Christian apologist Jonathan McLatchie labels Muslims a “cancer”

McLatchie caught on audio saying Muslim communities are “cancers” to western civilization, and spreading the myth of Muslim “no-go zones”

McLatchie lying in church

I recently posted about a meeting I had with up-and-coming Christian apologist Jonathan McLatchie with whom I had several conversations last weekend at Regents Park Mosque. I reported my impression that he was a bright and pleasant chap who appeared to be a refreshing change from the rabid bigotry and extremism of some of his fellow missionaries such as Jay Smith and Sam Shamoun.

Today I am genuinely shocked to learn about McLatchie’s true nature after viewing a new video by Yahya Snow which reveals some truly shocking lies and the worse kind of anti-Muslim bigotry.

Snow comments:

This bout of Islamophobic bigotry and propaganda was presented by Jonathan McLatchie in a presentation which was delivered at St. Timothy’s Parish Church, Middlesbrough, England. Jonathan McLatchie sounds like a member of a far right Christian group here. I’m not saying he is a member of any racist and/or Islamophobic groups but his comments are certainly extremist and hate-preaching. In this clip I have used an old video I made rebuking the well known Islamophobe for presenting the same lie as Jonathan did (Muslim/Sharia no-go-zones in France). The extremist Islamophobe, Jonathan McLatchie, rounds off his bigotry as he describes Muslim communities as ‘cancers’ which reminded me of another Islamophobe who goes by the name Sam Shamoun. Quite what this type of propaganda is doing in a church is beyond me.

 Here is the video:

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youtube comment:

Screen Shot 2015-08-22 at 15.21.19



Categories: Islam, Silly

16 replies

  1. Just to confirm Jonathan has contacted me and he has maintained there are Sharia run no-go-zones in France while maintaining his cancer comments were only directed towards those areas (which he is due to prove the existence of). I’m pretty confident he just ran with the same lie that FOX News ran with but I will wait for his evidence and sources for such communities in France.

    I know it sounds pie-in-the-sky and ridiculous BUT if he genuinely has evidence for these communities in France then I will certainly delete my video. If he does not then he has effectively labelled French Muslim communities (and by the way of logical extension) our communities here in the UK as cancers because these alleged Sharia run ‘no go zones’ are simply what people perceive to be Muslim ghettos (or what us regular non-bigotted folk call deprived urban areas which just happen to have more Muslims than NonMuslims) and let’s not forget the same right wing lies labelled Brimingham as one of these no go sharia zone things.

    It just does not help cohesion in our society especially considering the 81 year old Muslim killed in the North of England recently. What was the point in prattling on about some right wing propaganda in a church in Middlesbrough of all places?

    In the same presentation Jonathan is unclear on his rhetoric about ‘Taqiyya’….oh yeah Jonathan felt he needed to tell a Middlesbrough church congregation about Taqiyaa (I hope to do a video on this…I will just use the same rebuke material that I used for David Wood…I get the feeling Jonathan borrows from Wood…I noticed when responding to his claims on a Hadith in Sunan Abu Dawud). Perhaps more worryingly he claimed ‘terrorsim’ is part of the second stage of Jihad…while the first stage is just living peacefully with the Non Muslims. Clearly that makes people view us as some sort of fifth column in the UK. Did a Middlesbrough congregagtion really need to be fed with this? What purposedid it serve?

    It’s the type of rhetoric that can radicalise folk to bash distrust Muslims, discriminate against us, abuse us and perhaps even bash a few of us. Irresponsible. Sure Jonathan is influenced by Wood but Wood lives in a toatally different culture, country and has a history of psychological problems. Jonathan is not stupid…he should know the comments he made destroy bridges.

    I will add another video respinding to some of his Jay Smith level apologetics in the JonathanMcLatchie section tonight and if he offers any credible evidence for his claims about our communities in France I will certainly update the section as it’s only fair. However, I think this is detracting somewhat from the low-level apologetics Jonathan has exhibited in his collaboration with Jay Smith which is littered with inconsistency, inaccuracy, misrepresentation and outlandish claims which I can only assume are geared towards stigmatising us as Non-Thinkers (as Atheists do to fundamentalist Christians):

    http://thefactsaboutislam.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Jonathan%20McLatchie

    I trust Jonathan will learn from these interactions with Muslims, we are human being too with feelings. We don’t take kindly to people presenting material which just heightens Islamophobia and further drives rifts between the majority community here in Britian and it’s small Muslim community. We don;t want to be marginalised from society, you would all decry it in your churches if it was black or Jewish people who were the object of such propaganda so why is it different for us? We’re humans too. And we are not all the types who will just accept this status quo…some of us will complain and shout from the roof tops.

    In fact today on the tube I had a stranger approach me who began spouting his anti-Chinese rhetoric to me. I told him not to generalise. Nobody would accept that type of talk about Chinese people…so why is our society plagued with it when it comes to Muslims?

    PS If there are any Brits out there who want to talk about Muslims and Islam…remember if there’s any hint of hate-mongering against us there will be complaints to either the police or the hosts of such events. I’m sick of it. And you know what pisses me off more is that Jonathan seems like the type of bloke I and many other Muslims would be pals with at uni/work…the guy can do better and SHOULD do better than the stooping to Wood-style rhetoric which is roundly denounced here:

    http://thefactsaboutislam.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/David%20Wood

    Who are these guys want to emulate, Jesus p or some psychologically damaged fundamentalist Islamophobe in America?

    WWJD?

    YS

    Liked by 1 person

  2. Lol, reading my comment back…that’s what happens when you write while talking to clients over the phone in the office. However, it’s still pretty understandable.

    Let me do a James Whiite, I’m good but even I cannot write perfectly while reading html code, talking to clients, day dreaming about a new bow tie, eating a peach and writing these comments. But I’m good. Now let me pop over to FaceBook and claim I’m a scholar in German, Norwegian, Bradfordian and Arabic. Out of the way, I’ve got ego stroking to do.

    Liked by 1 person

  3. I have been speaking to Jonathan’s mate Richard Zetter (who is also mates with Nabeel in Oxford) who refuses to condemn using the word ‘cancer’ to describe Muslim communities ‘in the right circumstances”, as he puts it.

    I asked him about Wood and Shamoun and he does not see them as anti-Muslim or extreme! lol

    Another deluded Christian! Why do otherwise normal people end up appeasing extremists and bigots?

    Liked by 1 person

  4. I tried to make my position fairly clear, but apologies if I did not. I hope to make my position clear to anyone who may be reading this blog:

    If (and this is a hypothetical ‘if’, for I am not convinced that the communities Jonathan McLatchie speaks about exists, though nor do I deny it – I simply haven’t looked into the issue) there are communities which are no-go zones, and if they are intolerant towards outsiders and even use force to exclude people, and if such communities become a breeding ground for violent extremism (I may not have clarified this point sufficiently to Paul Williams, in which case my apologies), then I wouldn’t oppose someone using the word ‘cancer’ to describe the violent elements within that society (though I wouldn’t myself use or encourage such terminology). I would not oppose all of the people within that community (and I imagine Jonathan wouldn’t either), simply those violent factions. And it is nothing to do with their religion – I would oppose violent extremism within any community, e.g. Jewish or Buddhist, including my own (Christian). I have nothing against Muslims, and indeed, it has been a pleasure in recent months to make new Muslim friends (who are nice and friendly people) and to enjoy their acquaintance.

    When Paul Williams asked me whether I thought Wood and Shamoun were extremists or anti-Muslim, this was my response:

    ‘I don’t know about everything Wood and Shamoun has said, so there could be extremist things they’ve said that I don’t know about. In that video you sent me, Shamoun made some comment about cancer, but I don’t really know the context and who he’s talking about.

    As for what I’ve seen from them generally – I don’t think so. I think they’re bold and offensive, which isn’t my style, but I wouldn’t condemn it – sometimes truth is more important than sparing feelings.

    I don’t think they’re anti-Muslim, but I think they are trying to disprove Islam, and I think they are anti-Islamic extremism.’ [EDIT: Just to clarify, I meant they are against Islamic extremism, not that they are extremely against Islam].

    I then apologised for having disappointed Paul Williams, and asked:

    ‘Is there anything particularly extreme about Wood and Shamoun that you’d like me to oppose, which perhaps I simply don’t know about?’

    I did not receive a response.

    I mean no ill will to Paul Williams or any Muslim, and I hope that this post clarifies my perspective. I am opposed to extremist violence, not Muslims, whose friendship and company I have hitherto enjoyed (and which I hope to continue enjoying, providing this post does not make them run a mile).

    I am happy to continue the conversation on here if anyone wishes to respond to and challenge my position.

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  5. @Richard, they don’t exist. The mayor of Paris should know there’s no ‘Sharia governed no-go-zones’. Even Fox News has said there’s no credible evidence for such either. If Fox News is not even going to try and defend it then what does that say about Jonathan’s claims. Clearly Jonathan made a few mistakes..’it’s part of apologetics to admit your mistakes rather than dig yourself in further.

    However, there’s more controversy from that presentation in Middlesbrough.Jonathan McLatchie presents a theory which suggests peaceful Muslim communities are terrorists in the making and potential ‘persecutors’ and ‘subjugators’ of Non Muslims.

    If there’s an increase in hate crime against Muslims in the North East then please call/write to that church to ask them whether their event has any bearing on any spike in hate crimes.

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  6. @Richard, just a few comments on what you wrote as you seem like you wish for some sort of dialogue. It’s late but I will offer a tired response.

    Wood and Shamoun are actually against Islam. If you look at their work, which I have sadly, they argue extremism is Islam. so for them ISIS, Al QAEDA etc are Islamic. Thus they are against Islam albeit in an indirect way as they first misrepresent it and then argue against it in a crude fashion. Odd balls.

    You also said they are bold and offensive whilst seemingly suggesting they were doing it to further the truth. Nope. Shamoun has presented such lies as ‘Muslims can have sex with animals’ and Wood has presented forgeries and just straight up lied in a few instances. Check the relevant sections on my blog if you’re really interested. It’s all documented Richard.

    You asked for the context of the Shamoun clip, this is the best I have…

    Peace

    Like

  7. Thank you Yahya Snow for taking the time to respond to me, and in a courteous manner 🙂

    As I tried to make clear before, until this point I have not myself been arguing one way or another on the question of whether the no-go zones exist. If I were to throw in my two cents, however, it seems clear that Fox News overstepped the mark. But it seems that there are still some documented cases of ‘no go zones’ – how often or how widespread they are in force is another matter entirely. To see evidence, cf. http://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/249744/no-no-go-zones-really-robert-spencer#.VL5ks7aKI44.twitter . I do not express an opinion on how common these incidents are. And yes the author is extreme, and I do not condone the author per se. However, in so far as he uses other sources, this article should be borne in mind.

    ‘Wood and Shamoun are actually against Islam. If you look at their work, which I have sadly, they argue extremism is Islam. so for them ISIS, Al QAEDA etc are Islamic. Thus they are against Islam albeit in an indirect way as they first misrepresent it and then argue against it in a crude fashion. Odd balls.’ – From my understanding of them, they are against what they consider to be ‘true Islam’, which they consider to be violent. But they believe that many (most?) Muslims do not follow that form of Islam, and instead follow a peaceful form. You say that they misrepresent it, and maybe they do – but if David Wood and Sam Shamoun are honestly convinced that true Islam is a violent form of Islam, then that’s their opinion. Perhaps they honestly disagree with you over what constitutes ‘true Islam’, even if their opinion is factually wrong.

    ‘You also said they are bold and offensive whilst seemingly suggesting they were doing it to further the truth. Nope. Shamoun has presented such lies as ‘Muslims can have sex with animals’ and Wood has presented forgeries and just straight up lied in a few instances. Check the relevant sections on my blog if you’re really interested. It’s all documented Richard.’ I would need to look into these instances to comment further. Truth be told, however, I am not writing on this blog to defend David Wood or Sam Shamoun – I am writing here mainly to defend my reputation, lest my Muslim friends, who I wish to keep, think that I am anti-Muslim, a charge I would strongly resist. I have also, in Jonathan’s defence, tried to show that Jonathan’s position about no-go zones MIGHT have some grounding in reality, or at least that Jonathan could honestly come to such a position.

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  8. Oh and sorry I forgot to say – I can’t fully hear everything Sam Shamoun said in that video, but from what I heard, I condemn his statement.

    Liked by 2 people

  9. Hi Richard, nice to see you here.

    Like

  10. Nice to bump into you Ijaz – it’s a shame it’s under such bleak circumstances.

    Like

  11. @Richard Zetter

    I don’t know your background but I just came back from a church in the City of London and I mainly saw old or middle-aged people there who I imagine would be appalled at the views Wood and Shamoun express. These folk were friendly towards me. I’m looking to build bridges and cohesion between British Christians with Muslims. Today was an important first step in building those bridges and taking preemptive action against the virus and cancer (hat tip to McLatchie) that is Islamophobic hate-preaching which is spilling over into the UK now from America.

    I’d rather not waste my time talking about Shamoun and Wood who both have no training in Islam. Anybody with scholarship and training in Islam know they are full of malice and distortion.

    Thanks for clarifying why you are here. Why do you think your reputation is at stake here? Are you a backer of Shamoun, Wood and/or McLatchie? To be honest, I’ve never heard of them mention you. Have you made any controversial and/or malicious comments towards Muslims and Islam?

    If the answer is no then I don’t think anybody is going to label you as an Islamophobic bigot.

    As for Jonathan McLatchie, no offense Robert, I don’t want to hear any of this far-fetched defence by claiming there ‘may’ be a ‘sharia governed no go zone’ in Europe. It’s just insulting our intelligence. Maybe /mcLatchie’s church and buddies will accept such but for me that’s just lame excuse making in order for the man’s pride to continue to suppress a warranted apology and retraction of those comments. In any case, there’s been further comments by M?cLatchie where he effectively labels British Muslim communities as a sneaky fifth column looking to ‘persecute’ Non Muslims and even use terrorism (see the relevant vid above)

    And lastly, feel free to browse the Shamoun and Wood sections if you are really interested in knowing more about their level of polemics

    http://thefactsaboutislam.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/David%20Wood

    http://thefactsaboutislam.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Sam%20Shamoun

    I hope you will continue to have Muslim friends and I hope you will begin to stand up for Muslims even though it means speaking out against some of your buddies/co-religionists. The sermon today was focussing on small changes that lead to a greater positive goal.

    Liked by 1 person

  12. @Richard

    I just finished boiling some veg. Sorry, I noticed in the post I called you Robert.

    I wanted to add, Jonathan and I were having a perfectly reasonable discussion on FB and all of a sudden without warning and reason the man just blocked me. Interestingly enough he did it after posting a load of right wing links to support his pi-in the-sky claim of sharia governed zones in Europe (a couple of those were by Spencer). So before I could comment on them and just say they are in no way shape or form evidence for such claims. Perhaps seeing Muslims rebuke him openly and refute his polemics shook his foundation and shook some preconceived ideas he may have had of Muslims being intellectually inferior (it seems he may have those ideas as per some of the arguments in his collaboration with Smith).

    Perhaps you can enquire what is so grating to him that he felt the obligation to destroy the bridge of dialogue, friendship and debate? He’s an aspiring academic, get used to taking criticism. If you think some is unwarranted, challenge it INTELLECTUALLY and at the anvil of discussion rather than throwing strops and resorting to actions of last recourse (blocking people).

    So if you can Richard, please do ask and please do try to resolve some of these issues.

    Peace

    Like

  13. I thought my reputation was at stake as I was mentioned by name in a comment above, a comment that (perhaps unintentionally) I do not feel accurately represented my views.

    ‘Are you a backer of Shamoun, Wood and/or McLatchie?’ – Shamoun and Wood raise interesting issues concerning Islam, but I don’t necessarily agree with their conclusions. I have only recently become familiar with Jonathan McLatchie’s apologetics – I have nothing against his scientific apologetics, and I think that his recent debate/dialogue with Shabir Ally was a helpful and respectful dialogue. However, I don’t know enough about Shamoun or Wood’s controversial statements to endorse or condemn them (and to be honest, it’s an issue I’m not particularly wishing to delve into). As for Jonathan McLatchie, I hope I’ve clarified my perspective above.

    ‘Have you made any controversial and/or malicious comments towards Muslims and Islam?’ – I would say no, and I do not wish to, however the comment I was mentioned in above may portray my position (perhaps unintentionally) in a controversial light.

    As for Jonathan’s comments about ‘effectively label[ing] British Muslim communities as a sneaky fifth column looking to ‘persecute’ Non Muslims and even use terrorism (see the relevant vid above)’, I’ve managed to refrain from looking into this issue, and I do not wish to delve into the matter.

    Thank you for the links, I’ll have a quick browse.

    No problem at all, Robert is a nice name 😛

    I’m afraid I don’t know why he blocked you, and I cannot speak on his behalf. Who knows, maybe in the light of this controversy he needed some time out from it all.

    Thank you for your comments Yahya – best wishes and peace.

    Like

  14. I should clarify as it wasn’t clear (if Paul monitoring this page could edit it that’d be super), the quotation marks in the former comments about Jonathan were your words, not Jonathan’s!

    Like

  15. it’s worth noting that McLatchie has responded to this blog and others like it: http://crossexamined.org/on-shariah-governed-enclaves-in-france-a-clarifying-note/

    Like

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