Muslims should pray for Christian activist Jayda Fransen even though she says Muslims are her enemy [Timeframe 9.34-10.15]
Jayda has recently been arrested and is being or has been flown to Northern Ireland for interrogation. Behind that hard exterior and the fighting words, I can imagine she is feeling isolated, afraid and helpless right now. Please pray for her.
Jayda Fransen, 31, from Penge in south-east London, was arrested in Bromley by Police Service of Northern Ireland (PSNI) detectives on Saturday.
Britain First leader Paul Golding, in a video posted on his Twitter feed, said Ms Fransen will be taken to Belfast to be interviewed over comments she made outside the City Hall in August. [Independent]
A message left on Paul Golding’s FaceBook profile:
Categories: Islamophobia, Missionaries, News, Terrorism, White nationalism
Blogging Theology 
What are you praying for?
This perhaps:
[9.30] And the Jews say: Uzair is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!
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I’m probably speaking for most of the Muslims who read and participate on thid blog when I say: no, we’re praying for her guidance.
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Are you praying for Asia Bibi as well? A woman sentenced to death for blasphemy who has been in jail many years in Pakistan.
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did she commit blasphemy?
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I am. And I’m praying that Pakistan comes away from its backwardness.
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If she did commit blasphemy there is nothing to pray for her in that sense. But there are some doubts about whether there were false allegations against her.
@Abu Talhah
Pakistan is not a backward country. Tabek’s rant against the blasphemy law has been refuted last year.
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Not successfully. Get therapy.
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@Abu Talhah
Please don’t always say such things about me. That is insulting.
I know that I sound a little bit paranoid when talking about the tabekians but this is because I really suffer emotionally from their injustice and evil beliefs.
I have always been a lover of the Hanafi madhhab and Imam Maturidi. Then the tabekians came and took these names away by their lies and manipulations.
Regarding the blasphemy law, it was indeed refuted. Nobody ever disputed that Abu Hanifah hold the opinion that the Dhimmi should not be killed for blasphemy. That was discussed years before Tabek used it to defend the filthy secularist Salman Taseer.
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Blasphemy is not a criminal offence according to Jesus. So Islam has no authority to define it as such. A sin yes, against the HS unforgivable, but not a crime. Blasphemy against a man is also impossible. But Islam makes it possible!
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He made it criminal offence for thousands of years. But hey, we all know what you’ll say: that’s the OT!
As if that refutes anything.
Besides we don’t believe in the bible because it’s not from God.
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You speak as if you have access to the penal code espoused by Jesus, peace be upon him and his mother. How very strange.
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But it is according to God (in the old testament)
Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Bring out of the camp the one who cursed, and let all who heard him lay their hands on his head, and let all the congregation stone him. And speak to the people of Israel, saying, Whoever curses his God shall bear his sin. Whoever blasphemes the name of the Lord shall surely be put to death. All the congregation shall stone him. The sojourner as well as the native, when he blasphemes the Name, shall be put to death. – Leviticus 24:13-16
and Jesus confirmed that obeying the Torah was necessary for salvation:
And he said to him, “Why do you ask me about what is good? There is only one who is good. If you would enter life, keep the commandments.” – Matthew 19:17
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Patrobin, – Slam dunk!!
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pat
Muslims apologists love to take matthew 19:17 out of context – not surprising since the context exposes the falsity of islam.
The commandments jesus refers to are..
Is there a commandment to kill blasphemers in any of that?
Worst for islam is that jesus clearly states that the commandments are insufficient for salvation – the man says that he follows all these commandments, an jesus clearly states that it is not enough. Legalistic and ritualistic islam is, thus, nullified by matthew 19:17-21.
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Jesus upheld death penalty for apostates and said salvation was by faith and works.
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A slight misread of the translation if you would be perfect is not the same as saying if you would be saved. I know your reply will be you have to be perfect to be saved to which I will answer then no one is saved and you will reply , only through the blood. We have then swung through the usual full circle of entrenched beliefs and retreated into our safe ivory towers.
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LOL!!!
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Joel
You’ve missed the point of why Jesus said what he did to the rich man. Let me provide the context;
Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.” – Matthew 19:23-24
The point was that the man worshipped his wealth and when Jesus challenged him to abandon his wealth he refused. That has nothing to do with Jesus redefining the Torah but rather emphasising that what is most important, which is to ““…love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.”
What would you expect Jesus to do, name all 613 commandments? His audience were Jewish they would have already known them.
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A neat reply but not good enough since it is very difficult to define what love of riches implies. Some would say any excess of income , others would say riches are fine so long as properly used and so we go on a merry go round of discussion. I would say we who live in the worlds richest western democracies are wealthy beyond belief since one third of the world lives on $2 per day.
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Pat
Actually, I think you have missed the point.
Mathew 19:28…
Again, jesus re-iterates that it is faith – i.e. following jesus, faith in jesus – that brings salvation, not mindless obedience to ritual and certainly not through ones own efforts to “buy” one’s way into heaven by accruing good deeds. All have sinned, all will sin. It is human nature.
If – as you claim – jesus preached salvation through the law, then the rich man would have attained it by following the law, as he claims to have done. Jesus does not deny that this rich man has followed the commandments, he affirms that this is not sufficient.
“What would you expect Jesus to do, name all 613 commandments? His audience were Jewish they would have already known them.”
Jesus named the commandments in answer to the specific question of which ones should be followed – jesus could as easily have “all of them” without naming them. So your answer does not really make sense. All the other commandments should be observed and understood through these most significant ones that jesus mentioned.
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Joel
I believe it is you who is confused my dear nowhere in the passage you quoted does Jesus deny obedience to the law is necessary for salvation but rather if we take the whole story into account he affirms its necessity.
Of course faith in Jesus is needed just as faith in Moses was but that doesn’t mean he taught faith alone. Remember he taught that the law was not abolished:
“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.” – Matthew 5:17
Regarding the rich man, please reread my earlier comment, Jesus was exposing his love of wealth over his love for God. Jesus often taught as per his sermon on the mount that it is not enough to follow the law but one must imbibe its principles as well.
Faith and works.
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pat
“I believe it is you who is confused my dear nowhere in the passage you quoted does Jesus deny obedience to the law is necessary for salvation but rather if we take the whole story into account he affirms its necessity.”
You have missed the point again. Jesus clearly states that the law is insufficient – else, the rich man would have attained salvation. It doesn’t get any clearer. Faith in jesus is the key to salvation, not soulless laws, and mindless rituals.
Again, muslim apologists love to quote Mat 5:17 out of context but it backfires on islam. The object of the law is atonement, jesus fulfills the law, he, therefore is the atonement for our sin. This destroys islam.
“Regarding the rich man, please reread my earlier comment, Jesus was exposing his love of wealth over his love for God. “
Sure he was, but you can’t have it both ways. Either as you claim jesus, upheld the law as the way to salvation, in which case the man would have been saved, or the law was insufficient, which is was since jesus himself says that it is insufficient.
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The law is insufficient? Not according to the bible;
The law of the LORD is perfect, reviving the soul; the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple; – Psalm 19:7
Your evangelical theology denies you the right to follow the bibles’ teaching!
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pat
Nice job at moving the goalposts!
Your claim was that jesus affirmed the necessity of the law for salvation – jesus contradicts that clearly in matthew 19. In mat 19, he says that the law is insufficient.
According to you, the patriarchs would have no salvation because they didn;t abide by the law .
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My position is far kinder to Jesus because yours would have him denounce the bible which declares the law as perfect. Jesus did not deny it as insufficient but rather encouraged a deeper understanding of the foundation of the law which is to love God and to love your neighbour if one doesn’t do this according to Jesus then you have not perfectly obeyed the law at all. Much like what Paul said about love being the foundation of faith in 1 corinthians 13.
Further evidence of a need for balance between faith and works can be found in the epistle of James which also addresses your mentioning of the patriarchs:
“You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. And the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,”and he was called God’s friend. You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone.” – James 2:20-24
As you can see Abraham was justified by both his faith and good deeds. The parable of the good samaritan demonstrates the need for balance by saying to the scholar that to inherit eternal life one must look to the law “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?”. Jesus then went on to explain the law as mercy demonstrated through the parable.
In my opinion if we take all of what Jesus said in the gospels we find moments where he extols the virtues of both depending on what the person Jesus was speaking with needed to hear. Thus my position is that of balance, obeying the law of God which is perfect according to the bible is enough but in order to truly follow the law perfectly one must understand and imbibe its principles.
Faith alone rejects the need to do good deeds because you have already received the ultimate reward of paradise without doing anything and if there is no need to act then why be good at all?
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Matthew 12 v 31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
Jesus seems to be much more forgiving than Mohammed.
Have I committed blasphemy by saying that?
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Erasmus
Holy Spirit is God. Blaspheme against Holy Spirit(God) is a sin. What is in your brain, Erasmus? To say ;
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Erasmus
November 20, 2017 • 9:13 am
Blasphemy is not a criminal offence according to Jesus. So Islam has no authority to define it as such. A sin yes, against the HS unforgivable, but not a crime. Blasphemy against a man is also impossible. But Islam makes it possible!
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Erasmus, you either don’t know what is a crime or just as usual, you are in the fantasy of Christians Hollywood, changing and using words for their whims and caprice.
Sin is a crime:
Proof:
sin1
sin/Submit
noun
1.
an immoral act considered to be a transgression against divine law.
“a sin in the eyes of God”
synonyms: immoral act, wrong, wrongdoing, act of evil/wickedness, transgression, crime, offense, misdeed, misdemeanor; archaictrespass
“a sin in the eyes of God”
wickedness, wrongdoing, wrong, evil, evildoing, sinfulness, immorality, iniquity, vice, crime
“the human capacity for sin”
verb
verb
1.
commit a sin.
“I sinned and brought shame down on us”
synonyms: commit a sin, commit an offense, transgress, do wrong, commit a crime, break the law, misbehave, go astray; archaictrespass
“I have sinned”
Source: https://www.google.ca/search?q=what+is+a+sin&rlz=1C1AVFC_enCA738CA739&oq=what+is+a+sin&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.3508j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
To commit sin is to commit crime.
Thanks.
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So does that mean that even Jesus’ sacrifice will not save the person who blasphemes against the holy spirit? Something for Ignoramus to ponder…
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Erasmus
“Jesus seems to be much more forgiving than Mohammed.”
I say;
No Sir, you forgot this;
Luke 19:27
New International Version
But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them–bring them here and kill them in front of me.'”
Prophet Mohammed will not fight his enemies until they threaten and fight him but when they stop he stops. He is commanded to live with non Muslims but Jesus will not allow anyone who will not follow him to live with him. Jesus destroy peoples properties(tables and chairs) because they do not want to follow him, even when he was not a ruler but ruled. No wonder he will be the most non forgiving person when he is a ruler.
Thanks.
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Jesus like , us all , tailors what he says to fit the circumstances and remember this is translated from a long time ago. You are correct in this conclusion so why try to come to rock solid truths about what he did or said , my suspicion is that you crave certainty.
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