And Now for Something Completely Different (or is it?)

Thanks to Ibn Issam for the suggestion from another post on this blog

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Categories: And Now for Something Completely Different

39 replies

  1. makes you think how blasphemous christians are.

    Liked by 1 person

  2. PW,
    Glad to be of assistance!!

    Liked by 1 person

    • A clarification for the benefit of Christians:

      We Muslims revere and respect Prophet Issa (Jesus) (as) as an honored Prophet and Messenger of God for he is a great Prophet of Islam. It is because we maintain a belief in the absolute oneness of God, and do not associate partners (two, three or more) in his divinity, that we are free to accept the fully human nature of Jesus (as) in its entirety. Importantly, we do not feel the pressing need to innovate or believe in any false doctrines in order provide rationale for the purported divine nature of Jesus. Likewise, we do not feel the need to explain away any of the embarrassing traits that come with being a human, by believing in such blasphemy.

      We draw the line at assigning Divinity to Jesus, let alone, worshipping him, or any other man, object, or entity other than the one true supreme divine being (Almighty God Allah). As Muslims we believe that the true historical Jesus (as) himself would have approved of this stance:

      And behold! Allah will say: “O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst thou say unto men, worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah’?” He will say: “Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, Thou I know not what is in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden. (5:116, Yusuf Ali)

      I pray that this post, will help our Christian Brothers and Sisters see the error in the Trinitarian misguidance, and I pray that they will come home to the true path of Islam!

      Liked by 2 people

    • May Allah bless you man!

      Liked by 1 person

  3. “Can’t say I would worship someone who messed his nappies though.”

    don’t worry they have a solution for that. god farting and excreting was 2 natures, 1 person.

    but whenever you get embarrassed by godly act

    just minus the divine nature.

    from now on it makes better sense not to refer to “jesus” as “jesus” for he is, according to christians , 2 natures, 1 person.

    this in any dictionary would not be defined as a human being , but some other kind of creature .

    so whenever you have trouble with godly act

    just take away the divine nature, then you have

    1 nature, 1 person

    Liked by 1 person

  4. A while ago I asked, “If He wasn’t God, Who was He?” A few days later when there was no response, I asked again, If not God, Who? Who was this guy described in the books and letters of the N. T.? Bart acknowledges that indeed a man called Jesus Christ did exist. Well, if he’s right, then exactly Who, What, was He? And upon what do we base our opinions?

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    • Prophet.

      Messiah.

      Qur’an.

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    • Paul

      What does the quran say the term “messiah” means?

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    • That’s where we differ. I view the N.T. as describing Jesus pretty thoroughly.

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    • Graham, the Qur’an does not define the term. But we know from other historical sources that it means ‘anointed one’ and is only ever used in the Jewish Bible to describe human beings.

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    • paul didn’t you just recently give this explanation ? how many times do they want you to repeat yourself?

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hank, not everything in the New Testament is to be trusted as faithful to the historical Jesus, esp. the Fourth Gospel.

      Like

    • Edward, there is indeed a sight infestation of trolls on this blog.

      Like

    • Paul Williams

      “Graham, the Qur’an does not define the term. But we know from other historical sources that it means ‘anointed one’ and is only ever used in the Jewish Bible to describe human beings.”

      So we have no idea what the quran’s writers were talking about when they threw the word in there. Pretty important thing to leave out.

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    • I’m sure God knows what he means by this term. History fills in the gaps of our knowledge as I have already made clear. But we have discussed all this before.

      Do you suffer from obsessive compulsive disorder?

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    • Maseeh in Arabic means literally ( the anointed one). It came from the root (M-S – H) م س ح which means to anoint.

      You can put many verbs in Arabic in The Template XaXeeX . For example, (K-S-R) ك س ر which means to break, so Kaseer means ( the Broken one) .

      Liked by 1 person

    • Paul Williams

      “I’m sure God knows what he means by this term. History fills in the gaps of our knowledge as I have already made clear. But we have discussed all this before.”

      That’s quite a significant admission – the quran leaves huge gaps in our theological knowledge that your allah relies on to get his message across.

      Abdullah

      “Maseeh in Arabic means literally ( the anointed one). It came from the root (M-S – H) م س ح which means to anoint.

      You can put many verbs in Arabic in The Template XaXeeX . For example, (K-S-R) ك س ر which means to break, so Kaseer means ( the Broken one) .”

      Interesting but completely irrelevant.

      WHat is the point, purpose and role of the messiah? The quran just borrows a word that is given no meaning or context whatsoever.

      What does the “anointed one” do? What is the significance of him, or her?

      The quran doesn’t say, because the the anonymous guys who wrote it were not familiar with jewish and christian theology.

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    • Yawn. You and I have already discussed this at length before. I’m beginning to realise you DO have obsessive compulsive disorder. Get some help dude.

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  5. How does the Qur’an describe him?

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    • see Ibn Issam’s comment above

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    • Thanks.

      “O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst thou say unto men, worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah’?” He will say: “Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, Thou I know not what is in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden. (5:116, Yusuf Ali)

      Is it “will say” or did say? Did Jesus say, “Glory to thee…” according to the Qur’an? Is there more in The Qur’an regarding Jesus?

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    • Yes there is. Please use the Google search engine facility to find out more, thank you.

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    • The truth, according to the Quran, is that:

      “The Messiah, son of Mary, was no other than a messenger; messengers before him had indeed passed away.” (Quran 5:75)

      Furthermore, the Quran states that the Messiah called to the worship of “the true God” like all the prophets before him:

      “But the Messiah said, ‘O Children of Israel, worship God, my Lord and your Lord.’” (Quran 5:72)

      The Quran refers to Jesus as the Messiah (al-Maseeh) at least nine times.[9] One of the explanations given by Muslim lexicographers is that Jesus was the Messiah because he anointed the eyes of the blind to cure them (Quran 3:43; Mark 6:13; James 5:14), or because he used to lay hands on the sick.

      (2) Sign

      The Quran describes Jesus to be a ‘Sign,’ an aayah in the Quran. In the terminology of the Quran a miracle is a ‘sign’ of God to display divine might and unrestricted ability to do acts outside the chain of cause and effect. In this sense, the virgin birth of Jesus is a miracle; a wonderful show of God’s mighty power to do as He pleases. Therefore, Jesus is a ‘sign’ not only to the Israelites but to the entire world:

      “And We made the son of Mary and his mother as a Sign.” (Quran 23:50)

      “…We may make him a sign to men…” (Quran 19:21)

      “and We made her and her son a sign for all peoples.” (Quran 21:91)

      In addition, the Quran declares Jesus’ second coming to be a ‘sign,’ an announcement that the Judgment Day is coming close, “And indeed, Jesus will be a sign for the Hour (of Judgment), so have no doubt about it, and follow Me. This is a straight path.” (Quran 43:61)

      Lots of research to do. Does the Qur’an rely upon the New Testament to draw conclusions about Christ or writings of other sources?

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    • No. The Qur’an is the speech of the Creator Himself.

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    • “Hank, not everything in the New Testament is to be trusted as faithful to the historical Jesus, esp. the Fourth Gospel.” pw

      That’s why I want to figure out not only what you consider to be accurate and inaccurate, but how you reach that conclusion.

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  6. “Can’t say I would worship someone who messed his nappies though.”

    Why not?

    If God the eternal Word of God کلمه الله / eternal Son; out of love became a human and humbled Himself voluntarily and wanted to enter into our problems, struggles, temptations, limitations, what is the problem?

    John 1:1-5
    John 1:14
    Philippians 2:5-8
    Hebrews 2:14-18
    Luke 1:34-35

    God was the one who thought of our digestion systems, food, digestion, waste expulsion, etc. – it was His idea and He created the bowels, etc. in order to expel waste.

    He is the creator who thought of that, and He is worthy of worship.

    If He willingly voluntarily became a human to experience our experiences and suffer and die and rise from the dead in order to redeem us; He is worthy of Worship; because of His love and truth and power and wisdom was demonstrated in the incarnation, atonement, resurrection, and ascension.

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    • ‘Can’t say I would worship someone who messed his nappies though.’

      Like

    • “God was the one who thought of our digestion systems, food, digestion, waste expulsion, etc. – it was His idea and He created the bowels, etc. in order to expel waste.”

      so you are saying that 2 natures, 1 person fully experienced the passing of excretion and bowl movement and maybe had thoughts of having a shit?

      “He is the creator who thought of that, and He is worthy of worship.”

      worthy of worship while he is going for a crap?
      so you would worship jesus in a communal toilet?

      what is the difference between you and greek pagans who believed in human gods?

      If He willingly voluntarily became a human to experience our experiences ”

      he —–> human through changing his invisible powers to finite created person

      which implies

      2 natures, 1 person as god + human fully experienced our experiences

      fully god and fully human experienced human crapping


      and suffer and die and rise from the dead in order to redeem us; He is worthy of Worship; because of His love and truth and power and wisdom was demonstrated in the incarnation, atonement, resurrection, and ascension.”

      fiction

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    • @Ken: Why not?

      Because Jesus or any of the OT prophets didn’t worship God who messed up his nappy!

      Like

  7. “Can’t say I would worship someone who messed his nappies though.”

    Ken Temple: Why not?

    That gave me a good laugh!

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    • Ken Temple

      November 1, 2016 • 9:18 pm

      “Can’t say I would worship someone who messed his nappies though.”

      Why not?

      If God the eternal Word of God کلمه الله / eternal Son; out of love became a human and humbled Himself voluntarily and wanted to enter into our problems, struggles, temptations, limitations, what is the problem?

      I say;
      Why not?
      Because there are other creature gods like Haile Selassie, Jesus, Sai Baba, Hindus Monkeys, Elephants, voodoos snakes etc. who have their gods coming down as those creatures Himself voluntarily and wanted to enter into our problems, temptations, limitations, what is the problem?

      If you do not find any think wrong worshiping a creature in a nappies probably with some s*** then do not find any problem on monkey gods, elephant gods, that shits on streets of India and voodoo snake gods other God Men like Haile Selassie, Sai Baba.

      I find it very insulting to God to worship the above gods because they are all creatures including Jesus Christ visiting toiled. God does not visit toilet that is why He said “there is nothing like Him” and He is not a man i.e. a creature.

      Thanks.

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  8. Paul, This is what i’m beginning to learn about what the Qur’an has to say regarding Jesus:

    …was proclaimed to be the word (or “a word”) of God and the Christ/Messiah (sura 3:45)
    …was born of a virgin (sura 3:47, 19:27-28)
    …was confirmed to be righteous (sura 6:85, sura 3:46)
    …performed miracles (sura 3:49)
    …had disciples (sura 3:52-53, 5:111-118)
    …was sent with a gospel (sura 5:46)
    …words should be believed (sura 4:171)
    …was taken into Heaven by God (sura 4:156-159)
    …will have a second and visible coming to the earth (sura 3:55)

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    • 4:171 O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of Allah aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) a messenger of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in Allah and His messengers. Say not “Trinity”: desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah: Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth.

      4:172 Christ disdaineth nor to serve and worship Allah . . .

      5:17 In blasphemy indeed are those that say that Allah is Christ the son of Mary.

      5:46 And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him: We sent him the Gospel: therein was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Law that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear Allah.

      5:72 They do blaspheme who say: “Allah is Christ the son of Mary.” But said Christ: “O Children of Israel! worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord.” Whoever joins other gods with Allah,- Allah will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode.

      5:75 Christ the son of Mary was no more than a messenger; many were the messengers that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food.

      5:78 Curses were pronounced on those among the Children of Israel who rejected Faith, by the tongue of David and of Jesus the son of Mary: because they disobeyed and persisted in excesses.

      5:110 O Jesus the son of Mary! Recount My favour to thee and to thy mother. Behold! I strengthened thee with the holy spirit, so that thou didst speak to the people in childhood and in maturity. Behold! I taught thee the Book and Wisdom, the Law and the Gospel and behold! thou makest out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, by My leave, and thou breathest into it and it becometh a bird by My leave, and thou healest those born blind, and the lepers, by My leave. And behold! thou bringest forth the dead by My leave. And behold! I did restrain the Children of Israel from (violence to) thee when thou didst show them the clear Signs, and the unbelievers among them said: ‘This is nothing but evident magic.’

      5:112 Behold! the disciples, said: “O Jesus the son of Mary! can thy Lord send down to us a table set (with viands) from heaven?” Said Jesus: “Fear Allah, if ye have faith.”

      5:114 Said Jesus the son of Mary: “O Allah our Lord! Send us from heaven a table set (with viands), that there may be for us-for the first and the last of us-a solemn festival and a sign from thee; and provide for our sustenance, for thou art the best Sustainer (of our needs).”

      5:116 Allah will say: “O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst thou say unto men, worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah’?” He will say: “Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart . . .”

      6:85 And Zakariya and John, and Jesus and Elias: all in the ranks of the righteous.

      9:30 The Jews call ‘Uzair a son of Allah, and the Christians call Christ the son of Allah.

      9:31 They take their priests and their anchorites to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Christ the son of Mary; yet they were commanded to worship but One Allah: there is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (Far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him).

      19:19 He said: “Nay, I am only a messenger from thy Lord, (to announce) to thee the gift of a holy son.”

      19:20 She said: “How shall I have a son, seeing that no man has touched me, and I am not unchaste?”

      19:21 He said: “So (it will be): Thy Lord saith, ‘that is easy for Me: and (We wish) to appoint him as a Sign unto men and a Mercy from Us’: It is a matter (so) decreed.”

      19:22 So she conceived him, and she retired with him to a remote place.

      19:27 At length she brought the (babe) to her people, carrying him (in her arms). They said: “O Mary! truly an amazing thing hast thou brought!”

      19:30 He said: “I am indeed a servant of Allah: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet.”

      19:31 “And He hath made me blessed wheresoever I be, and hath enjoined on me Prayer and Charity as long as I live.”

      19:32 “(He) hath made me kind to my mother, and not overbearing or miserable.”

      19:33 “So peace is on me the day I was born, the day that I die, and the day that I shall be raised up to life (again)!”

      19:34 Such (was) Jesus the son of Mary: (it is) a statement of truth, about which they (vainly) dispute.

      19:88 They say: “(Allah) Most Gracious has begotten a son!”

      19:91 That they should invoke a son for (Allah) Most Gracious.

      19:92 For it is not consonant with the majesty of (Allah) Most Gracious that He should beget a son.

      21:91 And (remember) her who guarded her chastity: We breathed into her of Our spirit, and We made her and her son a sign for all peoples.

      23:50 And We made the son of Mary and his mother as a Sign: We gave them both shelter on high ground, affording rest and security and furnished with springs.

      33:7 And remember We took from the prophets their covenant: As (We did) from thee: from Noah, Abraham, Moses, and Jesus the son of Mary: We took from them a solemn covenant.

      42:13 The same religion has He established for you as that which He enjoined on Noah-the which We have sent by inspiration to thee-and that which We enjoined on Abraham, Moses, and Jesus: Namely, that ye should remain steadfast in religion, and make no divisions therein: to those who worship other things than Allah, hard is the (way) to which thou callest them. Allah chooses to Himself those whom He pleases, and guides to Himself those who turn (to Him).43:61. And (Jesus) shall be a Sign (for the coming of) the Hour (of Judgment): therefore have no doubt about the (Hour), but follow ye Me: this is a Straight Way.

      43: 63 When Jesus came with Clear Signs, he said: “Now have I come to you with Wisdom, and in order to make clear to you some of the (points) on which ye dispute: therefore fear Allah and obey me.

      57:27 We sent after them Jesus the son of Mary, and bestowed on him the Gospel; and We ordained in the hearts of those who followed him Compassion and Mercy .

      61:6 And remember, Jesus, the son of Mary, said: “O Children of Israel! I am the messenger of Allah (sent) to you, confirming the Law (which came) before me, and giving Glad Tidings of a Messenger to come after me, whose name shall be Ahmad.” But when he came to them with Clear Signs, they said, “this is evident sorcery!”

      61:14 O ye who believe! Be ye helpers of Allah: As said Jesus the son of Mary to the Disciples, “Who will be my helpers to (the work of) Allah?” Said the disciples, “We are Allah’s helpers!” then a portion of the Children of Israel believed, and a portion disbelieved: But We gave power to those who believed, against their enemies, and they became the ones that prevailed.
      N. S. R. K. Ravi

      much to study. holy cow

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    • Hank,
      I encourage you to put aside your presuppositions and read Qur’an with an open heart and open mind. May Allah Guide you through your Qur’anic studies to the true deen, the straight path of Islam and true Abrahamic Monotheism.

      We would be happy to welcome a man of faith such as yourself to Islam.

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  9. Hank, I am happy you are reading the Qur’an. If you are FULLY sincere, may God Almighty FULLY bless you.

    Salam (peace)

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  10. Thanks you Omer and Ibn Issam. Kind of you. I desire to know truth. I love my God. Truth is truth and I have no concerns or fears pursuing truth wherever that path leads. I know practically nothing about Islam. I’m excited about trying to learn more, but I get confused very quickly. I end up with a bunch of questions just like that. For example, if the following statements are true, is Jesus resurrected in Islam?

    In the Qur’ân, we read: “…and because of their saying: ‘We killed Jesus Christ, the son of Mary, the Messenger of God!’ But they did not kill him nor did they crucify him, but it appeared to them that they did. And those who differ therein are full of doubts with no certain knowledge. And they surely did not kill him. Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself, and Allah is Mighty, Wise.” [Sûrah al-Nisâ’: 157-158]

    Like

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