is a dwarf and fat. The old man (i.e. AbuBarzah) understood it. So he said: I did not think that I should remain among people who would make me feel ashamed of the company of Muhammad. Thereupon Ubaydullah said: The company of Muhammad is a honour for you, not a disgrace. He added: I called for you to ask about the reservoir. Did you hear the Apostle of Allah mentioning anything about it? AbuBarzah said: Yes, not once, twice, thrice, four times or five times. If anyone believes it, may Allah not supply him with water from it. He then went away angrily. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 40, Number 4731: http://www.searchtruth.com/book_display.php?book=40&translator=3&start=0&number=4731)
Now let’s see what the hadiths say about one of your mothers being a fat porker:
Narrated Aisha:
Sauda (the wife of the Prophet) went out to answer the call of nature after it was made obligatory (for all the Muslims ladies) to observe the veil. SHE WAS A FAT HUGE LADY, and everybody who knew her before could recognize her. So ‘Umar bin Al-Khattab saw her and said, “O Sauda! By Allah, you cannot hide yourself from us, so think of a way by which you should not be recognized on going out. Sauda returned while Allah’s Apostle was in my house taking his supper and a bone covered with meat was in his hand. She entered and said, “O Allah’s Apostle! I went out to answer the call of nature and ‘Umar said to me so-and-so.” Then Allah inspired him (the Prophet) and when the state of inspiration was over and the bone was still in his hand as he had not put in down, he said (to Sauda), “You (women) have been allowed to go out for your needs.” (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 318)
Now we see how your wicked profit wanted to divorce and dump her. Being a fat obese porker, Sauda wasn’t attractive to him anymore since his sexual lust and perversion lay in sleeping with a minor who was still playing with her dollS
So what was that about being fat ya ibn muta?
Man it really must suck trying to defend your vile wicked demonized profit!
Blogging Theology 
I’m not convinced Aisha (ra) was 9 when she married the Prophet (saw). Ages of people seem to be exaggerated in the early Islamic sources. For instance, Abu Afak was 120 years old which seems highly implausible given the mortality rate in 7th century Arabia; similarly, Khadija (ra) was 40 when she married the Prophet which seems implausible due to the low likelihood of being able to concieve past 50, and she bore him many daughters!
The young age of Aisha could very well be Sunni propaganda. Casting her as the Prophet’s youngest and favorite wife served as a counter narrative to Shiite polemics.
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There goes KMAK destroying the very foundation of the Quran since by throwing your earliest and supposedly mist reliable traditions under the bus, you have no basis to answer questions concerning the what, why, who, where, when and how of your scripture.
Moreover, care to debate me in my Paltalk room to see if whether Aisha was 9 according to your supposedly best and most reliable sources?
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Doubting Aisha’s age = throwing your earliest and supposedly mist reliable traditions under the bus? You really are an uneducated buffoon.
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KMAK again exposes his illiteracy and that receiving a formal educated was a total waste in your case. Note what he says:
“Doubting Aisha’s age = throwing your earliest and supposedly mist reliable traditions under the bus? You really are an uneducated buffoon.”
Now let me expose who the real uneducated buffoon is.
Since Aisha’s age is found in all your major sources, including your earliest ones, and since all the information you know about your false profit and his “revelations” come from these very same sources, this means that by calling into question the reliability of these authors and compilers concerning Aisha’s age,information which is found in every one of these sources, and deemed to be absolutely reliable by the authors/compilers, then you pretty much destroyed the very foundation of your deen since you have now called into question the ability of these authors/compilers pass on reliable historical information concerning the life and mission of your profit.
Way to go ignoramus!
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Could Shamoun please answer some of my questions:
1. Why did God (Jesus) allow Jacob to give his 7-year-old daughter away in marriage to Shechem?
2. Why didn’t Jesus (God) stop child marriages in Jacob’s time, if it was something he was against, as YOU claim shamoun??
Here in the following article, there is a number of proofs from GENESIS where Jacob gave away her daughter in marriage when she was 7 (SEVEN) YEARS OLD, yes you heard it right.
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/08/02/bible-how-old-was-dinah-when-she-was-married-to-shechem/
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Williams, I am actually writing a rebuttal to Brown exposing the gross lie that Aisha wasn’t a child or that she was mature enough to have sex with a 54 year old man.
Do you really want to justify a 54 year old man having sex with a 9 tear old minor still playing with her dolls and on swings?
Narrated Aisha:
The Prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six (years). We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Bani-al-Harith bin Khazraj. Then I got ill and my hair fell down. Later on my hair grew (again) and my mother, Um Ruman, came to me WHILE I WAS PLAYING IN A SWING WITH SOME OF MY GIRL FRIENDS. She called me, and I went to her, not knowing what she wanted to do to me. She caught me by the hand and made me stand at the door of the house. I was breathless then, and when my breathing became all right, she took some water and rubbed my face and head with it. Then she took me into the house. There in the house I saw some Ansari women who said, “Best wishes and Allah’s Blessing and a good luck.” Then she entrusted me to them and they prepared me (for the marriage). Unexpectedly Allah’s Apostle came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 58, Number 234)
‘A’isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported that Allah’s Apostle (may peace be upon him) married her when she was seven years old, and he was taken to his house as a bride when she was nine, AND HER DOLLS WERE WITH HER; and when he (the Holy Prophet) died she was eighteen years old. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3311)
Really? Come on Williams, you are much better and more moral than this.
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To what extent does playing with dolls preclude one from being physically mature, taking into account the context of 7th century Arabia? Also, to what extent was Muhammad’s relationship with Ayesha wrong?
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Kmak, good questions. Some people will play with dolls way beyond the age of 9
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Sam, I did not actually write the article. I reblogged it.
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I believe That she was 9. However,. Ask any old christian woman in any village in Lebanon!
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Williams, you often really end up disappointing me because you can’t see how stupid some of the questions and arguments offered by Muslims truly are. Take for instance KMAK’s question which you like, which only exposes that he is “an uneducated buffoon” who has no business discussing his religion. Now let help educate this illiterate Muslim wannabe by letting his own scholars explain to him why Aisha playing with dolls PROVES she was a minor, and not a mature girl:
Narrated ‘Aisha:
I used to play with the dolls in the presence of the Prophet, and my girl friends also used to play with me. When Allah’s Apostle used to enter (my dwelling place) they used to hide themselves, but the Prophet would call them to join and play with me. (The playing with the dolls and similar images IS FORBIDDEN, but it was allowed for ‘Aisha at that time, as she was a little girl, NOT YET REACHED THE AGE OF PUBERTY.) (Fateh-al-Bari page 143, Vol.13) (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 73, Number 151)
Here you have the commentary of Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani explaining why Aisha was permitted to play with dolls when Islam prohibits such things. The reason? BECAUSE SHE HADN’T REACHED PUBERTY YET!
Here is another narration showing Aisha wasn’t pubescent yet when Muhammad slept with her:
Narrated ‘Aisha:
The Prophet was screening me with his Rida’ (garment covering the upper part of the body) while I was looking at the Ethiopians who were playing in the courtyard of the mosque. (I continued watching) till I was satisfied. So you may deduce from this event how a little girl (WHO HAS NOT REACHED THE AGE OF PUBERTY) who is eager to enjoy amusement should be treated in this respect. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 163)
So here again we see that Muhammad allowed Aisha to observe things that would be normally forbidden for women BECAUSE SHE WAS A LITTLE GIRL WHO HADN’T REACHED PUBERTY!
I can understand why you wouldn’t know this Williams, but I can’t understand how this “uneducated buffoon” and world class ignoramus wouldn’t know what his own false, wicked religion teaches concerning these things.
Now just to show both of you how repulsive your defense of Muhammad’s marriage to a minor truly is, please let me know if you would be ok with a 54 year old Muslim marrying and having sex with your 9 year old sister or daughter. And I hope you bring up the cultural argument since I will bury that pathetic and stupid defense for your reading pleasure.
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Sam I have no problem with the marriage. If you were consistent with your beliefs you would have no problem either.
How old do historians think Mary was when she married Joseph? TWELVE. And if Joseph was considerably older than Mary as Christian tradition says he was, then you MUST condemn St Joseph for being a child abuser.
So will you be consistent Sam?
Do not disappoint me dude.
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“ow just to show both of you how repulsive your defense of Muhammad’s marriage to a minor truly is, please let me know if you would be ok with a 54 year old Muslim marrying and having sex with your 9 year old sister or daughter”
That has been happening with jews and christians for 1900 years!
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Williams, your arguments go from bad to outright pathetic. Note what you wrote:
BEGIN
i have no problem with the marriage. If you werw consistent with yor beliefs you would nbot either.
How old do historians think Mary was when she married Joseph? TWELVE. And if Joseph was considerably older than Mary as Christian tradition says he was, then you MUST condemn St Joseph for being a child abuser.
END
First, quote a reliable historical source that places Mary’s age at 12.
Second, quote a reliable historical source that says that Joseph was nearly 6 times here age, like we find in the case of your profit. Muhammad was old enough to be Aisha’s great grandfather.
This brings me to my fourth point. Comparing the marriage of a 12 year old girl with someone around her age, and not much older than her, is not the same as a prepubescent 9 year old girl who is still found playing with dolls and swings with other minors marrying a 54 year old man.
Fourth, you claim your profit is a role model for all peoples, in all places, for all times. Therefore, we would expect such a man to abolish cultural practices that are bad and harmful, especially for the psychological, physiological, and emotional well being of young girls. We wouldn’t expect him to enshrine a practice which allows grown men till this very day to marry and have sex with young minors as we find in Quran 65:4 and all the classical commentaries and hadiths that explain this verse:
And if you are in doubt as to the prescribed period for such of your women as have despaired of monthly courses, then know that the prescribed period for them is three months, and also for such AS DO NOT HAVE not have their monthly courses YET.. And as for those who are with child, their period shall be until they are delivered of their burden. And whoso fears ALLAH, HE will provide facilities for him in his affair. S. 65:4 Sher Ali
The surrounding context deals with the issue of the waiting period for divorce, and remarriage. The Quran is telling Muslims to wait for a certain period of time before making the divorce final or deciding to forego it. The Quran exhorts men to wait a period of three months in the case of women who either are no longer menstruating or haven’t even started their menstrual cycles! Thus, Islam permits men to marry prepubescent girls and even divorce them if they so choose!
We find the following narration in Sahih Al-Bukhari:
Narrated Sahl bin Sad:
While we were sitting in the company of the Prophet a woman came to him and presented herself (for marriage) to him. The Prophet looked at her, lowering his eyes and raising them, but did not give a reply. One of his companions said, “Marry her to me O Allah’s Apostle!” The Prophet asked (him), “Have you got anything?” He said, “I have got nothing.” The Prophet said, “Not even an iron ring?” He said, “Not even an iron ring, but I will tear my garment into two halves and give her one half and keep the other half.” The Prophet; said, “No. Do you know some of the Quran (by heart)?” He said, “Yes.” The Prophet said, “Go, I have agreed to marry her to you with what you know of the Qur’an (as her Mahr).” ‘And for those who have no courses (i.e. they are still immature). (65.4) And the ‘Iddat for the girl BEFORE PUBERTY is three months (in the above Verse). (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 63; emphasis ours)
Ibn Kathir writes regarding this verse:
, “The `Iddah is made up of cleanliness and the menstrual period.” So he divorces her while it is clear that she is pregnant, or he does not due to having sex, or since he does not know if she is pregnant or not. This is why the scholars said that there are two types of divorce, one that conforms to the Sunnah and another innovated. The divorce that conforms to the Sunnah is one where the husband pronounces one divorce to his wife when she is not having her menses and without having had sexual intercourse with her after the menses ended. One could divorce his wife when it is clear that she is pregnant. As for the innovated divorce, it occurs when one divorces his wife when she is having her menses, or after the menses ends, has sexual intercourse with her and then divorces her, even though he does not know if she became pregnant or not. There is a third type of divorce, which is neither a Sunnah nor an innovation where one divorces A YOUNG WIFE WHO HAS NOT BEGUN TO HAVE MENSES, the wife who is beyond the age of having menses, and divorcing one’s wife before the marriage was consummated. (Capital emphasis ours)
And:
The `Iddah of Those in Menopause and Those Who do not have Menses
Allah the Exalted clarifies the waiting period of the woman in menopause. And that is the one whose menstruation has stopped due to her older age. Her `Iddah is three months instead of the three monthly cycles for those who menstruate, which is based upon the Ayah in (Surat) Al-Baqarah. [see 2:228] The same for THE YOUNG, WHO HAVE NOT REACHED THE YEARS OF MENSTRUATION…
Ibn Abi Hatim recorded a simpler narration than this one from Ubay bin Ka`b who said, “O Allah’s Messenger! When the Ayah in Surat Al-Baqarah was revealed prescribing the `Iddah of divorce, some people in Al-Madinah said, `There are still some women whose `Iddah has not been mentioned in the Qur’an. There are THE YOUNG, the old whose menstruation is discontinued, and the pregnant.’ Later on, this Ayah was revealed… (Capital emphasis ours)
In fact, didn’t Muhammad abolish the very humane practice of adoption? Therefore, you have no problem with a man who abolishes something so beautiful as a adoption and who then enshrines marriages with young girls!
Finally, you forget the fact that the Quran forbade anyone from marrying any of Muhammad’s widows. This means that Aisha was left husbandless and childless from the age of 18 until her death many years later. And you still have the audacity to believe that your man Muhammad was a mercy for mankind? He was no mercy, but misery since his coming into the world destroyed the lives and mental and spiritual health of countless numbers of human beings, beginning with his own wives.
Shame on you for trying to justify such a filthy, wicked practice.
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“Fourth, you claim your profit is a role model for all peoples, in all places, for all times. ”
Of course! He, also, taught us that the custom and tradition for each time and place are considered if they don’t violate Law of God.
That kind of marriage was very popular, and it was not wrong based on that culture.
Moreover, that’s exactly what christians and jews used to do at that region.
The problem with christians today ( The western ones only), that they are so arrogant that they make the scale for what it is wrong & what it is right on base of their culture.
Dude! your bible as whole does not fit this view!
By the way, Jesus was not a white dude nor did he speak English.
Finally, I encourage you to read the biography of Aisha ( peace be upon her) to see how a great woman she was.
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Shamoun the uneducated clown, here’s a hadith that indicates Aisha(ra) was past her puberty before she consummated her marriage to the Prophet:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
As for Ibn Hajar’s commentary, it is obvious he is attempting to reconcile the contradiction between Aisha playing with dolls and what he knew about the status of dolls in Islam during his time. ‘Aisha played with dolls. But we have been taught that playing with dolls is Haram. Therefore, Aisha must have been prepubescent’.
It didn’t occur to Ibn Hajar that perhaps the Prophet(saw) made an exception for Aisha. In any case, can you tell me to what extent classical jurists have permitted men to consummate marriages to prepubescent wives based on Ibn Hajar’s reading of the Hadith?
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Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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Could Shamoun please answer some of my questions if you can:
1. Why did God (Jesus) allow Jacob to give his 7-year-old daughter away in marriage to Shechem?
2. Why didn’t Jesus (God) stop child marriages in Jacob’s time, if it was something he was against, as YOU claim shamoun??
3. Why do you follow Jesus god, who allowed, permitted these things?
Here in the following article, there is a number of proofs from GENESIS where Jacob gave away her daughter in marriage when she was 7 (SEVEN) YEARS OLD, yes you heard it right.
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/08/02/bible-how-old-was-dinah-when-she-was-married-to-shechem/
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Ahem!
And the elephant in the room is that Sam Shamoun is on record saying the Biblical age of consent is puberty. We have already seen Ezekiel 16 being used as a proof text by a Christian apologist to show the Biblical age of consent is puberty:
…Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, you who were naked and bare. 8 ” ‘Later I passed by, and when I looked at you and saw that you were old enough for love… [taken from Ezekiel 16]
See here for more information on this see:
And in any case, this quote maybe of interest:
“The Bible gives us no information about the age at which girls are married. The practice of marrying the eldest first was not universal (Gn 29:26). On the other hand, it seems certain that girls, and therefore presumably boys too, were married very young; for centuries this has been the custom of the East, and in many places it still obtains to-day.” (De Vaux, R. (1997). Ancient Israel: Its Life and Institutions (John McHugh, trans.). Grand Rapids, Michigan: Wm. B. EerdmansPublishing Co. p. 29)
I would also like to refer the readers to material from the Jesus scholar Geza Vermes, in which he highlights Jewish tradition at the time of Jesus was in fact to use puberty as a biological sign for consummation of marriage.
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Oh Sam I am very very disappointed in you. Surely you can do better? I am just asking you to be consistent. Why do you find that so difficult?
“Sam Shamoun is on record saying the Biblical age of consent is puberty.”
So if a Jewish girl is 10 or 12 years old, you are happy to see her married to an older man.
Dude is the Chicago heat affecting your brain?
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‘Dude is the Chicago heat affecting your brain?’
I think the lack of education affected his brain the most.
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Ahem is right. Concernign Ezekiel 16:4-14, God mentions that the young babe attained the age for lovemaking after her breasts had formed and her pubic hairs had grown, clear signs of puberty. The reason we believe that the reference is to pubic hair is because a) the hair on the head of a girl grows many years before reaching the time of puberty, and b) the connection to nakedness suggests that the exposure of her body parts needed to be covered since it was shameful for them to be exposed for all to see. In other words, there was no shame for the hair of a girl’s head to be uncovered, but exposing one’s pubic hairs would be.
Here is how the English Standard Version renders the above passage:
“I made you flourish like a plant of the field. And you grew up and became tall and arrived at full adornment. Your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. When I passed by you AGAIN and saw you, behold, you were at the age for love, and I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness; I made my vow to you and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Lord GOD, and you became mine.” Ezekiel 16:7-8 ESV
Pay attention to the fact that it is only after the young girl attained maidenhood, puberty, that God passed by again and then proceeded to marry her. God’s spreading the corner of his garment and making a covenant with the young maiden refers to marriage as the following passages indicate:
“A man shall not take his father’s wife so that he will not uncover his father’s skirt.” Deuteronomy 22:30
“He said, ‘Who are you?’ And she answered, ‘I am Ruth your maid. So spread your covering over your maid, for you are a close relative.’” Ruth 3:9
Ruth is asking Boaz to marry her so as to preserve Naomi’s family’s line. Thus, we have a biblical text establishing puberty as the minimum age for marriage.
Man, can’t wait to get this pagan in my room come August 20th! Now check out my next posts.
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Since Yahyaslime likes commentaries here are some for him to chew over as he prepares for his slaughter come August 20th.
16:1ff This message reminded Jerusalem of its former despised status among the Canaanite nations. Using the imagery of a young baby growing TO MATURE WOMANHOOD, God reminded that he raised her from a lowly state to great glory as his bride… (Life Application Study Bible, New American Bible- Updated Edition [Zondervan Grand Rapids, MI, May 2000], p. 1364)
16:6-14 The LORD passes by twice (vv. 6-7, 8-14)… The LORD’s action contrasts with that of the parents. Following ancient Near Eastern custom, the LORD enacts a legal adoption by announcing, literally, “In your blood, live.” The life-giving act, however, is threatened by the nakedness OF POSTPUBESCENT REALITY… The LORD acts to protect the vulnerable young woman WHO IS NOW SEXUALLY MATURE… (The New Interpreter’s Study Bible: New Revised Standard Version With the Apocrypha (Hardcover) [Abingdon Press, May, 2003], p. 1175)
The creative command turned into fact, and the baby grew INTO ADOLESCENCE AND SEXUAL MATURITY, marked by breasts and pubic hair (cf. Isa 7:20)… (Leslie C. Allen, Word Biblical Commentary: Ezekiel 1-19 [Word Book Publishers, Dallas TX 1994], p. 237)
God then cared for the nation and caused it to increase and flourish like sprouts in a field, language reminiscent of the growth of the nation in Egypt as described in Exod 1:7, 12. So she (Israel) prospered until she reached the maturity of womanhood. As a beautiful young woman of marriageable age, she became the wife of Yahweh… (Lamar Eugene Cooper, Sr., New American Commentary: An Exegetical and Theological Exposition of Holy Scripture- NIV Text, Ezekiel [Broadman & Holman Publishers 1994], pp. 169-170)
… The word of the Lord was all it took to turn the field from a place of death (16:5) to a place of life (16:7). Subsequently, she grew up, REACHED SEXUAL MATURITY (16:7), AND ATTAINED AN AGE OF APPROPRIATE FOR MARRIAGE (16:8)…
6. NIV: “You … became the most beautiful of jewels. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew,” should perhaps rather be translated, “You developed the ornament of ornaments [namely] your breasts were formed and your [pubic] hair sprouted.” The point is the physical development THAT ACCOMPANIES THE ONSET OF PUBERTY… (Iain M. Duguid, The NIV Application Commentary: Ezekiel [Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids MI, 1999], p. 210)
… The text chronicles her growth; she flourishes (grows up) “like a sprout (… semah) of the field,” a vegetal simile conventionally an increase in population, but here descriptive of physical maturation. “At full womanhood” (NRSV) is, in Hebrew, “ornament of ornaments” (i.e., the loveliest of ornaments): well-formed and “sprouted” [simmeah] pubic hair. Ezekiel’s double of samah, “to sprout,” v. 7 creates a “a verbal bridge” between the images of vegetal fertility and female puberty… Now Yahweh passes by her again and, seeing THAT SHE HAS REACHED THE AGE FOR SEXUAL LOVEMAKING… spreads the edge (lit., “wing”) of his cloak over her, covering her nakedness… (The New Interpreter’s Bible: A Commentary in Twelve Volumes: Introduction to Prophetic Literature, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Baruch, Letter of Jeremiah, Lamentations, Ezekiel [Abingdon Press, Nashville 2001], Volume VI, pp. 1226-1228)
… It denotes growing to the threshold of maturity and child bearing in a woman… After this there takes place the second occasion of Yahweh’s passing by, introduced verbally exactly like the first. This calls THE MATURE GIRL TO THE FULL HONOR OF WOMANHOOD and to “life” in the full sense… the sovereign freedom of Yahweh, who is wherever he wills to be and who is therefore always present at the right time, is to be seen in this. Yahweh affirms what v. 7 has described, on the basis of what he himself has seen, and does not shrink from the view that he is waiting until the time is ripe. Then he affirms his choice… (Walther Zimmerli, Hermenia, Critical and Historical Commentary on the Bible Series- Ezekiel 1: A Commentary on the Book of the Prophet Ezekiel, Chapters 1-24 [Fortress Press, Philadelphia 1979], pp. 339-340)
A non-Christian Jewish commentary writes regarding 16:6-8:
God wills the abandoned infant to live. She lives ANF GROWS TO PUBERTY… UPON REACHING PUBERTY, SHE IS READY FOR MARRIAGE … (The Jewish Study Bible: Tanakh Translation, Torah, Nevi’im, Kethuvim (Hardcover) [Oxford University Press, October 2003], p. 1069)
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Now let’s see how various translations render Ezekiel 16:7-8.
I made you thrive like plants of the field. You grew up AND MATURED and became very beautiful. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, but you were stark naked. Then I passed by you and saw you, AND YOU WERE INDEED AT THE AGE OF LOVE… Holman Christian Standard Bible
and grow up like a plant of the field. And you grew up and became tall AND ARRIVED AT FULL MAIDENHOOD; your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. When I passed by you again and looked upon you, behold, YOU WERE AT THE AGE OF LOVE… RSV
and grow up like a plant of the field. You grew up and became tall AND ARRIVED AT FULL WOMANHOOD; your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. I passed by you again and looked on you; you were at the age for love… NRSV
You grew and developed, YOU CAME TO THE AGE OF PUBERTY; your breasts were formed, your hair had grown, but you were still stark naked. Again I passed by you and saw that you were now old enough for love… NAB
And I made you grow like the gross of the fields. You developed, you, YOU REACHED MARRIAGEABLE AGE. Your breasts became firm and your hair grew richly, but you were stark naked. New Jerusalem Bible
“I will increase your numbers just like plants growing in the field.” And you did increase, you developed, YOU REACHED PUBERTY, your breasts appeared, and your hair grew long; but you were naked and exposed… Again I passed by you, looked at you and saw that your time had come, the time for love… Complete Jewish Bible
I made you grow like a plant in the field. You grew up, matured, and became a young woman. Your breasts developed, and your hair grew. Yet, you were naked and bare. I went by you again and looked at you. YOU WERE OLD ENOUGH TO MAKE LOVE TO… GOD’s WORD Translation
“Grow up like a plant in the field!” And you did. You grew up. You grew tall AND MATURED AS A WOMAN, full-breasted, with flowing hair. But you were naked and vulnerable, fragile and exposed. I came by again and saw you, SO THAT YOU WERE READY FOR LOVE and a lover… The Message
I caused you [Israel] to multiply as the bud which grows in the field, and you increased and became tall AND YOU CAME TO FULL MAIDENHOOD and beauty; your breasts were formed and your hair had grown, yet you were naked and bare. Now I passed by you again and looked upon you; behold, YOU WERE MATURING AND AT THE TIME FOR LOVE… Amplified Bible
I took care of you, like someone caring for a tender, young plant. You grew up TO BE A BEAUTIFUL WOMAN with perfect breasts and long hair, but you were still naked. When I saw you again, YOU WERE OLD ENOUGH TO HAVE SEX… CEV
YahyaSlime could not have picked a worse example from the OT to condone his wicked profit having sex with a 9 year old minor playing with dolls.
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In light of the foregoing we conclude that the Bible does set forth the acceptable age of marriage. Yahweh’s parable to his people presupposes their prior knowledge and acceptance of the marriageable age being set sometime after a young maiden has attained puberty. Anything before this would be viewed as abnormal and unusual. Extra-biblical sources provide some support for puberty being the marriageable age, that both Jews and Christians have understood this to be the case. For instance, an early Christian writer and Church Father, Clement of Alexandria, wrote:
It is not only fornication, but also the giving in marriage prematurely, that is called fornication; when, so to speak, one not of ripe age is given to a husband, either of her own accord or by her parents. (Clement of Alexandria, IX.-Fragment of the Treatise on Marriage, Early Church Fathers – Ante-Nicene Fathers, Volume II; online edition; bold and underline emphasis ours)
The Mishnah sets the age of maturity for a female at twelve years and six months:
“she won her case in court before she matured [at the age of twelve years and six months], lo, they belong to the father.” Mishnah Ketubot, 4:1.
The Baker Encyclopedia of the Bible in volume 2, page 1407, under “Marriage”, states this about Jewish marriage customs:
“Subsequently, MINIMUM AGES ages (for marriage) of 13 for boys and 12 for girls were set.”
Jim West, Th.D., writes in an online article titled, “Ancient Israelite Marriage Customs”:
“The wife was to be taken from within the larger family circle (usually at the ‘outset of puberty’ OR AROUND THE AGE OF 13) in order to maintain the purity of the family line.” (Source)
With that said I am going to quote the Islamic sources proving that Aisha was a minor who hadn’t attained puberty, which means that Muhammad stands condemned for fornicating with a child who was so young that she was still playing with dolls. What makes this disgusting is that none of you see anything wrong with a 54 year old man violating a child in the name of his god. Truly reprehensible.
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Shamoun can write 4 posts in response to Yahyah but not one addressing my latest rejoinder to him. Poor uneducated p.o.s.
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Pathetic attempt by Shamoun as usual. He has no problem with his Jesus (God) allowing and permitting (BIBLE) his soldiers to penetrate (rape) pre-pubescent girls, yet has the cheek to talk about Aisha’s marriage:
TWO accurate translations which clearly show that the passage only speaks about ‘female children’ are as follows:
Jubilee Bible 2000 – “But all the FEMALE CHILDREN children that have not known a man by lying with him keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Webster’s Bible – “Translation But all the FEMALE CHILDREN that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
https://discover-the-truth.com/2015/10/29/child-marriage-in-the-bible/
Christian scholars say MARRIAGE with pre-pubescent was allowed:
Whedon’s Commentary on the Bible:
Verse 17-18.
The little ones — The object of the command to kill every male was to exterminate the whole nation, the cup of whose iniquity was full. For the righteousness of the mode see Joshua 6:21, note. Every woman who might possibly have been engaged in the licentious worship of Peor was to share the fate of the male children, to preserve Israel from all taint of that abomination. The pure maidens could be incorporated into Israel without peril to the national religion. Joshua 6:23-25, notes. They could not be treated as concubines, since the law against fornication was in full force, (Deuteronomy 22:25-29,) but THEY COULD BE LAWFULLY MARRIED TO THEIR CAPTORS (DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14).
Peter Pett’s Commentary on the Bible:
Numbers 31:18
‘But all the women-children, who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.’ But the young women children were a different matter. THEY COULD BE TAKEN IN MARRIAGE or as servants and would expect to accept the religion of their new husbands or masters. They would gradually be merged into Israel. Compare DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14. They would not feel the same responsibility for blood vengeance which was mainly incumbent on the males.[2]
Notice both commentaries direct readers to READ deuteronomy 21:14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
There you have it, Jesus, who is God of the Old Testament allowed marriage and the rape of pre-pubescent girls. Deuteronomy is about RAPE, this fact is referenced in the following five articles;
1
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/29/deuteronomy-211014-hebrew-word-anah-means-rape/
2
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/deuteronomy-2110-14-soldiers-raped-women/
3
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/hebrew-word-anah-inna-carries-the-meaning-of-rape/
4,
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/biblical-law-forces-rapist-to-marry-victim-anahinna/
5,
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/08/01/rape-in-ezekiel-2211-and-deuteronomy-2114/
GOD willing there will be more articles published how the filthy, made up god Sham-moon worships allows and permits rape all through out the Bible, from the Old Testament to the Testament.
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“The creative command turned into fact, and the baby grew INTO ADOLESCENCE AND SEXUAL MATURITY, marked by breasts and pubic hair”
OK when does that happen for girls scientifically? (10-14)!
http://www.medicinenet.com/puberty/article.htm
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Williams you really should be ashamed and disgusted with yourself for lying through your teeth again about me and for justifying the actions of your perverted profit. Note what you said:
BEGIN
Oh Sam I am very very disappointed in you. Surely you can do better? I am just asking you to be consistent. Why do you find that so difficult?
“Sam Shamoun is on record saying the Biblical age of consent is puberty.”
So if a Jewish girl is 10 or 12 years old, you are happy to see her married to an older man.
Dude is the Chicago heat affecting your brain?
END
Williams, do I need to repost my response here to show you how shamelessly perverted my words? First, show me where I said anything about a 10 year old. Second, my comment regarding the age of 12 was within the context of what Jewish culture deemed to be an appropriate age. Unlike your profit, the Jews required that a girl had to have attained puberty and mature enough to have sex before being married off to someone. And so they came with a range of 12 and half for girls, NOT 9! Nor would they allow marriages with minors who hadn’t had their periods yet, like your false profit did.
Third, I was responding to your claim about Mary being 12, explaining that even if she were twelve this doesn’t mean she married a man 6 times here age. Nor is 12 the same as a 9 year old minor who hadn’t attained puberty having sex with a man old enough to be her grandfather. So I think kissing the black stone and reading the Quran have made you retarded, which is why could shameless misread my comments.
With that said, be a man and answer my questions which conveniently evaded. UNLIKE THE TALMUD, OR RABBINIC JEWS, you believe Muhammad was a man for all peoples at all times. THEREFORE, why didn’t your profit abolish this “cultural” practice of sexually violating minors to immature to have sex if he is supposedly a role model FOR ALL TIMES? Why enshrine and engage in such a vile practice that leaves girls traumatized sexually, emotionally and physiologically? And do you think that Muhammad was right for abolishing adoption, A HUMANE PRACTICE, while enshrining the sexual violation of minors?
Finally, are you ok with your profit leaving his wives husbandless and childless for all the days of their lives? Are you ok with Muhammad leaving Aisha a widow at 18, and being the reason for her remaining without any children, without any man to love her, for years after your false profit’s death?
Now be a man and answer my questions, and stop your tap dance routine.
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Your bible permits to marry a girl who reached her puberty (10-14). That means a pastor in his 60s can marry a girl who is in age of 10.
What’s the result of that permission?
The result that permission has been applied for more than 2000 years by jews and christians.
If you think that you’ve become so ” civilized” to apply that “disgusting teaching” in your bible, it would be your own problem.
I know already that you will be more “civilized” to permit gays’ marriage in the future ,and you will condemn Islam for prohibiting that.
It’s not our problem that you christianized most values of secular products.
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Shamoun why you lying for? the Old Testament allowed pre-pubescent marriages. This is why Rebekah was married off at 3, according to Rashi:
1. Rashi’s commentary on Genesis 25:20 says:
forty years old: For when Abraham came from Mount Moriah, he was informed that Rebecca had been born. Isaac was then thirty-seven years old, for at that time Sarah died, and from the time that Isaac was born until the “Binding” [of Isaac], when Sarah died, were thirty-seven years, for she was ninety years old when Isaac was born, and one hundred and twenty-seven when she died, as it is stated (above 23:1): “The life of Sarah was [a hundred and twenty-seven years.”] This makes Isaac thirty-seven years old, and at that time, Rebecca was born. He waited for her until she would be fit for MARITAL RELATIONS-THREE YEARS-AND THEN MARRIED HER.— [From Gen. Rabbah 57:1
Your lie that they got married at 12 when they hit puberty is not histrically true. Israelite girls (those that followed OT LAW) allowed Pre-pubescent marriages to happen:
Professor Geza Vermes who is well-known and a respected scholar comments that Pre-pubescent girls were allowed to be married.
“…the Greek parthenos could also mean that the girl was young and/or unmarried. In fact, in the Septuagint translation of the Old Testament parthenos was used to render three distinct Hebrew words, ‘Virgin’, ‘girl’ and ‘young woman’. Already Rabbis in the Tannaitic era (first to second century ad) subscribed to further nuances, and there is no reason to think that all these were invented by them. Even the word betulah, which normally means virgo intact, when used by them could carry the laternal sense of bodily immaturity with the consequential inability to conceive. In Rabbinic terminology this type of virginity in a woman ceased with the physical onset of puberty. The Mishnah, the oldest of the rabbinic codes, defines a virgin as a female who ‘has never seen blood even though she is married’ (mNiddah 1:4). The Tosefta, another early Jewish code of law, claims in the name of Rabbi Eliezer ben Hyrcanus (late first century ad) that such a woman would continue to count as a virgin even after she had conceived and borne children without prior menstruation (tNiddah 1:6)! To understand these statements, WE MUST REMEMBER THAT IN THE INTERTESTAMENTAL AND EARLY RABBINIC AGE, PRE-PUBERTY MARRIAGE WAS GENERALLY PERMITTED. In fact rabbis seriously debated whether bloodstains found after the wedding night in nuptial bed of a minor, i.e. a ‘virgin in respect of menstruation’, marked her first period or the consummation of the marriage.”
Reverend Kathryn J. Riss also makes mention that in first century parents married off their daughters who were pre-pubescent to much older men. What is interesting is she does not mention once that Rabbis or anyone higher up in authority speaking against such marriages.
“The longest New Testament passage on marriage is found, not in Ephesians, but in 1 Corinthians chapter 7. In stark contrast to the legal positions and social expectations of the first century, here the rights and responsibilities of man and woman are upheld as equal. Although marriages were arranged by parents, who often ESPOUSED THEIR PRE-PUBESCENT DAUGHTERS TO MUCH OLDER MEN…” [11]
Theological Dictionary of the Old Testament, by G. Johannes Botterweck, Helmer Ringgren and Heinz-Josef Fabry it states,
“One might counter that the expression mohar habbetulot (Ex. 22:16[17]) refers rather to the pretium virginitatis. In this case, the mohar would be compensation to the girl for the loss of her virginity. This explanation, however, is unacceptable, since it proceeds on the assumption that the term betula means ‘virgin.’ This may doubtlessly be the case in many passages, but in joel 1:8, betula thus refers to a married woman who had been ‘possessed’ by her husband (ba’al); betula thus refers to a marriageable girl who was physically able to cope with a man, ‘taking her into his possession.’ Here the term betula says nothing about her virginity. Ex.22:16 (17) (kesep yisqol kemohar hab betulot) can thus be translated ‘he shall weigh out as much silver as is required for marriageable girls.’ In this context we should point out that ancient Hebrew custom did not associate marriageability with puberty. In contrast to the marriageable girl (betula), the…. Alma refers to a girl in puberty capable of conception. GIRLS COULD IN FACT ALREADY BE GIVEN MARRIAGE LONG BEFORE ACTUAL PHYSICAL MATURITY, PERHAPS EVEN AS YOUNG AS FIVE YEARS OLD (CF. LEV. 27:5), AND IT DID HAPPEN THAT MARRIAGES WERE ALREADY CONSUMMATED WITH PREPUBESCENT GIRLS. [12]
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/09/14/bible-child-marriage-in-ancient-israelite-times-paedophilia/
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Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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Salamun alaikum,
Folks, have you all never heard something called “pubertas praecox”?
In addition, people in Arabia grew up and still grow up in a society with strict and very harsh conditions, thus getting mentally more mature in a much younger age, unlike todays western “softened” teenies with good and comfort life conditions, even if you still play with dolls, though.
Furthermore, Aisha (ra) was a very intelligent person, even a female scholar; that’s why I’m wondering why there are no other ones anymore, because remeber, there are only male prophets, but why not also female scholars?
Common, that’s not an Ad-Hoc argumentation at all, just sum up all these things and I hope you will get a proper answer to this “problem”.
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This is from Sam Shamoun:
Williams, thanks for being so cowardly as to block my comments so I can obliterate the lies of KMAK and flyingstonekisser, a.k.a. Discover-The-Paganism-And-Immorality-Of-Muhammad.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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Why is my comment not getting approved br Paul Williams? Here it is again:
Pathetic attempt by Shamoun as usual. He has no problem with his Jesus (God) allowing and permitting (BIBLE) his soldiers to penetrate (rape) pre-pubescent girls, yet has the cheek to talk about Aisha’s marriage:
TWO accurate translations which clearly show that the passage only speaks about ‘female children’ are as follows:
Jubilee Bible 2000 – “But all the FEMALE CHILDREN children that have not known a man by lying with him keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Webster’s Bible – “Translation But all the FEMALE CHILDREN that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
https://discover-the-truth.com/2015/10/29/child-marriage-in-the-bible/
Christian scholars say MARRIAGE with pre-pubescent was allowed:
Whedon’s Commentary on the Bible:
Verse 17-18.
The little ones — The object of the command to kill every male was to exterminate the whole nation, the cup of whose iniquity was full. For the righteousness of the mode see Joshua 6:21, note. Every woman who might possibly have been engaged in the licentious worship of Peor was to share the fate of the male children, to preserve Israel from all taint of that abomination. The pure maidens could be incorporated into Israel without peril to the national religion. Joshua 6:23-25, notes. They could not be treated as concubines, since the law against fornication was in full force, (Deuteronomy 22:25-29,) but THEY COULD BE LAWFULLY MARRIED TO THEIR CAPTORS (DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14).
Peter Pett’s Commentary on the Bible:
Numbers 31:18
‘But all the women-children, who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.’ But the young women children were a different matter. THEY COULD BE TAKEN IN MARRIAGE or as servants and would expect to accept the religion of their new husbands or masters. They would gradually be merged into Israel. Compare DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14. They would not feel the same responsibility for blood vengeance which was mainly incumbent on the males.[2]
Notice both commentaries direct readers to READ Deuteronomy 21:14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
There you have it, Jesus, who is God of the Old Testament allowed marriage and the rape of pre-pubescent girls. Deuteronomy is about RAPE, this fact is referenced in the following five articles in the LINK;
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/08/01/rape-in-ezekiel-2211-and-deuteronomy-2114/
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This is from Sam Shamoun:
Williams, thanks for being so cowardly as to block my comments so I can obliterate the lies of KMAK and flyingstonekisser, a.k.a. Discover-The-Paganism-And-Immorality-Of-Muhammad.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the Arabic. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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FLYINGSTONESMOOCHER is back at it I see, again reading the Holy Bible as if it were his filthy Quran and sunna. So here goes!
Let me once again demolish your filthy gross perversion of Deuteronomy 21:10-14, since you have it confused with your wicked profit raping married women:
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For instance, the following verse permits Muslim men (which includes Muhammad himself) to sleep with married women whom they have taken captive:
Also (prohibited are) women already married, except those whom your right hands possess: Thus hath God ordained (Prohibitions) against you: Except for these, all others are lawful, provided ye seek (them in marriage) with gifts from your property, – desiring chastity, not lust, seeing that ye derive benefit from them, give them their dowers (at least) as prescribed; but if, after a dower is prescribed, agree Mutually (to vary it), there is no blame on you, and God is All-knowing, All-wise. S. 4:24 Y. Ali
Tragically, this did not remain a mere abstraction but was readily put into practice by Muhammad’s sexually craved jihadists:
Abu Sirma said to Abu Sa’id al Khadri: O Abu Sa’id, did you hear Allah’s Messenger mentioning al-‘azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah’s Messenger on the expedition to the Bi’l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing ‘azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah’s Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah’s Messenger, and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3371)
And:
Abu Said al-Khudri said: The apostle of Allah sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain. They met their enemy and fought with them. They defeated them and took them captives. Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Quranic verse, ‘And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess’. That is to say, they are lawful for them when they complete their waiting period. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Volume 2, Number 2150)
This same narration is found in all of the major hadith collections:
Chapter 36. What Has Been Related (About A Man) Who Captures A Slave Woman That Has A Husband, Is It Lawful For Him To Have Relations With Her?
1132. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri narrated: We got some captives on the day of Awtas, and they had husbands among their people. They mentioned that to the Messenger of Allah, so the following was revealed: And women who are already married, except those whom your right hands possess. (Hasan) (English Translation of Jami‘ At-Tirmidhi, Compiled by Imam Hafiz Abu ‘Eisa Mohammad Ibn ‘Eisa At-Tirmidhi, From Hadith No. 544 to 1204, translated by Abu Khaliyl (USA), ahadith edited and referenced by Hafiz Tahir Zubair ‘Ali Za’i [Darussalam Publishers & Distributors, First Edition: November 2007], Volume 2, p. 502; underline emphasis ours)
And:
1137. Jabir bin ‘Abdullah narrated: “We practiced ‘Azl while the Qur’an was being revealed.” (Sahih)
(Abu ‘Eisa said:) The Hadith of Jabir is a Hasan Sahih Hadith. It has been reported from him through other routes.
There are those among the people of knowledge, among the Companions of the Prophet and others, who permitted ‘Azl. Malik bin Anas said: “The permission of the free woman is to be requested for ‘Azl, while the slave woman’s permission need not be requested.” (Ibid., Chapter 39. What Has Been related About ‘Azl, p. 507)
Finally:
(3) 3016. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri said: “On the Day of Awtas, we captured some women who had husbands among the idolaters. SO SOME OF THE MEN DISLIKED THAT, so Allah, Most High, revealed: ‘And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess….’” (Sahih)
[Abu ‘Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan.
(4) 3017. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri said: “we captured some women on the Day of Awtas and they had husbands among their people. That was mentioned to the Messenger of Allah so Allah revealed: ‘…And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess….” (Sahih)
[Abu ‘Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan.
This is how it was reported by Ath-Thawri, from ‘Uthman Al-Batti, from Abu Al-Khalil, from Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri from the Prophet and it is similar. “From Abu ‘Alqamah” is not in this Hadith and I do not know of anyone who mentioned Abu ‘Alqamah in this Hadith except in what Hammam mentioned from Qatadah. Abu Al-Khalil’s name is Salih bin Abi Mariam. (Jami‘ At-Tirmidhi, Volume 5, From Hadith No. 2606 to 3290, Chapter 4. Regarding Surat An-Nisa’, pp. 331-332; capital and underline emphasis ours)
Thus, Muhammad and his deity condoned and encouraged men to virtually rape their female captives whether they were married or not.
Now unless this taqiyyist wants us to believe that such women whose families had just been murdered and (in some cases) whose husbands were still alive would actually consent to having sex with their captors, it should be apparent that the Islamic deity is actually permitting, and even encouraging, rape and adultery in his so-called holy book!
How truly sad and tragic for these women that Muhammad and his god did not share the shame and concern of the jihadists regarding the highly unethical nature of raping captives whose husbands were still alive. Instead, Allah and his messenger rushed to justify such a perverted and heinous crime!
Contrast this filth with what Deuteronomy teaches concerning the issue of female captives:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her.” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
Here we see that, instead of permitting men to rape captive women, the Holy Bible forces the Israelites to marry them if they wanted to have sex with them, and then letting them go free in case of a divorce. This means that the Holy Bible is actually dignifying these women by not allowing them to be treated the way Allah and his “messenger” had them treated, namely like animals. Now this is a command which predates the Quran by approximately 2200 years!
To say that such an injunction was truly shocking and revolutionary for that time period would be a wild understatement, just as the following commentaries illustrate:
“The law focuses on the rights of the woman by stating that the man who marries a female prisoner of war and subsequently becomes dissatisfied with her, for whatever reasons, is not permitted to reduce her to slavery. Such a woman had legal rights in ancient Israel, and moral obligations ensue from the fact that the man initiated a sexual relationship with her. Perhaps the most significant conclusion to draw from this text is the respect for the personhood of a captured woman. A primary concern in the laws of Deut 21–25 is for protecting the poor and vulnerable in society from exploitation on the part of the powerful.” (Duane L. Christensen, Word Biblical Commentary: Deuteronomy 21:10–34:12 [Thomas Nelson Publishers, Nashville, TN 2002], Volume 6b, p. 475; bold emphasis ours)
“Throughout the ancient Mediterranean world, captive women of vanquished peoples were assumed to be the due sexual prerogative of the victors. This law exceptionally seeks to provide for the human rights of the woman who falls into this predicament… the verb ‘inah is also sometimes used for rape, and its employment here astringently suggests that the sexual exploitation of a captive woman, even in a legally sanctioned arrangement of concubinage, is equivalent to rape.” (Robert Alter, The Five Books of Moses: A Translation with Commentary [W. W. Norton & Company, 2008], p. 982; bold emphasis ours)
“The instructions given for the treatment of female captives in Deuteronomy 21:10-14 take it for granted that a conquering army have the right to dispose of the conquered population in any way that it wishes. It is hard for those coming from a different cultural context to see this as anything other than appalling, but this approach would have been unquestioned within the ancient Near East, and we have to see these instructions within that setting. What is remarkable is that although the woman may have had no choice in the matter–the soldier who fancied her has every right to make her this wife–nevertheless her identity as a human being is at least to some extent recognized. She is not to be thrown into the new situation but must be allowed time to mourn for her parents and her past life… Within these oppressive situations the laws are geared to provide at least a level of protection for the women involved… Women who were bought as wives or captured in war and taken as wives could not be sold as slaves or even neglected (Ex 21.11; Deut 21.14).” (The IVP Women’s Bible Commentary, eds. Catherine Clark Kroeger & Mary J. Evans [InterVarsity Press, Downers Grove, IL 2002], pp. 100, 102)
“The space given for weeping is not primarily a period of mourning (though it is perhaps to be assumed that the woman’s father has died in the herem; 20:13, 15). Rather, it is given in compassionate consideration of the large adjustment she must make, and the accompanying trauma. It is an acknowledgment, too, that her former life is ended and a new life is to begin (cf. Ps. 45:10). The hints of compassion breaking through the brutality of the age reflect an awareness of divine compassion, however limited by the thought climate of the times.” (Ian Cairns, Word and Presence: A Commentary on the book of Deuteronomy (International Theological Commentary), [William B. Eerdmans Publishing Co., Grand Rapids, MI 1992], p. 189; bold emphasis ours)
For more on the humanitarian nature of this OT passage we recommend the following article: A note on the humanitarian character of Deut 21.10-14.
Unfortunately, there’s more to the story. The so-called sound ahadith report that Muhammad taught that Allah has predestined the amount of adultery a person must necessarily commit:
Narrated Ibn ‘Abbas:
I did not see anything so resembling minor sins as what Abu Huraira said from the Prophet, who said, “Allah has written for the son of Adam his INEVITABLE share of adultery whether he is aware of it or not: The adultery of the eye is the looking (at something which is sinful to look at), and the adultery of the tongue is to utter (what it is unlawful to utter), and the innerself wishes and longs for (adultery) and the private parts turn that into reality or refrain from submitting to the temptation.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 77, Number 609)
Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he OF NECESSITY MUST COMMIT (or there would be no escape from it). (Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421; see also Number 6422)
In other words, these Muslims were only carrying out the very sexual filth which their god had predestined for them!
END
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And here is my demolition of his butchering of the word ana. This isn’t anything. Watch what I am going to do with your shame piece on Q. 9:29 which I am nearly finished with it. Like I said, everytime you lie through your teeth in the name of the jinn you worship and his profit I will take it out on Muhammad. So enjoy!
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To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
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FLYINGSTONESMOTHERER, enjoy!
What the readers of our site may not know is that the Holy Bible makes a reference to the general age of a girl considered for marriage. The reference is found in a parable where God likens Israel to a baby girl whom Yahweh took in and then eventually married. The parable proceeds to liken Israel’s dabble with idolatry to a wife who commits adultery and prostitution.
Not only does this specific parable present the marriageable age of a girl, the parable also assumes that this is a fact that was already well known and observed by the peoples, specifically Israel.
“On the day you were born your cord was not cut, nor were you washed with water to make you clean, nor were you rubbed with salt or wrapped in cloths. No one looked on you with pity or had compassion enough to do any of these things for you. Rather, you were thrown out into the open field, for on the day you were born you were despised. Then I passed by and saw you kicking about in your blood, and as you lay there in your blood I said to you, ‘Live!’ I made you grow like a plant of the field. You grew up and developed and became the most beautiful of jewels. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, you who were naked and bare. Later I passed by, and when I looked at you and saw that you were old enough for love, I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness. I gave you my solemn oath and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Sovereign LORD, and you became mine. I bathed you with water and washed the blood from you and put ointments on you. I clothed you with an embroidered dress and put leather sandals on you. I dressed you in fine linen and covered you with costly garments. I adorned you with jewelry: I put bracelets on your arms and a necklace around your neck, and I put a ring on your nose, earrings on your ears and a beautiful crown on your head. So you were adorned with gold and silver; your clothes were of fine linen and costly fabric and embroidered cloth. Your food was fine flour, honey and olive oil. You became very beautiful and rose to be a queen. And your fame spread among the nations on account of your beauty, because the splendor I had given you made your beauty perfect, declares the Sovereign LORD.” Ezekiel 16:4-14
God mentions that the young babe attained the age for lovemaking after her breasts had formed and her pubic hairs had grown, clear signs of puberty. The reason we believe that the reference is to pubic hair is because a) the hair on the head of a girl grows many years before reaching the time of puberty, and b) the connection to nakedness suggests that the exposure of her body parts needed to be covered since it was shameful for them to be exposed for all to see. In other words, there was no shame for the hair of a girl’s head to be uncovered, but exposing one’s pubic hairs would be.
Here is how the English Standard Version renders the above passage:
“I made you flourish like a plant of the field. And you grew up and became tall and arrived at full adornment. Your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. When I passed by you AGAIN and saw you, behold, you were at the age for love, and I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness; I made my vow to you and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Lord GOD, and you became mine.” Ezekiel 16:7-8 ESV
Pay attention to the fact that it is only after the young girl attained maidenhood, puberty, that God passed by again and then proceeded to marry her. God’s spreading the corner of his garment and making a covenant with the young maiden refers to marriage as the following passages indicate:
“A man shall not take his father’s wife so that he will not uncover his father’s skirt.” Deuteronomy 22:30
“He said, ‘Who are you?’ And she answered, ‘I am Ruth your maid. So spread your covering over your maid, for you are a close relative.’” Ruth 3:9
Ruth is asking Boaz to marry her so as to preserve Naomi’s family’s line.
“And this second thing you do. You cover the LORD’s altar with tears, with weeping and groaning because he no longer regards the offering or accepts it with favor from your hand. But you say, ‘Why does he not?’ Because the LORD was witness between you and the wife of your youth, to whom you have been faithless, though she is your companion and your wife by covenant. Did he not make them one, with a portion of the Spirit in their union? And what was the one God seeking? Godly offspring. So guard yourselves in your spirit, and let none of you be faithless to the wife of your youth. ‘For the man who hates and divorces, says the LORD, the God of Israel, covers his garment with violence, says the LORD of hosts. So guard yourselves in your spirit, and do not be faithless.’” Malachi 2:13-16
Thus, we have a biblical text establishing puberty as the minimum age for marriage.
More in the next post.
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I am continue from where I left off. Pay careful attention flyinghourisnatcher!
At this point I am going to quote various translations and commentaries in order to solidify that the Holy Bible, unlike the trash you call the Quran and sunna, only allows marriages with sexually mature women.
Bible Translations
16:1ff This message reminded Jerusalem of its former despised status among the Canaanite nations. Using the imagery of a young baby growing TO MATURE WOMANHOOD, God reminded that he raised her from a lowly state to great glory as his bride… (Life Application Study Bible, New American Bible- Updated Edition [Zondervan Grand Rapids, MI, May 2000], p. 1364)
16:6-14 The LORD passes by twice (vv. 6-7, 8-14)… The LORD’s action contrasts with that of the parents. Following ancient Near Eastern custom, the LORD enacts a legal adoption by announcing, literally, “In your blood, live.” The life-giving act, however, is threatened by the nakedness OF POSTPUBESCENT REALITY… The LORD acts to protect the vulnerable young woman WHO IS NOW SEXUALLY MATURE… (The New Interpreter’s Study Bible: New Revised Standard Version With the Apocrypha (Hardcover) [Abingdon Press, May, 2003], p. 1175)
The creative command turned into fact, and the baby grew INTO ADOLESCENCE AND SEXUAL MATURITY, marked by breasts and pubic hair (cf. Isa 7:20)… (Leslie C. Allen, Word Biblical Commentary: Ezekiel 1-19 [Word Book Publishers, Dallas TX 1994], p. 237)
God then cared for the nation and caused it to increase and flourish like sprouts in a field, language reminiscent of the growth of the nation in Egypt as described in Exod 1:7, 12. So she (Israel) prospered until she reached the maturity of womanhood. As a beautiful young woman of marriageable age, she became the wife of Yahweh… (Lamar Eugene Cooper, Sr., New American Commentary: An Exegetical and Theological Exposition of Holy Scripture- NIV Text, Ezekiel [Broadman & Holman Publishers 1994], pp. 169-170)
… The word of the Lord was all it took to turn the field from a place of death (16:5) to a place of life (16:7). Subsequently, she grew up, REACHED SEXUAL MATURITY (16:7), AND ATTAINED AN AGE OF APPROPRIATE FOR MARRIAGE (16:8)…
6. NIV: “You … became the most beautiful of jewels. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew,” should perhaps rather be translated, “You developed the ornament of ornaments [namely] your breasts were formed and your [pubic] hair sprouted.” The point is the physical development THAT ACCOMPANIES THE ONSET OF PUBERTY… (Iain M. Duguid, The NIV Application Commentary: Ezekiel [Zondervan Publishing House, Grand Rapids MI, 1999], p. 210)
… The text chronicles her growth; she flourishes (grows up) “like a sprout (… semah) of the field,” a vegetal simile conventionally an increase in population, but here descriptive of physical maturation. “At full womanhood” (NRSV) is, in Hebrew, “ornament of ornaments” (i.e., the loveliest of ornaments): well-formed and “sprouted” [simmeah] pubic hair. Ezekiel’s double of samah, “to sprout,” v. 7 creates a “a verbal bridge” between the images of vegetal fertility and female puberty… Now Yahweh passes by her again and, seeing THAT SHE HAS REACHED THE AGE FOR SEXUAL LOVEMAKING… spreads the edge (lit., “wing”) of his cloak over her, covering her nakedness… (The New Interpreter’s Bible: A Commentary in Twelve Volumes: Introduction to Prophetic Literature, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Baruch, Letter of Jeremiah, Lamentations, Ezekiel [Abingdon Press, Nashville 2001], Volume VI, pp. 1226-1228)
… It denotes growing to the threshold of maturity and child bearing in a woman… After this there takes place the second occasion of Yahweh’s passing by, introduced verbally exactly like the first. This calls THE MATURE GIRL TO THE FULL HONOR OF WOMANHOOD and to “life” in the full sense… the sovereign freedom of Yahweh, who is wherever he wills to be and who is therefore always present at the right time, is to be seen in this. Yahweh affirms what v. 7 has described, on the basis of what he himself has seen, and does not shrink from the view that he is waiting until the time is ripe. Then he affirms his choice… (Walther Zimmerli, Hermenia, Critical and Historical Commentary on the Bible Series- Ezekiel 1: A Commentary on the Book of the Prophet Ezekiel, Chapters 1-24 [Fortress Press, Philadelphia 1979], pp. 339-340)
A non-Christian Jewish commentary writes regarding 16:6-8:
God wills the abandoned infant to live. She lives ANF GROWS TO PUBERTY… UPON REACHING PUBERTY, SHE IS READY FOR MARRIAGE … (The Jewish Study Bible: Tanakh Translation, Torah, Nevi’im, Kethuvim (Hardcover) [Oxford University Press, October 2003], p. 1069)
I got more for you my muta loving friend!
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Here’s more for you, flyingmutalover!
Now let’s see how various translations render Ezekiel 16:7-8.
I made you thrive like plants of the field. You grew up AND MATURED and became very beautiful. Your breasts were formed and your hair grew, but you were stark naked. Then I passed by you and saw you, AND YOU WERE INDEED AT THE AGE OF LOVE… Holman Christian Standard Bible
and grow up like a plant of the field. And you grew up and became tall AND ARRIVED AT FULL MAIDENHOOD; your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. When I passed by you again and looked upon you, behold, YOU WERE AT THE AGE OF LOVE… RSV
and grow up like a plant of the field. You grew up and became tall AND ARRIVED AT FULL WOMANHOOD; your breasts were formed, and your hair had grown; yet you were naked and bare. I passed by you again and looked on you; you were at the age for love… NRSV
You grew and developed, YOU CAME TO THE AGE OF PUBERTY; your breasts were formed, your hair had grown, but you were still stark naked. Again I passed by you and saw that you were now old enough for love… NAB
And I made you grow like the gross of the fields. You developed, you, YOU REACHED MARRIAGEABLE AGE. Your breasts became firm and your hair grew richly, but you were stark naked. New Jerusalem Bible
“I will increase your numbers just like plants growing in the field.” And you did increase, you developed, YOU REACHED PUBERTY, your breasts appeared, and your hair grew long; but you were naked and exposed… Again I passed by you, looked at you and saw that your time had come, the time for love… Complete Jewish Bible
I made you grow like a plant in the field. You grew up, matured, and became a young woman. Your breasts developed, and your hair grew. Yet, you were naked and bare. I went by you again and looked at you. YOU WERE OLD ENOUGH TO MAKE LOVE TO… GOD’s WORD Translation
“Grow up like a plant in the field!” And you did. You grew up. You grew tall AND MATURED AS A WOMAN, full-breasted, with flowing hair. But you were naked and vulnerable, fragile and exposed. I came by again and saw you, SO THAT YOU WERE READY FOR LOVE and a lover… The Message
I caused you [Israel] to multiply as the bud which grows in the field, and you increased and became tall AND YOU CAME TO FULL MAIDENHOOD and beauty; your breasts were formed and your hair had grown, yet you were naked and bare. Now I passed by you again and looked upon you; behold, YOU WERE MATURING AND AT THE TIME FOR LOVE… Amplified Bible
I took care of you, like someone caring for a tender, young plant. You grew up TO BE A BEAUTIFUL WOMAN with perfect breasts and long hair, but you were still naked. When I saw you again, YOU WERE OLD ENOUGH TO HAVE SEX… CEV
In light of the foregoing we conclude that the Bible does set forth the acceptable age of marriage. Yahweh’s parable to his people presupposes their prior knowledge and acceptance of the marriageable age being set sometime after a young maiden has attained puberty. Anything before this would be viewed as abnormal and unusual. Extra-biblical sources provide some support for puberty being the marriageable age, that both Jews and Christians have understood this to be the case. For instance, an early Christian writer and Church Father, Clement of Alexandria, wrote:
It is not only fornication, but also the giving in marriage prematurely, that is called fornication; when, so to speak, one not of ripe age is given to a husband, either of her own accord or by her parents. (Clement of Alexandria, IX.-Fragment of the Treatise on Marriage, Early Church Fathers – Ante-Nicene Fathers, Volume II)
The Mishnah sets the age of maturity for a female at twelve years and six months:
“she won her case in court before she matured [at the age of twelve years and six months], lo, they belong to the father.” Mishnah Ketubot, 4:1.
The Baker Encyclopedia of the Bible in volume 2, page 1407, under “Marriage”, states this about Jewish marriage customs:
“Subsequently, minimum ages (for marriage) of 13 for boys and 12 for girls were set.”
Jim West, Th.D., writes in an online article titled, “Ancient Israelite Marriage Customs”:
“The wife was to be taken from within the larger family circle (usually at the ‘outset of puberty’ or around the age of 13) in order to maintain the purity of the family line.”
The foregoing also puts to rest the slander and false claim that passages such as Numbers 31:17-18 allow men to have sex with young, prepubescent girls, something nowhere stated within the chapter itself. The passage from Ezekiel establishes the point that these young girls could not be touched until they attained the age of puberty, and even then the men had to marry them as the following citation states:
“When you go out to battle against your enemies, and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take them away captive, and see among the captives a beautiful woman, and have a desire for her and would take her as a wife for yourself, then you shall bring her home to your house, and she shall shave her head and trim her nails. She shall also remove the clothes of her captivity and shall remain in your house, and mourn her father and mother a full month; and after that you may go in to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go WHEREVER SHE WISHES; BUT YOU SHALL CERTAINLY NOT SELL HER FOR MONEY, YOU SHALL NOT MISTREAT HER, because you have humbled her.” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
Islam, however, allows for the raping and selling of captive women even if they are married! (Cf. Sura 4:24)
OUCH!
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Williams, thanks for being so cowardly as to block my comments so I as to prevent me from obliterating the lies of KMAK and flyingstonekisser, a.k.a. Discover-The-Paganism-And-Immorality-Of-Muhammad.
Let me further shame and humiliate KMAK for quoting a hadith that mistranslates the text. Note what he cited:
Hadith no: 465
Narrated: Aisha
I had seen my parents following Islam since I attained the age of puberty. Not a day passed but the Prophet visited us, both in the mornings and evenings. My father Abu Bakr thought of building a mosque in the courtyard of his house and he did so. He used to pray and recite the Qur’an in it. The pagan women and their children used to stand by him and look at him with surprise. Abu Bakr was a softhearted person and could not help weeping while reciting the Quran. The chiefs of the Quraish pagans became afraid of that (i.e. that their children and women might be affected by the recitation of Quran).”
Now let me shame this uneducated buffoon who was too afraid to give the full info on the volume and book that this hadith is found in. It is Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 8, Number 465. The meaning of this hadith is clarified in this next one:
“Narrated Aisha: (wife of the Prophet) Since I reached the age WHEN I COULD REMEMBER THINGS, I have seen my parents worshipping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Apostle visited us both in the morning and in the evening…” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 37, Number 494)
Now, here is the good news. Note how Aisha Bewley renders the first hadith:
LII: A mosque should not be built in a thoroughfare if that would be detrimental to people
Al-Hasan, Ayyub and Malik all said this.
464. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I have no recollection of my parents doing anything but following the deen of Islam. No day would pass without the Messenger of Allah visiting us at either end of it, both morning and evening. Then it occurred to Abu Bakr to build a mosque in the forecourt of his house. He used to pray and recite Qur’an in it. The pagan women and children would stand there amazed, staring at him. Abu Bakr was a man who wept easily and could not control his tears when reading the Qur’an and this was a matter of great concern to those nobles of Quraysh who worshipped idols.” (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 11: Mosques: http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0002P0011.aspx; http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari5.html#11)
Now here is how she renders the second narration:
IV: The protection and promise granted to Abu Bakr during the time of the Prophet
2175. It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen.”
It is related that ‘A’isha, the wife of the Prophet, said, “I only remember my parents following the deen. Not a day passed by without the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, coming to us at the two ends of the day, morning and evening… (Bewley, The Sahih Collection of al-Bukhari, Chapter 42: Book of Sureties (Kafala): http://bewley.virtualave.net/bukhari17.html#kafala)
So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Now let me further shame you by using Bukhari again to prove that Aisha WAS A MINOR WHO HADN’T ATTAINED PUBERTY when Muhammad starting having sex with her:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO! This again that Muhammad married her before she reached maidenhood!
And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
Keep up with your stupidity and watch what I do to you.
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Sam and everyone else:
I did not block any of your comments. I was away from the computer and wordpress put them into moderation. I have now approved them all.
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by the way she was earlier engaged to Jubayr bn Mut’ im…
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OOPS! Sorry about that Williams. You now approved of the same post which I sent about 10 different times, trying to see if it would go through. My apologies!
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We look yet again at the Hebrew word ‘anah’ (inna) in relation to Deuteronomy 21:14,
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
The different translations for Deuteronomy 21:14 do not give an accurate portrayal of what happened to the slave-women. The only accurate translation for the verse is from the GNT translation. Nearly every other translation make it out that the slave-women captured in warfare were happily jumping into another man’s bed. Same men (soldiers) who murdered her husband, father, and brothers.
how do we know ANAH means RAPE. Well let’s look at other verses where the exact same word is used:
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/eze/22/11/t_conc_824011
Translations for Ezekiel 22:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“11 One man commits a terrible sin against his own neighbor’s wife. Another man has sex with his daughter-in-law and makes her unclean. Another man RAPES his father’s daughter—his very own sister.” – Ezekiel 22:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“11 One person in you does a hated act with his neighbor’s wife. Another has shamefully violated his daughter-in-law. And another RAPES his half sister.” – Ezekiel 22:11
New Living Translation (NLT)
“11 Within your walls live men who commit adultery with their neighbors’ wives, who defile their daughters-in-law, or who RAPE their own sisters.” – Ezekiel 22:11
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
“11 And ish hath committed to’evah with his neighbor’s isha; and another hath lewdly made tameh his kallah (daughter-in-law); and another in thee hath RAPED his achot, his bat aviv.” – Ezekiel 22:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“11 There are those in you who do abominable things with their neighbors’ wives, men who defile their daughters-in-law by incest, men who COERCE THEIR SISTERS TO INTERCOURSE, the daughters of their own fathers.” – Ezekiel 22:11
New Century Version (NCV)
“11 One man in you does a hateful act with his neighbor’s wife, while another has shamefully made his daughter-in-law unclean sexually. And another FORCES HIS HALF SISTER TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS with him.” – Ezekiel 22:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“11 One man in you does a ·hateful [detestable; abominable] act with his neighbor’s wife, while another has shamefully ·made his daughter-in-law unclean sexually [L defiled his daughter-in-law; C ritually]. And another FORCES HIS HALF SISTER TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS [L violates his father’s daughter] with him [C all forbidden in the Law; Lev. 18:9, 15, 20].” – Ezekiel 22:11
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I know you think that by repeating your crap over and over again, much like Muhammad used to do with the Quran, you actually think you are refuting a person. Therefore, the only cure to your lies and idolatry is to repeat my response to your trash which makes Muhammad look logical over and over again as well. So enjoy!
BEGIN
For instance, the following verse permits Muslim men (which includes Muhammad himself) to sleep with married women whom they have taken captive:
Also (prohibited are) women already married, except those whom your right hands possess: Thus hath God ordained (Prohibitions) against you: Except for these, all others are lawful, provided ye seek (them in marriage) with gifts from your property, – desiring chastity, not lust, seeing that ye derive benefit from them, give them their dowers (at least) as prescribed; but if, after a dower is prescribed, agree Mutually (to vary it), there is no blame on you, and God is All-knowing, All-wise. S. 4:24 Y. Ali
Tragically, this did not remain a mere abstraction but was readily put into practice by Muhammad’s sexually craved jihadists:
Abu Sirma said to Abu Sa’id al Khadri: O Abu Sa’id, did you hear Allah’s Messenger mentioning al-‘azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah’s Messenger on the expedition to the Bi’l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing ‘azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah’s Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah’s Messenger, and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3371)
And:
Abu Said al-Khudri said: The apostle of Allah sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain. They met their enemy and fought with them. They defeated them and took them captives. Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Quranic verse, ‘And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess’. That is to say, they are lawful for them when they complete their waiting period. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Volume 2, Number 2150)
This same narration is found in all of the major hadith collections:
Chapter 36. What Has Been Related (About A Man) Who Captures A Slave Woman That Has A Husband, Is It Lawful For Him To Have Relations With Her?
1132. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri narrated: We got some captives on the day of Awtas, and they had husbands among their people. They mentioned that to the Messenger of Allah, so the following was revealed: And women who are already married, except those whom your right hands possess. (Hasan) (English Translation of Jami‘ At-Tirmidhi, Compiled by Imam Hafiz Abu ‘Eisa Mohammad Ibn ‘Eisa At-Tirmidhi, From Hadith No. 544 to 1204, translated by Abu Khaliyl (USA), ahadith edited and referenced by Hafiz Tahir Zubair ‘Ali Za’i [Darussalam Publishers & Distributors, First Edition: November 2007], Volume 2, p. 502; underline emphasis ours)
And:
1137. Jabir bin ‘Abdullah narrated: “We practiced ‘Azl while the Qur’an was being revealed.” (Sahih)
(Abu ‘Eisa said:) The Hadith of Jabir is a Hasan Sahih Hadith. It has been reported from him through other routes.
There are those among the people of knowledge, among the Companions of the Prophet and others, who permitted ‘Azl. Malik bin Anas said: “The permission of the free woman is to be requested for ‘Azl, while the slave woman’s permission need not be requested.” (Ibid., Chapter 39. What Has Been related About ‘Azl, p. 507)
Finally:
(3) 3016. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri said: “On the Day of Awtas, we captured some women who had husbands among the idolaters. SO SOME OF THE MEN DISLIKED THAT, so Allah, Most High, revealed: ‘And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess….’” (Sahih)
[Abu ‘Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan.
(4) 3017. Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri said: “we captured some women on the Day of Awtas and they had husbands among their people. That was mentioned to the Messenger of Allah so Allah revealed: ‘…And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess….” (Sahih)
[Abu ‘Eisa said:] This Hadith is Hasan.
This is how it was reported by Ath-Thawri, from ‘Uthman Al-Batti, from Abu Al-Khalil, from Abu Sa‘eed Al-Khudri from the Prophet and it is similar. “From Abu ‘Alqamah” is not in this Hadith and I do not know of anyone who mentioned Abu ‘Alqamah in this Hadith except in what Hammam mentioned from Qatadah. Abu Al-Khalil’s name is Salih bin Abi Mariam. (Jami‘ At-Tirmidhi, Volume 5, From Hadith No. 2606 to 3290, Chapter 4. Regarding Surat An-Nisa’, pp. 331-332; capital and underline emphasis ours)
Thus, Muhammad and his deity condoned and encouraged men to virtually rape their female captives whether they were married or not.
Now unless this taqiyyist wants us to believe that such women whose families had just been murdered and (in some cases) whose husbands were still alive would actually consent to having sex with their captors, it should be apparent that the Islamic deity is actually permitting, and even encouraging, rape and adultery in his so-called holy book!
How truly sad and tragic for these women that Muhammad and his god did not share the shame and concern of the jihadists regarding the highly unethical nature of raping captives whose husbands were still alive. Instead, Allah and his messenger rushed to justify such a perverted and heinous crime!
Contrast this filth with what Deuteronomy teaches concerning the issue of female captives:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her.” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
Here we see that, instead of permitting men to rape captive women, the Holy Bible forces the Israelites to marry them if they wanted to have sex with them, and then letting them go free in case of a divorce. This means that the Holy Bible is actually dignifying these women by not allowing them to be treated the way Allah and his “messenger” had them treated, namely like animals. Now this is a command which predates the Quran by approximately 2200 years!
To say that such an injunction was truly shocking and revolutionary for that time period would be a wild understatement, just as the following commentaries illustrate:
“The law focuses on the rights of the woman by stating that the man who marries a female prisoner of war and subsequently becomes dissatisfied with her, for whatever reasons, is not permitted to reduce her to slavery. Such a woman had legal rights in ancient Israel, and moral obligations ensue from the fact that the man initiated a sexual relationship with her. Perhaps the most significant conclusion to draw from this text is the respect for the personhood of a captured woman. A primary concern in the laws of Deut 21–25 is for protecting the poor and vulnerable in society from exploitation on the part of the powerful.” (Duane L. Christensen, Word Biblical Commentary: Deuteronomy 21:10–34:12 [Thomas Nelson Publishers, Nashville, TN 2002], Volume 6b, p. 475; bold emphasis ours)
“Throughout the ancient Mediterranean world, captive women of vanquished peoples were assumed to be the due sexual prerogative of the victors. This law exceptionally seeks to provide for the human rights of the woman who falls into this predicament… the verb ‘inah is also sometimes used for rape, and its employment here astringently suggests that the sexual exploitation of a captive woman, even in a legally sanctioned arrangement of concubinage, is equivalent to rape.” (Robert Alter, The Five Books of Moses: A Translation with Commentary [W. W. Norton & Company, 2008], p. 982; bold emphasis ours)
“The instructions given for the treatment of female captives in Deuteronomy 21:10-14 take it for granted that a conquering army have the right to dispose of the conquered population in any way that it wishes. It is hard for those coming from a different cultural context to see this as anything other than appalling, but this approach would have been unquestioned within the ancient Near East, and we have to see these instructions within that setting. What is remarkable is that although the woman may have had no choice in the matter–the soldier who fancied her has every right to make her this wife–nevertheless her identity as a human being is at least to some extent recognized. She is not to be thrown into the new situation but must be allowed time to mourn for her parents and her past life… Within these oppressive situations the laws are geared to provide at least a level of protection for the women involved… Women who were bought as wives or captured in war and taken as wives could not be sold as slaves or even neglected (Ex 21.11; Deut 21.14).” (The IVP Women’s Bible Commentary, eds. Catherine Clark Kroeger & Mary J. Evans [InterVarsity Press, Downers Grove, IL 2002], pp. 100, 102)
“The space given for weeping is not primarily a period of mourning (though it is perhaps to be assumed that the woman’s father has died in the herem; 20:13, 15). Rather, it is given in compassionate consideration of the large adjustment she must make, and the accompanying trauma. It is an acknowledgment, too, that her former life is ended and a new life is to begin (cf. Ps. 45:10). The hints of compassion breaking through the brutality of the age reflect an awareness of divine compassion, however limited by the thought climate of the times.” (Ian Cairns, Word and Presence: A Commentary on the book of Deuteronomy (International Theological Commentary), [William B. Eerdmans Publishing Co., Grand Rapids, MI 1992], p. 189; bold emphasis ours)
For more on the humanitarian nature of this OT passage we recommend the following article: A note on the humanitarian character of Deut 21.10-14.
Unfortunately, there’s more to the story. The so-called sound ahadith report that Muhammad taught that Allah has predestined the amount of adultery a person must necessarily commit:
Narrated Ibn ‘Abbas:
I did not see anything so resembling minor sins as what Abu Huraira said from the Prophet, who said, “Allah has written for the son of Adam his INEVITABLE share of adultery whether he is aware of it or not: The adultery of the eye is the looking (at something which is sinful to look at), and the adultery of the tongue is to utter (what it is unlawful to utter), and the innerself wishes and longs for (adultery) and the private parts turn that into reality or refrain from submitting to the temptation.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 77, Number 609)
Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he OF NECESSITY MUST COMMIT (or there would be no escape from it). (Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421; see also Number 6422)
In other words, these Muslims were only carrying out the very sexual filth which their god had predestined for them!
END
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And here you go flyingmutalover! Do make sure you enjoy it! And here is my demolition of his butchering of the word ana. This isn’t anything. Watch what I am going to do with your shame piece on Q. 9:29 which I am nearly finished with it. Like I said, everytime you lie through your teeth in the name of the jinn you worship and his profit I will take it out on Muhammad. So enjoy!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Also make sure to read my article on Deuteronomy 22:28-29 which further exposes your profit for the immoral monster he truly was! http://answeringislam.net/Shamoun/ot_and_rape.htm
Ta ta! 😉
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Thank you Williams for allowing me to respond here and expose the pathetic attempts of your fellow Muslims to justify the action of a 54 year old man having sex with a 9 year old minor to immature for sex.
Now I can return to my rebuttals by the grace of the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Judge.
Just to let you know, I just finished a 4 part rebuttal exposing the lies of liars like discover-paganism-of-islam letmeturnthestonesmoochingonmyselfandsmashmyheadwithit who tried to explain away the hadith where Muhammad beat Aisha and hurt her. You will absolutely love that one since these shameless dawagandists deliberately misused Lane’s Lexicon which I will now turn against them and use as an illustration that they have no integrity whatsoever. And watch what I am about to do to flying stone kisser’s pathetic article on Q. 9:29. I am sure he will absolutely love it!
Take care buddy ole’ pal! it was nice chatting with you again.
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Here is a different translation for the exact word ‘anah’, I will expose your pagan Babble. I am no ordinary internet writer, I will find things in the Bible you have never heard of 😛
One of the verses that has been downplayed by Christian apologists as not endorsing or approving ‘rape’ is Deuteronomy 21:10-14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since YOU FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.
They claim that the word ‘anah’ used here doesn’t actually mean ‘ rape’ (forced intercourse). How can we prove that RAPE DID TAKE PLACE? Let’s read another translations for a different verses (with the exact word (anah)):
Lamentations 5:11 has the Hebrew word ‘anah’ same one that is in Deuteronomy 21:14
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/lam/5/11/t_conc_802011
Different TRANSLATIONS for Lamentations 5:11
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/29/deuteronomy-211014-hebrew-word-anah-means-rape/
Translations for Lamentations 5:11
New Living Translation
“Our enemies RAPE THE WOMEN in Jerusalem and the young girls in all the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version (ESV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Standard Version (ISV)
“They have RAPED women in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
NET Bible
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
GOD’S WORD® Translation
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Women have been RAPED in Zion, young women in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“They have RAPED the women of Tziyon, virgins in the cities of Y’hudah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“On Zion and everywhere in Judah our wives and daughters are BEING RAPED.” – Lamentations 5:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“The enemy raped the women of Zion. They RAPED THE WOMEN in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“The enemy [L They] ·ABUSED [VIOLATED; RAPED] the women ·of Jerusalem [L in Zion; C the location of the Temple] and the ·girls [L virgins] in the ·cities [towns] of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Good News Translation (GNT)
“Our wives have BEEN RAPED on Mount Zion itself; in every Judean village our daughters have been forced to submit.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“The ENEMY RAPED the women of Jerusalem and the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“They RAPED women in Zion, young women[a] in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Living Bible (TLB)
“They RAPE the women of Jerusalem and the girls in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Message (MSG)
“Our wives were RAPED in the streets in Zion, and our virgins in the cities of Judah.” Lamentations 5:11
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the cities of Judah…” – Lamentations 5:11
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Voice (VOICE)
“In the place where God should be— Zion and the surrounding towns of Judah— Women, young and old alike, are BRUTALLY RAPED and violated.” – Lamentations 5:11
EVEN THE COMMENTARIES AGREE THAT ANAH MEANS RAPE:
Bridgeway Bible Commentary:
Conditions in Judah are terrible. The people have to search the barren country regions for food, and in doing so they risk death from desert bandits (9-10). Judean WOMEN ARE RAPED, former leaders are tortured, and children are forced to work like slaves (11-13). The old way of life has gone, and with it has gone all celebration and rejoicing (14-15). People everywhere are unhappy, discouraged and ashamed. They acknowledge that their sin has brought all this upon them (16-18). (Bridgeway Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible:
“They ravished the women … the virgins of the cities of Judah” (Lamentations 5:11). This is an accompanying vice of warfare that is just as much a part of modern wars as it was in antiquity. Nothing is more terrible and disgusting than the WHOLESALE RAPE of the women (all of them) by an army of enemies. The bestiality of wicked men unrestrained by any outside force is the utmost in depravity.
(Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable:
“The enemy had RAPED THE WOMEN and girls in Jerusalem and Judah. Respected princes had experienced the most humiliating deaths, and the enemy gave no respect to Judah”s elderly. Since Nebuchadnezzar evidently did not torture his victims (cf. Jeremiah 52:10-11; Jeremiah 52:24-27), it may be that the Chaldeans strung up the princes by their hands-after they had died-to dishonor them (cf. Deuteronomy 21:22-23). [Note: Keil, 2:451.]” (Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable – Lamentations 5:11 – Online source)
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah ( Lamentations 5:11 ).
The enemies had come in. It must have been a horrible thing. The fathers to see their wives and their young daughters ravished by the enemy, RAPED and all and then murdered.” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
American Old Testament scholar and the William Marcellus McPheeters Professor Emerita of Old Testament at Columbia Theological Seminary – Kathleen M. O’Connor:
“Women’s history
As symbolic figures, women convey mixed messages in Lamentations, but when the book speaks of real women, it tells of their history in painful and illuminating ways. The book brings into the open hidden victims of war who suffer long after the war’s end. Some verses mention women’s sufferings alongside those of men and other social groups. Young women have gone into captivity with young men (2:21). Young girls and elders grieve over Zion’s destruction (2:10). Other verses attend specifically to the plight of women. The male speaker grieves over ‘the fate of all the young women in my city’ (3:11). ‘WOMEN ARE RAPED in Zion’ (5:11).” (Women’s Bible Commentary: Expanded Edition [Edited by Carol Ann Newsom, Sharon H. Ringe, WJK – Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1998], by Kathleen M. O’Connor, page 190)
Dr. Charles H. Dyer:
“The first group mentioned who suffered the horrors of foreign occupation were the women of Jerusalem (Zion) and the virgins … of Judah. Women who survived the Babylonian assault on their cities were mercilessly RAPED BY THE SADISTIC SOLDIERS. In a scene of savage brutality, repeated by many conquering armies throughout history, the victors went on a wanton spree of lustful revenge against defenceless women.” (The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition Of the Scriptures By Dallas Seminary Faculty – Old Testament [Editors John F. Walvoord, Roy B. Zuck, 1983] by Charles H. Dyer, page 1222)
Professor of Old Testament David L. Petersen:
The elegant literary construction stands in constrast with the devastating destruction: much will be violated. The book of Lamentations, which reflects the fall of Jerusalem, refers to all three elements, the destruction of the city, presumably its walls (2:8); plundering (1:18) and violation of dwelling places (2:2); WOMEN RAPED (5:11).” (Zechariah 9-14 and Malachi: A Commentary [Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1995], by David L. Petersen, page 141)
Professor David W. Chapman:
“The context of 5:11-14 concentrates on the horrors that women and men faced in the exilic period. After speaking of the rape RAPE OF THE WOMEN IN 5:11, the two verses above mention in descending social order the fate of the men (a similar order is reiterated in 5:14). The Hebrew perfect verbs are translated above with the English simple past; however, many modern interpreters (going back to Lam 5:1) understand these are current afflictions for the writer. (Ancient Jewish and Christian Perceptions of Crucifixion [Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen zum Neuen Testament, 2. Reihe – Mohr Siebeck, Tubingen, Germany, 2008], by David W. Chapman, page 158)
There you have it Sham-Moon, your god you worship allows rape, and forced sexual intercourse. Enjoy there will be more articles published exposing your pagan Babble
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The Bible, Jesus (God) of the Old Testament allowed rape slaves. The GNT Bible accurately described what happened to the women:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
How do we know ANAH is RAPE? Let’s read deuteronomy 22:29,
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/deu/22/29/t_conc_175029
Different translations for Deuteronomy 22:29.
Living Bible (TLB)
“28-29 If a man RAPES A GIRL who is not engaged and is caught in the act, he must pay a fine[a] to the girl’s father and marry her; he may never divorce her.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
The Message (MSG)
“28-29 When a man comes upon a virgin who has never been engaged and grabs and RAPES HER and they are found out, the man who RAPED HER has to give her father fifty pieces of silver. He has to marry her because he took advantage of her. And he can never divorce her.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“29 the man who had sexual intercourse with her must give the girl’s father 1¼ pounds of silver, and she will become his wife. Since he RAPED HER, he can never divorce her as long as he lives.[a]” – Deuteronomy 22:29
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“29 The man who has RAPED HER must pay her father fifty shekels of silver and she must become his wife because he has violated her; he may never divorce her as long as he lives.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
New International Reader’s Version (NIRV)
“29 Then the man must weigh out 20 ounces of silver. He must give it to her father. The man must marry the young woman, because he RAPED HER. And he can never divorce her as long as he lives.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“29 they will be forced to get married. He must give her father fifty pieces of silver as a bride-price and[a] can never divorce her.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
Footnote for CEV Translation:
“22.28,29 talks her into sleeping with him. . . bride-price and: Or “FORCES HER TO HAVE SEX.”
Expanded Bible (EXB)
29 the man who ·had sexual relations [L lay] with her must pay the girl’s father about ·one and one-fourth pounds [L fifty shekels] of silver. He must also marry the girl, because he has ·dishonored [HUMILIATED; RAPED] her, and he may never divorce her for as long as he lives [Ex. 22:16–17].” – Deuteronomy 22:29
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
“29 the man who had sexual intercourse with her must give the girl’s father 1¼ pounds of silver, and she will become his wife. SINCE HE RAPED HER, he can never divorce her as long as he lives.[a]” – Deuteronomy 22:29
Good News Translation (GNT)
“29 He is to pay her father the bride price of fifty pieces of silver, and she is to become his wife, because he FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE WITH HIM. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.” – Deuteronomy 22:29
EVEN THE COMMENTATORS SAY IT IS ABOUT RAPE:
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/biblical-law-forces-rapist-to-marry-victim-anahinna/
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“NOW, IF YOU RAPED A GIRL, and she is a virgin, and she is not betrothed to someone else, then you”re to take her as your wife to pay her father fifty shekels of silver (Deuteronomy 22:23-29).” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Deuteronomy 22:29 – online source)
Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible – Unabridged:
“But if SHE WAS FORCED, THE MAN ONLY WHO COMMITTED THE RAPE was to suffer for the violence, which was regarded as a capital crime. In the case of a maiden not betrothed being seduced, the man was OBLIGED TO MARRY HER, and he forfeited the right possessed by other husbands of giving her a divorce. …”(Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible – Unabridged – Deuteronomy 22:29 – online source)
Biblical scholars John Walton, Victor Matthew and Mark Chavalas in their The IVP Bible Background Commentary have the following on Deuteronomy 22:25-27 which is the context of verses 28 and 29:
“In this case, Israelite law adds another criterion by specifying the guiltlessness of the woman who is RAPED in the countryside, where her screams were unlikely to attract assistance. The assumption of her innocence is based on the implied resistance to the rape in this circumstance.” (Walton, J. H., Matthew, V. H., & Chavalas, M. W. (2000). The IVP Bible Background Commentary: The Old Testament. Downers Grove, Illinois: InterVarsity Press. p. 196)
Biblical scholar and historian Philip King who was professor of Biblical Studies in the Department of Theology at Boston College and Dorot Professor of the Archeology of Israel in the Department of Near Eastern Languages and Civilizations at Hardvard University Lawrence Stager write:
“RAPE IS REFERRED TO ONLY IN DEUTERONOMY, but with no sharp distinction between rape and seduction. THE RAPIST “SHALL GIVE FIFTY SHEKELS OF SILVER TO THAT YOUNG WOMAN’S FATHER, AND SHE SHALL BECOME HIS WIFE. Because he violated her, he shall not be permitted to divorce her as long as he lives.”(Deut. 22:29) The Payment in this case represents the mohar.” (King, P. J, & Stager, L. E. (2001). Life in Biblical Israel. In Douglas A. Knight (ed.), Library of Ancient Israel. Louisville, Kentucky: Westminster John Knox Press. p. 60)
The late conservative Biblical scholar Peter Craigie who held several top posts such as head of the religious studies department at the University of Calgary in his commentary on Deuteronomy 22:28-29 writes as follows:
“28-29 (iv) The RAPE OF A SINGLE WOMAN. THE MAN USES FORCE ON THE WOMAN, who is a virgin and is not betrothed to a man; the two are discovered while the crime is being committed. In this case, the man must pay damages to the father, in the amount of fifty pieces (shekels) of silver, and he must marry the woman.” (Craigie, P. C. (1976). The New International Commentary on the Old Testament: The Book of Deuteronomy. Grand Rapids, Michigan: Wm. Eerdmans Publishing Co. p. 295)
The late Biblical scholar and specialist in Hebrew studies Roger Whybray writes:
“Deuteronomy 22:22-29 deals with adultery and RAPE, and make distinctions between RAPE in the open country, where the woman is defenceless, and rape in the town, where it is held that she could have shouted for help. Rape of an unbetrothed virgin is punished by a payment to her father.” (Whybray, R. N. (2002). The Good Life in the Old Testament. Edinburgh, Scotland: T&T Clark. p. 50)
Associate Professor of Religious Studies at Salve Regina University T. J. Wray writes:
“The crime of rape in the Bible is varied and complex. In the world of biblical antiquity, RAPE is largely viewed as a crime of disordered lust. Today, we know that it is about must more, but in the Bible, if an unengaged virgin is RAPED, she may actually be required TO MARRY HER RAPIST, and the rapist may must pay the girl’s father a fee for defiling his daughter (Deuteronomy 22:28-29)! Though Deuteronomy stipulates the death penalty for the rape of an engaged female (Deut. 22:25-27, there are numerous cases of vigilante justice for victims of rape (Gen 34:25-29; Judges 19-20; 2 Sam 13:22-29), which leads us to conclude that perhaps in ancient Israel, the long arm of the law often falls short when it comes to rape.” (Wray, T. J. (2011). What the Bible Really Tells Us: The Essential Guide to Biblical Literacy. Lanham, Maryland: Rowman & Littlefield Publishers, Inc. p. 142)
Dr. Gary Hall, Professor of Old Testament and Hebrew at Lincoln Christian Seminary in his commentary on Deuteronomy 22:28-29 write:
“22:28-29 If the girl who was violated was not married or engaged, the penalty was not death but a fine and the loss of the right of divorce. The law protected both the girl (economic security) and the father (loss of bride price). The girl’s loss of virginity would have made her virtually unmarriageable. In Exodus 22:16 the father could refuse to let the girl marry the seducer. There is some question whether the act in view here was rape (NIV) or consensual. The word of verse 25 (“seize”) was not used but an apparently more mild word which meant “take hold of.” However, the explanation that the man had violated the girl POINTS TOWARD RAPE. The expression was also used of Shechem’s treatment of Dinah (Gen. 34:2).” (Hall, G. H. (2000). The College Press NIV Commentary: Deuteronomy. United States: College Press Publishing Co. p. 339)
Avid Christian pastor and Bible instructor Warren W. Wiersbe writes:
“According to the law, if a man RAPED A VIRGIN not engaged to be married, he had to pay her father a fine and marry her, and he could never divorce her (Deut. 2:28-29).” (Wiersbe, W. W. (2003). The Bible Exposition Commentary: Old Testament History. Colorado Springs, Colorado: Cook Communications Ministries. p. 342)
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Hey their playing your song! Here is an excerpt from my article which puts your vile profit to shame: http://answeringislam.net/Shamoun/ot_and_rape.htm
As can be seen, the word can mean entice, persuade, deceive etc. The following passage uses the word in a slightly similar fashion to that of Exodus, namely how God will allure or draw Israel back to his love:
“‘Therefore I am now going to allure (pathath) her; I will lead her into the desert and speak tenderly to her. There I will give her back her vineyards, and will make the Valley of Achor a door of hope. There she will sing as in the days of her youth, as in the day she came up out of Egypt. In that day,’ declares the LORD, ‘you will call me “my husband”; you will no longer call me “my master.” I will remove the names of the Baals from her lips; no longer will their names be invoked. In that day I will make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field and the birds of the air and the creatures that move along the ground. Bow and sword and battle I will abolish from the land, so that all may lie down in safety. I will betroth you to me forever; I will betroth you in righteousness and justice, in love and compassion. I will betroth you in faithfulness, and you will acknowledge the LORD.’” Hosea 2:14-20
It is clear from the context that Exodus is referring to a man persuading or enticing a woman into having sex. Hence, this passage lends support to the fact that the woman in Deuteronomy 22:28-29 consented to the sexual act, and wasn’t forced into having sex. In other words, there was no rape involved between the man and the woman.
As the following Study Bible puts it:
22:28-29 Preceding legislation dealt with cases of rape involving a woman already married or engaged. The ruling outlined here is addressed in cases of seduction IN WHICH IT IS ASSUMED THAT THE WOMAN WAS, OR MAY HAVE BEEN, CONSENTING TO THE SEXUAL RELATIONSHIP. The fact that such a relationship had taken place was nevertheless regarded as of vital concern to the community and therefore required that a requisite sum of money be paid to the woman’s father. It is assumed that the bride’s father’s rights have been violated by what had taken place and that appropriate compensation was necessary to offset the loss of the expected bride-price. A further stipulation required that the couple should then marry and that no subsequent divorce was to be permitted. In Exodus 22:16-17 the closely comparable law allows that the father need not consent to giving his daughter to the man, in which case the compensation was still to be paid to the father. Fifty shekels was a significantly large amount and may be assumed to have been equivalent to the average bride-price. (The New Interpreter’s Study Bible: New Revised Standard Version with the Apocrypha [Abingdon Press, Nashville TN 2003], pp. 278-279; underline and capital emphasis ours)
Or, as the late renowned Bible expositor John Gill explained it long ago:
If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed…
That is, meets with one in a field, which is not espoused to a man; and the man is supposed to be an unmarried man, as appears by what follows:
and lay hold on her, and lie with her,
she yielding to it, and so is not expressive of a rape, as (Deuteronomy 22:25) WHERE A DIFFERENT WORD FROM THIS IS THERE USED; which signifies taking strong hold of her, and ravishing her by force; yet this, though owing to his first violent seizure of her, and so different from what was obtained by enticing words, professions of love, and promises of marriage, and the like, as in (Exodus 22:16,17) but not without her consent:
and they be found;
in the field together, and in the fact; or however there are witnesses of it, or they themselves have confessed, it, and perhaps betrayed by her pregnancy. (The New John Gill Exposition of the Entire Bible; online source; capital and underline emphasis ours)
And this is what the late great Christian philosopher and apologist Dr. Greg L. Bahnsen wrote concerning this issue:
… “If a man finds a girl who is an unbetrothed virgin, an he lays hold of her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man lying down with her shall give to the girl’s father fifty pieces of silver, and she shall be his wife because he has humbled her; he may not put her away all his days.” [Deuteronomy 22:28-29]
This is the literal translation of the Hebrew. Unfortunately, some commentators and Bible translations … make the mistake of interpreting these words as referring to the use of force and thus to raping a virgin. Such a view is quite unacceptable, for a number of reasons. (1) This would lay a burden and penalty on the woman who had no part or consent in the act, which is as unfair and senseless as punishing the victim of attempted murder.
(2) The Hebrew word tapas (“lay hold of her,” emphasized above) simply means to take hold of something, grasp it in hand, and (by application) to capture or seize something. It is the verb used for “handling” the harp and flute (Gen. 4:21), the sword (Ezek. 21:11; 30:21), the sickle (Jer. 50:16), the shield (Jer. 46:9), the oars (Ezek. 27:29), and the bow (Amos 2:15). It is likewise used for “taking” God’s name (Prov. 30:9) or “dealing” with the law of God (Jer. 2:8). Joseph’s garment was “grasped” (Gen. 39:12; cf. I Kings 11:30), even as Moses “took” the two tablets of the law (Deut. 9:17). People are “caught” (I Kings 20:18), even as cities are “captured” (Deut. 20:19; Isa. 36:1). An adulterous wife may not have been “caught” in the act (Num. 5:13). In all of these instances it is clear that, while force may come into the picture from further description, the Hebrew verb “to handle, grasp, capture” does not in itself indicate anything about the use of force.
This verb used in Deuteronomy 22:28 is different from the verb used in verse 25 (chazak, from the root meaning “to be strong, firm”) which can mean “to seize” a bear and kill it (I Sam. 17:35; cf. 2 Sam. 2:16; Zech. 14:13), “to prevail” (2 Sam. 24:4; Dan. 11:7), “to be strong” (Deut. 31:6; 2 Sam. 2:7), etc. Deuteronomy 22:25 thus speaks of a man finding a woman and “forcing her.” Just three verses later (Deut. 25:28), the verb is changed to simply “take hold of” her – indicating an action less intense and violent than the action dealt with in verse 25 (viz., rape).
(3) The Hebrew word anah (“humble, afflict,” emphasized above) used in Deuteronomy 22:29 can sometimes be used for forcing a woman (Gen. 34:2; Jud. 20:5; 2 Sam. 13:12, 14, 22, 32; Lam. 5:11) but need not indicate a forcible rape, which is clear from the Deuteronomy passage itself at verse 24. It can simply mean to dishonor, mistreat, or afflict (e.g., Ex. 1:11; Gen. 16:6; Ex. 22:22; Deut. 8:2; Ps. 119:67), and in sexual settings can denote other kinds of sin than rape (Ezek. 22:10, 11).
We can agree with the reasoning of James Jordan: “At first sight, this seems to allow for rape of an unbetrothed girl. In Hebrew, however, the verb ‘seize’ is a weaker verb than the verb for ‘force’ used in the same passage (v. 25) to describe rape. This stronger verb is also used for the rape of Tamar (2 Sam. 13:11). Implied here is a notion of catching the girl, but not a notion that she fought back with anything more than a token resistance. Modern random rape would not be excusable under this law, and would have to come under the death penalty of Deuteronomy 22:25-27” (The Law of the Covenant, p. 149).
Accordingly, one will find that many competent authorities in Biblical interpretation understand Deuteronomy 22:28-29 to apply to cases of seduction, not forcible rape. For instance:
Meredith Kline: “The seducer of an unbetrothed virgin was obliged to take her as wife, paying the customary bride price and forfeiting the right of divorce” (Treaty of the Great King: The Covenant Structure of Deuteronomy, p. 111).
Matthew Henry: “… if he and the damsel did consent, he should be bound to marry her, and never to divorce her, how much soever she was below him and how unpleasing soever she might afterwards be to him” (Commentary on the Whole Bible, ad loc.).
J. A. Thompson: “Seduction of a young girl. Where the girl was not betrothed and no legal obligations had been entered into, the man was forced to pay the normal bride-price and marry the girl. He was not allowed, subsequently, to send her away (Deuteronomy: Introduction and Commentary, Tyndale Series, p. 237).
In Israel’s Laws and legal Precedents (1907), Charles Foster Kent (professor of Biblical Literature at Yale University) clearly distinguished between the law pertaining to rape in Dt. 22:25-27 and the law pertaining to seduction in Dt. 22:28-29 (pp. 117-118).
Keil and Delitzsch classify Deuteronomy 22:28-29 under the category of “Seduction of a virgin,” comment that the crime involved was “their deed” – implying consent of the part of both parties – and liken this law to that found in Exodus 22:16-17 (Biblical Commentary on the Old Testament, vol. 3, p. 412).
Even if one has some question about the applicability of Deuteronomy 22:28-29, the clear and decisive command from God when a man has seduced a virgin is found in Exodus 22:16-17: “If a man seduces a virgin who is not betrothed and lies with her, he shall surely pay her dowry to make her his wife. If her father absolutely refuses to give her to him, he shall weigh out money according to the dowry for virgins.”
In this text there is no question whatsoever of forcible rape. The Hebrew verb used to describe the sin (italicized in the quotation above) is patah, used elsewhere for “coaxing” (Jud. 14:15), “luring” (Jud. 16:5; Hos. 2:14), and “enticing” (Prov. 1:10; 16:29). When a man gets a virgin to consent to have sexual relations with him, he is morally obligated to marry her – as the following commentators indicate:
John Calvin: “The remedy is, that he who has corrupted the girl should be compelled to marry her, and also to give her a dowry from his own property, lest, if he should afterwards cast her off, she should go away from her bed penniless” (Commentaries on the Four Last Books of Moses Arranged in the Form of a Harmony, vol. 3, pp. 83-84.
J. C. Connell: “Although she consented, it was still his responsibility to protect her from lifelong shame resulting from the sin of the moment by marrying her, not without payment of the regular dowry” (“Exodus,” New bible Commentary, ed. F. Davidson, p. 122).
Adam Clarke: “This was an exceedingly wise and humane law, and must have operated powerfully against seduction and fornication; because the person who might feel inclined to take advantage of a young woman knew that he must marry her, and give her a dowry, if her parents consented” (The Holy Bible … with a Commentary and Critical Notes, vol. 1, p. 414).
Alan Cole: “If a man seduces a virgin: … he must acknowledge her as his wife, unless her father refuses” (Exodus: An Introduction and Commentary, Tyndale Series, p. 173).
James Jordan: “the punishment for the seducer is that he must marry the girl, unless her father objects, and that he may never divorce her (according to Dt. 22:29)” (The Law of the Covenant, p. 148).
Walter C. Kaiser, Jr.: “Exodus 22:16-17 takes up the problem of the seduction of a maiden who was not engaged …. Here the seducer must pay the ‘bride-price’ and agree to marry her” (Toward Old Testament Ethics, p. 107).
(Bahnsen, Pre-Marital Sexual Relations: What is the Moral Obligation When Repeated Incidents are Confessed?, PE152, Covenant Media Foundation, 1992)
In light of the foregoing, we feel the following rendering best captures the intended meaning of the passage which has nothing to do with a woman having to marry her rapist:
“Suppose a woman isn’t engaged to be married, and a man talks her into sleeping with him. If they are caught, they will be forced to get married. He must give her father fifty pieces of silver as a bride-price and can never divorce her.” Contemporary English Version (CEV)
This concludes our exegesis of Deuteronomy 22:28-29. We prayerfully hope that by the grace of our risen Lord and eternal Savior Jesus Christ, this short paper will be of great help to those Christians who have been confronted by Muslims with the accusation that the Holy Bible condones the raping of women. Hopefully, both Christians and Muslims will see that the Holy Bible nowhere condones rape.
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And now be a good lil muta loving pagan and read this thoroughly!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
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Will the real rapist and adulterer please stand up!
And here you go flyingmutalover! Do make sure you enjoy it! And here is my demolition of his butchering of the word ana. This isn’t anything. Watch what I am going to do with your shame piece on Q. 9:29 which I am nearly finished with it. Like I said, everytime you lie through your teeth in the name of the jinn you worship and his profit I will take it out on Muhammad. So enjoy!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
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Here is a different translation for the exact word ‘anah’ 🙂
One of the verses that has been downplayed by Christian apologists as not endorsing or approving ‘rape’ is Deuteronomy 21:10-14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since YOU FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.
They claim that the word ‘anah’ used here doesn’t actually mean ‘ rape’ (forced intercourse). How can we prove that RAPE DID TAKE PLACE? Let’s read another translations for a different verses (with the exact word (anah)):
Lamentations 5:11 has the Hebrew word ‘anah’ same one that is in Deuteronomy 21:14
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/lam/5/11/t_conc_802011
Different TRANSLATIONS for Lamentations 5:11
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/29/deuteronomy-211014-hebrew-word-anah-means-rape/
Translations for Lamentations 5:11
New Living Translation
“Our enemies RAPE THE WOMEN in Jerusalem and the young girls in all the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version (ESV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Standard Version (ISV)
“They have RAPED women in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
NET Bible
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
GOD’S WORD® Translation
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Women have been RAPED in Zion, young women in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“They have RAPED the women of Tziyon, virgins in the cities of Y’hudah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“On Zion and everywhere in Judah our wives and daughters are BEING RAPED.” – Lamentations 5:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“The enemy raped the women of Zion. They RAPED THE WOMEN in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“The enemy [L They] ·ABUSED [VIOLATED; RAPED] the women ·of Jerusalem [L in Zion; C the location of the Temple] and the ·girls [L virgins] in the ·cities [towns] of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Good News Translation (GNT)
“Our wives have BEEN RAPED on Mount Zion itself; in every Judean village our daughters have been forced to submit.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“The ENEMY RAPED the women of Jerusalem and the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“They RAPED women in Zion, young women[a] in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Living Bible (TLB)
“They RAPE the women of Jerusalem and the girls in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Message (MSG)
“Our wives were RAPED in the streets in Zion, and our virgins in the cities of Judah.” Lamentations 5:11
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the cities of Judah…” – Lamentations 5:11
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Voice (VOICE)
“In the place where God should be— Zion and the surrounding towns of Judah— Women, young and old alike, are BRUTALLY RAPED and violated.” – Lamentations 5:11
EVEN THE COMMENTARIES AGREE THAT ANAH MEANS RAPE:
Bridgeway Bible Commentary:
Conditions in Judah are terrible. The people have to search the barren country regions for food, and in doing so they risk death from desert bandits (9-10). Judean WOMEN ARE RAPED, former leaders are tortured, and children are forced to work like slaves (11-13). The old way of life has gone, and with it has gone all celebration and rejoicing (14-15). People everywhere are unhappy, discouraged and ashamed. They acknowledge that their sin has brought all this upon them (16-18). (Bridgeway Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible:
“They ravished the women … the virgins of the cities of Judah” (Lamentations 5:11). This is an accompanying vice of warfare that is just as much a part of modern wars as it was in antiquity. Nothing is more terrible and disgusting than the WHOLESALE RAPE of the women (all of them) by an army of enemies. The bestiality of wicked men unrestrained by any outside force is the utmost in depravity.
(Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable:
“The enemy had RAPED THE WOMEN and girls in Jerusalem and Judah. Respected princes had experienced the most humiliating deaths, and the enemy gave no respect to Judah”s elderly. Since Nebuchadnezzar evidently did not torture his victims (cf. Jeremiah 52:10-11; Jeremiah 52:24-27), it may be that the Chaldeans strung up the princes by their hands-after they had died-to dishonor them (cf. Deuteronomy 21:22-23). [Note: Keil, 2:451.]” (Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable – Lamentations 5:11 – Online source)
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah ( Lamentations 5:11 ).
The enemies had come in. It must have been a horrible thing. The fathers to see their wives and their young daughters ravished by the enemy, RAPED and all and then murdered.” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
American Old Testament scholar and the William Marcellus McPheeters Professor Emerita of Old Testament at Columbia Theological Seminary – Kathleen M. O’Connor:
“Women’s history
As symbolic figures, women convey mixed messages in Lamentations, but when the book speaks of real women, it tells of their history in painful and illuminating ways. The book brings into the open hidden victims of war who suffer long after the war’s end. Some verses mention women’s sufferings alongside those of men and other social groups. Young women have gone into captivity with young men (2:21). Young girls and elders grieve over Zion’s destruction (2:10). Other verses attend specifically to the plight of women. The male speaker grieves over ‘the fate of all the young women in my city’ (3:11). ‘WOMEN ARE RAPED in Zion’ (5:11).” (Women’s Bible Commentary: Expanded Edition [Edited by Carol Ann Newsom, Sharon H. Ringe, WJK – Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1998], by Kathleen M. O’Connor, page 190)
Dr. Charles H. Dyer:
“The first group mentioned who suffered the horrors of foreign occupation were the women of Jerusalem (Zion) and the virgins … of Judah. Women who survived the Babylonian assault on their cities were mercilessly RAPED BY THE SADISTIC SOLDIERS. In a scene of savage brutality, repeated by many conquering armies throughout history, the victors went on a wanton spree of lustful revenge against defenceless women.” (The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition Of the Scriptures By Dallas Seminary Faculty – Old Testament [Editors John F. Walvoord, Roy B. Zuck, 1983] by Charles H. Dyer, page 1222)
Professor of Old Testament David L. Petersen:
The elegant literary construction stands in constrast with the devastating destruction: much will be violated. The book of Lamentations, which reflects the fall of Jerusalem, refers to all three elements, the destruction of the city, presumably its walls (2:8); plundering (1:18) and violation of dwelling places (2:2); WOMEN RAPED (5:11).” (Zechariah 9-14 and Malachi: A Commentary [Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1995], by David L. Petersen, page 141)
Professor David W. Chapman:
“The context of 5:11-14 concentrates on the horrors that women and men faced in the exilic period. After speaking of the rape RAPE OF THE WOMEN IN 5:11, the two verses above mention in descending social order the fate of the men (a similar order is reiterated in 5:14). The Hebrew perfect verbs are translated above with the English simple past; however, many modern interpreters (going back to Lam 5:1) understand these are current afflictions for the writer. (Ancient Jewish and Christian Perceptions of Crucifixion [Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen zum Neuen Testament, 2. Reihe – Mohr Siebeck, Tubingen, Germany, 2008], by David W. Chapman, page 158)
There you have it Sham-Moon, your god you worship allows rape, and forced sexual intercourse. Enjoy there will be more articles published exposing your pagan Babble 😉 🙂
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Deuteronomy 21:10-14 has been noted by some that the ‘provisions’ laid out in the passage are ‘remarkable’, ‘compassionate’ and ‘humanistic’. Let’s read:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/hebrew-word-anah-inna-carries-the-meaning-of-rape/
Anah means ‘RAPE’, this is attested in the following verses for Genesis 34:2,
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/gen/34/2/t_conc_34002
Translations for Genesis 34:2
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“2 and Sh’khem the son of Hamor the Hivi, the local ruler, saw her, grabbed her, RAPED HER and humiliated her.” – Genesis 34:2
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“2 She was seen by Hamor’s son Shechem, the leader of the Hivites, and he grabbed her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“2 She was seen by Shechem, the son of Hamor the Hivite, who ruled that area. Shechem took Dinah and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Good News Translation (GNT)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, who was chief of that region, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, a prince of the region, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“2 Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of that land, saw Dinah. He took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
International Standard Version (ISV)
“2 When Hamor the Hivite’s son Shechem, the regional leader, saw her, he grabbed her and RAPED HER, humiliating her.” – Genesis 34:2
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“2 And Shechem, the son of Hamor the Hivite, the prince of the land, saw her. And he took her and lay with her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
The Message (MSG)
“1-2 One day Dinah, the daughter Leah had given Jacob, went to visit some of the women in that country. Shechem, the son of Hamor the Hivite who was chieftain there, saw her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“2 When Shechem, son of the local ruler Hamor the Hivite, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Living Bible (TLB)
“2 but when Shechem, son of King Hamor the Hivite, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
“2 When Shechem, son of the local ruler Hamor the Hivite, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New International Reader’s Version (NIRV)
“2 Hamor, the Hivite, was the ruler of that area. When his son Shechem saw Dinah, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New International Version (NIV)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of that area, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New International Version – UK (NIVUK)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of that area, saw her, he took her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New Living Translation (NLT)
“2 But when the local prince, Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, saw Dinah, he seized her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
Tree of Life Version (TLV)
“2 When Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, the prince of the land, saw her, he took her and lay with her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
The Voice (VOICE)
“2 But when Shechem (son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region) saw Dinah, he grabbed her and RAPED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
“2 When Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, the prince of the land, saw her, he took her and LAY WITH HER [A]BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
New Century Version (NCV)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of the land, saw her, he took her and FORCED HER TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS WITH HIM.” – Genesis 34:2
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, who ruled that area, saw her, he grabbed her, FORCED HIMSELF ON HER, and SEXUALLY ASSAULTED HER.” – Genesis 34:2
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region, saw her, he seized her and LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region, saw her, he seized her and LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition (NRSVACE)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region, saw her, he SEIZED HER AND LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
New Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition (NRSVCE)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, prince of the region, saw her, he seized her and LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
Wycliffe Bible (WYC)
“2 And when Shechem, the son of Hamor (the) Hivite, the prince of that land, had seen her, he loved her, and he ravished her, and (he) slept with her, and OPPRESSED THE VIRGIN BY VIOLENCE (and he oppressed the virgin with violence).” – Genesis 34:2
Amplified Bible (AMP)
“2 When Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, prince (sheik) of the land, saw her, he KIDNAPPED HER AND LAY [INTIMATELY] WITH HER BY FORCE [humbling and offending her].” – Genesis 34:2
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“2 When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite [C one of the tribes that inhabited Canaan], the ·ruler [prince] of the land, saw her, he took her and FORCED HER TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS WITH HIM [lay with her and humiliated/violated her].” – Genesis 34:2
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“2 When Shechem, son of Hamor the Hivite,[a] the leader of the region, saw her, HE SEIZED HER AND LAY WITH HER BY FORCE.” – Genesis 34:2
GOD WILLING I WILL BE EXPOSING YOU FILTHY PAGAN babble passages, showing how the Bible allows rape, forced sexual intercourse, all to be found in your Babble. 🙂
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Let’s expose the real women raping and prostituting murderer, shall we?
And here you go flyingmutalover! Do make sure you enjoy it! And here is my demolition of his butchering of the word ana. This isn’t anything. Watch what I am going to do with your shame piece on Q. 9:29 which I am nearly finished with it. Like I said, everytime you lie through your teeth in the name of the jinn you worship and his profit I will take it out on Muhammad. So enjoy!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Now what was that about rape! Must really suck being you!
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Like I said, be a good lil muta loving pagan and read this thoroughly!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
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Here is a different translation for the exact word ‘anah’ 🙂
One of the verses that has been downplayed by Christian apologists as not endorsing or approving ‘rape’ is Deuteronomy 21:10-14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since YOU FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.
They claim that the word ‘anah’ used here doesn’t actually mean ‘ rape’ (forced intercourse). How can we prove that RAPE DID TAKE PLACE? Let’s read another translations for a different verses (with the exact word (anah)):
Lamentations 5:11 has the Hebrew word ‘anah’ same one that is in Deuteronomy 21:14
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/lam/5/11/t_conc_802011
Different TRANSLATIONS for Lamentations 5:11
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/29/deuteronomy-211014-hebrew-word-anah-means-rape/
Translations for Lamentations 5:11
New Living Translation
“Our enemies RAPE THE WOMEN in Jerusalem and the young girls in all the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version (ESV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Standard Version (ISV)
“They have RAPED women in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
NET Bible
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
GOD’S WORD® Translation
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Women have been RAPED in Zion, young women in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“They have RAPED the women of Tziyon, virgins in the cities of Y’hudah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“On Zion and everywhere in Judah our wives and daughters are BEING RAPED.” – Lamentations 5:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“The enemy raped the women of Zion. They RAPED THE WOMEN in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“The enemy [L They] ·ABUSED [VIOLATED; RAPED] the women ·of Jerusalem [L in Zion; C the location of the Temple] and the ·girls [L virgins] in the ·cities [towns] of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Good News Translation (GNT)
“Our wives have BEEN RAPED on Mount Zion itself; in every Judean village our daughters have been forced to submit.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“The ENEMY RAPED the women of Jerusalem and the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“They RAPED women in Zion, young women[a] in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Living Bible (TLB)
“They RAPE the women of Jerusalem and the girls in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Message (MSG)
“Our wives were RAPED in the streets in Zion, and our virgins in the cities of Judah.” Lamentations 5:11
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the cities of Judah…” – Lamentations 5:11
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Voice (VOICE)
“In the place where God should be— Zion and the surrounding towns of Judah— Women, young and old alike, are BRUTALLY RAPED and violated.” – Lamentations 5:11
EVEN THE COMMENTARIES AGREE THAT ANAH MEANS RAPE:
Bridgeway Bible Commentary:
Conditions in Judah are terrible. The people have to search the barren country regions for food, and in doing so they risk death from desert bandits (9-10). Judean WOMEN ARE RAPED, former leaders are tortured, and children are forced to work like slaves (11-13). The old way of life has gone, and with it has gone all celebration and rejoicing (14-15). People everywhere are unhappy, discouraged and ashamed. They acknowledge that their sin has brought all this upon them (16-18). (Bridgeway Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible:
“They ravished the women … the virgins of the cities of Judah” (Lamentations 5:11). This is an accompanying vice of warfare that is just as much a part of modern wars as it was in antiquity. Nothing is more terrible and disgusting than the WHOLESALE RAPE of the women (all of them) by an army of enemies. The bestiality of wicked men unrestrained by any outside force is the utmost in depravity.
(Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable:
“The enemy had RAPED THE WOMEN and girls in Jerusalem and Judah. Respected princes had experienced the most humiliating deaths, and the enemy gave no respect to Judah”s elderly. Since Nebuchadnezzar evidently did not torture his victims (cf. Jeremiah 52:10-11; Jeremiah 52:24-27), it may be that the Chaldeans strung up the princes by their hands-after they had died-to dishonor them (cf. Deuteronomy 21:22-23). [Note: Keil, 2:451.]” (Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable – Lamentations 5:11 – Online source)
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah ( Lamentations 5:11 ).
The enemies had come in. It must have been a horrible thing. The fathers to see their wives and their young daughters ravished by the enemy, RAPED and all and then murdered.” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
American Old Testament scholar and the William Marcellus McPheeters Professor Emerita of Old Testament at Columbia Theological Seminary – Kathleen M. O’Connor:
“Women’s history
As symbolic figures, women convey mixed messages in Lamentations, but when the book speaks of real women, it tells of their history in painful and illuminating ways. The book brings into the open hidden victims of war who suffer long after the war’s end. Some verses mention women’s sufferings alongside those of men and other social groups. Young women have gone into captivity with young men (2:21). Young girls and elders grieve over Zion’s destruction (2:10). Other verses attend specifically to the plight of women. The male speaker grieves over ‘the fate of all the young women in my city’ (3:11). ‘WOMEN ARE RAPED in Zion’ (5:11).” (Women’s Bible Commentary: Expanded Edition [Edited by Carol Ann Newsom, Sharon H. Ringe, WJK – Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1998], by Kathleen M. O’Connor, page 190)
Dr. Charles H. Dyer:
“The first group mentioned who suffered the horrors of foreign occupation were the women of Jerusalem (Zion) and the virgins … of Judah. Women who survived the Babylonian assault on their cities were mercilessly RAPED BY THE SADISTIC SOLDIERS. In a scene of savage brutality, repeated by many conquering armies throughout history, the victors went on a wanton spree of lustful revenge against defenceless women.” (The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition Of the Scriptures By Dallas Seminary Faculty – Old Testament [Editors John F. Walvoord, Roy B. Zuck, 1983] by Charles H. Dyer, page 1222)
Professor of Old Testament David L. Petersen:
The elegant literary construction stands in constrast with the devastating destruction: much will be violated. The book of Lamentations, which reflects the fall of Jerusalem, refers to all three elements, the destruction of the city, presumably its walls (2:8); plundering (1:18) and violation of dwelling places (2:2); WOMEN RAPED (5:11).” (Zechariah 9-14 and Malachi: A Commentary [Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1995], by David L. Petersen, page 141)
Professor David W. Chapman:
“The context of 5:11-14 concentrates on the horrors that women and men faced in the exilic period. After speaking of the rape RAPE OF THE WOMEN IN 5:11, the two verses above mention in descending social order the fate of the men (a similar order is reiterated in 5:14). The Hebrew perfect verbs are translated above with the English simple past; however, many modern interpreters (going back to Lam 5:1) understand these are current afflictions for the writer. (Ancient Jewish and Christian Perceptions of Crucifixion [Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen zum Neuen Testament, 2. Reihe – Mohr Siebeck, Tubingen, Germany, 2008], by David W. Chapman, page 158)
There you have it Sham-Moon, your god you worship allows rape, and forced sexual intercourse. Enjoy there will be more articles published exposing your pagan Babble 😉 🙂
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For all christians who copy from David Wood’s site.
(Deut 21:11-14) has nothing to do with marriage .
Satanic Christians have been always playing with the translations.
If the (Deut 21:11-14) had anything to do with marriage, why would God command that Israeli man to (release )that captive woman and not to (divorce) her?
We read in (Deut 21:14) “But if you marry her and she does not please you, you must let her go free. You may not sell her or treat her as a slave, for you have humiliated her”
Why would God command that man not to SELL her ? Wasn’t that the normal situation when a husband divorces his wife? Why was there a need to instruct that man?
Then, what kind of (Humiliation) that man did for that woman?
If we read the Hebrew text, we will find the answer.
The term which is used in Hebrew is (עִנִּיתָֽהּ׃)!!
Guess what?
The same term (עִנִּיתָֽהּ׃) has been used in Genesis 34:2 in the story of Dinah which has been translated to (Rape).
The term in Hebrew is pronounced as (anah). in Arabic is (anna)
I’m an Arabic man, and I know how that term is used. It’s used to describe any act which has been done by FORCE.
Note (Deut21:11-14) has nothing to do with Marriage. Baal could be used as (husband). However, it means the (owner) in Arabic and Hebrew.
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More rape passages from the pagan god Sha-moon worships 🙂
One of the best translations to illustrate that rape did indeed take place in Deuteronomy, is the GNT translation. It reads:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/deuteronomy-2110-14-soldiers-raped-women/
HOW DO WE KNOW THAT HEBREW ‘ANAH’ MEANS RAPE? WELL LET’S READ THE EXACT WORD IN A DIFFERENT VERSE:
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/jdg/20/5/t_conc_231005
TRANSLATIONS for Judges 20:5
Amplified Bible (AMP)
“5 But the men of Gibeah rose up against me and surrounded the house at night because of me. They intended to kill me, but instead they RAPED my concubine [so brutally] that she died.” – Judges 20:5
Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)
“5 And the men of Gibeah rose against me and beset the house round about me by night; they meant to kill me and they RAPED my concubine, and she is dead.” – Judges 20:5
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“5 and the men in Giv‘ah attacked me and surrounded the house I was staying in at night. They wanted to kill me, but instead they RAPED my concubine to death.” – Judges 20:5
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“5 Later that night, the men of Gibeah surrounded the house. They wanted to kill me, but instead they RAPED and killed my wife.” – Judges 20:5
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition (DRA)
“5 And behold the men of that city in the night beset the house wherein I was, intending to kill me, and abused my wife with an incredible FURY OF LUST, so that at last she died.” – Judges 20:5
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“5 But during the night the men of the city of Gibeah came to the house where I was staying. They surrounded the house, and they wanted to kill me. They RAPED my slave woman, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“5 During the night the ·men [leaders; lords] of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house and wanted to kill me. They FORCED MY SLAVE WOMAN TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS [abused/RAPED my concubine] and she died.” – Judges 20:5
GOD’S WORD Translation (GW)
“5 The citizens of Gibeah came to attack me. They surrounded the house where I was staying that night. They intended to kill me, but instead, they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
Good News Translation (GNT)
“5 The men of Gibeah came to get me and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me; instead they RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“5 Citizens of Gibeah ganged up on me and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, but they RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house and wanted to kill me. They RAPED my slave woman. And she died!” – Judges 20:5
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
Living Bible (TLB)
“5 “That night the men of Gibeah surrounded the house, planning to kill me, and they RAPED my wife until she was dead.” – Judges 20:5
The Message (MSG)
“That night the men of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house, intending to kill me. They GANG-RAPED my concubine and she died.” – Judges 20:5
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“5 The citizens of Gibeah came to attack me. They surrounded the house where I was staying that night. They intended to kill me, but instead, they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Century Version (NCV)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house and wanted to kill me. They FORCED MY SLAVE WOMAN TO HAVE SEXUAL RELATIONS and she died.” – Judges 20:5
New International Reader’s Version (NIRV)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me. They surrounded the house. They were planning to kill me. They RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
New International Version (NIV)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me and surrounded the house, intending to kill me. They RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
New International Version – UK (NIVUK)
“5 During the night the men of Gibeah came after me and surrounded the house, intending to kill me. They RAPED my concubine, and she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Living Translation (NLT)
“5 That night some of the leading citizens of Gibeah surrounded the house, planning to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she was dead.” – Judges 20:5
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me, and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me, and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition (NRSVACE)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me, and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
New Revised Standard Version Catholic Edition (NRSVCE)
“5 The lords of Gibeah rose up against me, and surrounded the house at night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
Orthodox Jewish Bible (OJB)
“5 And the ba’alei haGiv’ah rose against me, and surrounded the bais upon me by lailah, and intended to have murdered me; and my pilegesh have they RAPED, that she is dead.” – Judges 20:5
Tree of Life Version (TLV)
“5 Then men of Gibeah rose against me and surrounded the house over me at night. They intended to kill me, but instead, they RAPED my concubine until she died.” – Judges 20:5
The Voice (VOICE)
“5 but the leaders of the city came to the house where we were staying and surrounded it, wanting to attack me. They intended to kill me, but they RAPED my mistress until she died.” – Judges 20:5
World English Bible (WEB)
“5 The men of Gibeah rose against me, and surrounded the house by night. They intended to kill me, and they RAPED my concubine, and she is dead.” – Judges 20:5
There will be a further 10 articles coming soon exposing your Babble for what it is 🙂
Enjoy 😉
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Now what was that about rape?
And now be a good lil muta loving pagan and read this thoroughly!
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
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You need to stop confusing the Bible with your book of filth and porn. And let’s again expose the real women raping and prostituting murderer, shall we?
BEGIN
To now further add insult to injury, let me further break down Deuteronomy 21:10-14 to show how this passage condemns Muhammad as an adulterer and rapist:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the Lord your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and attracted to her, YOU MAY TAKE HER AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband AND SHE SHALL BE YOUR WIFE. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her (innitah).” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
The word innitah comes from anah. Now let us see how other versions render this word in v. 14:
“But if you aren’t pleased with her, you must send her away as she wishes. You are not allowed to sell her for money or treat her as a slave because you have HUMILIATED her.” Common English Bible
“It shall be, if you are not pleased with her, then you shall let her go [c]wherever she wishes; but you shall certainly not sell her for money, you shall not [d]mistreat her, because you have HUMBLED her.” New American Standard Bible
But if you are not satisfied with her, you shall let her go free and not sell her for money. You must not treat her as a slave, since you have DISHONORED her. New Revised Standard Version
And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not deal with her as a slave, because thou hast HUMBLED her. Jewish Publication Society 1917
And it will be, if you do not desire her, then you shall send her away wherever she wishes, but you shall not sell her for money. You shall not keep her as a servant, because you have AFFLICTED her. Complete Jewish Bible with Rashi Commentary
The reason why these versions rendered the word anah as dishonored, humbled, afflicted etc. is because the word is not being used here in the sense of forcing the captive woman to have sex, but of dishonoring or humiliating her by divorcing her and sending her on her way. That this word can and does mean refer to dishonoring someone, and not forcing them to have sex, is easily seen from the way this word is used in the following verses:
“This shall be a perpetual statute for you so that in the seventh month, on the tenth day of the month, you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and do no work of any kind, whether it is the native citizen or the stranger who sojourns among you. For on that day the priest shall make atonement for you to cleanse you, so that you may be clean from all your sins before the Lord. It shall be a sabbath, a solemn rest for you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves. It is a perpetual statute. The priest, who is anointed and consecrated to minister as a priest in the place of his father, shall make atonement, and shall put on the linen garments, the holy garments. And he shall make atonement for the Holy Sanctuary, for the tent of meeting, and for the altar, and he shall make atonement for the priests, and for all the people of the congregation.” Leviticus 16:29-33
“The Lord spoke to Moses, saying: Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be the Day of Atonement. It shall be a holy convocation to you, and you shall HUMBLE yourselves, and offer a food offering made by fire to the Lord. You shall do no work on that same day, for it is the Day of Atonement to make atonement for you before the Lord your God. For whoever is not HUMBLED on that same day, he shall be cut off from among his people. And whoever does any work in that same day, that person I will destroy from among his people. You shall do no manner of work. It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations in all your dwellings. It shall be to you a sabbath of complete rest, and you shall afflict your souls. On the ninth day of the month starting at the evening, from evening to evening, you shall celebrate your sabbath.” Leviticus 23:16-32
“You will have a holy assembly on the tenth day of this seventh month, and you will AFFLICT yourselves. You will not do any work on it.” Numbers 29:7
“You must carefully keep all the commandments that I am commanding you today, so that you may live, and multiply, and go in and possess the land which the Lord swore to your fathers. You must remember that the Lord your God led you all the way these forty years in the wilderness, to HUMBLE you, and to prove you, to know what was in your heart, whether you would keep His commandments or not. He HUMBLED you and let you suffer hunger, and fed you with manna, which you did not know, nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man does not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the Lord. Your clothing did not wear out on you, nor did your feet swell these forty years. You must also consider in your heart that, as a man disciplines his son, so the Lord your God disciplines you… who fed you in the wilderness with manna, which your fathers did not know, that He might HUMBLE you and that He might prove you, to do good for you in the end. ” Deuteronomy 8:1-5, 16
Thus, this text doesn’t permit Israelite men to rape captive women like Muhammad’s god allowed his profit and jihadi thugs. Rather, it is telling them they can only have sex with women whom they have taken captive BY FIRST MARRYING THEM! Even the very translation used by this demented liar AFFIRMS THAT THE ISRAELITES HAD TO MARRY THE CAPTIVE WOMEN, AND WERE TO SET THEM FREE AND NOT SELL THEM AS SLAVES IF THEY ENDED UP DIVORCING THEM, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT WHO NOT ONLY RAPED THEM WITHOUT MARRYING THEM BUT THEN SOLD THEM OFF AFTER HE GOT DONE VIOLATING THEM!
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like AND WANT TO MARRY HER. 12 take her your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, YOU MAY MARRY HER. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. since you forced her to have intercourse with you, YOU CANNOT TREAT HER AS A SLAVE AND SELL HER.
OUCH!
MORE IMPORTANTLY, YOU CANNOT QUOTE A SINGLE VERSE FROM THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THAT ISRAELITES OR BELIEVES CAN RAPE MARRIED WOMEN THAT HAVE BEEN TAKEN CAPTIVE, UNLIKE YOUR WICKED PROFIT!
DOUBLE OUCH!!!!
You could only wish that your profit had shown the same decency and civility towards captive women that this passage from Deuteronomy does, a passage which predates your filthy Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Like I said, keep producing your trash and filth and keep watching hundreds of thousands leave your wicked and filthy deen and turn to the glory of Christ, Muhammad’s God and Judge!
With that said give me a time and date when you can come to my paltak room so we can compare Deuteronomy 21:10-14 with the filth of Quran 4:24 and your profit’s implementation of it so all can see how well you do defending your garbage.
END
Now what was that about rape! Must really suck being you!
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Here is a different translation for the exact word ‘anah’ , Sham-moon make sure to read through all the evidence that is presented. Don’t get a heart attack 😉
One of the verses that has been downplayed by Christian apologists as not endorsing or approving ‘rape’ is Deuteronomy 21:10-14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
10 “When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since YOU FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.
They claim that the word ‘anah’ used here doesn’t actually mean ‘ rape’ (forced intercourse). How can we prove that RAPE DID TAKE PLACE? Let’s read another translations for a different verses (with the exact word (anah)):
Lamentations 5:11 has the Hebrew word ‘anah’ same one that is in Deuteronomy 21:14
https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/lam/5/11/t_conc_802011
Different TRANSLATIONS for Lamentations 5:11
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/29/deuteronomy-211014-hebrew-word-anah-means-rape/
Translations for Lamentations 5:11
New Living Translation
“Our enemies RAPE THE WOMEN in Jerusalem and the young girls in all the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version (ESV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
English Standard Version Anglicised (ESVUK)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Holman Christian Standard Bible (HCSB)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Standard Version (ISV)
“They have RAPED women in Zion, young women in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
NET Bible
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
GOD’S WORD® Translation
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Common English Bible (CEB)
“Women have been RAPED in Zion, young women in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)
“They have RAPED the women of Tziyon, virgins in the cities of Y’hudah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Contemporary English Version (CEV)
“On Zion and everywhere in Judah our wives and daughters are BEING RAPED.” – Lamentations 5:11
Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
“The enemy raped the women of Zion. They RAPED THE WOMEN in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Expanded Bible (EXB)
“The enemy [L They] ·ABUSED [VIOLATED; RAPED] the women ·of Jerusalem [L in Zion; C the location of the Temple] and the ·girls [L virgins] in the ·cities [towns] of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Good News Translation (GNT)
“Our wives have BEEN RAPED on Mount Zion itself; in every Judean village our daughters have been forced to submit.” – Lamentations 5:11
International Children’s Bible (ICB)
“The ENEMY RAPED the women of Jerusalem and the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Lexham English Bible (LEB)
“They RAPED women in Zion, young women[a] in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
Living Bible (TLB)
“They RAPE the women of Jerusalem and the girls in Judah’s cities.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Message (MSG)
“Our wives were RAPED in the streets in Zion, and our virgins in the cities of Judah.” Lamentations 5:11
Names of God Bible (NOG)
“Women in Zion are RAPED, so are the girls in the cities of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New American Bible (Revised Edition) (NABRE)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, young women in the cities of Judah…” – Lamentations 5:11
New English Translation (NET Bible)
“They RAPED women in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised (NRSVA)
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
New Revised Standard Version, Anglicised Catholic Edition
“Women are RAPED in Zion, virgins in the towns of Judah.” – Lamentations 5:11
The Voice (VOICE)
“In the place where God should be— Zion and the surrounding towns of Judah— Women, young and old alike, are BRUTALLY RAPED and violated.” – Lamentations 5:11
EVEN THE COMMENTARIES AGREE THAT ANAH MEANS RAPE:
Bridgeway Bible Commentary:
Conditions in Judah are terrible. The people have to search the barren country regions for food, and in doing so they risk death from desert bandits (9-10). Judean WOMEN ARE RAPED, former leaders are tortured, and children are forced to work like slaves (11-13). The old way of life has gone, and with it has gone all celebration and rejoicing (14-15). People everywhere are unhappy, discouraged and ashamed. They acknowledge that their sin has brought all this upon them (16-18). (Bridgeway Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible:
“They ravished the women … the virgins of the cities of Judah” (Lamentations 5:11). This is an accompanying vice of warfare that is just as much a part of modern wars as it was in antiquity. Nothing is more terrible and disgusting than the WHOLESALE RAPE of the women (all of them) by an army of enemies. The bestiality of wicked men unrestrained by any outside force is the utmost in depravity.
(Coffman’s Commentaries on the Bible – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable:
“The enemy had RAPED THE WOMEN and girls in Jerusalem and Judah. Respected princes had experienced the most humiliating deaths, and the enemy gave no respect to Judah”s elderly. Since Nebuchadnezzar evidently did not torture his victims (cf. Jeremiah 52:10-11; Jeremiah 52:24-27), it may be that the Chaldeans strung up the princes by their hands-after they had died-to dishonor them (cf. Deuteronomy 21:22-23). [Note: Keil, 2:451.]” (Expository Notes of Dr. Thomas Constable – Lamentations 5:11 – Online source)
Chuck Smith Bible Commentary:
“They ravished the women in Zion, and the maids in the cities of Judah ( Lamentations 5:11 ).
The enemies had come in. It must have been a horrible thing. The fathers to see their wives and their young daughters ravished by the enemy, RAPED and all and then murdered.” (Chuck Smith Bible Commentary – Lamentations 5:11 – online source)
American Old Testament scholar and the William Marcellus McPheeters Professor Emerita of Old Testament at Columbia Theological Seminary – Kathleen M. O’Connor:
“Women’s history
As symbolic figures, women convey mixed messages in Lamentations, but when the book speaks of real women, it tells of their history in painful and illuminating ways. The book brings into the open hidden victims of war who suffer long after the war’s end. Some verses mention women’s sufferings alongside those of men and other social groups. Young women have gone into captivity with young men (2:21). Young girls and elders grieve over Zion’s destruction (2:10). Other verses attend specifically to the plight of women. The male speaker grieves over ‘the fate of all the young women in my city’ (3:11). ‘WOMEN ARE RAPED in Zion’ (5:11).” (Women’s Bible Commentary: Expanded Edition [Edited by Carol Ann Newsom, Sharon H. Ringe, WJK – Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1998], by Kathleen M. O’Connor, page 190)
Dr. Charles H. Dyer:
“The first group mentioned who suffered the horrors of foreign occupation were the women of Jerusalem (Zion) and the virgins … of Judah. Women who survived the Babylonian assault on their cities were mercilessly RAPED BY THE SADISTIC SOLDIERS. In a scene of savage brutality, repeated by many conquering armies throughout history, the victors went on a wanton spree of lustful revenge against defenceless women.” (The Bible Knowledge Commentary: An Exposition Of the Scriptures By Dallas Seminary Faculty – Old Testament [Editors John F. Walvoord, Roy B. Zuck, 1983] by Charles H. Dyer, page 1222)
Professor of Old Testament David L. Petersen:
The elegant literary construction stands in constrast with the devastating destruction: much will be violated. The book of Lamentations, which reflects the fall of Jerusalem, refers to all three elements, the destruction of the city, presumably its walls (2:8); plundering (1:18) and violation of dwelling places (2:2); WOMEN RAPED (5:11).” (Zechariah 9-14 and Malachi: A Commentary [Westminister – John Knox Press Louisville – Kentucky, 1995], by David L. Petersen, page 141)
Professor David W. Chapman:
“The context of 5:11-14 concentrates on the horrors that women and men faced in the exilic period. After speaking of the rape RAPE OF THE WOMEN IN 5:11, the two verses above mention in descending social order the fate of the men (a similar order is reiterated in 5:14). The Hebrew perfect verbs are translated above with the English simple past; however, many modern interpreters (going back to Lam 5:1) understand these are current afflictions for the writer. (Ancient Jewish and Christian Perceptions of Crucifixion [Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen zum Neuen Testament, 2. Reihe – Mohr Siebeck, Tubingen, Germany, 2008], by David W. Chapman, page 158)
There you have it Sham-Moon, your god you worship allows rape, and forced sexual intercourse. Enjoy there will be more articles published exposing your pagan Babble 😉 🙂
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One of uneducated Shamoun’s tricks is to make long posts so as to give the impression that he has a bevy of evidence for his claims when in reality a good portion of his posts are nothing more than his emotionally disturbed rants. Another purpose served by these long posts is to spam his opponents out of a debate. Anyway,
Uneducated Shamoun: So you see that it is a mistranslation SINCE THE HADITH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT AISHA HAVING REACHED PUBERTY! Man, you really must feel stupid right about now!
Can you name one scholar who says ‘the age of remembering things’ isn’t a description of puberty?
Uneducated Shamoun: Here we have al-Bukhari mentioning Aisha’s marriage to Muhammad at the age of 9 AS AN EXAMPLE OF QURAN 65:4 WHICH ALLOWS GROWN MEN TO MARRY AND HAVE SEX WITH YOUNG PREPUBESCENT MINORS WHO THEY CAN EVEN DIVORCE FOR OTHER GROWN PERVERTS TO MARRY IF THEY WANT TO!
Where does Bukhari say 65:4 allows men to consummate marriages with prepubescent wives? Also, to what extent did classical jurists allow men to consummate marriages to prepubescent wives based on the hadith in question? To what extent did classical scholars understand 65.4 as permitting prepubescent intercourse? Please don’t run from these questions.
Shi’t: And contrary to your lie, Ibn Hajar forgot more about the hadiths then you could ever dream of learning and understanding. The fact is that the reason why Muhammad allowed Aisha to play with her barbie dolls is because she hadn’t reached puberty. Therefore, Muhammad decided to make things easier for her as she had to learn to live with the trauma of a 54 year old man having sex with her on a regular basis.
(1) Your statement about Ibn Hajar doesn’t make sense. (2) To what extent was Aisha traumatized by her relationship with Muhammad?
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Dude, talk about a guy who is really mentally challenged. Where does Bukhari talk abotu marriages with minors? You serious? DID YOU NOT READ THE HADITH CAREFULLY? Here it is again:
XXXIX. A man giving his young children in marriage
By the words of Allah, “that also applies to those WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED” (65:4) and He made the ‘idda of a girl before puberty three months.
4840. It is related from ‘A’isha that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and consummated it when she was nine, and she was his wife for nine years. (Aisha Bewley, The Sahih Collection of Al-Bukhari, Chapter 70. Book of Marriage)
Do you see the verse he is quoting? QURAN 65:4. Now was is that important. Here’s why:
And if you are in doubt as to the prescribed period for such of your women as have despaired of monthly courses, then know that the prescribed period for them is three months, and also for such AS DO NOT HAVE not have their monthly courses YET.. And as for those who are with child, their period shall be until they are delivered of their burden. And whoso fears ALLAH, HE will provide facilities for him in his affair. S. 65:4 Sher Ali
The surrounding context deals with the issue of the waiting period for divorce, and remarriage. The Quran is telling Muslims to wait for a certain period of time before making the divorce final or deciding to forego it. The Quran exhorts men to wait a period of three months in the case of women who either are no longer menstruating or haven’t even started their menstrual cycles! Thus, Islam permits men to marry prepubescent girls and even divorce them if they so choose!
This is further confirmed by the fact that according to Quran 33:49 THERE IS NO WAITING PERIOD FOR A WOMAN WHOSE MARRIAGE HASN’T BEEN CONSUMMATED BY SEXUAL INTERCOURSE!
Now note the narration in Sahih Al-Bukhari ONCE AGAIN:
Narrated Sahl bin Sad:
While we were sitting in the company of the Prophet a woman came to him and presented herself (for marriage) to him. The Prophet looked at her, lowering his eyes and raising them, but did not give a reply. One of his companions said, “Marry her to me O Allah’s Apostle!” The Prophet asked (him), “Have you got anything?” He said, “I have got nothing.” The Prophet said, “Not even an iron ring?” He said, “Not even an iron ring, but I will tear my garment into two halves and give her one half and keep the other half.” The Prophet; said, “No. Do you know some of the Quran (by heart)?” He said, “Yes.” The Prophet said, “Go, I have agreed to marry her to you with what you know of the Qur’an (as her Mahr).” ‘And for those who have no courses (i.e. they are still immature). (65.4) AND THE ‘IDDAT FOR THE GIRL BEFORE PUBERTY IS THREE MONTHS (in the above Verse). (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 63; emphasis ours)
Ibn Kathir writes regarding this verse:
, “The `Iddah is made up of cleanliness and the menstrual period.” So he divorces her while it is clear that she is pregnant, or he does not due to having sex, or since he does not know if she is pregnant or not. This is why the scholars said that there are two types of divorce, one that conforms to the Sunnah and another innovated. The divorce that conforms to the Sunnah is one where the husband pronounces one divorce to his wife when she is not having her menses and without having had sexual intercourse with her after the menses ended. One could divorce his wife when it is clear that she is pregnant. As for the innovated divorce, it occurs when one divorces his wife when she is having her menses, or after the menses ends, has sexual intercourse with her and then divorces her, even though he does not know if she became pregnant or not. There is a third type of divorce, which is neither a Sunnah nor an innovation where one divorces A YOUNG WIFE WHO HAS NOT BEGUN TO HAVE MENSES, the wife who is beyond the age of having menses, and divorcing one’s wife before the marriage was consummated.
And:
The `Iddah of Those in Menopause and Those Who do not have Menses
Allah the Exalted clarifies the waiting period of the woman in menopause. And that is the one whose menstruation has stopped due to her older age. Her `Iddah is three months instead of the three monthly cycles for those who menstruate, which is based upon the Ayah in (Surat) Al-Baqarah. [see 2:228] The same for THE YOUNG, WHO HAVE NOT REACHED THE YEARS OF MENSTRUATION…
Ibn Abi Hatim recorded a simpler narration than this one from Ubay bin Ka`b who said, “O Allah’s Messenger! When the Ayah in Surat Al-Baqarah was revealed prescribing the `Iddah of divorce, some people in Al-Madinah said, `There are still some women whose `Iddah has not been mentioned in the Qur’an. There are THE YOUNG, the old whose menstruation is discontinued, and the pregnant.’ Later on, this Ayah was revealed…
Still not convinced that your wicked religion allows men to have sex with minors before they attain puberty? Well then, here goes:
Tafsir al-Jalalayn
And [as for] those of your women who (read allā’ī or allā’i in both instances) no longer expect to menstruate, if you have any doubts, about their waiting period, their prescribed [waiting] period shall be three months, and [also for] those who have not yet menstruated, BECAUSE OF THEIR YOUNG AGE, their period shall [also] be three months — both cases apply to other than those whose spouses have died; for these [latter] their period is prescribed in the verse: they shall wait by themselves for four months and ten [days] [Q. 2:234]. …
Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs
(And for such of your women as despair of menstruation) because of old age, (if ye doubt) about their waiting period, (their period (of waiting) shall be three months) upon which another man asked: “O Messenger of Allah! What about the waiting period of those who do not have menstruation BECAUSE THEY ARE TOO YOUNG?” (along with those who have it not) because of young age, their waiting period is three months.
Asbab Al-Nuzul by Al-Wahidi
(And for such of your women as despair of menstruation…) [65:4]. Said Muqatil: “When the verse (Women who are divorced shall wait, keeping themselves apart…), Kallad ibn al-Nu‘man ibn Qays al-Ansari said: ‘O Messenger of Allah, what is the waiting period of the woman who does not menstruate and the woman who has not menstruated yet? And what is the waiting period of the pregnant woman?’ And so Allah, exalted is He, revealed this verse”. Abu Ishaq al-Muqri’ informed us> Muhammad ibn ‘Abd Allah ibn Hamdun> Makki ibn ‘Abdan> Abu’l-Azhar> Asbat ibn Muhammad> Mutarrif> Abu ‘Uthman ‘Amr ibn Salim who said: “When the waiting period for divorced and widowed women was mentioned in Surah al-Baqarah, Ubayy ibn Ka‘b said: ‘O Messenger of Allah, some women of Medina are saying: there are other women who have not been mentioned!’ He asked him: ‘And who are they?’ He said: ‘THOSE WHO ARE TOO YOUNG [SUCH THAT THEY HAVE NOT STARTED MENSTRUATING YET], those who are too old [whose menstruation has stopped] and those who are pregnant’. And so this verse (And for such of your women as despair of menstruation…) was revealed”.
Tafsir al-Kabir by Ar-Razi
{and those who have not menstruated yet} A man stood and asked: ‘O messenger of Allah, what is the period (Iddah) of THE YOUNG GIRL WHO HAS NOT YET MENSTRUATED?’ Then Allah revealed {and those who have not menstruated yet}, meaning that her Iddah is like the old-aged woman who reached her menopause. (Arabic Source; translation by Mutee’a Al-Fadi)
Tafsir Al-Qurtubi
{and those who have not menstruated yet} Meaning the young girl.(*)
[Note: * Here “young” (as-sagheerah) denotes a girl who did not reach the age of puberty yet.]
It is noteworthy that Al-Baidawi simply repeats the Quranic phrase, i.e. the explanation is identical to the phrase that is to be explained. Maybe Al-Baidawi felt the need to comment because the issue is controversial, but since the statement itself is clear, you better accept it as it is. Perhaps this is an attempt of persuasion by repetition?
Tafsir al-Qur’an by Al-Fayrooz Abadi
{and those who have not menstruated yet} Those who did not menstruate DUE TO THEIR YOUNG AGE.
Al-dar al-manthour fi al-tafseer bil ma’thour by As-Suyuti
{and those who have not menstruated yet} They are THE YOUNG GIRLS (jawari) WHO HAVE NOT MENSTRUATED YET.
Tafsir Muqatil ibn Sulayman
{and those who have not menstruated yet} … means the Iddah of THE YOUNG GIRLS (jawari) WHO HAVE NOT MENSTRUATED YET, and they were married and then divorced.
We conclude with excerpts from two important commentaries from the 20th century.
English Tafsir Ma’ariful Qur’an by Maulana Mufti Muhammad Shafi‘ and Mufti Muhammad Taqi Usmani
… and in the terminology of Shari’ah the term ‘‘iddah means the waiting period prescribed for a divorced woman before she can marry another man. [p. 493] … Women who do not menstruate, BECAUSE THEY HAVE NOT YET ATTAINED PUBERTY, or because they have attained menopausal age, … [p. 494] … This procedure applies in the case of the women whose ‘‘iddah is calculated by menstrual cycles or clean cycles. It does not apply to women for whom waiting-period is not compulsory, as in the case of a woman who did not have privacy with her husband. If a man and a woman got married but they did not get together in privacy, ‘‘iddah is not necessary for her at all when she is divorced. Therefore, it is permissible to divorce such women during their monthly courses. Likewise, ‘‘iddah for a woman who does not menstruate ON ACCOUNT OF MINORITY OF AGE, or because she has attained menopausal age, is computed on monthly basis. Their ‘‘iddah is three months. [pp. 495-6]
Finally, Tafhim al-Qur’an by Abu-Ala’ Maududi:
“Therefore, making mention of the waiting-period for girls WHO HAVE NOT YET MENSTRUATED, clearly proves that it is not only permissible to give away the girl at this age BUT IT IS PERMISSIBLE FOR THE HUSBAND TO CONSUMMATE MARRIAGE WITH HER. Now, obviously NO MUSLIM HAS THE RIGHT TO FORBID A THING which the Qur’an HAS HELD AS PERMISSIBLE.” (Maududi, volume 5, p. 620, note 13, emphasis added)
Moreover, you don’t need to reach puberty to be able to recall events in your life, since you have children as young as five or six who start understanding things and are able to remember them later in life. Talk about desperate and outright laughable!
Time for you to find another religion and abandon this filthy deen once and for all, just like your former brother Converted2Islam has done, all glory to the Lord Jesus!
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Shamoun is INFERRING HIS OWN PERVERTED SICKENING interpretation on to the verse. He sees everything in sexual way. He got that perverted mind attached to him as a result of the Bible.
Shamoun as usual. He has no problem with his Jesus (God) allowing and permitting (BIBLE) his soldiers to penetrate (rape) pre-pubescent girls, yet has the cheek to talk about Aisha’s marriage:
TWO accurate translations which clearly show that the passage only speaks about ‘female children’ are as follows:
Jubilee Bible 2000 – “But all the FEMALE CHILDREN children that have not known a man by lying with him keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
Webster’s Bible – “Translation But all the FEMALE CHILDREN that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for YOURSELVES.” – Numbers 31:18
https://discover-the-truth.com/2015/10/29/child-marriage-in-the-bible/
Christian scholars say MARRIAGE with pre-pubescent was allowed:
Whedon’s Commentary on the Bible:
Verse 17-18.
The little ones — The object of the command to kill every male was to exterminate the whole nation, the cup of whose iniquity was full. For the righteousness of the mode see Joshua 6:21, note. Every woman who might possibly have been engaged in the licentious worship of Peor was to share the fate of the male children, to preserve Israel from all taint of that abomination. The pure maidens could be incorporated into Israel without peril to the national religion. Joshua 6:23-25, notes. They could not be treated as concubines, since the law against fornication was in full force, (Deuteronomy 22:25-29,) but THEY COULD BE LAWFULLY MARRIED TO THEIR CAPTORS (DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14).
Peter Pett’s Commentary on the Bible:
Numbers 31:18
‘But all the women-children, who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.’ But the young women children were a different matter. THEY COULD BE TAKEN IN MARRIAGE or as servants and would expect to accept the religion of their new husbands or masters. They would gradually be merged into Israel. Compare DEUTERONOMY 21:10-14. They would not feel the same responsibility for blood vengeance which was mainly incumbent on the males.[2]
Notice both commentaries direct readers to READ Deuteronomy 21:14:
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 Good News Translation (GNT)
“10 When the Lord your God gives you victory in battle and you take prisoners, 11 you may see among them a beautiful woman that you like and want to marry. 12 TAKE HER to your home, where she will shave her head, cut her fingernails, 13 and change her clothes. She is to stay in your home and mourn for her parents for a month; after that, you may marry her. 14 Later, if you no longer want her, you are to let her go free. Since you FORCED HER TO HAVE INTERCOURSE (ANAH) WITH YOU, you cannot treat her as a slave and sell her.”
There you have it, Jesus, who is God of the Old Testament allowed marriage and the rape of pre-pubescent girls. Deuteronomy is about RAPE, this fact is referenced in the following five articles;
1
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/29/deuteronomy-211014-hebrew-word-anah-means-rape/
2
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/deuteronomy-2110-14-soldiers-raped-women/
3
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/hebrew-word-anah-inna-carries-the-meaning-of-rape/
4,
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/30/biblical-law-forces-rapist-to-marry-victim-anahinna/
5,
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/08/01/rape-in-ezekiel-2211-and-deuteronomy-2114/
GOD willing there will be more articles published how the filthy, made up god Sham-moon worships allows and permits rape all throughout the Bible, from the Old Testament to the Testament. 😉 :p
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Sam’s lack of education clearly shows. I asked him to name me a scholar who doesn’t equate the age of remembering things with pubertyand he gives me his own opinion, as if the opinion of an uneducated piece of crap with bi polar disorder matters. I asked him to show me where Bukhari infers from 65.4 that sex with prepubescent wives are allowed and he copy and pastes stuff after stuff about the ‘Idda’ of prepubescent girls which is not what I asked for. I asked him to what extent Muslim jurists understood the Hadith of Aisha’s age as sanctioning sex with prepubescent wives which he ignored. I asked him to what extent Muslim jurists understood 65.4 as permitting men to have sex with prepubescent wives which again is met with a deluge of copy and pasted stuff on idda that I didn’t bother to read. I asked him to prove Aisha was traumatized which he again ignored.
As I said, one of Shamoun’s tricks is to make exceedingly long posts so as to fool readers into thinking he has an unlimited supply of evidence for his position when in reality a great portion of his posts are just disturbed rants.
Let me make this simple for you. What is the standard position among classical Muslim jurists regarding the consummation of marriage with prepubescent girls?
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Paul’s Pal
Your God became man and had sex a minor(Mary) and gave birth to himself. Your God himself(Jesus Christ) according to you had to stay and feritized by the womb of a minor(Mary) and you are ok. with that.
You just keep spamming this page with your uneducated and unresearched posts. Dr. Browm reminded anyone that both Christians and Jews marry young women at the time of our prophet and they did not see anything wrong with his marriage to Aisha(RA).
Untill in the 1900’s, there was no age limitations when it comes to marriage but most religious people follow the puberty and adolescence in people. It was until last century when the age limit of 14,15,16etc. was made standard by some countries.
These 14,15,16 etc. are allowed to have sex among their age groups and it brings teenage pregnancies, prostitution, lack of respect from such people, drug, rape, murder, school drop out etc.
It is better for a adolescent person to get some one who will take care of him to marry whether young or old, than to restrict sex to young people which is really causing problems and one of our problems now a days.
Our prophets and Jews and Christians married young women and we did not read about teenage pregnancy, drug, gangs etc. among youth at their time.
It is only fools like Sam Shamoun who has no proper education who will use his time without his brain to be writing nonsense,. I am happy some Christians do not take Sam Shamoun serious any more. It is Chrstians who reduced Sam Shamoun to rabble with the help of some Muslims. He is a liar like Dr.Nabeel Quraish; At least Nabeel is a Doctor and we respect him for that. Sam Shamoun status = 0. Sam has nothing to boast of except big stomach full of filth and shit.
Thanks.
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I believe Aisha was 9, therefore she was a child when it happened. However there are a lot of factors that people should think about before jumping to conclusions.
Abu Bakr her father, approved of the marriage so he clearly did not see anything wrong with it. I haven’t come across any hadiths criticising Muhammad for marrying Aisha at a young age (if there is one perhaps someone can show me). Muhammad had at least 13 wives who were grown women (apart from Aisha), so he clearly wasn’t a paedophile nor did he have some kind of fetish for little girls. His marriage to Aisha was for political reasons as it strengthened his position in Arabia. Of course he did eventually love Aisha very much but there’s no indication of when that happened. My opinion is that it happened when she grew older, perhaps 14, 16 or 18 I don’t know.
People in ancient times used to marry quite young. It was common for Royal heirs to be married around the age of 12 and 14 across many different cultures, even in Europe. Lifespans have always fluctuated throughout history but the general trend is that people had shorter lifespans in ancient times and only recently have we been able to find people on a larger scale worldwide living up til their 80s and 90s.
Times have changed though, and I don’t think it would be normal for a man in his 50s to marry a 9 year old today but sadly it does happen and for many of these young girls it is a sad and painful process that has on occasion led to death. One thing to note, even though the hadiths say Aisha was 6 or 9, from what I’ve seen there is no mention as to what age she was when she first had sex with Muhammad. My opinion is that Muhammad waited until she was older and those men today who marry little girls should be patient and wait until their bride is much older before putting them through such a painful process at a young age. Ultimately this is a cultural issue, as our cultures have changed so have our views. In England a few centuries ago it would have been normal for 12 and 14 year olds to be married, but now that’s changed. Perhaps as someone mentioned above, our society has become less mature so it takes longer for the younger generation to grow mentally compared to times before.
I think the modern Muslim commentators who say Aisha was much older are simply embarrassed about the facts and struggle with the abuse that non-Muslims throw at them about Aisha’ age. I can’t blame them though, it’s hard to be honest with people who simply want to attack you or your beliefs without considering the circumstances or context, so you may end up sugar coating to prevent further criticism or damage. I’m not here to argue about whether this marriage was right or wrong, just that we need more honest discourse between all the Abrahamic faiths, we are after all, brothers and sisters who all believe in the same God. The Quran says it well in Surah 29:46, that we all surrender or submit to God, whether we are Jew, Christian or Muslim. Likewise Jesus also said “For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.” (Matthew 12:50)
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@Paul’s Pal
For all christians who copy from David Wood’s site.
(Deut 21:11-14) has nothing to do with marriage .
Satanic Christians have been always playing with the translations.
If the (Deut 21:11-14) had anything to do with marriage, why would God command that Israeli man to (release )that captive woman and not to (divorce) her?
We read in (Deut 21:14) “But if you marry her and she does not please you, you must let her go free. You may not sell her or treat her as a slave, for you have humiliated her”
Why would God command that man not to SELL her ? Wasn’t that the normal situation when a husband divorces his wife? Why was there a need to instruct that man?
Then, what kind of (Humiliation) that man did for that woman?
If we read the Hebrew text, we will find the answer.
The term which is used in Hebrew is (עִנִּיתָֽהּ׃)!!
Guess what?
The same term (עִנִּיתָֽהּ׃) has been used in Genesis 34:2 in the story of Dinah which has been translated to (Rape).
The term in Hebrew is pronounced as (anah). in Arabic is (anna)
I’m an Arabic man, and I know how that term is used. It’s used to describe any act which has been done by FORCE.
Note (Deut21:11-14) has nothing to do with Marriage. Baal could be used as (husband). However, it means the (owner) in Arabic and Hebrew.
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What’s the matter Sam? Afraid to engage an educated person who can see through your bullsh’it?
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Things are not looking for the uneducated, filthy piece of garbage, Shamoun. I asked him to name one scholar who says age of remembering doesn’t imply puberty, and all Shamoun could do was give me his own silly opinion not realizing that the opinions of an uneducated piece of shi’t doesn’t matter. Ladies and gentleman, here’s a classically trained, Syrian Hadith scholar, Salah Al Din Al Idlibi’s examination of the Hadith in question:
Bukhari narrated by way Aisha that she said “by the time I could make out the world, my parents were Muslim, during that time, no day would pass except with the visit of the prophet during the day and the night. So when the Muslims were tested (prosecuted), Abu Bakr left in migration towards Alhabasha (Ethiopia), and when he reached the area of Alghimad he was met by Ibn Aldaghna…”
There are two arguments to be made from this narration:
1- A child would generally not comprehend something as intangible as religiosity of others by the age of four. Had Aisha been born in the 4th year before the message, and her first comprehension would have been at 8 years old, she statement “I was aware of my parents’ religiosity” irrelevant. Since Abu Bakr was known to have been one of the earliest converts to Islam, and Um Ruman became Muslim in Mecca long before, as narrated by Ibn Saa’ad.
However if she was born before the Message by 4 years, and her first comprehension of the world at the first year of the message, that statement would make sense. That her first comprehension of the world was that of both her parents’ religiousity rather than just one parent. This proves that she was born before the message by four years, and this is confirmed in other evidences and sources.
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Here’s the source
http://www.academia.edu/12866608/A_Modern_Matn_Criticism_on_the_Tradition_on_%C4%80_%C4%ABshas_Age_of_Marriage_Translation_and_Analysis
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Sham out has chickened out!
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Please send the following to your friend Sham, when you have time 😉
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/08/02/bible-how-old-was-dinah-when-she-was-married-to-shechem/
The above evidence shows that YHWH approved Jacob to give her SEVEN YEAR OLD DAUGHTER DINAH to Shechem in MARRIAGE. This account is related in Genesis.
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Forgive me friend, but why would I rob Sam of his peace by delivering a message from a man that follows a prophet that urinates like a girl?
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Albert, are you the type of Shamoun follower who also worships god-Jesus pen** every night and day? Only pagans do these things.
Did you know that Jesus is described in Revelations as being a “Hermaphrodite”?
Repent! Cease from your pagan activities
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Careful Albert… if you don’t want your first comment to be your last on this blog
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A prophet that urinates like a girl? This is the extent of Wood’s propaganda? Wood is a severely disturbed, piece of sh’it.
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He is indeed.
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ENJOY! http://www.reformedapologeticsministries.com/2016/08/muhammads-marriage-to-prepubescent.html
what was that about chickening out? The sham is your profit and his god.
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The piss and urine has been refuted here. Please don’t get a heart attack 😉
http://www.letmeturnthetables.com/2011/05/did-prophet-commend-people-drinking-his.html
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Now sine flyingmutalover seems to have a “penis” fixation it seems I am going to need to humiliate his wicked profit and demon whom he worshiped.
First, I challenge flyingstonekisser to quote a single passage where it says that Dinah was seven years old. He again reads the Bible as if it is his filthy Quran and sunn which enshrines grown jihadi thugs to have sex with young minors. See the above quotes for the proof.
Now let’s see who really worshiped “penises,” “vulvas/vaginas,” piss, saliva etc. In the following examples we see Muhammad’s followers drinking the piss that came out of his “penis” which he used to physically violate a young minor, and also drinking his blood and dirty water, as well as smear his filthy saliva all over their bodies:
The worship which Muslims gave (give) to Muhammad can be seen from situations where his followers would drink Muhammad’s urine and smear his spittle on themselves, thinking that they would receive a blessing or a cure as a result of it!
One of the scholars concerned with reports about the Prophet and his qualities related that when he wanted to defecate, the earth split open and swallowed up his faeces and urine, and it gave off a fragrant smell.
Muhammad ibn Sa’d, al-Waqidi’s scribe, related that ‘A’isha said to the Prophet, “When you come from relieving yourself, we do not see anything noxious from you.” He said, “‘A’isha, don’t you know that the earth swallows up what comes out of the prophets so that none of it is seen?”
Although this tradition is not famous, the people of knowledge still mention the purity of his faeces and urine…
There was also a time when Malik ibn Sinan DRANK HIS BLOOD on the Day of Uhud and licked it up. The Prophet allowed him to do that and then said, “The Fire will not touch you.”
Something similar occurred when ‘Abdullah ibn az-Zubayr drank cupped blood. The Prophet said, “Woe to you from the people and woe to the people from you,” but he did not object to what he had done.
Something similar is related about when a woman DRANK SOME OF HIS URINE. He told her, “You will never complain of a stomach-ache.”
He did not order any of them to wash their mouths out nor did he forbid them to do it again.
The hadith of the woman drinking the urine is sound. Ad-Daraqutni follows Muslim and al-Bukhari who relate it in the Sahih. The name of this woman was Baraka, but they disagree about her lineage. Some say that it was Umm Ayman, a wooden cup he placed under his bed in which he would urinate during the night. One night he urinated in it and when he examined it in the morning there was nothing in it. He asked Baraka about that. She said, “I got up and felt thirsty, so I drank it without knowing.” The hadith is related by Ibn Jurayj and others.
The Prophet was born circumcised with his umbilical cord cut… (pp. 35-37)
yad continues:
When Quraysh sent ‘Urwa ibn Mas’ud to the Messenger of Allah in the year of al-Hudaybiyya, he saw the unparalleled respect which his Companions displayed towards him. Whenever he did ‘wudu THEY RAN TO GET HIS LEFTOVER ‘WUDU WATER AND NEARLY FOUGHT OVER IT. IF HE SPAT THEY TOOK IT WITH THEIR HANDS AND WIPED IT ON THEIR FACES AND BODIES. If a hair of his fell they ran to get it. If he commanded them to do something, they ran to do his command. If he spoke, they lowered their voices in his presence. They did not stare at him due to their respect for him. When he returned to Quraysh, he said, “People of Quraysh! I have been to Chosroes in his kingdom, and Caesar in his kingdom and the Negus in his kingdom, but by Allah, I have not seen any king among his people treated anything like the way Muhammad is treated by his Companions.” …
Anas said, “I saw the Messenger when his hair was being shaved. His companions were around him and whenever a lock fell, a man picked it up.” (Iyad, pp. 236-237)
The sahih ahadith narrate the same thing:
… Before embracing Islam Al-Mughira was in the company of some people. He killed them and took their property and came (to Medina) to embrace Islam. The Prophet said (to him, “As regards your Islam, I accept it, but as for the property I do not take anything of it. (As it was taken through treason). Urwa then started looking at the Companions of the Prophet. By Allah, whenever Allah’s Apostle spat, the spittle would fall in the hand of one of them (i.e. the Prophet’s companions) WHO WOULD RUB IT ON HIS FACE AND SKIN; if he ordered them they would carry his orders immediately; if he performed ablution, they would struggle to take the remaining water; and when they spoke to him, they would lower their voices and would not look at his face constantly out of respect. Urwa returned to his people and said, “O people! By Allah, I have been to the kings and to Caesar, Khosrau and An-Najashi, yet I have never seen any of them respected by his courtiers as much as Muhammad is respected by his companions. By Allah, if he spat, the spittle would fall in the hand of one of them (i.e. the Prophet’s companions) who would rub it on his face and skin; if he ordered them, they would carry out his order immediately; if he performed ablution, they would struggle to take the remaining water; and when they spoke, they would lower their voices and would not look at his face constantly out of respect.” (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 3, Book 50, Number 891)
And you pagans claim that you don’t worship this vile false profit!
More in the next post.
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The piss and urine been refuted here. Please don’t get a heart attack 😉
http://www.letmeturnthetables.com/2011/05/did-prophet-commend-people-drinking-his.html
Could you Shamoun please answer some of my questions:
1. Why did God (Jesus) allow Jacob to give his 7-year-old daughter away in marriage to Shechem?
2. Why didn’t Jesus (God) stop child marriages in Jacob’s time, if it was something he was against, as YOU claim shamoun??
3. You said ‘show’, the evidence it is ALL in there. Try do a response to this article, you will dig a bigger whole for yourself ;p 😉
Here in the following article, there is a number of proofs from GENESIS where Jacob gave away her daughter in marriage when she was 7 (SEVEN) YEARS OLD, yes you heard it right. I was actually being generous with the number 7, it was a lot lower:
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/08/02/bible-how-old-was-dinah-when-she-was-married-to-shechem/
Why did Jesus your god allow Moses to marry/rape/penetrate pre-pubescent girls in the Bible?
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/11/14/bible-does-numbers-3118-sanction-pre-pubescent-marriages-child-marriage-2/
God willing I will be publishing another article where Jesus, your god allowed Moses to rape pre-pubescent girls.
Enjoy, read them articles slowly, make sure the ambulance is on standby we don’t want you to have a heart attack 😉
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Time to muzzle Muhammad’s dog again.
Here is the obliteration of your lie that God allowed his men to sleep or rape with prepubescent girls like your filthy profit did:
http://answeringislam.net/Responses/Osama/pedophilia.htm
http://christianthinktank.com/midian.html
Now let me make it easier for you. QUOTE A VERSE FROM GENESIS WHERE IT SAYS THAT DINAH WAS SEVEN YEARS OLD. I know you see the filth, pornography and pedophilia of your profit all over the Holy Bible, but I am sorry to burst your bubble, the Bible is not the filthy porn you call Quran and Sunna.
ONCE AGAIN. PLEASE QUOTE THE VERSE WHERE IT SAYS SHE WAS SEVEN.
Man you really must feel stupid for giving me the chance to expose your profit to such shame and humiliation on a blog that is supposed to be about Islam! ROFL!
By by stone kisser!
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If you get the time to read the article, the evidence is there. I am not here to convince and spoon feed, a pagan that worships a P every day.
I will God willing expose Christianity for what it is, a pagan man-made that has no relation to the true Monotheism that was preached by Jesus.
😉
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Flyingibnmuta’s love for “penises” is simply the result of his being influenced by his profit and jinn. The following quotes show that Flyinghourilover’s god is so fascinated with “penises” and “vulvas/vaginas” that he turned his paradise into a whore house where he created and placed swelling breasted whores for jihadi thugs like him to spend all eternity deflowering with erect “penises”:
Wherein both will be those (maidens) restraining their glances upon their husbands, whom no man or jinn YATMITHUNNA (HAS OPENED THEIR HYMENS WITH SEXUAL INTERCOURSE) before them… Houris (beautiful, fair females) restrained in pavilions; Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinns and men) deny? Whom no man or jinn YATMITHUNNA (HAS OPENED THEIR HYMENS WITH SEXUAL INTERCOURSE) before them. S. 55:56, 72-74 Hilali-Khan
Surely for the godfearing awaits a place of security, gardens and vineyards and maidens WITH SWELLING BREASTS, like of age, and a cup overflowing. S. 78:31-34 Arberry
Thus, the Quran speaks of heavenly creatures who have swelling breasts and who shall be physically penetrated, or deflowered, by both men and jinn!
Lest this child of Lucifer deny that the Quran describes Allah’s abode as a whore house we will cite some of Islam’s premier scholars to refute him:
meaning, wide-eyed maidens WITH FULLY DEVELOPED BREASTS. Ibn ‘Abbas, Mujahid and others have said, …
“This means ROUND BREASTS. They meant by this THAT THE BREASTS OF THESE GIRLS WILL BE FULLY ROUNDED AND NOT SAGGING, because they will be virgins, equal in age…” (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Abridged), (Surat At-Tagabun to the end of the Qur’an), First Edition: September 2000, Volume 10, pp. 333-334; capital emphasis ours)
Interestingly, there is one Sunni Muslim writer that quotes certain Muslim authorities who admit that the Quran’s language here is quite erotic and that this particular reference even causes persons to get aroused. In response to the unfairness of men having up to 70 wives whereas women will only have one husband in paradise, Shaykh G.F. Haddad states:
We do not know with certainty that there will be such a restriction on women even if the reverse would hardly be mentionable to a decent woman. A woman in the traditional world would and does consider it a horrible thing to say to her that “You can have all the men you want”! The Qur’an would never use inappropriate language. However, the Qur’an does mention that for the inhabitants of Paradise – male and female – {There wait on them immortal youths} (56:17), {There serve them youths of everlasting youth, whom, when you see them, you would take for scattered pearls} (76:19). If this does not make a believing woman happy then, as Imam al-Shafi`i said to the one WHO IS NOT MOVED BY EROTIC POETRY, “You have no feelings.” As for the believing men, as one of the Awliya said, some of them will need GHUSL just FOR HEARING THE VERSE {Same-age young-bosomed girls} (78:33). As for us hard-hearted analphabets we may read it and read it without effect. (Haddad, Sex with slaves and women’s rights; capital emphasis ours)
Ghusl refers, in this specific context, to the ritual bathing of the body that a Muslim must perform after sexual intercourse or because of a seminal discharge. What the author is essentially saying is that Surah 78:33 can cause a person to be aroused to such an extent that he ends up having an emission!
In other words, this Muslims is admitting that reading flyingstonekisser’s filthy book can cause a man to ejaculate all over himself! YUCK!!!!
Another famous commentator, ar-Razi, stated in his Tafsir (Volume 8, p. 311) that:
“The kawa`ib are the buxom girls (nawahid) whose breasts have become FULL (taka“abat) and ROUND (tafallakat).” (bold and capital emphasis ours)
Ibn Kathir said of Q. 55:56 that:
meaning they are delightful virgins of comparable age who never had sexual intercourse with anyone, whether from mankind or Jinns, before their husbands. This is also a proof that the believers among the Jinns will enter Paradise. Artat bin Al-Mundhir said, “Damrah bin Habib was asked if the Jinns will enter Paradise and he said, `Yes, and they will get married. The Jinns will have Jinn women and the humans will have female humans.’” Allah’s statement, …
Then Allah describes these women for the proposed…
Mujahid, Al-Hasan, Ibn Zayd and others said, “They are as pure as rubies and white as Marjan.” So here they described Marjan as pearls… (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Abridged), (Surat Al-Jathiyah to the end of Surat Al-Munafiqun), First Edition: September 2000, Volume 9, pp. 400-401)
He also wrote in respect to Q. 56:35-37 that flyingibnmuta’s jinn will give sexual perverts like him the sex drive of a hundred men so he can spend all eternity deflowering the whores of paradise:
Abu Dawud At-Tayalisi recorded that Anas said that the Messenger of Allah said…
Anas said, “I asked, ‘O Allah’s Messenger! Will one be able to do that? He said,
((He will be given the strength OF A HUNDRED (MEN).))
At-Tirmidhi also recorded it and said, “Sahih Gharib.” Abu Al-Qasim At-Tabarani recorded that Abu Hurayrah said that the Messenger of Allah was asked, “O Allah’s Messenger! Will we have sexual intercourse with our wives in Paradise?” He said…
((The man will be able to have sexual intercourse WITH A HUNDRED VIRGINS IN ONE DAY.))
Al-Hafiz Abu ‘Abdullah Al-Maqisi said, “In my view, the Hadith meets the criteria of the Sahih, and Allah knows best.” (Ibid., pp. 429-430; capital emphasis ours)
The two Jalals noted in reference to Q. 56:36 that,
and made them virgins, immaculate – every time their spouses enter them they find them virgins, NOR IS THERE ANY PAIN [OF DEFLORATION] – (Tafsir al-Jalalayn; capital emphasis ours)
And regarding Q. 36:55 they say:
Indeed today the inhabitants of Paradise are busy (read fi shughlin or fi shughulin), [oblivious] to what the inhabitants of the Fire are suffering, [busy] delighting in pleasures such as DEFLOWERING VIRGINS – not busy with anything wearisome, as there is no toil in Paradise – rejoicing, blissful (fakihuna is a second predicate of inna, the first being fi shugulin, ‘busy’); (Tafsir al-Jalalayn; capital emphasis ours)
And here is what the hadith compiler Ibn Majah stated about the sexual organs of the men and the maidens of paradise:
4337. Abu ‘Umama (Allah be pleased with him) reported that Allah’s Messenger (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said, “Allah will not admit anyone in the Paradise but Allah, the Mighty and Glorious, will marry him with seventy two wives: two will be from virgins (haurine) with big eyes and seventy will be his inheritance from the people of the Hell-Fire (1). Everyone of them will have A PLEASANT VAGINA and HE (the man) WILL HAVE A SEXUAL ORGAN THAT DOES NOT BEND DOWN (during sexual intercourse).”
Hisham b. Khalid says, “The words ‘out of his inheritance (due) from the denizens of the Fire’, many men who will enter the Fire and the inmates of the Paradise will inherit their wives just as Faraoh’s[sic] wife will be inherited (by the believer).”
According to al-Zawa’id, its isnad has some controversy. Al-‘Ajali has declared Khalid b. Yazid b. Abi Malik reliable while Imam Ahmad, Ibn Mu’in, Abu Dawud, Nasa’i, Ibn Jarud Sahi, ‘Uqail etc., have declare[sic] Ahmad b. Salih al-Misri da’if. (Sunan Ibn-I-Majah (Imam Abu Abdullah Muhammad b. Yazid Ibn-I-Maja Al-Qazwini), English version by Muhammad Tufail Ansari [Kazi Publications, Lahore (Pakistan), 1st edition 1995], Chapter NO. XXXIX, “The Description of the Paradise”, Volume V, p. 546; capital emphasis ours)
Now let’s see what the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer, says about this filthy trash book you guys call holy and about turning paradise into a whore house:
“Jesus answered them, ‘Do you not err, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God? When they rise from the dead, THEY NEITHER MARRY NOR ARE GIVEN IN MARRIAGE, but are like angels in heaven.'” Mark 12:24-25
“Jesus answered, ‘You err, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God. For in the resurrection THEY NEITHER MARRY NOR ARE GIVEN IN MARRIAGE, but are like the angels of God in heaven.” Matthew 22:29-30
“Jesus answered them, ‘The sons of this age marry and are given in marriage. But those who are counted worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, NEITHER MARRY NOR ARE GIVEN IN MARRIAGE. For they cannot die any more, for they are equal to the angels and are the sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.'” Luke 20:34-36
I have more filth for flyingmutalover in the next post. So enjoy!
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FLYINGHOURIDEFLOWERER will really love this since it shows his god’s fascination with the private parts of women whom he likes to blow into!
And (remember) her who guarded her SEXUAL ORGAN (Arabic- farjahaa): We breathed into her from Our Spirit, and We made her and her son a Sign for all people. S. 21:91
And Mary the daughter of ‘Imran, who guarded her SEXUAL ORGAN (Arabic- farjahaa) and We breathed INTO IT of Our spirit; and she testified to the truth of the words of her Lord and of His revelations, and was one of the devout (servants). S. 66:12
The word farjahaa, from farj, refers to a person’s private area, to their private parts.
Mahmoud M. Ayoub contrasts the birth narratives of the Gospel of Luke with that mentioned in the Quran. All capital emphasis is ours:
“The language of this verse (author- Luke 1:35) is clearly circumspect. It implies no sexual union or divine generation of any kind. Furthermore, while Luke’s description agrees both in form and spirit with the Qur’anic idea of the conception of Christ, the language of the Qur’an IS FAR MORE GRAPHIC AND OPEN TO INTERPRETATION.” (Christian-Muslim Encounters, ed. Yvonne Yazbeck Haddad & Wadi Z. Haddad [University Press of Florida, 1995], p. 67)
He goes on to say:
“… Then of Mary He (author-allegedly God) continues: ‘And she who guarded well [lit. fortified] her chastity [lit. GENERATIVE ORGAN], and thus We breathed INTO HER of our spirit, and We made her and her son a sign [or miracle, ‘Aya] for all beings’ (S. 21:90-91) …
“In the second instance the Qur’an speaks of Mary as a righteous woman who lived in strict chastity and obedience to God: ‘And Mary daughter of ‘Imran who guarded well her GENERATIVE ORGAN farjaha, and thus We breathed INTO HER of our spirit’ (S. 66:12). THE BOLD AND GRAPHIC STATEMENT APPEARS TO HAVE SHOCKED TRADITIONISTS AND COMMENTATORS, so that most of them tried to cover it up with different and FARFETCHED significations or glossed over it with out comment…
“Ibn Kathir interprets the phrase ‘guarded well her generative organ’ to mean: ‘safeguarded and protected it. Guarding well ihsan signifies chastity and high birth.’ He comments on the phrase, ‘and thus We breathed into it of our spirit’ thus ‘that is, through the angel Gabriel. This is because God sent him to her, and he took for her the form of a man of good stature (S. 19:17). God commanded him to breathe INTO THE BREAST OF HER CHEMISE. HIS BREATH WENT DOWN AND PENETRATED HER GENERATIVE ORGAN, AND THUS CAUSED HER TO CONCEIVE JESUS …’” (Ibid.)
Finally:
“Abu Ja’far al-Tusi, the jurist doctor of the Shi’i community, as well as his well known disciple al-Tabarsi, read the words, ‘We breathed INTO IT’ literally. Al-Tusi says: ‘It has been held that Gabriel BREATHED INTO MARY’S GENERATIVE ORGAN then God created Christ in it’ …” (Ibid., p. 68)
And here is how one lexical source defines the term:
Fa-Ra-Jiim = To open, separate, cleave, split, enlarge, part, let a space between, make a room, comfort anything in, dispel cares. An opening, intervening space [gap or breach] between two things. Ex: Parting hind legs or intervening spaces between fingers.
He opened, made room, ample space.
Furijat – Cloven, split, rent, opened.
Farjun (Pl. Furuj) – PUDENDA (SEX ORGAN); chastity, space between legs (of horse or mare), part/s of a person (male/female) INDECENT TO EXPOSE, EXTERNAL PORTIONS OF THE ORGANS OF GENERATION [OF A MALE/FEMALE]. ALSO THE POSTERIOR OF PUDENDUM because it is a place of opening, of between the legs.
faraja vb. (1) perf. pass. 77:9
farj n.m. (pl. furuj) 21:91, 23:5, 24:30, 24:31, 33:35, 50:6, 66:12, 70:29
LL, V6, p: 143, 144, 145 (Project Root List; capital emphasis ours)
Now I will have more proof that flyingmutalover’s god absolutely loves to blow into the private parts of women in the next post.
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Here is the second part of my post showing that flyinghourideflowerer’s deity loves women’s private parts.
Here are some Quranic verses where the word farj clearly refers to sexual organs:
Prosperous are the believers who in their prayers are humble … and guard their private parts (lifuroojihim). S. 23:1-2,5 Arberry
Say to the believers, that they cast down their eyes and guard their private parts (furoojahum); that is purer for them. God is aware of the things they work. And say to the believing women, that they cast down their eyes’ and guard their private parts (furoojahunna), and reveal not their adornment save such as is outward; and let them cast their veils over their bosoms, and not reveal their adornment save to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husbands’ fathers, or their sons, or their husbands’ sons, or their brothers, or their brothers’ sons, or their sisters’ sons, or their women, or what their right hands own, or such men as attend them, not having sexual desire, or children who have not yet attained knowledge of women’s private parts; nor let them stamp their feet, so that their hidden ornament may be known. And turn all together to God, O you believers; haply so you will prosper. S. 24:30-31 Arberry
Men and women who have surrendered, believing men and believing women, obedient men and obedient women, truthful men and truthful women, enduring men and enduring women, humble men and humble women, men and women who give in charity, men who fast and women who fast, men and women who guard their private parts (furoojahum), men and women who remember God oft — for them God has prepared forgiveness and a mighty wage. S. 33:35 Arberry
and guard their private parts (lifuroojihim). S. 70:29 Arberry
Ibn Kathir makes the following comments in reference to S. 19:22-23:
“Allah, the Exalted, informs about Maryam that when Jibril had spoken to her about what Allah said, she accepted the decree of Allah. Many scholars of the predecessors (Salaf) have mentioned that at this point the angel (who was Jibril) blew into the opening of her garment that she was wearing. Then the breath descended until it entered INTO HER VAGINA and she conceived by the leave of Allah.” (Tafsir Ibn Kathir, Abridged, Volume 6, Surat Al-Isra’, Verse 39 To the end of Surat Al-Mu’minun, first edition July 2000, p. 244; bold and capital emphasis ours)
Ibn Kathir’s notes on S. 2:223 also help us to see the very graphic nature of the term farj:
this refers to Al-Farj (THE VAGINA), as Ibn ‘Abbas, Mujahid and other scholars have stated. Therefore, anal sex is prohibited, as we will further emphasize afterwards, Allah willing …
Ibn Jurayj (one of the reporters of the Hadith) said that Allah’s Messengers said …
((From the front or from behind, as long as it occurs IN THE FARJ (VAGINA).)) …
Abu Bakr bin Ziyad Naysaburi reported that Isma’il bin Ruh said that he asked Malik bin Anas, “What do you say about having sex with women in the anus?” He said, “You are not an Arab? Does sex occur but in the place of pregnancy? Do it only IN THE FARJ (VAGINA).” (Tafsir Ibn Kathir (Abridged), Volume 1, Parts 1 and 2 (Surat Al-Fatihah to Verse 252 of Surat Al-Baqarah), first edition January 2000, pp. 618, 619, 622; capital emphasis ours)
With that said, we turn to Ibn Kathir who provides additional evidence for the very graphic and distasteful nature of the Quranic depiction of the birth of Jesus. In his comments on S. 66:12, Ibn Kathir writes:
meaning who protected and purified her honor, by being chaste and free of immorality,
meaning, through the angel Jibril. Allah sent the angel Jibril to Maryam, and he came to her in the shape of a man in every respect. Allah commanded him TO BLOW into a gap of her garment and that breath went into her womb THROUGH HER PRIVATE PART; this is how ‘Isa was conceived. This is why Allah said here,
meaning His decree and His legislation. (Tafsir Ibn Kathir – Abridged, Volume 10, Surat At-Tagabun to the end of the Qur’an, pp. 75-76; capital emphasis ours)
In the above references which speak of Christ’s conception, we see how this word is used to describe Allah’s penetrating Mary’s private area by blowing his Spirit into it. Talk about a filthy and disgusting way of speaking of the glorious conception and birth of the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer!
There’s more. In responding to the Shia position regarding the permissibility of temporary marriages (mutah), this Sunni writer defines farj as:
I’arat al-Furuj (LOANING OF VAGINAS)
The Shi’ah books of fiqh carry a separate chapter entitled “I’arat al-Furuj.” This could literally be translated as “The Loaning of Vaginas.” … (Dr. Ahmad ‘Abdullah Salamah, Shi’ah Concept of Temporary Marriage (Mut’ah); capital emphasis ours)
YIKES!
Here is the final Muslim example showing that farj refers to the female organ:
Narrated Basrah:
A man from the Ansar called Basrah said: I married a virgin woman in her veil. When I entered upon her, I found her pregnant. (I mentioned this to the Prophet). The Prophet said: She will get the dower, for you made her VAGINA (farj) lawful for you. The child will be your slave. When she has begotten (a child), flog her (according to the version of al-Hasan). The version of Ibn AbusSari has: You people, flog her, or said: inflict hard punishment on him. (Sunan of Abu Dawud, Book 11, Number 2126)
Christian writer Abd al-Masih helps to put this in perspective. Commenting on S. 21:91, al-Masih notes:
“Whoever reads verse 91 of Sura al-Anbiya’ 21 carefully could be embarrassed. It is scandalous how Muhammad and his spirit of revelation lift Mary up as the most important of all women, and at the same time tear away her veil of chastity. Her self-protection is not described in a euphemism, but is calculated brutally, as in a business deal:
And she guraded her vagina [farj] so we breathed into her of our spirit. (Sura al-Anbiya’ 21:91)
This revelation is not an honour, but an exposition. Maybe it was customary among Bedouins to speak contemptuously and carelessly about women. But this only shows the rule of Arabic men and their contempt for women. If the best of women is spoken about like this, what about others! The men are never written about like this. They remain covered, holier-than-thou and self-righteous.” (Abd al-Masih, Who Is The Spirit From Allah In Islam? [Light of Life, P.O. Box 13, A-9503, VILLACH AUSTRIA], pp. 46-47)
He notes regarding S. 66:12:
“The second problem is caused by the Arabic language. In Arabic, Allah does not say: ‘so we breathed into her of our spirit’, but ‘into him’. Who is it, into whom the spirit was breathed? The embryo ‘Isa? That is difficult to accept, for then ‘Isa would have existed in Mary’s womb already before the spirit was breathed into her. That would mean that Allah created ‘Isa beforehand or that he existed before he was conceived. Both options are out of the question for Islamic scholars.
Who is it then, into whom the Spirit from Allah was breathed? IT IS ALMOST UNSPEAKABLE, but the last expression in the previous sentence, which is masculine in Arabic, IS THE EXPRESSION FOR MARY’S GENITALS.[43] The literal meaning of Allah’s statement in Arabic is then, ‘so we breathed into her vagina [farj] of our spirit.’ This turns the stomachs of some of our readers.
Rudi Paret, the best translator of the Qur’an into German, confirms the meaning of this phrase in a footnote. This seems not only to us, but also to many Islamic scholars to be a blasphemy. Ibn Mas’ud went so far as to suggest that the Qur’anic text should be changed to read ‘so we breathed into her [Mary] of our spirit.’ It is comforting to see that there are Muslims who prefer the possibility of a fallible Qur’an to a blasphemy like this.
Other commentators explain the expression into him as Mary’s heart or body, which are masculine in Arabic, but not mentioned in the text. These are nothing but attempts to cover up the problem, but the problem itself remains. The assumption that it was an unclean spirit that spoke through Muhammad is obvious. It is almost impossible to imagine that Muslims claim that Jibril himself did this. Here the false statement of an unclean spirit stands against the noble Holy Spirit.” (Ibid., pp. 53-54; capital emphasis ours)
In the above indicated footnote, the author states:
43. According to al-Nasafi: “in her vagina” (Madarik al-Tanzil, vol. 4, p. 272). (Ibid., p. 53)
So now flyingibnmuta, what was that about “penises” and seven year old girls?
Like I said, keep barking your filth and watch how I muzzle you. Even though you desire to be Muhammad’s dog, you need to watch out for yourself since you know what your child sleeping profit did to dogs? He ordered them to be murdered!
What a demented vile human being! No wonder you are so wicked, vile and demented! You can’t be any better than your profit and his jinn.
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So now flyingibnmuta, what was that about “penises” and seven year old girls?
Like I said, keep barking your filth and watch how I muzzle you. Even though you desire to be Muhammad’s dog, you need to watch out for yourself since you know what your child sleeping profit did to dogs? He ordered them to be murdered!
Chapter 19: ANGELS DO NOT ENTER A HOUSE IN WHICH THERE IS A DOG OR A PICTURE
A’isha reported that Gabriel made a promise with Allah’s Messenger to come at a definite hour; that hour came but he did not visit him. And there was in his hand (in the hand of Allah’s Apostle) a staff. He threw it from his hand and said: Never has Allah or His messengers (angels) ever broken their promise. Then he cast a glance (and by chance) found a puppy under his cot and said: ‘A’isha, when did this dog enter here? She said: By Allah, I don’t know. He then commanded and it was turned out. Then Gabriel came and Allah’s Messenger said to him: You promised me and I waited for you, but you did not come, whereupon he said: It was the dog in your house which prevented me (to come), for we (angels) do not enter a house in which there is a dog or a picture. (Sahih Muslim, Book 024, Number 5246)
And because of this, “Allah’s Apostle ordered that the dogs should be killed” (Vol. 4, No. 540).
Later, after realizing that dogs were a necessity for hunting and guarding sheep, Muhammad changed his mind:
Maimuna reported that one morning Allah’s Messenger was silent with grief. Maimuna said: Allah’s Messenger, I find a change in your mood today. Allah’s Messenger said: Gabriel had promised me that he would meet me tonight, but he did not meet me. By Allah, he never broke his promises, and Allah’s Messenger spent the day in this sad (mood). Then it occurred to him that there had been a puppy under their cot. He commanded and it was turned out. He then took some water in his hand and sprinkled it at that place. When it was evening Gabriel met him and he said to him: you promised me that you would meet me the previous night. He said: Yes, but we do not enter a house in which there is a dog or a picture. Then on that very morning he commanded the killing of the dogs until he announced that the dog kept for the orchards should also be killed, but he spared the dog meant for the protection of extensive fields (or big gardens). (Sahih Muslim, Book 024, Number 5248)
Chapter 31: COMMAND OF KILLING DOGS AND THEN ITS ABROGATION, AND PROHIBITION OF KEEPING THEM BUT FOR HUNTING AND PROTECTION OF LANDS OR CATTLE OR LIKE THAT…
Ibn Umar reported that Allah’s messenger ordered the killings of dogs except the dog tamed for hunting, or watching of the herd of sheep or other domestic animals…” (Sahih Muslim, Book 010, Number 3812)
Abu Zubair heard Jabir b. Abdullah saying: Allah’s messenger ordered us to kill dogs, and we carried out this order so much that we also killed the dog coming with a woman from the desert. Then Allah’s Apostle forbade their killing. He (the Holy Prophet) further said: It is your duty to kill the jet black (dog) having two spots (on the eyes), for it is a devil. (Sahih Muslim, Book 010, Number 3813)
What a demented vile human being! No wonder you are so wicked, vile and demented! You can’t be any better than your profit and his jinn.
I guess it never dawned on Muhammad’s “Gabriel” to appear to Muhammad once he left his house, as opposed to making Allah’s profit-making messenger all that time for another seizure to hit him in order for him to receive more “revelations”. But that’s not all. These narrations raise a few questions. First, if Allah’s angels are capable of withstanding Satan himself, how can dogs or pictures stop them from accomplishing their tasks? Second, if dogs are really devils then why does the Quran say that Allah protected a dog along with the Companions of the Cave (Q. 18:18 and 18:20)? Is Allah in the business of preserving evil animals as they lay asleep for centuries only to awaken them again? More importantly, what were these righteous servants doing with a dog in the first place? Third, didn’t Allah give Solomon power over the Jinn to build statues or images (Q. 34:13)? And didn’t the temple which Solomon built for the worship of God contain images (1 Kings 6:23-35; 7:27-37; 2 Chronicles 3:10-14)? Does this therefore mean that the angels never entered Solomon’s palace or temple?
The stupidity of the Sunna gets even more laughable. The translator of Sahih Muslim, Abdul Hamid Siddiqui, tries to desperately explain away the obvious problems with Muhammad’s stance on dogs,
“The Hadith gives us an idea why the Holy Prophet commanded to kill dogs. There must have been an excess of stray dogs and thus the danger of rabies in the city of Medina and its suburbs. The Holy Prophet, therefore, ordered to kill them. Later on when it was found that his companions were killing them indiscriminately, he forbade them to do so and told them that only ferocious beasts which were a source of danger to life should be killed. The word ‘devil’ clarifies this point. Here devil stands for ferocious…” (Sahih Muslim by Imam Muslim, rendered into English by Abdul Hamid Siddiqui [Kitab Bhavan, New Delhi, India, 11th Reprint 1995], Volume III & IV, Book X. Kitab Al-Buyu’ (Pertaining To Business Transactions), p. 825, fn. 2012; italic emphasis ours)
One senses Siddiqui’s desperation to defend the killing of dogs. He tries to justify this by assuming that there was an excess of stray and rabid dogs in Medina, yet provides no proof for such a claim. Secondly, even if his assumption was correct, why did Muhammad allow both hunting and sheep dogs to remain alive? After all, these dogs would be just as deadly since they would come in contact with ferocious disease-infested animals that could have easily transmitted these diseases to humans. Furthermore, we are still left to grapple with the problem of jet-black dogs with two spots being devils. If “devil”, as Sidiqqi states, means ferocious, then why single out these dogs as devils when there were other dogs just as, or even more, ferocious than they? It would seem that Muhammad believed that these animals were literally possessed by devils.
What makes this all the more sadder is that there are clowns like you K’SBRAINEDGOTSMACKEDANDBRAINDAMAGEDBYISLAM that actually believe this garbage.
Now that I have exposed you and your profit to further shame and disgrace time for me to return to the rest of my rebuttals. Until I return to humiliate you again, enjoy all the posts that I wrote in your honor!
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Williams, speaking of being Muhammadans who worship Muhammad I am sure you are going to love this: http://www.reformedapologeticsministries.com/2016/08/muhammad-praise-of-all-creation.html
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I almost forget. Here is a Muslim article defending the act of drinking Muhammad’s nasty, filthy urine. Enjoy! http://scholarspen.blogspot.ca/2005/05/prophets-urine_10.html
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The piss and urine have been refuted:
http://www.letmeturnthetables.com/2011/05/did-prophet-commend-people-drinking-his.html
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Like I said, you guys are desperate jokes who think you are refuting arguments when in reality you are exposing yourselves as the inept pagans who couldn’t defend your lies if your eternal lives depended on it. The fact is that THIS IS A SUNNI ARTICLE DEFENDING THE FACT THAT THE NARRATIONS OF THE WOMAN DRINKING MUHAMMAD’S PISS WITH MUHAMMAD APPROVING IT!
Now since you cite this liar, I just published a three part rebuttal exposing him for being a liar like you.
In this article, your fellow stone worshiper wrote:
Now for the meaning of the word, ‘lahad, let’s refer to Lane’s Lexicon. He writes…
He pushed, pushed away, or repelled, him: or pushed him violently upon the chest: (L:) or he pushed (Let Me Turn The Tables, “Did Prophet Muhammad beat his wife, Aisha?” http://www.letmeturnthetables.com/2011/03/muhammad-beat-aisha.html)
He even had the audacity of providing an image to show that this is what the Lexicon says: http://www.letmeturnthetables.com/2011/03/muhammad-beat-aisha.html
Because you guys are so demonized you cannot help but lie and think you will get away with it.
However, because we serve the true God who hates lies and deceit he ends up enabling us to expose your lies and blasphemies in order to shame you for the world to see just how evil your deen is.
Here is what the lexicon actually says IN CONTEXT:
“… He pushed, pushed away, or REPELLED, HIM: or pushed him VIOLENTLY UPON THE CHEST: (L 🙂 or he pushed him, pushed him away, or repelled him, ON ACCOUNT OF HIS BASENESS, OR DESPICABLENESS: (S, L, K 🙂 OR HE STRUCK HIM IN THE BREASTS, (L,), OR IN THE BASES OF THE BREASTS, (K,), and in the bases of the shoulder-blades: (L, K) or he pressed, or squeezed, him…” (Edward William Lane, Arabic-English Lexicon, p. 2676; bold, capital and underline emphasis ours)
Lane goes on to list “struck” as one of the meanings of this specific Arabic word! How, then, could the author have failed to include this portion of the lexicon in his “response” seeing that this is the whole point of the objection against Muhammad? And how could some of the other Muslim dawagandists claim that “struck” is not an accurate definition of the word lahada when this is precisely the meaning that is given?
In fact, notice how the following lexicon defines this term:
“… lahad, INF. lahd, oppress; jade; BEAT, push.” (Francis Joseph Steingass, Arabic-English Dictionary, p. 929; bold, capital and underline emphasis ours)
This shows that Muslims have no problem with deliberately lying and distorting the facts of a matter, so long as it helps them to justify the morally objectionable and reprehensible actions of their false prophet.
All of this is part of my rebuttal for the world to see: http://www.reformedapologeticsministries.com/2016/08/muhammad-and-wife-beating-catching_97.html
So I want to again thank you for helping us glorify the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer, and expose your profit for what he truly was. Much appreciated!
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nope sorry sammy..wrong again!..lol..here is the hadith linked to the corret contextual understanding about the Prophet poking Aisha on the chest..lol..
The hadeeth mentioned in the question is that which was narrated from ‘Aa’ishah (may Allah be pleased with her), who said:
When it was my night when the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) was with me, he came in and took off his cloak, took off his shoes and put them by his feet, spread the edge of his waist wrapper on his bed and lay down. He waited until he thought that I had gone to sleep, then he picked up his cloak slowly, put on his shoes slowly, opened the door slowly, and went out, then he closed it slowly. I put my chemise over my head and veiled myself, and wrapped my waist wrapper around me, then I set out following him, until he reached al-Baqee‘ where he stood for a long time, then he raised his hands three times. Then he set off, so I set off, then he hastened, so I hastened, then he jogged, so I jogged, then he ran so I ran, then I reached home before him and went in. No sooner had I laid down but he came in and said: “What is the matter, O ‘Aa’ishah? Why are you out of breath?” I said: It is nothing. He said: “Either you tell me or the Subtle One, the All-Aware will tell me.” I said: O Messenger of Allah, may my father and mother be sacrificed for you! And I told him. He said: “So you were the person that I saw in front of me?” I said: Yes. He gave me a painful shove on the chest, then he said: “Did you think that Allah and His Messenger would be unjust to you?” She said: Whatever the people conceal, Allah knows it; yes. He said: “Jibreel came to me when you saw. He called me but he concealed it from you, and I answered him but I concealed it from you. He would not enter upon you when you were not fully dressed. I thought that you had gone to sleep and I did not want to wake you up, and I was afraid that you might be frightened. He said: “Your Lord is commanding you to go to the people of al-Baqee’ and pray for forgiveness for them.” I said: What should I say to them, O Messenger of Allah? He said: “Say: Peace be upon the people of these abodes, believers and Muslims. May Allah have mercy on those of us who have gone on before and those who come later, and we will – if Allah wills – join you soon.”
Narrated by Muslim, 974
https://islamqa.info/en/164216
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Furthermore John Louis Esposito who is a professor of International Affairs and Islamic Studies at Georgetown University. Professor John L. Esposito is a Catholic Christian also cites the above hadith mentioned and makes it clear that nowhere in the Hadith or Quran is there any record of Muhammed (p) ever mistreating any of his wives, it does not exist. He writes:
“….the hadith (Prophetic traditions) note Muhammad’s respect for and protection of women. Muhammad said, ‘The best of you is he who is best to his wife.’ Muhammad’s wife Aisha narrated that Muhammad never hit any servant or woman and never physically struck anyone with his own hand. Neither the Quran nor the hadith record Muhammad as ever mistreating or losing temper with any of his wives, even when he was unhappy or dissatisfied”
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/12/23/refuting-the-allegation-that-muhammed-hit-his-wife-aisha-and-more/
The word that is used in above Hadith as “Struck” is false; the word in Arabic that is used is “Lahada.” Edward William Lane explains that the Arabic word “Lahada” means “pushed away”…
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Shammy how does your god hate lies and deception?:
1.Jesus deceived and lied to his brothers.
2.Jesus (god) encourages people to lie and deceive in the Old Testament.
3. Even Paul your lord encourages Christians like you to lie and deceive non-Christians:
https://discover-the-truth.com/2015/01/22/holy-bible-allows-lying-deception/
Do you think a pagan like you would know more than Aisha HERSELF who said Prophet Muhammed NEVER hit her?:
Aisha said: “Allaah’s Messenger (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING with his hand ever, except when fighting in the path of Allaah. Nor did he ever hit a servant or a woman.” [Recorded In Ibn Majah. Al-Albani graded it Sahih.]
AND
‘Aisha (May Allah be pleased with her) reported: Messenger of Allah (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING WITH HIS HAND neither a servant NOR A WOMAN but of course, he did fight in the Cause of Allah. He never took revenge upon anyone for the wrong done to him, but of course, he exacted retribution for the sake of Allah in case the Injunctions of Allah about unlawful acts were violated. [Muslim Arabic/English book reference : Book 1, Hadith 644]
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/12/23/refuting-the-allegation-that-muhammed-hit-his-wife-aisha-and-more/
Now compare this with your Babble, where Jesus (god) encourages Christians like you to BEAT your child with a ROD as sanctioned from your Bible:
“Proverbs 23:13-14 Withhold not correction from the child: for ifIF THOU BEATEST HIM WITH A ROD, HE SHALL NOT DIE. THOU SHALT BEAT HIM WITH A ROD, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.”
A commentary from a Christian, Dr. Philip Ayers says:
The same principles are true for parents. We must apply strict rules and consequences for our children, or they will run from us when the opportunity comes. WE MUST SPANK OUR CHILDREN AT TIMES. THE WORLD CALLS THIS UNUSUAL AND UNACCEPTABLE PUNISHMENT: CORPORAL IN NATURE. GOD CALLS IT DIVINE LOVE. Genuine affection for children will not withhold corporal punishment. Parental discipline will produce Godly virtue, parental joy, and blessed children. (A Proverb a Day Keeps the Devil Away Dr Philip Ayers page 357)
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/10/09/does-the-bible-teach-child-abuse-beat-him-with-a-rod/
New Testament (BIBLE) PERMITS/encourages Christians to rape their own wifes:
“4 The WIFE DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY over her own body (private part), but HER HUSBAND DOES. …” – I Corinthians 7:4
This verse commands that a Christian wife has no authority over her body. The ‘body’ part mentioned here is reference to her ‘private parts’. Basically, the husband has full right to have sexual relations with his wife even when she refuses. The Christian husband can have forceful sexual intimacy even if the wife refuses. For the wife to refuse this, is a major sin. This in modern terms would be called ‘marital rape’.
A COMMNETARY on 1 Corinthians 7:4 and Marital rape:
Pastor and Bible teacher David Guzik:
“b. On the same idea, also the wife to her husband: The wife is not to withhold marital affection from her husband. Paul strongly puts forth the idea that there is a mutual sexual responsibility in marriage. The husband has obligations toward his wife, and the wife has obligations toward her husband.
i. Render to his wife: The emphasis is on giving, on “I owe you” instead of “you owe me.” In God’s heart, sex is put on a much higher level than merely the husband’s privilege and the wife’s duty.
c. The wife does not have authority over her own body: In fact, these obligations ARE SO CONCRETE, IT COULD BE SAID THAT THE WIFE’S BODY DOES NOT EVEN BELONG TO HERSELF, BUT TO HER HUSBAND. The same principle is true of the husband’s body in regard to his wife. …”
(David Guzik Commentary on the Bible – online source)
AND
Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges:
“Verse 4
4. οὐκ ἐξουσιάζει. A.V. hath not power. Better, HATH NO RIGHT. ἐξουσία sometimes stands for power, as in Revelation 9:3. But the more usual sense of the word is AUTHORITY. τοῦ ἰδίου σώματος. OVER HER OWN BODY. Because in everything connected with the duties of married life each should consult the comfort, well-being, and happiness of the other before their own, and should be especially careful that they do not, by any selfishness on the part of either, ‘cause their brother to offend’” (Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges – online source)
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/27/does-the-new-testament-endorse-marital-rape/
“Ouch” 😉
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ive shoved and poked my brother in this manner before..lol. no harm mate!…lol
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So sam we want to again thank you for helping us glorify Allah, Jesus’s God and Destroyer, and expose your lies and twisting of truth ..Much appreciated!
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I know that being a Muhammadan, illiteracy is common among you folk. Let me repeat the quote from Edward William Lane’s Lexicon:
“… He pushed, pushed away, or REPELLED, HIM: or pushed him VIOLENTLY UPON THE CHEST: (L or he pushed him, pushed him away, or repelled him, ON ACCOUNT OF HIS BASENESS, OR DESPICABLENESS: (S, L, K) OR HE STRUCK HIM IN THE BREASTS, (L,), OR IN THE BASES OF THE BREASTS, (K,), and in the bases of the shoulder-blades: (L, K) or he pressed, or squeezed, him…” (Edward William Lane, Arabic-English Lexicon, p. 2676; capital and underline emphasis ours)
Here is the link: http://www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume7/00000204.pdf
Let me repeat that part again:
OR HE STRUCK HIM IN THE BREASTS, (L,), OR IN THE BASES OF THE BREASTS, (K,),
OUCH!
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Shammy-sham-scam how does your god hate lies and deception?:
1.Jesus deceived and lied to his brothers.
2.Jesus (god) encourages people to lie and deceive in the Old Testament.
3. Even Paul your lord encourages Christians like you to lie and deceive non-Christians:
https://discover-the-truth.com/2015/01/22/holy-bible-allows-lying-deception/
Do you think a pagan like you would know more than Aisha HERSELF who said Prophet Muhammed NEVER hit her?:
Aisha said: “Allaah’s Messenger (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING with his hand ever, except when fighting in the path of Allaah. Nor did he ever hit a servant or a woman.” [Recorded In Ibn Majah. Al-Albani graded it Sahih.]
AND
‘Aisha (May Allah be pleased with her) reported: Messenger of Allah (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING WITH HIS HAND neither a servant NOR A WOMAN but of course, he did fight in the Cause of Allah. He never took revenge upon anyone for the wrong done to him, but of course, he exacted retribution for the sake of Allah in case the Injunctions of Allah about unlawful acts were violated. [Muslim Arabic/English book reference : Book 1, Hadith 644]
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/12/23/refuting-the-allegation-that-muhammed-hit-his-wife-aisha-and-more/
Now compare this with your Babble, where Jesus (god) encourages Christians like you to BEAT your child with a ROD as sanctioned from your Bible:
“Proverbs 23:13-14 Withhold not correction from the child: for ifIF THOU BEATEST HIM WITH A ROD, HE SHALL NOT DIE. THOU SHALT BEAT HIM WITH A ROD, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.”
A commentary from a Christian, Dr. Philip Ayers says:
The same principles are true for parents. We must apply strict rules and consequences for our children, or they will run from us when the opportunity comes. WE MUST SPANK OUR CHILDREN AT TIMES. THE WORLD CALLS THIS UNUSUAL AND UNACCEPTABLE PUNISHMENT: CORPORAL IN NATURE. GOD CALLS IT DIVINE LOVE. Genuine affection for children will not withhold corporal punishment. Parental discipline will produce Godly virtue, parental joy, and blessed children. (A Proverb a Day Keeps the Devil Away Dr Philip Ayers page 357)
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/10/09/does-the-bible-teach-child-abuse-beat-him-with-a-rod/
New Testament (BIBLE) PERMITS/encourages Christians to rape their own wifes:
“4 The WIFE DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY over her own body (private part), but HER HUSBAND DOES. …” – I Corinthians 7:4
This verse commands that a Christian wife has no authority over her body. The ‘body’ part mentioned here is reference to her ‘private parts’. Basically, the husband has full right to have sexual relations with his wife even when she refuses. The Christian husband can have forceful sexual intimacy even if the wife refuses. For the wife to refuse this, is a major sin. This in modern terms would be called ‘marital rape’.
A COMMNETARY on 1 Corinthians 7:4 and Marital rape:
Pastor and Bible teacher David Guzik:
“b. On the same idea, also the wife to her husband: The wife is not to withhold marital affection from her husband. Paul strongly puts forth the idea that there is a mutual sexual responsibility in marriage. The husband has obligations toward his wife, and the wife has obligations toward her husband.
i. Render to his wife: The emphasis is on giving, on “I owe you” instead of “you owe me.” In God’s heart, sex is put on a much higher level than merely the husband’s privilege and the wife’s duty.
c. The wife does not have authority over her own body: In fact, these obligations ARE SO CONCRETE, IT COULD BE SAID THAT THE WIFE’S BODY DOES NOT EVEN BELONG TO HERSELF, BUT TO HER HUSBAND. The same principle is true of the husband’s body in regard to his wife. …”
(David Guzik Commentary on the Bible – online source)
AND
Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges:
“Verse 4
4. οὐκ ἐξουσιάζει. A.V. hath not power. Better, HATH NO RIGHT. ἐξουσία sometimes stands for power, as in Revelation 9:3. But the more usual sense of the word is AUTHORITY. τοῦ ἰδίου σώματος. OVER HER OWN BODY. Because in everything connected with the duties of married life each should consult the comfort, well-being, and happiness of the other before their own, and should be especially careful that they do not, by any selfishness on the part of either, ‘cause their brother to offend’” (Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges – online source)
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/27/does-the-new-testament-endorse-marital-rape/
“Ouch”😉
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*or* he pushed him, pushed him away, *or*repelled him,… lolol… however contextually sammy the prophet was not a wife beater..lol.. nope… the hadith contextually does not mean what your implying about the prophet lol…
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FLYINGMUTALOVER, I already obliterated the claim that Muhammad never hit her:
http://www.reformedapologeticsministries.com/2016/08/muhammad-and-wife-beating-catching_3.html
So be a good pagan stone licker and read the rebuttal before I further embarrass you and your profit.
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Omar, Aisha herself debunked the pagan Shammy-sham-scam, in the following Hadith:
Aisha said: “Allaah’s Messenger (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING with his hand ever, except when fighting in the path of Allaah. Nor did he ever hit a servant or a woman.” [Recorded In Ibn Majah. Al-Albani graded it Sahih.]
AND
‘Aisha (May Allah be pleased with her) reported: Messenger of Allah (pbuh) NEVER HIT ANYTHING WITH HIS HAND neither a servant NOR A WOMAN but of course, he did fight in the Cause of Allah. He never took revenge upon anyone for the wrong done to him, but of course, he exacted retribution for the sake of Allah in case the Injunctions of Allah about unlawful acts were violated. [Muslim Arabic/English book reference : Book 1, Hadith 644]
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/12/23/refuting-the-allegation-that-muhammed-hit-his-wife-aisha-and-more/
“ouch” 😉
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no you didnt sam.. your refuted your own self inflicted misunderstandings…lol
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Flying Pir 🖒
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Now let me further humiliate and muzzle Muhammad’s dog, flyingibnmuta:
“Now concerning the things about which you wrote to me: ‘It is good for a man not to touch a woman.’ Nevertheless, because of sexual immorality, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. Let the husband render to the wife due affection, and likewise the wife to the husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does. LIKEWISE, THE HUSBAND DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY OVER HIS OWN BODY, BUT THE WIFE DOES. Do not deprive one another except with consent for a time, that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer. Then come together again, so that Satan does not tempt you for lack of self-control.” 1 Corinthians 7:1-5
Being a wicked demon you can’t help but twist the Bible to your profit’s shame and humiliation. You could only wish that your wicked profit taught something similar to what Paul did. But as we know, Muhammad is under the sandals of Paul, Jesus’ Slave and Muhammad’s Master.
Now let us see how your profit compared women to fields and dogs and asses:
Your women ARE A TILLAGE for you; so come unto your tillage AS YOU WISH, and forward for your souls; and fear God, and know that you shall meet Him. Give thou good tidings to the believers. S. 2:223 Arberry
The hadiths provide the reason why this passage was given:
Narrated Jabir:
Jews used to say: “If one has sexual intercourse with his wife from the back, then she will deliver a squint-eyed child.” So this Verse was revealed:– “Your wives are a tilth unto you; so go to your tilth when or how you will.” (2.223) (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 51)
The hadiths even tell us how Allah and his angels feel about a woman that refuses to allow her husband to enter her when and how he wants:
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah’s Apostle said, “If a husband calls his wife to his bed (i.e. to have sexual relation) and she refuses and causes him to sleep in anger, the angels will curse her till morning.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Book 54, Number 460)
Abu Huraira reported Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: By Him in Whose Hand is my life, when a man calls his wife to his bed, and she does not respond, the One Who is in the heaven is displeased with her until he (her husband) is pleased with her. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3367)
Narrated ‘Aisha:
The things which annul the prayers were mentioned before me. They said, “Prayer is annulled by a dog, a donkey AND A WOMAN (if they pass in front of the praying people).” I said, “You have made us (i.e. women) dogs. I saw the Prophet praying while I used to lie in my bed between him and the Qibla. Whenever I was in need of something, I would slip away, for I disliked to face him.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 9, Number 490)
Abu Dharr reported: THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH (may peace be upon him) SAID: When any one of you stands for prayer and there is a thing before him equal to the back of the saddle that covers him and in case there is not before him (a thing) equal to the back of the saddle, HIS PRAYER WOULD BE CUT OFF BY (passing of an) ASS, WOMAN, AND BLACK DOG. I said: O Abu Dharr, what feature is there in a black dog which distinguish it from the red dog and the yellow dog? He said: O, son of my brother, I asked the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) as you are asking me, and he said: The black dog is a devil. (Sahih Muslim, Book 004, Number 1032)
Abu Huraira reported: THE MESSENGER OF ALLAH SAID: A WOMAN, AN ASS AND A DOG DISRUPT THE PRAYER, but something like the back of a saddle guards against that. (Sahih Muslim, Book 004, Number 1034)
So here we see how your profit placed your mother, sisters, wives and daughters on the same level as fields, dogs and asses!
Man, it really must suck being a black stone kisser who keeps getting humiliated, no thanks to your vile, wicked profit!
With that said, have a good night knowing how your profit just got exposed for all to read.
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Almost forgot to place Muhammad under the shoes of Paul, his master. Now let’s see who the wicked lying agent of Satan really was.
Paul on Lying
Muslims often claim that Paul admitted to lying in Romans 3:7-8. Yet when we actually read these verses in context, a different picture altogether arises. It is clear that Paul was speaking figuratively. Paul was addressing how man’s unrighteousness manifests God’s righteous judgment more clearly. Paul then addresses a hypothetical question a person might ask that if in fact one’s falsehood proves that God is righteous, then why does God condemn the individual? Here is the passage in question:
“But if our unrighteousness brings out God’s righteousness more clearly, what shall we say? That God is unjust in bringing his wrath on us? (I am using a human argument.) Certainly not! If that were so, how could God judge the world? ‘If my falsehood enhances God’s truthfulness and so increases his glory, why am I still condemned as a sinner?’ Why not say – as we are being slanderously reported as saying and as some claim that we say – ‘Let us do evil that good may result’? Their condemnation is deserved.” Romans 3:5-8
Interestingly, Paul indicates that it was deceitful men who were slanderously accusing the Apostle of condoning sin and falsehood, a charge to which Paul places under the condemnation of God.
Here is Paul’s views regarding lying and deception:
“Unlike so many, we do not peddle the word of God for profit. On the contrary, in Christ we speak before God with sincerity, like men sent from God.” 2 Corinthians 2:17
“Rather, we have renounced secret and shameful ways; we do not use deception, nor do we distort the word of God. On the contrary, by setting forth the truth plainly we commend ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God.” 2 Corinthians 4:2
“Am I now trying to win the approval of men, or of God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still trying to please men, I would not be a servant of Christ.” Galatians 1:10 “Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth?” Galatians 4:16
“You know, brothers, that our visit to you was not a failure. We had previously suffered and been insulted in Philippi, as you know, but with the help of our God we dared to tell you his gospel in spite of strong opposition. For the appeal we make does not spring from error or impure motives, nor are we trying to trick you. On the contrary, we speak as men approved by God to be entrusted with the gospel. We are not trying to please men but God, who tests our hearts. You know we never used flattery, nor did we put on a mask to cover up greed-God is our witness. We were not looking for praise from men, not from you or anyone else. As apostles of Christ we could have been a burden to you, but we were gentle among you, like a mother caring for her little children. We loved you so much that we were delighted to share with you not only the gospel of God but our lives as well, because you had become so dear to us. Surely you remember, brothers, our toil and hardship; we worked night and day in order not to be a burden to anyone while we preached the gospel of God to you. You are witnesses, and so is God, of how holy, righteous and blameless we were among you who believed.” 1 Thessalonians 2:1-10
“Put to death, therefore, whatever belongs to your earthly nature: sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires and greed, which is idolatry. Because of these, the wrath of God is coming. You used to walk in these ways, in the life you once lived. But now you must rid yourselves of all such things as these: anger, rage, malice, slander, and filthy language from your lips. Do not lie to each other, since you have taken off your old self with its practices and have put on the new self, which is being renewed in knowledge in the image of its Creator.” Colossians 3:5-10
“For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, masquerading as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness. Their end will be what their actions deserve.” 2 Corinthians 11:13-15
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Now let’s compare Paul’s moral integrity with Muhammad’s wickedness and deceitfulness.
Muhammad on Lying
It might surprise our readers to discover that it is Muhammad who condoned deception and lying to achieve one’s aim, as the following verses demonstrate:
“Whoso disbelieves in God, after he has believed – excepting him who has been compelled, and in his heart is still at rest in his belief – but whosoever’s heart is expanded in unbelief, upon them shall rest anger from God, and there awaits them a mighty chastisement.” S. 16:106
Al-Tabari comments:
“It has been reported that the Quraish compelled ‘Ammar, his father Yasir, and his mother Sumayya to renounce Islam. So they tied Sumayyya to two camels and pointed a spear to her heart, saying to her that she converted for the men, and killed her. Later they killed Yasir. Thus, these two were the first martyrs in Islam. As for ‘Ammar, he told them, unwillingly, what they wanted to hear. So it was told the Messenger of God that ‘Ammar disbelieved. He said, ‘No, ‘Ammar is full of faith from the top of his head to the bottom of his feet; belief has been mingled with his flesh and blood.’ ‘Ammar came weeping to the Messenger of God. Therefore, the Messenger of God started to wipe his tears, and said, ‘If they come back to you, REPEAT TO THEM WHAT YOU SAID.’ This is the evidence for the admissibility of speaking unbelief under compulsion.” (‘Abdallah ‘Abd al-Fadi, Is the Qur’an Infallible? [Light of Life PO Box 13 A-9503 Villach, Austria], p. 97; capital emphasis ours)
The Traditions tell us that there are at least four instances where deception can be used:
Humaid b. ‘Abd al-Rahman b. ‘Auf reported that his mother Umm Kulthum daughter of ‘Uqba b. Abu Mu’ait, and she was one amongst the first emigrants who pledged allegiance to Allah’s Apostle, as saying that she heard Allah’s Messenger as saying: A liar is not one who tries to bring reconciliation amongst people and speaks good (in order to avert dispute), or he conveys good. Ibn Shihab said he did not hear that exemption was granted in anything what the people speak as lie but in three cases: in battle, for bringing reconciliation amongst persons and the narration of the words of the husband to his wife, and the narration of the words of a wife to her husband (in a twisted form in order to bring reconciliation between them). (Sahih Muslim, Book 032, Number 6303)
More information is provided by William Muir’s “Life of Mahomet”, Volume I, footnote 88:
The common Moslem belief is that it is allowable to tell a falsehood on four occasions:
1st, to save one’s life;
2nd, to effect a peace or reconciliation;
3rd, to persuade a woman;
4th, on the occasion of a journey or expedition.
To save one’s life
The first is borne out by Mahomet’s express sanction. Ammar ibn Yasir was sorely persecuted by the pagans of Mecca, and denied the faith for his deliverance. The Prophet approved of his conduct: – “If they do this again, then repeat the same recantation to them again.” Katib al Wackidi; p. 227 ½.
Another tradition preserved in the family of Yasir, is as follows: – “The idolators seized Ammar, and they let him not go until he had abused Mahomet and spoken well of their gods. He then repaired to the Prophet, who asked of him what had happened.” – “Evil, oh Prophet of the Lord! I was not let go until I had abused thee, and spoken well of their gods.” – “But how,” replied Mahomet, “dost thou find thins own heart?” – “Secure and steadfast in the faith.” – “Then,” said Mahomet, “if they repeat the same, do thou too repeat the same.” Ibid. Mahomet also said that Ammar’s lie was better than Aba Jahl’s truth.
To effect a peace or reconciliation
The second is directly sanctioned by the following tradition:- “That person is not a liar who makes peace between two people, and speaks good words to do away their quarrel, although they should be lies.” Mishcat, vol ii. p.427
To persuade a woman
As to the third, we have a melancholy instance that Mahomet did not think it wrong to make false promises to his wives, in the matter of Mary his Egyptian maid.
On the occasion of a journey or expedition
And regarding the fourth, it was his constant habit in projecting expeditions (excepting only that to Tabuk) to conceal his intentions, and to give out that he was about to proceed in another direction from the true one. (Hishami, p. 392; Katib al Wackidi, p. 133 ½.)
Hence, Muhammad treated truth and deception according to his own style of situational ethics. Muhammad condoned, and actually permitted lying to further his goals.
We are told in Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 4, Number 361:
Narrated Zahdam:
Once we were in the house of Abu Musa who presented a meal containing cooked chicken. A man from the tribe of Bani Taim Allah with red complexion as if he were from the Byzantine war prisoners, was present. Abu Musa invited him to share the meal but he (apologized) saying. “I saw chickens eating dirty things and so I have had a strong aversion to eating them, and have taken an oath that I will not eat chickens.” Abu Musa said, “Come along, I will tell you about this matter (i.e. how to cancel one’s oath). I went to the Prophet in the company of a group of Al-Ashariyin, asked him to provide us with means of conveyance. He said, ‘By Allah, I will not provide you with any means of conveyance and I have nothing to make you ride on.’ Then some camels as booty were brought to Allah’s Apostle and he asked for us saying. ‘Where are the group of Al-Ash’ariyun?’ Then he ordered that we should be given five camels with white humps. When we set out we said, ‘What have we done? We will never be blessed (with what we have been given).’ So, we returned to the Prophet and said, ‘We asked you to provide us with means of conveyance, but you took an oath that you would not provide us with any means of conveyance. Did you forget (your oath when you gave us the camels)?’ He replied. ‘I have not provided you with means of conveyance but Allah has provided you with it, and by Allah, Allah willing, if ever I take an oath to do something, and later on I find that it is more beneficial to do something different, I will do the thing which is better, and give expiation for my oath.'”
The Quran testifies that even Allah is a deceiver:
The Hypocrites – they seek to deceive Allah but it is Allah Who DECEIVES them. When they stand up to prayer, they stand without earnestness, to be seen of men, but little do they hold Allah in remembrance; S. 4:142
Ibn Kathir comments:
In verse nine of Al-Baqarah, Allah says: While in the above verse, Allah says: There is no doubt that Allah does not deceive as He is All-Aware of secrets. But, the hypocrites, owing to their ignorance, believe that they can trick Allah on the Day of Judgment them with the same external shows of piety and honesty that they used to gain advantage with the people and to get verdicts in the law courts in this world. Allah knows their intentions. Similarly, Allah says in the following verse: (58:18).
After claiming that Allah does not deceive, Ibn Kathir goes on to say:
It is Allah Who tempts them in their going over the limits and their misguidance, and DECEIVES them into reaching false perceptions regarding the purpose of this life and the trial on the Day of Judgment when their falsehood will fail. It is reported in a hadith that: ‘Allah commands that a servant enter Paradise, as it may seem to people, then takes him to Fire.’” (Tafsir Ibn Kathir, Sura An-Nisa, ayat 24-147, abridged by Sheikh Muhammad Nasib Ar-Rafa’i [Al-Firdous Ltd., London 2000], pp. 207-208; capital emphasis ours)
Therefore, Muslims themselves admit that their God is a deceiver.
Further passages from the Qur’an about the deceiving nature of Allah:
And (the unbelievers) schemed and planned, and Allah schemed also, and the best of schemers is Allah. S. 3:54
Remember how the unbelievers schemed against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or to slay thee, or get thee out (of thy home). They scheme and plot, but the best of schemers is Allah. S. 8:30
The term for scheme in Arabic is makr and denotes one who is a deceiver, a conniver, a schemer. It is always used in a negative sense. Allah is thus seen as the best of deceivers, the premiere schemer and conniving one.
Muslim theologians themselves admit to the negative connotation of the Arabic term. For example Dr. Mahmoud M. Ayoub in his book, The Quran and Its Interpreters, Volume II, The House of Imran, brings up the question of,
“how the word makr (scheming or plotting), WHICH IMPLIES DECEITFULNESS OR DISHONESTY could be attributed to God.” (Ibid. [1992 State University of New York Press, Albany], p. 165; capital emphasis ours)
After listing several Muslim sources he quotes ar-Razi as arguing that “scheming (makr) is actually AN ACT OF DECEPTION AIMING AT CAUSING EVIL. It is not possible to attribute deception to God. Thus the word is one of the muttashabihat [multivalent words of the Quran].” (Ibid., p. 166; capital emphasis ours)
Like I said, keep blaspheming Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer, and watch me keep muzzling you and humiliating Muhammad.
Good night! 😉
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Let me quote what Shammy-sham-Scam quoted from 1Corinthians 7:
“Now concerning the things about which you wrote to me: ‘It is good for a man not to touch a woman.’ Nevertheless, because of sexual immorality, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. Let the husband render to the wife due affection, and likewise the wife to the husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does. LIKEWISE, THE HUSBAND DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY OVER HIS OWN BODY, BUT THE WIFE DOES. Do not deprive one another except with consent for a time, that you may give yourselves to fasting and prayer. Then come together again, so that Satan does not tempt you for lack of self-control.” 1 Corinthians 7:1-5
SHAMMY DO YOU EVEN READ BEFORE YOU PASTE IT HERE? CANT YOU READ THAT THE WIFE CAN ALSO RAPE THE HUSBAND FROM YOUR BIBLE?????
New Testament (BIBLE) PERMITS/encourages Christians to rape their own wife:
“4 The WIFE DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY over her own body (private part), but HER HUSBAND DOES. …” – I Corinthians 7:4
This verse commands that a Christian wife has no authority over her body. The ‘body’ part mentioned here a reference to her ‘private parts’. Basically, the husband has full right to have sexual relations with his wife even when she refuses. The Christian husband can have forceful sexual intimacy even if the wife refuses. For the wife to refuse this, is a major sin. This in modern terms would be called ‘marital rape’.
A COMMENTARY on 1 Corinthians 7:4 and Marital rape:
Pastor and Bible teacher David Guzik:
“b. On the same idea, also the wife to her husband: The wife is not to withhold marital affection from her husband. Paul strongly puts forth the idea that there is a mutual sexual responsibility in marriage. The husband has obligations toward his wife, and the wife has obligations toward her husband.
i. Render to his wife: The emphasis is on giving, on “I owe you” instead of “you owe me.” In God’s heart, sex is put on a much higher level than merely the husband’s privilege and the wife’s duty.
c. The wife does not have authority over her own body: In fact, these obligations ARE SO CONCRETE, IT COULD BE SAID THAT THE WIFE’S BODY DOES NOT EVEN BELONG TO HERSELF, BUT TO HER HUSBAND. The same principle is true of the husband’s body in regard to his wife. …”
(David Guzik Commentary on the Bible – online source)
AND
Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges:
“Verse 4
4. οὐκ ἐξουσιάζει. A.V. hath not power. Better, HATH NO RIGHT. ἐξουσία sometimes stands for power, as in Revelation 9:3. But the more usual sense of the word is AUTHORITY. τοῦ ἰδίου σώματος. OVER HER OWN BODY. Because in everything connected with the duties of married life each should consult the comfort, well-being, and happiness of the other before their own, and should be especially careful that they do not, by any selfishness on the part of either, ‘cause their brother to offend’” (Cambridge Greek Testament for Schools and Colleges – online source)
https://discover-the-truth.com/2016/07/27/does-the-new-testament-endorse-marital-rape/
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Shammy-sham-Scam on your Lord paul encouraging Christians ike you to lie and deceive non-Christians:
“Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. TO THE JEWS I BECAME A LIKE A JEW, TO WIN THE JEWS. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. I do it all for the sake of the gospel, that I may share with them in its blessings.” – 1 Corinthians 9:19-23
Paul confesses here that he acted as a Jew in order to convert them to his faith. He even acted as a pagan so that he can lure them to his religion. The above verse shows that Paul would go in great lengths to spread his religion by deception. Let’s see now what the experts have to say on the above passage.
Saint John Cassian (B. 360 – D. 435) was a Christian monk and theologian. He is another in line of the early Church fathers who stated that, what Paul said in 1 Corinthians 9:20, was deception. The title of the chapter begins by “How even Apostles thought that a lie was often useful and the truth injurious”. He writes,
Chapter 20
“How even Apostles thought that a lie was often useful and the truth injurious.
“Instructed by which examples, the blessed James also, and all the chief princess of the primitive Church urged the Apostle Paul in consequence of the weakness of feeble persons to condescend to a fictitious arrangement and insisted on his purifying himself according to the requirements of the law, and shaving his head and paying his vows, as they THOUGHT THAT THE PRESENT HARM WHICH WOULD COME FROM THIS HYPOCRISY WAS OF NO ACCOUNT, but had regard rather to the gain which would result from his still continued preaching. For the gain to the Apostle Paul from his strictness would not have counterbalanced the loss to all nations from his speedy death. AND THIS WOULD CERTAINLY HAVE BEEN THEN INCURRED BY THE WHOLE CHURCH UNLESS THIS GOOD AND SALUTARY HYPOCRISY HAD PRESERVED HIM FOR THE PREACHING OF THE GOSPEL. FOR THEN WE MAY RIGHTLY AND PARDONABLY ACQUIESCE IN THE WRONG OF A LIE, WHEN, AS WE SAID, A GREATER HARM DEPENDS ON TELLING THE TRUTH, AND WHEN THE GOOD WHICH RESULTS TO US FROM SPEAKING THE TRUTH CANNOT COUNTERBALANCE THE HARM WHICH WILL BE CAUSED BY IT. …”
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/11/28/1-corinthians-9-apostle-pauls-missionary-deception-taqiyya/
On Jesus lying to his brothers:
https://discover-the-truth.com/2015/01/21/did-jesus-deceive-his-brothers-taqiyya-2/
On Jesus (god) deceiving people “BEST OF DECEIVERS”,
King James 2000 Bible Jeremiah 23:39 Therefore, behold, I, even I, will utterly DECEIVE (Nasha) YOU, and I will forsake you, and the city that I gave you and your fathers, and cast you out of my presence:
The Hebrew word ‘Nasha’ has the following meanings:
1) to beguile, deceive
A)(Niphal) to be beguiled
B)(Hiphil) to beguile, deceive
C)(Qal) utterly (infinitive)
MORE MASS DECEPTION FROM JESUS,
1 Kings 22:20-22: 20 And the LORD said, ‘WHO WILL ENTICE AHAM into attacking Ramoth Gilead and going to his death there?’ “One suggested this, and another that. 21 Finally, a spirit came forward, stood before the LORD and said, ‘I will entice him.’22 ” ‘By what means?’ the LORD asked. “‘I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouths of all his prophets,’ he said.” ‘You will succeed in enticing him,’ said the LORD. ‘Go and do it.’ Here we see that the man said that he would resort to lying in order to entice Ahab and God supported the idea and told him to go ahead and do it!
professor George Alexander Kennedy says the following on the passage,
…words for eloquence, speaking, and persuading in the Hebrew text of the Old Testament, there is no Hebrew transitive verb to express the thought ‘He persuades someone’ in a positive sense. The closest is the verb pata, which carries the connotation of enticement, seduction, and DECEPTION. EVEN THE LORD IS, SAID TO ENGAGE OCCASSIONALY IN THIS KIND OF RHETORIC (1 kings 22:20-22; 2 Chronicles 18:19-21; Ezekiel 14:9). Active persuasion in this sense is generally thought of as negative. [16]
https://discover-the-truth.com/2013/08/28/bible-yahweh-best-of-deceivers/
(“OUCH”) 😉
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The dog is barking again. Better question do you understand what you read SINCE IF WE GO WITH YOUR SICK, PERVERTED MISREADING OF 1 CORINTHIANS 7 THEN THAT MEANS THAT WIVES HAVE THE SAME RIGHT TO RAPE THEIR HUSBANDS?
You really must feel so stupid right now for shamelessly perverting Paul’s words, Muhammad’s Master, since you keep thinking you are reading the filth you call the Quran. But since you want to talk about rape, let’s see what your women enslaving and raping profit did with women like your mother, sisters, wives, and/or daughters.
The following verse permits Muslim men (which includes Muhammad himself) to sleep with married women whom they have taken captive:
Also (prohibited are) women already married, except those whom your right hands possess: Thus hath God ordained (Prohibitions) against you: Except for these, all others are lawful, provided ye seek (them in marriage) with gifts from your property, – desiring chastity, not lust, seeing that ye derive benefit from them, give them their dowers (at least) as prescribed; but if, after a dower is prescribed, agree Mutually (to vary it), there is no blame on you, and God is All-knowing, All-wise. S. 4:24 Y. Ali
Tragically, this did not remain a mere abstraction but was readily put into practice by Muhammad’s sexually craved jihadists:
Abu Sirma said to Abu Sa’id al Khadri: O Abu Sa’id, did you hear Allah’s Messenger mentioning al-‘azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah’s Messenger on the expedition to the Bi’l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing ‘azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah’s Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah’s Messenger, and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3371)
And:
Abu Said al-Khudri said: The apostle of Allah sent a military expedition to Awtas on the occasion of the battle of Hunain. They met their enemy and fought with them. They defeated them and took them captives. Some of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah were reluctant to have intercourse with the female captives in the presence of their husbands who were unbelievers. So Allah, the Exalted, sent down the Quranic verse, ‘And all married women (are forbidden) unto you save those (captives) whom your right hands possess’. That is to say, they are lawful for them when they complete their waiting period. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Volume 2, Number 2150)
Thus, Muhammad and his deity condoned and encouraged men to virtually rape their female captives whether they were married or not.
Now unless this taqiyyist wants us to believe that such women whose families had just been murdered and (in some cases) whose husbands were still alive would actually consent to having sex with their captors, it should be apparent that the Islamic deity is actually permitting, and even encouraging, rape and adultery in his so-called holy book!
How truly sad and tragic for these women that Muhammad and his god did not share the shame and concern of the jihadists regarding the highly unethical nature of raping captives whose husbands were still alive. Instead, Allah and his messenger rushed to justify such a perverted and heinous crime!
Contrast this filth with what Deuteronomy teaches concerning the issue of female captives:
“When you go to war against your enemies and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, if you notice among the captives a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her AS YOUR WIFE. Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her.” Deuteronomy 21:10-14
Here we see that, instead of permitting men to rape captive women, the Holy Bible forces the Israelites to marry them if they wanted to have sex with them, and then letting them go free in case of a divorce. This means that the Holy Bible is actually dignifying these women by not allowing them to be treated the way Allah and his “messenger” had them treated, namely like animals. Now this is a command which predates the Quran by approximately 2200 years!
Unfortunately, there’s more to the story. The so-called sound ahadith report that Muhammad taught that Allah has predestined the amount of adultery a person must necessarily commit:
Narrated Ibn ‘Abbas:
I did not see anything so resembling minor sins as what Abu Huraira said from the Prophet, who said, “Allah has written for the son of Adam his INEVITABLE share of adultery whether he is aware of it or not: The adultery of the eye is the looking (at something which is sinful to look at), and the adultery of the tongue is to utter (what it is unlawful to utter), and the innerself wishes and longs for (adultery) and the private parts turn that into reality or refrain from submitting to the temptation.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 8, Book 77, Number 609)
Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he OF NECESSITY MUST COMMIT (or there would be no escape from it). (Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421; see also Number 6422)
In other words, these Muslims were only carrying out the very sexual filth which their god had predestined for them! I have more for you in the next post.
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More filth from your profit.
As if Islam’s teachings couldn’t get any more morally repugnant, Allah goes ahead and permits his followers to pay women to marry them temporarily for the sole purpose of gratifying their sexual desires. This is typically referred to as “pleasure marriages” (zawaj al-mut’a).
According to the Muslim expositors, the following passage:
O you who believe! Make not unlawful the Taiyibat (all that is good as regards foods, things, deeds, beliefs, persons, etc.) which Allah has made lawful to you, and transgress not. Verily, Allah does not like the transgressors. S. 5:87 Hilali-Khan
Was “revealed” to condone the practice of marrying women for a short period of time:
Narrated Abdullah:
We used to participate in the holy wars carried on by the Prophet and we had no women (wives) with us. So we said (to the Prophet). “Shall we castrate ourselves?” But the Prophet forbade us to do that and thenceforth he allowed us to marry a woman (temporarily) by giving her even a garment, and then he recited: “O you who believe! Do not make unlawful the good things which Allah has made lawful for you.” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 139)
Narrated Abdullah:
We used to participate in the holy battles led by Allah’s Apostle and we had nothing (no wives) with us. So we said, “Shall we get ourselves castrated?” He forbade us that and then allowed us to marry women with a temporary contract and recited to us: — ‘O you who believe! Make not unlawful the good things which Allah has made lawful for you, but commit no transgression.’ (5.87) (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 13o)
Pay attention to the fact that, instead of teaching his men abstinence and self-control, Muhammad actually goes ahead and encourages his band of murdering thugs to find women to have sex with!
Sadly, there were instances in which women actually got pregnant through such unions:
Yahya related to me from Malik from Ibn Shihab from Urwa ibn az-Zubayr that Khawla ibn Hakim came to Umar ibn al-Khattab and said, “Rabia ibn Umayya made a temporary marriage with a woman and she is pregnant by him.” Umar ibn al-Khattab went out in dismay dragging his cloak, saying, “This temporary marriage, had I come across it, I would have ordered stoning and done away with it!” (Malik’s Muwatta, Book 28, Number 28.18.42)
Certain traditions claim that Muhammad abrogated this form of prostitution:
Narrated Jabir bin ‘Abdullah and Salama bin Al-Akwa’: While we were in an army, Allah’s Apostle came to us and said, “You have been allowed to do the Mut’a (marriage), so do it.” Salama bin Al-Akwa’ said: Allah’s Apostle’s said, “If a man and a woman agree (to marry temporarily), their marriage should last for three nights, and if they like to continue, they can do so; and if they want to separate, they can do so.” I do not know whether that was only for us or for all the people in general. Abu Abdullah (Al-Bukhari) said: ‘Ali made it clear that the Prophet said, “The Mut’a marriage has been cancelled (made unlawful).” (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 52)
However, there are other narrations which claim that Muslims continued to observe temporary marriages until the caliphate of Umar b. al-Khattab:
Ibn Uraij reported: ‘Ati’ reported that Jabir b. Abdullah came to perform ‘Umra, and we came to his abode, and the people asked him about different things, and then they made a mention of temporary marriage, whereupon he said: Yes, we had been benefiting ourselves by this temporary marriage during the lifetime of the Holy Prophet and during the time of Abu Bakr and ‘Umar. (Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3248)
Even sadder, and more shamefully, is the fact that the Shiite sect of Islam continues to observe this practice till this day. They even attempt to use the Sunni sources themselves to establish that this morally repugnant form of prostitution is still permissible since Muhammad and his followers never abrogated it! For the details and arguments we recommend the following online booklet.
Suffice it to say, such a practice is nothing more than prostitution and it is an outright insult to even label this filth as marriage.
With that said, here are my questions for you.
1. Would your mother, wives, sisters, daughters be ok with having sex with their Muslim captors, men who have taken them captive?
2. Would you be ok with Muhammad and his money treating your mother, sisters, or daughters as prostitutes by contracting muta with them?
Please answer the questions so I can post your answers for all to see.
What a joy it is to muzzle you and shame your profit! Thanks for helping me do so. 😉
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Now let’s see who the deceiver really is, shall we?
In response to these charges, Muslims oftentimes point to certain biblical passages in order to turn the tables on Christians. They hope that by citing specific biblical verses which seem to teach that Yahweh is also a deceiver this will then justify the Quranic portrait of Allah being a schemer and liar. The passages that Muslims often appeal to are Ezekiel 14:9-10 and 20:25-26.
There are at least a couple of problems with the Muslim logic. First, the only thing this would prove is that neither Yahweh of the Bible nor Allah of the Quran is worthy of being viewed or worshiped as God. It does nothing to justify the Quran’s picture of God.
Second, a careful examination of the biblical texts in question shows that there is no comparison with the Quran. The Muslims are comparing apples and oranges at this point. An analysis of the immediate (as well as the greater biblical) contexts will help explain why we say this.
We include here the two passages along with some of the immediate context for further clarification:
“Then certain of the elders of Israel came to me and sat before me. And the word of the LORD came to me: ‘Son of man, these men have taken their idols into their hearts, and set the stumbling block of their iniquity before their faces. Should I indeed let myself be consulted by them? Therefore speak to them and say to them, Thus says the Lord GOD: Any one of the house of Israel who takes his idols into his heart and sets the stumbling block of his iniquity before his face, and yet comes to the prophet, I the LORD will answer him as he comes with the multitude of his idols, that I may lay hold of the hearts of the house of Israel, who are all estranged from me through their idols. Therefore say to the house of Israel, Thus says the Lord GOD: Repent and turn away from your idols, and turn away your faces from all your abominations. For any one of the house of Israel, or of the strangers who sojourn in Israel, who separates himself from me, taking his idols into his heart and putting the stumbling block of his iniquity before his face, and yet comes to a prophet to consult me through him, I the LORD will answer him myself. And I will set my face against that man; I will make him a sign and a byword and cut him off from the midst of my people, and you shall know that I am the LORD. And if the prophet is deceived (pathath) and speaks a word, I, the LORD, have deceived (pathath) that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand against him and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel. And they shall bear their punishment–the punishment of the prophet and the punishment of the inquirer shall be alike–that the house of Israel may no more go astray from me, nor defile themselves anymore with all their transgressions, but that they may be my people and I may be their God, declares the Lord GOD.’” Ezekiel 14:1-10
“Moreover, I swore to them in the wilderness that I would scatter them among the nations and disperse them through the countries, because they had not obeyed my rules, but had rejected my statutes and profaned my Sabbaths, and their eyes were set on their fathers’ idols. Moreover, I gave them statutes that were not good and rules by which they could not have life, and I defiled them through their very gifts in their offering up all their firstborn, that I might devastate them. I did it that they might know that I am the LORD.” Ezekiel 20:23-26
In light of the contexts we can now proceed to analyze the implications of these texts. To begin with, God is not causing innocent or blameless people to be deceived and go astray. God, instead, is handing godless and rebellious sinners over to the desires of their evil, unregenerate hearts. In other words, God is giving the people exactly what their wicked hearts were craving, what their sinful natures desired. The following texts bring this out more clearly:
“But my people did not listen to my voice; Israel would not submit to me. So I gave them over to their stubborn hearts, to follow their own counsels. Psalm 81:11-12
“Who has spoken and it came to pass, unless the Lord has commanded it? Is it not from the mouth of the Most High that good and bad come? Why should a living man complain, a man, about the punishment of his sins?” Lamentations 3:37-39
“For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles. Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of THEIR hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, BECAUSE they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen. For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature; and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error. And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.” Romans 1:21-28
“The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.” 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12
Now the question becomes how does Yahweh deceive the false prophets so as to mislead sinners who do not want to obey? Does he directly inspire lies through these prophets, does he directly cause the persons to deceive? Or is he indirectly the cause of the deception, i.e. is Yahweh permitting a lying and deceptive agent to cause the false prophets to utter lies and falsehood?
To answer that we need to first see what the Holy Bible says about Yahweh’s character:
“The Rock, his work is perfect, for all his ways are justice. A God of faithfulness and without iniquity, just and upright is he.” Deuteronomy 32:4
“This God–his way is perfect; the word of the LORD proves true; he is a shield for all those who take refuge in him.” Psalm 18:30
“in hope of eternal life, which God, who never lies, promised before the ages began” Titus 1:2
“So when God desired to show more convincingly to the heirs of the promise the unchangeable character of his purpose, he guaranteed it with an oath, so that by two unchangeable things, in which it is IMPOSSIBLE for God to lie, we who have fled for refuge might have strong encouragement to hold fast to the hope set before us.” Hebrews 6:17-18
“Let no one say when he is tempted, ‘I am being tempted by God,’ for God CANNOT be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one. But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire. Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death. Do not be deceived, my beloved brothers. Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of lights with whom there is no variation or shadow due to change.” James 1:13-17
The citations above make it plain for all to see that God CANNOT lie since it is IMPOSSIBLE for him to do so, and won’t directly cause anyone to lie either. Hence, both the Old and New Testaments concur on this point: God himself cannot lie and isn’t the direct cause of any lie or deceit.
More in the next part.
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I continue my discussion of whether Yahweh is like your satan whom you worship.
We still need to answer the question of how can Yahweh say he has deceived the prophet when the same Scriptures say that Yahweh cannot deceive anyone. Is this a contradiction in the Scriptures? Not at all, as we shall now prove by God’s grace.
According to the Holy Bible, all agents are under God’s sovereign control and can only do what God permits:
“With him are strength and sound wisdom; the deceived and the deceiver are his.” Job 12:16
“Behold, I have created the smith who blows the fire of coals and produces a weapon for its purpose. I have also created the ravager to destroy; no weapon that is fashioned against you shall succeed, and you shall confute every tongue that rises against you in judgment. This is the heritage of the servants of the LORD and their vindication from me, declares the LORD.” Isaiah 54:16-17
These texts imply that the deceiver, the deceived, the smith and the wielder of the sword are all under God’s complete control to do as he sees fit.
“Simon, Simon, Satan has asked to sift you as wheat. But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers.” Luke 22:31-32
Jesus says that Satan has asked to sift through the disciples, which obviously means that he had to get permission from God first before he could anything.
What the above verses imply is that even Satan and the demons can only do what God permits them.
God often permits them to deceive or wreck havoc in order to accomplish his perfect and just purposes:
“The LORD has made everything for its purpose, even the wicked for the day of trouble.” Proverbs 16:4
“In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,” Ephesians 1:11
His purposes in permitting these evil entities to act in accord with their evil intent may be the result of judgment falling on sinful and rebellious people as in the case of the Ezekiel texts, or to accomplish a greater good as in the case of Christ being handed over to death for the salvation of God’s people. Please note the following texts carefully since they help to illuminate these points:
“And Micaiah said, ‘Therefore hear the word of the LORD: I saw the LORD sitting on his throne, and all the host of heaven standing beside him on his right hand and on his left; and the LORD said, “Who will entice (pathath) Ahab, that he may go up and fall at Ramoth-gilead?” And one said one thing, and another said another. Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, saying, “I will entice (pathath) him.” And the LORD said to him, “By what means?” And he said, “I will go out, and will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.” And he said, “You are to entice (pathath) him, and you shall succeed; go out and do so.” Now therefore behold, the LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these your prophets; the LORD has declared disaster for you.’ Then Zedekiah the son of Chenaanah came near and struck Micaiah on the cheek and said, ‘How did the Spirit of the LORD go from me to speak to you?’ And Micaiah said, ‘Behold, you shall see on that day when you go into an inner chamber to hide yourself.’ And the king of Israel said, ‘Seize Micaiah, and take him back to Amon the governor of the city and to Joash the king’s son, and say, “Thus says the king, ‘Put this fellow in prison and feed him meager rations of bread and water, until I come in peace.’”’ And Micaiah said, ‘If you return in peace, the LORD has not spoken by me.’ And he said, ‘Hear, all you peoples!’” 1 Kings 22:19-28
God caused the prophets to prophecy lies by permitting a lying spirit to inspire these lies through them. Notice that God himself didn’t lie, but permitted the spirit to lie through the prophets.
Interestingly, this passage uses the same Hebrew word for deception, pathath, which is found in the Ezekiel 14 text.
Further insight is found in the story of Job.
“Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them. The LORD said to Satan, ‘From where have you come?’ Satan answered the LORD and said, ‘From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it.’ And the LORD said to Satan, ‘Have you considered my servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, who fears God and turns away from evil?’ Then Satan answered the LORD and said, ‘Does Job fear God for no reason? Have you not put a hedge around him and his house and all that he has, on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his possessions have increased in the land. But stretch out your hand and touch all that he has, and he will curse you to your face.’ And the LORD said to Satan, ‘Behold, all that he has is in your hand. Only against him do not stretch out your hand.’ So Satan went out from the presence of the LORD. Now there was a day when his sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother’s house, and there came a messenger to Job and said, ‘The oxen were plowing and the donkeys feeding beside them, and the Sabeans fell upon them and took them and struck down the servants with the edge of the sword, and I alone have escaped to tell you.’ While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, ‘The fire of God fell from heaven and burned up the sheep and the servants and consumed them, and I alone have escaped to tell you.’ While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, ‘The Chaldeans formed three groups and made a raid on the camels and took them and struck down the servants with the edge of the sword, and I alone have escaped to tell you.’ While he was yet speaking, there came another and said, ‘Your sons and daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother’s house, and behold, a great wind came across the wilderness and struck the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young people, and they are dead, and I alone have escaped to tell you.’ Then Job arose and tore his robe and shaved his head and fell on the ground and worshiped. And he said, ‘Naked I came from my mother’s womb, and naked shall I return. The LORD gave, and the LORD has taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD.’” Job 1:6-22
“Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came among them to present himself before the LORD. And the LORD said to Satan, ‘From where have you come?’ Satan answered the LORD and said, ‘From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it.’ And the LORD said to Satan, ‘Have you considered my servant Job, that there is none like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, who fears God and turns away from evil? He still holds fast his integrity, although you incited me against him to destroy him without reason.’ Then Satan answered the LORD and said, ‘Skin for skin! All that a man has he will give for his life. But stretch out your hand and touch his bone and his flesh, and he will curse you to your face.’ And the LORD said to Satan, ‘Behold, he is in your hand; only spare his life.’ So Satan went out from the presence of the LORD and struck Job with loathsome sores from the sole of his foot to the crown of his head. And he took a piece of broken pottery with which to scrape himself while he sat in the ashes. Then his wife said to him, ‘Do you still hold fast your integrity? Curse God and die.’ But he said to her, ‘You speak as one of the foolish women would speak. Shall we receive good from God, and shall we not receive evil?’ In all this Job did not sin with his lips.” Job 2:1-10
Even though God permitted Satan to wreck havoc on Job, both God and Job attribute this calamity to God. The reason why should now be clear… Satan couldn’t have come near Job if God hadn’t allowed it. Hence, since God permitted Satan to do what he did it can therefore be said that these disasters came from Yahweh.
“Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a man attested to you by God with mighty works and wonders and signs that God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves know– this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men. God raised him up, loosing the pangs of death, because it was not possible for him to be held by it.” Acts 2:22-24
“for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place.” Acts 4:27-28
Again, it was God who decreed that the Lord Jesus would be betrayed and killed by lawless and godless men so as to accomplish the salvation of God for mankind.
The foregoing should make it apparent that the Holy Bible is not asserting that God is the direct cause of deceptions or lies. Rather, Yahweh is the indirect cause in the sense that he has decreed and permitted that liars and deceivers will deceive in order to accomplish God’s perfect and righteous will.
Putting it in another way, Yahweh doesn’t actually deceive or inspire deception. Rather, Yahweh permits, allows, decrees that lying spirits or humans will act in accord with their own deceptive hearts and mislead sinners and rebels who refuse to obey the true God. In so doing, God is simply handing over these individuals to their own desires since this is what they deserve.
Not done just yet,
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This is the third part of my post showing that Yahweh is not like the demon who inspired your profit.
Furthermore, and this is important, in both cases cited above, i.e. Ezekiel and Micaiah, God does not leave these sinners with deceived prophets only. The true prophet, with the true message of God, warns both groups also and then they decide for themselves that they want to follow the deceptive spirits. They followed those who said what they wanted to hear. They were given what they wanted. They were not deceived without an alternative and without a strong warning from God that this is what would take place when they insist on their idolatrous ways. These deceptions are not in the mouth of the true prophet (in distinction to Muhammad’s satanic verses), but only in the mouth of self-appointed false prophets who work for their own gain.
God had told his people to make a choice, to choose life over death:
“For this commandment that I command you today is not too hard for you, neither is it far off. It is not in heaven, that you should say, ‘Who will ascend to heaven for us and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it?’ Neither is it beyond the sea, that you should say, ‘Who will go over the sea for us and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it?’ But the word is very near you. It is in your mouth and in your heart, so that you can do it. See, I have set before you today life and good, death and evil. If you obey the commandments of the LORD your God that I command you today, by loving the LORD your God, by walking in his ways, and by keeping his commandments and his statutes and his rules, then you shall live and multiply, and the LORD your God will bless you in the land that you are entering to take possession of it. But if your heart turns away, and you will not hear, but are drawn away to worship other gods and serve them, I declare to you today, that you shall surely perish. You shall not live long in the land that you are going over the Jordan to enter and possess. I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and curse. Therefore choose life, that you and your offspring may live, loving the LORD your God, obeying his voice and holding fast to him, for he is your life and length of days, that you may dwell in the land that the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, to give them.” Deuteronomy 30:11-20
To this day, life and death is an option before us. God does not only put death before them and they have no option but to take it as if that is what God wanted for them. The prophet Ezekiel, as well as the others, shows that what God wants for his people, and for us, is to turn and live, not die:
“The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not suffer for the iniquity of the father, nor the father suffer for the iniquity of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself. But if a wicked person turns away from all his sins that he has committed and keeps all my statutes and does what is just and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die. None of the transgressions that he has committed shall be remembered against him; for the righteousness that he has done he shall live. Have I any pleasure in the death of the wicked, declares the Lord GOD, and not rather that he should turn from his way and live?” Ezekiel 18:20-23
“Therefore I will judge you, O house of Israel, every one according to his ways, declares the Lord GOD. Repent and turn from all your transgressions, lest iniquity be your ruin. Cast away from you all the transgressions that you have committed, and make yourselves a new heart and a new spirit! Why will you die, O house of Israel? For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Lord GOD; so turn, and live.” Ezekiel 18:30-32
“So you, son of man, I have made a watchman for the house of Israel. Whenever you hear a word from my mouth, you shall give them warning from me. If I say to the wicked, O wicked one, you shall surely die, and you do not speak to warn the wicked to turn from his way, that wicked person shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand. But if you warn the wicked to turn from his way, and he does not turn from his way, that person shall die in his iniquity, but you will have delivered your soul. And you, son of man, say to the house of Israel, Thus have you said: ‘Surely our transgressions and our sins are upon us, and we rot away because of them. How then can we live?’ Say to them, As I live, declares the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live; turn back, turn back from your evil ways, for why will you die, O house of Israel?” Ezekiel 33:7-11
“The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.” 2 Peter 3:9
Let us now contrast this biblical portrait of God with the Quran’s depiction of Allah.
Yahweh doesn’t lie and is not the direct cause of deception. Allah, on the other hand, both lies and directly causes deception as in the case of making it appear as though Jesus had been crucified when in fact he hadn’t been (cf. Sura 4:157), or commanding people to do evil and then punishing them for their obedience (Sura 17:16).
In accord with justice, Yahweh permits evil agents to mislead sinners and rebels who refuse to repent and obey God’s commands. He may even use the evil of the people to accomplish a greater good such as in the case of Christ’s crucifixion. He doesn’t cause righteous servants or the godly to be led astray, but protects them from the evil one (cf. Luke 10:17-20; 1 John 2:13-14; 4:1-4; 5:4-5, 18-19). Allah, on the other hand, deceives both believers and unbelievers (cf. Suras 4:142; 8:30, 43-44).
These points should make it clear to any open-minded reader that the Holy Bible and the Quran are not the same in their depiction of God’s character.
Here is another passage which Muslims often use to prove their assertion that Yahweh is a deceiver:
“O LORD, thou hast deceived me, and I was deceived; thou art stronger than I, and thou hast prevailed. I have become a laughingstock all the day; every one mocks me.” Jeremiah 20:7
Much like Ezekiel 14 and 1 Kings, the word for deceive here is pathath. But unlike those specific contexts, the word has nothing to do with deception. Words must be defined within a specific context, since the same word can mean different things in different contexts. Depending upon the context pathath can mean a host of things just as the following lexicon demonstrates:
pathah {paw-thaw’} # 06601
1) to be spacious, be open, be wide
a) (Qal) to be spacious or open or wide
b) (Hiphil) to make spacious, make open
2) to be simple, entice, deceive, persuade
a) (Qal)
1) to be open-minded, be simple, be naive
2) to be enticed, be deceived
b) (Niphal) to be deceived, be gullible
c) (Piel)
1) to persuade, seduce
2) to deceive
d) (Pual)
1) to be persuaded
2) to be deceived (Source)
We therefore must take a look at the immediate context to see what pathath exactly means. It is clear from the text that the word can only mean “persuade”:
“O LORD, You induced me, and I was persuaded; YOU ARE STRONGER THAN I, AND HAVE PREVAILED. I am in derision daily; Everyone mocks me. For when I spoke, I cried out; I shouted, ‘Violence and plunder!’ Because the word of the LORD was made to me A reproach and a derision daily. Then I said, ‘I will not make mention of Him, Nor speak anymore in His name.’ But His word was in my heart like a burning fire Shut up in my bones; I was weary of holding it back, And I could not.” Jeremiah 20:8-9 NKJV
God was persuading Jeremiah to continue the work which he was sent to do even though the latter didn’t want to. God had already warned Jeremiah beforehand what the response of the people would be to his preaching:
“Now the word of the LORD came to me, saying, ‘Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations.’ Then I said, ‘Ah, Lord GOD! Behold, I do not know how to speak, for I am only a youth.’ But the LORD said to me, ‘Do not say, “I am only a youth”; for to all to whom I send you, you shall go, and whatever I command you, you shall speak. Do not be afraid of them, for I am with you to deliver you, declares the LORD.’ Then the LORD put out his hand and touched my mouth. And the LORD said to me, ‘Behold, I have put my words in your mouth. See, I have set you this day over nations and over kingdoms, to pluck up and to break down, to destroy and to overthrow, to build and to plant.’ And the word of the LORD came to me, saying, ‘Jeremiah, what do you see?’ And I said, ‘I see an almond branch.’ Then the LORD said to me, ‘You have seen well, for I am watching over my word to perform it.’ The word of the LORD came to me a second time, saying, ‘What do you see?’ And I said, ‘I see a boiling pot, facing away from the north.’ Then the LORD said to me, ‘Out of the north disaster shall be let loose upon all the inhabitants of the land. For behold, I am calling all the tribes of the kingdoms of the north, declares the LORD, and they shall come, and every one shall set his throne at the entrance of the gates of Jerusalem, against all its walls all around and against all the cities of Judah. And I will declare my judgments against them, for all their evil in forsaking me. They have made offerings to other gods and worshiped the works of their own hands. But you, dress yourself for work; arise, and say to them everything that I command you. Do not be dismayed by them, lest I dismay you before them. And I, behold, I make you this day a fortified city, an iron pillar, and bronze walls, against the whole land, against the kings of Judah, its officials, its priests, and the people of the land. They will fight against you, but they shall not prevail against you, for I am with you, declares the LORD, to deliver you.’” Jeremiah 1:4-19
“To whom shall I speak and give warning, that they may hear? Behold, their ears are uncircumcised, they cannot listen; behold, the word of the LORD is to them an object of scorn; they take no pleasure in it.” Jeremiah 6:10
God promises him that his message will basically fall on deaf ears, that he will have strong opposition and even suffer persecution. So God never promised him a smooth sailing if he would be his prophet. He knew that it would be tough, God told him beforehand. Still, Jeremiah wants to give up. He is exhausted and his strength is gone. He doesn’t want to be a warner anymore who is constantly ridiculed. So he laments to God that he had induced and persuaded him to take this position, but he does not and could not say that God deceived him, since God had indeed told him beforehand. The verse has nothing to do with deception whatsoever.
We now turn to one final text that is used to prove that Yahweh deceives:
“Then I said, ‘Ah, Sovereign LORD, how completely you have deceived this people and Jerusalem by saying, ‘You will have peace,’ when the sword is at our throats.’” Jeremiah 4:10
Jeremiah accused God of deceiving the people into thinking that he was going to grant them peace.
There are several problems with appealing to this text to prove that God is a deceiver. In the first place, God never promised his people unconditional peace, but promised to grant them peace provided that they obeyed him. God also warned them of disaster if they failed to live by his instructions:
“If you fully obey the LORD your God and carefully follow all his commands I give you today, the LORD your God will set you high above all the nations on earth. All these blessings will come upon you and accompany you if you obey the LORD your God… However, if you do not obey the LORD your God and do not carefully follow all his commands and decrees I am giving you today, all these curses will come upon you and overtake you:” Deuteronomy 28:1-2, 15
“‘If you will return, O Israel, return to me,’ declares the LORD. If you put your detestable idols out of my sight and no longer go astray, and if in a truthful, just and righteous way you swear, “As surely as the LORD lives,” then the nations will be blessed by him and in him they will glory.’ This is what the LORD says to the men of Judah and to Jerusalem: ‘Break up your unplowed ground and do not sow among thorns. Circumcise yourselves to the LORD, circumcise your hearts, you men of Judah and people of Jerusalem, or my wrath will break out and burn like fire because of the evil you have done— burn with no one to quench it. Announce in Judah and proclaim in Jerusalem and say: “Sound the trumpet throughout the land!” Cry aloud and say: “Gather together! Let us flee to the fortified cities!” Raise the signal to go to Zion! Flee for safety without delay! For I am bringing disaster from the north, even terrible destruction. A lion has come out of his lair; a destroyer of nations has set out. He has left his place to lay waste your land. Your towns will lie in ruins without inhabitant. So put on sackcloth, lament and wail, for the fierce anger of the LORD has not turned away from us. In that day,’ declares the LORD, ‘the king and the officials will lose heart, the priests will be horrified, and the prophets will be appalled.’” Jeremiah 4:1-9
Second, it was the false prophets who deceived the people into believing that God had promised to give them peace in spite of their rebellion against the Lord:
“Then the LORD said to me, ‘Do not pray for the well-being of this people. Although they fast, I will not listen to their cry; though they offer burnt offerings and grain offerings, I will not accept them. Instead, I will destroy them with the sword, famine and plague.’ But I said, ‘Ah, Sovereign LORD, the prophets keep telling them, “You will not see the sword or suffer famine. Indeed, I will give you lasting peace in this place.’” Then the LORD said to me, ‘The prophets are prophesying lies in my name. I have not sent them or appointed them or spoken to them. They are prophesying to you false visions, divinations, idolatries and the delusions of their own minds. Therefore, this is what the LORD says about the prophets who are prophesying in my name: I did not send them, yet they are saying, “No sword or famine will touch this land.” Those same prophets will perish by sword and famine. And the people they are prophesying to will be thrown out into the streets of Jerusalem because of the famine and sword. There will be no one to bury them or their wives, their sons or their daughters. I will pour out on them the calamity they deserve.’” Jeremiah 14:11-16
This may account for Jeremiah falsely assuming that it was God who told the people that he would grant them peace when in fact he never made such a claim.
Third and more importantly, Jeremiah wasn’t always speaking by inspiration or conveying God’s thoughts, but spoke at times out of his own sinful flesh and frustrations. In fact, at one point Jeremiah had to be told to repent because he had fallen so far away due to the anger and disappointment he felt at the response he was receiving from the people:
“You understand, O LORD; remember me and care for me. Avenge me on my persecutors. You are long-suffering—do not take me away; think of how I suffer reproach for your sake. When your words came, I ate them; they were my joy and my heart’s delight, for I bear your name, O LORD God Almighty. I never sat in the company of revelers, never made merry with them; I sat alone because your hand was on me and you had filled me with indignation. Why is my pain unending and my wound grievous and incurable? Will you be to me like a deceptive brook, like a spring that fails? Therefore this is what the LORD says: ‘IF YOU REPENT, I will restore you that you may serve me; if you utter worthy, NOT WORTHLESS, words, you will be my spokesman. Let this people turn to you, but you must not turn to them. I will make you a wall to this people, a fortified wall of bronze; they will fight against you but will not overcome you, for I am with you to rescue and save you,’ declares the LORD. ‘I will save you from the hands of the wicked and redeem you from the grasp of the cruel.’” Jeremiah 15:15-21
Notice carefully how God expressly commanded Jeremiah to repent of his sins, for speaking and saying things that were wrong, in order that he may be restored as God’s prophet and agent.
The objector has erroneously assumed that just because Jeremiah recorded his own statements where he accused God of being a deceiver that this somehow means that he was reflecting God’s view of the situation. On the contrary, even though the entire book of Jeremiah is the inspired Word of God not everything stated within its pages necessarily reflects God’s mind. After all, the Bible accurately records historical events and speeches without this implying that it approves of them. To put it simply, the Bible doesn’t always support or condone the statements and actions it records since they do not always reflect God’s view. This essentially means that all the speeches and deeds of specific individuals that are found in the Bible must be viewed in light of the revealed will and words of God to see whether God approves of them or not.
By God’s grace, this concludes our analysis. In the service of the holy and pure sovereign Triune God, Yahweh Almighty. Amen. Come Lord Jesus, come. By your sovereign grace we will love you for ever and ever. Amen.
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Now let me prove to you that Allah and Satan are twin brothers (or more correctly, Allah is satan!). Enjoy!
The Quran claims that there is no one that is like Allah, none that are comparable to him.
(He is) the Creator of the heavens and the earth: He has made for you pairs from among yourselves, and pairs among cattle: by this means does He multiply you: there is nothing whatever like unto Him, and He is the One that hears and sees (all things). S. 42:11 Abdullah Yusuf Ali
And there is none like unto Him. S. 112:4 Y. Ali
Shockingly, however, there is one specific individual that is a lot like Allah according to the Muslim Scripture. We say shockingly because that someone happens to be the Devil himself!
In this article, we are going to list some of the many characteristics and functions which the Islamic deity shares in common with Satan. A comparison of the Arabic text of these passages will confirm that the very same exact qualities and abilities are ascribed to both Allah and the Devil.(1)
1. The Proud/Arrogant One
A. Satan
And when We said to the angels: Make obeisance to Adam they did obeisance, but Iblis (did it not). He refused and he was proud, and he was one of the unbelievers. S. 2:34 Shakir
(Allah) said: “(O Iblis) get down from this (Paradise), it is not for you to be arrogant here. Get out, for you are of those humiliated and disgraced.” S. 7:13 Hilali-Khan
B. Allah hates the Proud and sends them to hell
Assuredly Allah knoweth that which they keep hidden and that which they proclaim. Lo! He loveth not the proud… So enter the gates of hell, to dwell therein for ever. Woeful indeed will be the lodging of the arrogant. S. 16:23, 29 Pickthall
And on the day of resurrection you shall see those who lied against Allah; their faces shall be blackened. Is there not in hell an abode for the proud? S. 39:60 Shakir
C. Allah
It is Allah, except Whom there is no God; the King, the Pure, the Giver of Peace, the Bestower of Safety, the Protector, the Most Honourable, the Compeller, the Proud; Purity is to Allah from all what they ascribe as partners (to Him)! S. 59:23 Faridul Haque
Interestingly, the Arabic word for “the Proud”, Al-Mutakabbir, happens to be one of the ninety-names of Allah:
Al-Mutakabbir: The Supremely Great
Everything which is not Him is insignificant; He is the Great in Majesty or Most Excellent of beings, who has rights which no other possesses, the Possessor of power and excellence the like of which no other has; He who acts are good, exceeding the good acts of any other; the Majestic; He who disdains having the attributes of created beings; He who magnifies Himself against the proud among His creatures.
Al-Mutakabbir is one of the Ninety-Nine Names. (Aisha Bewley, Divine Names)
Now this puts Muslims in a dilemma since this basically means that Allah must not love himself, and has no choice but to punish himself in hell if he is going to be consistent. Note how this logically works out:
a. Allah hates all the proud and casts them into hell.
b. Allah is proud, in fact the most proud of them all.
c. Therefore, Allah must hate himself and will eventually cast himself into hell.
2. The Seducer/Perverter
A. Satan
Recite to them the history of him to whom we vouchsafed our signs, and who departed from them, so that Satan followed him, and he became one of the seduced. S. 7:175 Rodwell
[Eblis] said, by thy might [do I swear], I will surely seduce them all, S. 38:82 Rodwell
B. Allah sends all seducers/perverts to hell
Verily [as to] my servants, thou shalt have no power over them; but [over] those only who shall be seduced, and who shall follow thee. And hell is surely denounced unto them all: S. 15:42-43 Sale
But they were succeeded by an evil posterity who neglected the prayer, and followed [their base] appetites. So they will soon encounter [the reward of] perversity, S. 19:59 Ali Quli Qara’i
And hell will appear plainly to the erring. And it will be said unto them: Where is (all) that ye used to worship Instead of Allah? Can they help you or help themselves? Then will they be hurled therein, they and the seducers And the hosts of Iblis, together. S. 26:91-95 Pickthall
And those against whom the sentence is due shall say, ‘Our Lord! these are those whom we have seduced; we seduced them as we were seduced ourselves: but we clear ourselves to thee;- they, did not worship us!’ S. 28:63 Palmer
So our Lord’s Word is realised against us; we are tasting it. Therefore we perverted you, and we ourselves were perverts.’ So all of them on that day are sharers in the chastisement. S. 37:31-33 Arberry
C. Allah
[The devil] said, because thou hast depraved me, I will lay wait for [men] in thy strait way; S. 7:16 Sale
And my sincere counsel will not profit you, if I desire to counsel you sincerely, if God desires to pervert you; He is your Lord, and unto Him you shall be returned.’ S. 11:34 Arberry
Said he, ‘My Lord, for Thy perverting me I shall deck all fair to them in the earth, and I shall pervert them, all together, S. 15:39 Arberry
Just as we saw with the previous name/characteristic, the Quran’s teaching at this point again places Muslims in a dilemma. Since Allah assigns all seducers/perverters to fiery torment, this again means that he must also punish himself in hell as well. Note again the logic behind this argument:
a. Allah sends all seducers/perverts to hell.
b. Allah seduces and perverts people.
c. Therefore, Allah has to cast himself into hell if he is to be true to himself and faithful to his own laws.
I got more in the next part.
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Here is my second post proving from the Quran that your Allah is Satan since they are one and the same.
3. The Schemer/Beguiler
A. Satan
Those who believe fight in the cause of God, and those who reject Faith Fight in the cause of Evil: So fight ye against the friends of Satan: feeble indeed is the cunning of Satan. S. 4:76 Y. Ali
B. Allah
and I respite them — assuredly My guile is sure. S. 7:183 Arberry
First, he searched the baggage of others. Then came to his brother and produced it (peg) from his baggage! Thus, We played a trick on them, and found an excuse for Yusuf. The law of the king did not allow Yusuf to keep his brother! We elevate in status, whomever We please! And over all those with knowledge, there is the One Who is the all-Knowing!” S. 12:76 Dr. Munir Munshey
“… In that way We devised a cunning scheme for Yusuf…” Aisha Bewley
So leave Me with him who cries lies to this discourse! We will draw them on little by little whence they know not; and I shall respite them — assuredly My guile is sure. S. 68:44-45 Arberry
surely it is a decisive word; it is no merriment. They are devising guile, and I am devising guile. Arberry
4. The Deceiver/Conniver
A. Satan
Amazingly, the Quran never employs the specific Arabic words meaning deceiver/conniver, e.g., makara and khada, for Satan.
B. Allah
Shockingly, even though it never uses these particular terms in reference to Satan the Quran does, however, repeatedly employ them in respect to the Muslim deity!
Verily, the hypocrites seek to deceive God, but He deceives them; and when they rise up to pray, they rise up lazily to be seen of men, and do not remember God, except a few; S. 4:142 Palmer
And they deceived a deception, and we deceived a deception. And they did not feel. S. 27:50 The Generous Qur’an (GQ)
In fact, the Islamic scripture even goes as far as to describe Allah as the best deceiver/conniver of them all!
And they deceived, and Allah deceived. And Allah is the best deceiver. S. 3:54 GQ – cf. Q. 8:30
What makes this all the more shocking is that the Muslim scripture not only emphatically proclaims that all deception belongs to Allah,
And indeed, those before them deceived, so to Allah [belongs] all the deception. He knows what every soul earns, and the infidels will know to whom is the reward of the final home. S. 13:42 GQ
It further emphasizes that the only ones who think that they can ever be safe or secure from Allah’s deception are the unbelievers!
Are they secure from the deception of Allah? So no one can be secure from the deception of Allah except the losing people. S. 7:99 GQ
This means that the believers know better than to ever trust Allah enough to feel secure from his ever deceiving and misleading them. This brings us to our next point.
5. The Misleader/The one who leads people astray
A. Satan
And he entered the city at a time of carelessness of its folk, and he found therein two men fighting, one of his own caste, and the other of his enemies; and he who was of his caste asked him for help against him who was of his enemies. So Moses struck him with his fist and killed him. He said: This is of the devil’s doing. Lo! he is an enemy, a mere misleader. S. 28:15 Pickthall
B. Allah
Then what is the matter with you that you are divided into two parties about the hypocrites? Allah has cast them back (to disbelief) because of what they have earned. Do you want to guide him whom Allah has made to go astray? And he whom Allah has made to go astray, you will never find for him any way (of guidance). S. 4:88 Hilali-Khan
And whomsoever Allah wills to guide, He opens his breast to Islam, and whomsoever He wills to send astray, He makes his breast closed and constricted, as if he is climbing up to the sky. Thus Allah puts the wrath on those who believe not. S. 6:125 Hilali-Khan
And We sent not a Messenger except with the language of his people, in order that he might make (the Message) clear for them. Then Allah misleads whom He wills and guides whom He wills. And He is the All-Mighty, the All-Wise. S. 14:4 Hilali-Khan
If you (O Muhammad) covet for their guidance then verily Allah guides not those whom He makes to go astray (or none can guide him whom Allah sends astray). And they will have no helpers. S. 16:37 Hilali-Khan
6. The Tempter/Enticer
A. Satan
Children of Adam! Let not Satan tempt you as he brought your parents out of the Garden, stripping them of their garments to show them their shameful parts. Surely he sees you, he and his tribe, from where you see them not. We have made the Satans the friends of those who do not believe. S. 7:27 Arberry
Said, “Get out of here! Hell is the just recompense, a plentiful penalty for both _ you and those of them who follow you. Tempt and allure them _ anyone among them you can _ with your sly talk. Raid them with your horses and men, bamboozle a share in their wealth and children, and hold out (false) promises for them.” Surely Shaitan’s promise is nothing but an illusion. S. 17:63-64 Munshey
B. Allah
Do you not notice? WE SEND the Shaitans upon the disbelievers, and they continually incite and instigate them. S. 19:83 Munshey
That HE MAY MAKE that which the devil proposeth a temptation for those in whose hearts is a disease, and those whose hearts are hardened – Lo! the evil-doers are in open schism – S. 22:53 Pickthall
indeed ate food and walked in the markets. And We have made some of you to be a temptation for (some) others. “Will you (endure) patiently?” And your Lord
I still have more for you so don’t go anywhere.
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Here is the final part proving that Allah and Satan are identical.
7. The one who makes people filthy and unclean
A. Satan
Oh you who believe! The liquor (and all intoxicants), the games of chance, idols (and shrines), and all divining devices _ (lots, cards, dices, crystal balls) _ are the filthy handiwork of Shaitan, stay away from them, so that you may succeed. In fact, by means of intoxicants and gambling, Shaitan seeks to sow hatred and hostility among you, and seeks to keep you from the remembrance of Allah and the ‘salat’. So, will you quit (these vices) now? S. 5:90-91 Munshey
B. Allah
Allah unlocks and exposes to Islam the heart of the one whom He wishes to guide. (Conversely) He constricts and squeezes the heart of the one whom He wishes to mislead _ squeezes it so hard, he feels as if he was surging up in the sky. Thus, Allah lobs filth upon those who do not believe! S. 6:125
No soul can believe except with Allah’s permission! And He hurls filth upon those who refuse to think and pay attention! S. 10:100 Munshey
8. The one who commands people to commit indecencies/lewdness
A. Satan
Satan threatens you with poverty and enjoins upon you what is foul, whereas ALLAH promises you forgiveness from Himself and bounty. And ALLAH is Bountiful, All-Knowing. S. 2:268 Sher Ali
O ye who believe! Follow not the footsteps of the devil. Unto whomsoever followeth the footsteps of the devil, lo! he commandeth filthiness and wrong. Had it not been for the grace of Allah and His mercy unto you, not one of you would ever have grown pure. But Allah causeth whom He will to grow. And Allah is Hearer, Knower. S. 24:21 Pickthall
B. Allah
And WE DECREED for the Children of Israel in the Scripture: Ye verily will work corruption in the earth twice, and ye will become great tyrants. S. 17:4 Pickthall
And when We desire to destroy a city, We command its men who live at ease, and they commit ungodliness therein, then the Word is realized against it, and We destroy it utterly. S. 17:16 Arberry
9. The one who makes evil deeds seem fair and enticing
A. Satan
When the suffering reached them from us, why then did they not learn humility? On the contrary their hearts became hardened, and Satan made their (sinful) acts seem alluring to them. S. 6:43 Y. Ali
By Allah, We verily sent messengers unto the nations before thee, but the devil made their deeds fairseeming unto them. So he is their patron this day, and theirs will be a painful doom. S. 16:63 Pickthall
B. Allah
As to those who believe not in the Hereafter, We have made their deeds pleasing in their eyes; and so they wander about in distraction. S. 27:4 Y. Ali
Is he, then, to whom the evil of his deeds made fairseeming, so that he considers it as good (equal to one who is rightly guided)? Verily, Allah sends astray whom He wills, and guides whom He wills. So destroy not yourself (O Muhammad) in sorrow for them. Truly, Allah is the All-Knower of what they do! S. 35:8 Hilali-Khan
10. The Wrathful/He who brings wrath
A. Satan
When sleep covers you, it is assurance from him, and he sent down water from the heaven on you to purify you by it and cause the wrath of Satan to pass from you, and that he might tie on your heart and strengthen by it the feet. S. 8:11 GQ
B. Allah
But those who did wrong changed the word which had been told them for another saying, and We sent down upon the evil-doers wrath from heaven for their evil-doing. S. 2:59 Pickthall
He said: “Punishment and wrath have already come upon you from your Lord: dispute ye with me over names which ye have devised – ye and your fathers,- without authority from God? then wait: I am amongst you, also waiting.” S. 7:71 Y. Ali
But those of them who did wrong changed the word which had been told them for another saying, and We sent down upon them wrath from heaven for their wrongdoing. S. 7:162 Pickthall
11. He who causes people to forget
A. Satan
When you come across people who speak with scorn about Our revelations, turn away from them until they move on to another topic. If Satan should make you forget, then, when you have remembered, do not sit with those who are doing wrong. S. 6:68 Abdel Haleem
B. Allah
Any revelation We cause to be superseded or forgotten, We replace with something better or similar. Do you [Prophet] not know that God has power over everything? S. 2:106 Abdel Haleem
S. We shall make thee read (O Muhammad) so that thou shalt not forget Save that which Allah willeth. Lo! He knoweth the disclosed and that which still is hidden; 87:6-7 Pickthall
12. The one who inspires men
A. Satan/Devils
And eat not of that whereon Allah’s name hath not been mentioned, for lo! it is abomination. Lo! the devils do inspire their minions to dispute with you. But if ye obey them, ye will be in truth idolaters. S. 6:121 Pickthall
We have sent no messenger or apostle before you with whose recitations Satan did not tamper. Yet God abrogates what Satan interpolates; then He confirms His revelations, for God is all-knowing and all-wise. S. 22:52 Ahmed Ali
Here is how another version translates this verse:
We have sent no apostle, or prophet, before thee, but, when he read, Satan suggested some error in his reading. But God shall make void that which Satan hath suggested: Then shall God confirm his signs; for God is knowing and wise. Sale
B. Allah
And We sent not (as Our messengers) before thee other than men, whom We inspired. Ask the followers of the Reminder if ye know not? S. 21:7 Pickthall
Concluding Remarks
The striking, in fact shocking, similarities between Allah and the Devil leave Muslims with one of the following options. Either Satan desires to mimic the Islamic deity in an attempt to get people to think that he is actually Allah himself. Or Allah is simply the Devil masquerading as the true God of Abraham. This means that the Satan which the Quran warns Muslims of is nothing other than a counterfeit, a decoy which the arch-enemy of God set up in order to dupe Muslims into thinking that he and the Allah who inspired Muhammad could not possibly be one and the same individual. After all, how could the Muslim deity be Satan when the Quran goes out of its way to condemn him as a foe that Muslims must avoid at all costs?
As far as the Holy Bible is concerned, there can be doubt whatsoever that the true source of Muhammad’s revelations was not the God revealed in the Person of the Lord Jesus Christ. After all, the Quran plainly denies that Muhammad’s deity is a father to anyone,
And they say: The Beneficent hath taken unto Himself a son. Assuredly ye utter a disastrous thing Whereby almost the heavens are torn, and the earth is split asunder and the mountains fall in ruins, That ye ascribe unto the Beneficent a son, When it is not meet for (the Majesty of) the Beneficent that He should choose a son. There is none in the heavens and the earth but cometh unto the Beneficent as a slave. S. 19:88-93 Pickthall
And curses anyone who would claim that Christ is the Son of Allah:
And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah, and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah. That is their saying with their mouths. They imitate the saying of those who disbelieved of old. Allah (Himself) fighteth against them. How perverse are they! S. 9:30 Pickthall
As such, this identifies Muhammad one of the antichrists that the God-breathed Scriptures warns true believers about,
“Little children, it is the last hour. As you have heard that the antichrist will come, even now there are many antichrists. By this we know that it is the last hour… Who is a liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? Whoever denies the Father and the Son is the antichrist. No one who denies the Son has the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father.” 1 John 2:18, 22-23
Which in turn makes the spirit that spoke to and through Muhammad the spirit of antichrist, e.g., the Devil himself.
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So flyinghourilover, I again want to thank you for allowing me to muzzle you and to expose Muhammad by placing him under the sandals of the blessed Apostle Paul, the slave of the Lord Jesus, Muhammad’s God and Destroyer. Much appreciated! 😉
Now with that said, I do must return to more important matters such as writing more rebuttals and doing more teaching sessions exposing your wicked profit and glorifying the Lord Jesus, your Master and Muhammad’s Judge.
Good night!
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Shamoun: what was that about chickening out? The sham is your profit and his god.
Can you tell me what the website you referred to contains that you have not already reproduced word for word here? Keep running fat boy.
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Fat boy? You must be talking about your profit and his wife Sauda, whom the hadiths describe as being fat obese pigs. Enjoy!
Narrated AbuBarzah: AbdusSalam ibn AbuHazim AbuTalut said: I saw AbuBarzah who came to visit Ubaydullah ibn Ziyad. Then a man named Muslim who was there in the company mentioned it to me. When Ubaydullah saw him, he said: This Muhammad of yours is a dwarf and fat. The old man (i.e. AbuBarzah) understood it. So he said: I did not think that I should remain among people who would make me feel ashamed of the company of Muhammad. Thereupon Ubaydullah said: The company of Muhammad is a honour for you, not a disgrace. He added: I called for you to ask about the reservoir. Did you hear the Apostle of Allah mentioning anything about it? AbuBarzah said: Yes, not once, twice, thrice, four times or five times. If anyone believes it, may Allah not supply him with water from it. He then went away angrily. (Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 40, Number 4731: http://www.searchtruth.com/book_display.php?book=40&translator=3&start=0&number=4731)
Now let’s see what the hadiths say about one of your mothers being a fat porker:
Narrated Aisha:
Sauda (the wife of the Prophet) went out to answer the call of nature after it was made obligatory (for all the Muslims ladies) to observe the veil. SHE WAS A FAT HUGE LADY, and everybody who knew her before could recognize her. So ‘Umar bin Al-Khattab saw her and said, “O Sauda! By Allah, you cannot hide yourself from us, so think of a way by which you should not be recognized on going out. Sauda returned while Allah’s Apostle was in my house taking his supper and a bone covered with meat was in his hand. She entered and said, “O Allah’s Apostle! I went out to answer the call of nature and ‘Umar said to me so-and-so.” Then Allah inspired him (the Prophet) and when the state of inspiration was over and the bone was still in his hand as he had not put in down, he said (to Sauda), “You (women) have been allowed to go out for your needs.” (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 6, Book 60, Number 318)
Now we see how your wicked profit wanted to divorce and dump her. Being a fat obese porker, Sauda wasn’t attractive to him anymore since his sexual lust and perversion lay in sleeping with a minor who was still playing with her dollS
So what was that about being fat ya ibn muta?
Man it really must suck trying to defend your vile wicked demonized profit!
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Shamoun: Man it really must suck trying to defend your vile wicked demonized profit!
Poor Sam. Can’t answer my questions so tries to change the topic. It must be hard being an uneducated, ugly, overweight, bi-polar piece of sh’it.
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OK folks that enough of the insults – this thread is closed.
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